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The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,120
Brady is by far the greatest player in nfl history and it's not close. Nobody is close. He's done it all. Championships, season success, two different coaches, two different teams, 2+ different eras, like 6 different offensive systems, statistical brilliance, regular season brilliance, post season brilliance, great statistical seasons when surrounded by stars, great tactical seasons when playing with bad players around him. He's excelled thru like 4 distinct eras of offensive football. He's done everything. There is no argument. This is just capstone on his career.

Montana isn't in the conversation. And anybody who says like "going 4-0 is better than going 6-3" is stupid, because montana just lost earlier. It's like saying that losing in a division or wild card round is better than losing in the superbowl which is just so dumb. As if *not making the playoffs* is better than making the super bowl and losing a couple times. It's like saying that Cam Newton had a better season than Aaron rodgers this year, because rodgers lost in the playoffs while Newton only lost jn the regular season. It just doesn't make sense.

There's no argument anymore. Tom brady is the greatest player in nfl history. You could entertain an argument maybe in 2017... But not anymore. He was clearly the GOAT after 2018, but now, 43, going back to another super bowl it's ... Beating Brees and Rodgers in the playoffs, there's just no debate.

And also brady had an amazing season. He wasn't perfect, but it was *very very very good* and even tho he had like 1000 yards and 6 or 7 tds in the last few games it doesn't matter..nobody remembers how it happened in a couple years. Nobody remembers how Manning got his 55ish TD that season, only that he did.

And he's done this all in an era designed for no team or player to dominate for 20 years. It's remarkable.

As for greatest player across all team sports? Perhaps. Bill Russell is hard to argue against. The only argument against russell is the nature of the NBA from 1959 to 1973. Like that's a league designed for two players to dominate it for 15 years, and Russell did. I think Russell was more dominant than Jordan, but it was a very different league in the 16 years of Jordan than the 10+ coaching for Russell.

From a macro perspective these last 2 seasons are the perfect example. In 10 years everyone's gonna look at 2019 patriots and 2020 patriots, vs 2019 bucs and 2020 bucs and how it's a complete reversal (except that the bucs went to the SB while the Pats got dominated in the WC). Brady is the difference between a bad team (patriots) competing for SB and not, and good team (TB) missing the playoffs and then competing for a super bowl. The difference is having the GOAT. (Realistically during the seasons you know that the patriots also went from the #1 defense in the nfl to the ....#18, and a ton of other shit, but again in 10 years you forget that stuff)
 
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HiLife

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
39,847
Dudes been the GOAT for awhile. He could win with the buccaneers and haters will still try to downplay it.
 

ZeoVGM

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
76,219
Providence, RI
If that's true then I wasn't aware. I retract my statement then I will put a piece of shit like Brady on the same level as Brown in that case.

No.

You should still not be putting Brady on the same level as a man with domestic assault and rape allegations.

Some of you people who have been obsessively hating Brady for years really showing your asses at times.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
No.

You should still not be putting Brady on the same level as a man with domestic assault and rape allegations.

Some of you people who have been obsessively hating Brady for years really showing your asses at times.
I'm not saying that Tom being a racist Trumper is the same as what Brown did. I was just saying that wasn't going to put Brown on a separate pedestal like I was before. I had no idea he was that shit off the field. I've only ever heard the good stuff.


The sports media has done a good job of hiding it I guess.
 

TaterTots

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,985
I mean the bucs are a very strong football team which is why brady can play like shit after quarter 2, throw 3 interceptions and still win.

Some of you miss context. Sure, he threw a few picks, but at least 1 of them was a lucky fluke off the hands of his receiver that flew into the air into the other players hands. Another was thrown right when he received contact and caused the ball to go short. That's as much as the O's line fault as his. Not like he was throwing bullseye passes to the Packers.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
Dudes been the GOAT for awhile. He could win with the buccaneers and haters will still try to downplay it.
You say that like the Bucs are bad without him. Mike Evans and Chris Godwin are elite WRs. Gronk is a HoF. Ronald Jones looks to be a solid RB. They also have top 10 defense this year.

Brady winning with them is not nearly as impressive as you make it sound.
 

ZeoVGM

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
76,219
Providence, RI
It's so strange how people take issue with the "GOAT in any sport" phrasing.

