Mung

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,464
FFVII remake has a level cap of 50, and a large amount of materia that is accumulated and levelled up during the game.

How should part 2 handle this?

Should it carry over earned materia and levels using the saved game?

Will it start afresh at a fixed level, possibly with a plot device whereby all materia is lost?

Not carrying over progress could hamper the continuity, but everyone starting at different levels may create it's own issues too.
 

adj_noun

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
17,510
If they don't start fresh I'd imagine they Xenosaga it: your part one level can affect your starting level and materia a bit, but you don't start at a one to one position.
 

Soulflarz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,830
kiseki style, start at old level cap + change the materia system slightly/expand on it each release so that theres a reason for you to not necessarily just work your way back to where you were. Kiseki did it great.
 

Deleted member 6263

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,387
Yuffie will come in at the beginning and steal everyone's materia and weapons. You'll be left with your beginning weapons at "max" level, which are now less useful against creatures outside of Midgar.
 

JuanLatino

Cerny’s little helper
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,384
start fresh with standard materia equipped at level 1 (Like Fire, Ice, Thunder, Asses etc.)

Otherwise you would be too op at the start of the next game with all skills maxed out
 

MisterZimbu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
372
I can't see them carrying over anything. You're getting endgame spells at the end of FF7R so they have to roll that back somehow, and it's not like there's a whole lot of character customization to cut over anyway.
 

MrCibb

Member
Dec 12, 2018
5,349
UK
I doubt anything will carry over.

I've seen this discussed a lot. FF7R isn't inventing the concept of a sequel, we've had plenty of RPGs that don't carry anything over to the next one because it'd be too annoying to balance. If Square want to try then they can go for it but I don't think they will.
 

Nayeon

Member
Oct 29, 2017
329
Otherwise you would be too op at the start of the next game with all skills maxed out
Or.. or ... the game would just scale properly? If there's a savegame of Part 1 on your harddrive, it should be no problem for the game to read the data and collect whatever gear or materia or level you had and just carry it over. Furthermore, upon carrying over, the game should analyse how much potential your characters have based on that stuff and scale enemies and bosses appropriately.

No need to reset or partly reset. With this, everyone gets the best possible outcome. It won't hurt newcomers and veterans alike. I'd be highly disappointed to lose my summons or materia.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
Just add more mastery stars for materia. It's not hard.

Yuffie stealing everything permanently is a shitty compromise that makes the game worse and renders all your effort in the first game pointless. "Oh boy, I unlocked FIRA again" three more fucking times isn't going to be exciting.

I can't see them carrying over anything. You're getting endgame spells at the end of FF7R so they have to roll that back somehow, and it's not like there's a whole lot of character customization to cut over anyway.

There are still two more tiers of spells, and entire materia worth of abilities they haven't covered yet. There are ways to expand from here without starting from 0.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
Let players keep everything and simply scale enemies and new gear accordingly. They already proved they can make a Hard Mode, so just make that the jumping off point for the new normal difficulty. At most all they need to do is reset weapon levels so you don't start with eight materia slots in your weapons, then just introduce better weapons. It's not like having Firaga at the beginning of the second part is somehow going to break it.
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,860
Lol Yeah I think everyone agrees. Yuffie is the best way narratively to reset the player's inventory.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
Lol Yeah I think everyone agrees. Yuffie is the best way narratively to reset the player's inventory.

And you're gonna have her do that in parts 3 and 4 too? Yuffie sucks, and having her steal your entire inventory forever would make her the worst character in the entire series.
 

The Last One

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,585
Yuffie stealing the materia would be a good reason. Levels will revert back to level 1 without explanation.
 

Viale

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,640
Just add more mastery stars for materia. It's not hard.

Yuffie stealing everything permanently is a shitty compromise that makes the game worse and renders all your effort in the first game pointless. "Oh boy, I unlocked FIRA again" three more fucking times isn't going to be exciting.



There are still two more tiers of spells, and entire materia worth of abilities they haven't covered yet. There are ways to expand from here without starting from 0.

...? It's a new game though. Same thing happens in almost any jrpg with sequels. You're still unlocking fire - > fira - > firaga again in kh2, and all your effort in the first game isn't pointless, you still have all of that stuff... In that game.
 

Midgarian

Alt Account
Banned
Apr 16, 2020
2,619
Midgar
Yuffie is going to steal all our materia and then lost them
This.

Game starts within the Flashback.

After the flashback the party sleeps at Kalm.

When they wake up they find all their Materia stolen which is explained later once we encounter Yuffie.

Plus forget all the levels and everything. I'm going with Tim Rogers' theory that the battle system will be different. Based on the same foundation, but different enough that this discussion about progression will be irrelevant.
 

Jarmel

The Jackrabbit Always Wins
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,619
New York
This.

Game starts within the Flashback.

After the flashback the party sleeps at Kalm.

When they wake up they find all their Materia stolen which is explained later once we encounter Yuffie.

Plus forget all the levels and everything. I'm going with Tim Rogers' theory that the battle system will be different. Based on the same foundation, but different enough that this discussion about progression will be irrelevant.
Nah, I don't want Yuffie to steal them in the middle of the night. I want her to hustle you first.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
...? It's a new game though. Same thing happens in almost any jrpg with sequels. You're still unlocking fire - > fira - > firaga again in kh2, and all your effort in the first game isn't pointless, you still have all of that stuff... In that game.

There's like zero point to unlocking Bahamut in FFVIIR part 1. You can't use him in anything meaningful. Same with the Enemy Skill materia. If you can't carry that over, the effort was pointless.
 

Ferrs

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
18,831
Yuffie will steal your shit and you will NOT recover it. They'll make Wutai mandatory, where you probably recruit Yuffie , but she will already sold all your shit.
 

FeD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,286
I assume the whole battle of fate thing is going to be their narrative beat that allows them to reset progression between parts.
 

LinkStrikesBack

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,519
People kept insisting FF7R was a full game, here's the rub. Most likely they gonna ignore most of whatever progress people made and just stick Cloud and friends at level 30 or something with a preset list of materia.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,925
Mount Airy, MD
Whatever they do, I hope the non-linear weapon progression stays. It was cool (if clunky in UI) to have each weapon stay relevant rather than just "oh, new weapon, time to switch" at each new shop.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
Tell that to my hard mode playthrough. Bad Breath is very good.

And for people who don't want to play the whole game again on hard mode, that effort was, as I said, pointless. You can't even get Bahamut until the last three hours of the game, and if you DO get him then you would've needed to spend HOURS grinding.
 

Ebnas

Member
May 15, 2019
366
There's not going to be carry-over. You will start fresh, with maybe some small bonuses for a completed save file.
 

Adonais

Member
Oct 29, 2017
228
Metaverse
Regardless of weather or not they carry over materia levels, they won't be as exciting if they're capped out at the same level. I think something new needs to be introduced to keep magic interesting.

I think it's time for final fantasy to do something they've never done before in the single player games. And that's mixing elemental attacks. Mixing fire and wind, or water and lightning, etc. could introduce new magic types and new weaknesses to discover with enemies that would make battles more dynamic and interesting. I loved the battle system in Remake, but let's be honest. Did anyone ever remove Lightning+elemental combo from Cloud's sword for more than a couple bosses? Why not take the best part of materia, the combinations, and just run wild with it?
 
Last edited:
Jan 3, 2019
3,219
And for people who don't want to play the whole game again on hard mode, that effort was, as I said, pointless. You can't even get Bahamut until the last three hours of the game, and if you DO get him then you would've needed to spend HOURS grinding.
I got Bahamut halfway through the game without grinding, what are you talking about?

EDIT: No, wait, I had to grind the magic things, nvm. Was still halfway through the game though
 

Mugman

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,370
If anything carries over at all, I expect at most it'll be small bonus things, or maybe your affection points or whatever for the other party members. Not really sure what the difference is if they start everyone at level 50 or at level 1; it's still going to amount to the same thing.
 

Razorrin

Member
Nov 7, 2017
5,237
the HELP Menu.
The people saying Yuffie will steal your materia and that'd be okay are totally underestimating how much that will make people HATE Yuffie.

You can't simply get over a character erasing hard progress and be expected to care about them afterwards, over half the playerbase will absolutely despise her unconditionally for the entire rest of the Remake series, even though she was only used as an excuse for a lack of carry over, because she has to take the responsibility for that in the story.

They can't afford to spend time developing an optional party member into a non-optional one and have everyone hate them. Hope had justifiable reasons why he was the way he was in FFXIII, and a ton of people couldn't get over the "Crybaby asshole," who witnessed one of the party members drop their mom to their death.

He grew, and became pretty great, but that first impression of how he was before development totally poisoned the well because most people who play games and engage in community memes never get past that first impression if it makes the character unlikeable. You even have purposely unlikeable or asshole characters who bring a game down even if their bad behaviour is played out and condemned, because even showing stuff like racism and lgbt-phobia existing is felt by a ton of people as a "commendation" of their bad actions, though that's a much worse conversation for another thread.

So, Yuffie shouldn't steal their materia and "Lose it," selling it or something, that doesn't even make sense for her character. She would steal materia, obviously, but the reason why would keep her from ever selling it. It makes little sense unless they just have her holding onto all your materia forever, and do it again for part 3 and never return them, which isn't fair and didn't happen like that in the OG.