He's almost unquestionably the GOAT in his own sport. That automatically makes him one of an incredibly small number of people that can be considered one of the greatest players in sports of all time.

Taking issue with that phrasing is so silly and reeks of salt.
 

darkazcura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,901
You say that like the Bucs are bad without him. Mike Evans and Chris Godwin are elite WRs. Gronk is a HoF. Ronald Jones looks to be a solid RB. They also have top 10 defense this year.

Brady winning with them is not nearly as impressive as you make it sound.

So what did this great team do last year?

Sorry but your hate has been pretty laughable for pages. It's been great.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
So what did this great team do last year?
They had Winston last year who threw like 30INTs. What were they supposed to do with that?


Are you going to dispute any of what I said btw? Are Evans and Godwin not good? Is Gronk not a HoFer? Did their defense not finish top 10 in the league?


You can't dispute the facts. It's a good team with good players.
 

Deleted member 5260

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
441
You say that like the Bucs are bad without him. Mike Evans and Chris Godwin are elite WRs. Gronk is a HoF. Ronald Jones looks to be a solid RB. They also have top 10 defense this year.

Brady winning with them is not nearly as impressive as you make it sound.

No, Brady has 0 weapons, just like his entire tenure in New England. That's really the story of Tom Brady's entire career; perseverance despite bad head coaching, 0 weapons, 0 Defense, and never taking any short cuts.

Sure, with his 73 passer rating tonight, his career playoff passer rating is now below that of Tim Tebow, but those are just... Like... Numbers man. Whatever. GOAT!!!
 

darkazcura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,901
They had Winston last year who thread like 30INTs. What were they supposed to do with that?


Are you going to dispute any of what I said btw? Are Evans and Godwin not good? Is Gronk not a HoFer? Did their defense not finish top 10 in the league?


You can't dispute the facts. It's a good team with good players.

Tampa Bay has won a total of 59 games in the previous 10 years. That's 59–101. They have good talent sure, but a lot of teams do. Brady took an absolute joke of a franchise over the last 10 years to the Super Bowl in his first season.

sorry, dude, everyone is laughing at your arguments. They are bad, and you are clearly just trolling and hating.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
Tampa Bay has won a total of 59 games in the previous 10 years. That's 59–101. They have good talent sure, but a lot of teams do. Brady took an absolute joke of a franchise over the last 10 years to the Super Bowl in his first season.

sorry, dude, everyone is laughing at your arguments. They are bad, and you are clearly just trolling and hating.
What are you even talking about? lol He has an elite set of WRs, a solid running game, and a Top 10 defense. A good team is a good team. It doesn't matter what their record was last year. They went 11-5 this year. Does that sound like a bad team to you? A team can go 0-16 and then go 16-0 the next season would you call them a bad team? Of course not. Don't be stupid.


You are the troll here by my estimation given your insults and childish jabs.
 

UltimateHigh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,500
Tampa Bay has won a total of 59 games in the previous 10 years. That's 59–101. They have good talent sure, but a lot of teams do. Brady took an absolute joke of a franchise over the last 10 years to the Super Bowl in his first season.

sorry, dude, everyone is laughing at your arguments. They are bad, and you are clearly just trolling and hating.

his arguments are correct though.

this is a pretty good football TEAM.

that's why brady can play mediocre and still win the nfc championship.
 

darkazcura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,901
What are you even talking about? lol He has an elite set of WRs, a solid running game, and a Top 10 defense. A good team is a good team. It doesn't matter what their record was last year. They went 11-5 this year. Does that sound like a bad team to you?


You are the troll here by my estimation given your insults and childish jabs.

Lmao, you posted earlier about how stats are meaningless to you, and then a few posts later used stats to defend one of your positions while simultaneously using it against Brady.

You hate Brady. The bias is so clear. It's not really worth arguing with someone so biased. Childish biases will receive childish jabs and responses. Your arguments are poor.

Stats mean nothing to you apparently. Winning doesn't mean anything either. So what's the evaluation method? Pure eye test? No one is going to have a fair discussion with someone who lives in such a subjective realm of bias.
 
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Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
Lmao, you posted earlier about how stats are meaningless to you, and then a few posts later used stats to defend one of your positions while simultaneously using it against Brady.

You hate Brady. The bias is so clear. It's not really worth arguing with someone so biased. Childish biases will receive childish jabs and responses. Your arguments are poor.