I think, if they don't let you carry over Materia due to circumstances like Console differences and such, they will give you copies of all the missable or important materia from Part 1, and a baseline of materia already leveled a bit, while unlocking new levels for materia to be unlocked.

They may dole out most carried over (storywise if not actually carrying over) materia as the beginning portions go, which could be a way to properly reintergrate Remake's materia, and Yuffie if handled well, though it's doubtful the result would be different for anyone who wants to hate the character.

My preference would be full carry over, with the max level of 50 from the previous game accounted for to allow you to fight the Midgar Zolom as a big tough optional battle right out the gate rather then needing to come back later, but depending on how they handle these next parts it might not be possible, which is a shame.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
61,106
They're not going to reset the inventory. That will make no sense. They will balance the enemies properly. This is not rocket science.

You guys act like balancing enemies is some ancient occultic practice that was lost to time lol. We'll be fine.
 

Ferrs

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
18,831
They're not going to reset the inventory. That will make no sense. They will balance the enemies properly. This is not rocket science.

How do you balance enemies where everyone will start at a different point Part 2? There will be people at lvl 30, 40, 50, with weapons maxed, without no weapons maxed, with all summons, with only 1 summon, maxed or not maxed materia... you can't just balance the start of the game like this unless you let the people that maxed Part 1 to Yolo hard through an important chunk of Part 2 while eventually the lower-leveled players catch up.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
How do you balance enemies where everyone will start at a different point Part 2? There will be people at lvl 30, 40, 50, with weapons maxed, without no weapons maxed, with all summons, with only 1 summon, maxed or not maxed materia... you can't just balance the start of the game like this unless you let the people that maxed Part 1 to Yolo hard through an important chunk of Part 2.

Adaptive difficulty. New players in part 2 will probably start with a basic suite of materia and at level 30. You can cater the difficulty to people who didn't import save data and then have a different difficulty spec for people who do.
 

JuanLatino

Cerny’s little helper
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,384
Or.. or ... the game would just scale properly? If there's a savegame of Part 1 on your harddrive, it should be no problem for the game to read the data and collect whatever gear or materia or level you had and just carry it over. Furthermore, upon carrying over, the game should analyse how much potential your characters have based on that stuff and scale enemies and bosses appropriately.

No need to reset or partly reset. With this, everyone gets the best possible outcome. It won't hurt newcomers and veterans alike. I'd be highly disappointed to lose my summons or materia.

but the next part is going to be a completely new game? Like the next God of War, Spider-Man or The Last of Us.
So you start fresh as in every sequel and build up your way again, with a Combat (or New Combat Elements)


Are People expecting for the next God of War to take over all their Weapons, Armors and Skills from the previous Game?
 

Sanox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,577
Fresh new game. Quite a few of the materia from part 1 can be found/bought early on

New game with carry over. Harder difficulty, 1 of every materia you got from part 1 but materia are reset to 1 star. Option and difficulty meant for players who really enjoyed the combat of the first game.

General changes:

enemy skill now has star levels and each skill has a required star level. This keeps players who carry over data from having shit like bad breath at the start of the game but overall you will still end up unlocking it earlier than when you normally face a morbol in part 2

Parry, deadly dodge, assess are not materia any more. Parry and deadly dodge are simply moves the characters have. Instead of assess you now have more information about enemies from the start and fill up the rest through fighting them. For example the optimal way to stagger an enemy will be displayed after you managed to stagger an enemy once.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
61,106
How do you balance enemies where everyone will start at a different point Part 2? There will be people at lvl 30, 40, 50, with weapons maxed, without no weapons maxed, with all summons, with only 1 summon, maxed or not maxed materia... you can't just balance the start of the game like this unless you let the people that maxed Part 1 to Yolo hard through an important chunk of Part 2 while eventually the lower-leveled players catch up.
Easy.

Dynamic level for enemies. Done.

It will not be a fresh start.
 

Ferrs

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
18,831
Adaptive difficulty. New players in part 2 will probably start with a basic suite of materia and at level 30. You can cater the difficulty to people who didn't import save data and then have a different difficulty spec for people who do.

There's still a big gap between lvl 30 and lvl 50, let alone the amount of materia and the level that materia is.

Easy.

Dynamic level for enemies. Done.

That only works for levels but you still have the issue of balancing the equipment, materia and the level of those.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
117,392
There's still a big gap between lvl 30 and lvl 50, let alone the amount of materia and the level that materia is.

It's really not as hard of a problem as you're making it out to be. Just tune enemies' levels based on the player's starting level. A "fresh" save will put the player on one difficulty curve and an imported save will put them on a different one.