Stats mean nothing to you apparently. Winning doesn't mean anything either. So what's the evaluation method? Pure eye test? No one is going to have a fair discussion with someone who lives in such a subjective realm of bias.
Yeah you are just trolling now. I repeatedly have said that Brady is Top 5 all time despite how I feel about him. You are acting like I have just shit on him and called him bad. That was never my argument. I just said I wouldn't put him ahead of people like Marino or Montana in terms of skill at the position. Which is a perfectly reasonable stance to take.


Meanwhile you are in here trying to say an 11-5 team that just won its way into a Super Bowl is a bad team because of what they did last year. Acting like Brady is dragging a dead corpse of a team over the finish line all on his own. While also accusing others of trolling and throwing out childish jabs.
 

E.Balboa

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,459
Florianópolis, Brazil
As a Manning fan , I can't argue anymore. Brady is just so damn good at what he does.

As if he was not successful enough at NE, he transfers to the fucking Bucs , takes them to the Superbowl and just to put the cherry on top he's the first QB to take a team to a home SB. As if he needed another record...

I'd say fuck him in another time, but I've lived long enough to recognize greatness.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,359
Yeah I had the same reaction. I never heard about any of that. I watch ESPN and listen to sports radio all the time. Brown is always mentioned among the greatest of all time. I hear about his career, his community work, and his efforts regarding civil rights.

Yet somehow they never seemed to mention you know....the rape or the domestic abuse.
 

darkazcura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,901
Yeah you are just trolling now. I repeatedly have said that Brady is Top 5 all time despite how I feel about him. You are acting like I have just shit on him and called him bad. That was never my argument. I just said I wouldn't put him ahead of people like Marino or Montana in terms of skill at the position. Which is a perfectly reasonable stance to take.


Meanwhile you are in here trying to say an 11-5 team that just won its way into a Super Bowl is a bad team because of what they did last year. Acting like Brady is dragging a dead corpse of a team over the finish line all on his own.

Again, here:

Hard disagree. 4 is the highest I will give him. Montana, Marino, Unitas, and maybe even Manning are ahead of him in terms of the position itself. Obviously the most decorated of all time and a stat machine, but in a time where the QB is more protected than it's ever been (Tom Brady especially) and the passing game is more prevalent than it's ever been it's easy to rack up stats.


For example Philip Rivers just retired as 5th all time leader in passing yards I believe. Would you put him in the Top 5 all time discussion? Of course not. So the stats argument is nearly meaningless to me.

Not even close. Jim Brown, Jerry Rice, and Emmett Smith are all ahead of him. Especially Jerry and Smith. Look at their stats and then look at the next closest player to them. They are head and shoulders above the rest. Meanwhile Brady is just barely skating by others at the position when it comes to yards and TDs.

I am not trolling because I caught you in a pretzel of an argument. At first stats were meaningless to you because of era. Then all of a sudden they were meaningful. You can't change your arguments because something doesn't suit your evaluation. You even used them to support your argument on positional players. All over the place.

And, no, it is not reasonable for you to think Montana and Marino are better than Brady at this point. What is your evaluation method? Stats mean nothing to you (I think?). Winning means nothing to you apparently. So what is it? It sounds like you like Marino and Montana better as people and would prefer to have them on your team. That's fine, but no, they are not better. That is like me thinking Kobe is better than Jordan. It's an absolute joke. I like Paul Pierce better than Kobe Bryant and would take him on my team over Kobe most days of the week, but I know I'm biased there. He's not better than Kobe just cause I like him better and think he has some better moves subjectively.
 
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Big-E

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,169
Yeah you are just trolling now. I repeatedly have said that Brady is Top 5 all time despite how I feel about him. You are acting like I have just shit on him and called him bad. That was never my argument. I just said I wouldn't put him ahead of people like Marino or Montana in terms of skill at the position. Which is a perfectly reasonable stance to take.


Meanwhile you are in here trying to say an 11-5 team that just won its way into a Super Bowl is a bad team because of what they did last year. Acting like Brady is dragging a dead corpse of a team over the finish line all on his own.

Brady comes into the NFC and wins it with no training camp and a new system. The rest of the NFC let a 43 year old man make them a joke. The fact remains that this team was 7 to 9 last year and is now in a game they have not been to in longer than most in here have cared about football. Brady has had a profound impact on this team.