Finally saw The Last Jedi and now i see what y'all mean

[stefanomusilli96]

This is such a low effort post that it doesn't deserve any kind of discussion.

It's like if I made an OP about Episode I which just said "Jar Jar stepped on shit, kid was annoying. Bad". Most people agree Episode I was bad but there's no reason to provide any meaningful input to such a shit post.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Lol y' "all"

 

[Truant]

TLJ is a great movie trapped inside a terrible one.

Love Luke, love Reylo, love the «nobody» thing, loved Snoke.

Everything else is straight up bad.

 

[greenhadoken]

Movie is very bad. I'll never forget myself and others laughing out loud during multiple serious scenes on opening night, and single handedly killed any interest I had left in SW. Not as bad as the newest movie, but it was the beginning of the end. Everyone still defending this movie is either trolling or will change their mind in the next 5-10 years, just you wait :P

 

[Sol C. Johnson]

I thought it was okay but its when I realized I am pretty much done with Star Wars.

Realized the series isn't for me anymore.

I'm considering putting Star Wars on ignore. People can't control themselves around it.

 

[Dragoon]

It's a garbage movie with a few exceptional aspects OP, but era has massive hard on for this movie and will try to desperately convince you otherwise. The hyperspace moment is the best example of something looking extremely cool and being one of the best fucking things I've seen in a movie, albeit not as much as kissing while your homies are simultaneously getting murdered in the background using slow mo.

 

[Rogue74]

A masterpiece compared to Rise of Skywalker.

 

[WestEgg]

I liked it less than the people that love it, more than the people that despise it, and haven't felt the urge to rewatch it since the first time I saw it in theaters. Also still haven't seen Rise of Skywalker, I just kind of lost interest in the whole sequel era.

 

[Sordid Plebeian]

I rewatched it the other night, it's a messy film at times but has some good ideas. I can see why some people weren't into it

 

[deepFlaw]

Was hoping this would just be briefly saying how good it was but I guess this is an actual Star Wars thread.

 

[Crossing Eden]

I understand people having bad taste but ...



what?
She literally gets put on coma to heal, are you crazy?

What did you wanted? gore on a movie about space wizards for kids ?

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You expect people who didn't like TLJ to have good takes about why this dislike it?

Standalone, yeah whatever it's good enough generic feel good fantasy. But considering the franchise, they had so much potential and wasted it. In the end, we got the same old generic chosen one crap, literally copied beat for beat from previous films, in the same franchise no less. Super safe cash cow for a new generation.

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Literally one of the major points of the film is that Rey isn't a chosen one. It actively goes against that notion since it involves literally three different characters who'd fit into a chosen one archetype, none of whom fulfill the role. Hell this is spelled out very blatantly.

 

[Lost Lemurian]

I am still angry how it sidelined Finn... I still think Finn should of been the focus of the trilogy but whatever...

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He was a major focus of the movie....I don't understand...

 

[Reckheim]

Still haven't seen rise of the skywalker cause TLJ completely killed any hype I had for the trilogy. Seems like I ain't missing much anyways.

 

[King Dodongo]

Fortunately the movie cured my insomnia. The rest was awful. Mark Hamill said it best "not my Luke". Turd of a movie.

 

[thecouncil]

TLJ is a great movie trapped inside a terrible one.

Love Luke, love Reylo, love the «nobody» thing, loved Snoke.

Everything else is straight up bad.

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Yes.

I'll add that Holdo is cool and this movie made Poe extremely unlikeable which isn't a great idea for one of your main trilogy heroes. He sucks so much that Holdo has to commit suicide.

 

[Kotze282]

But what about Space Friction/Resistance (drag) ?
We are talking about a series with space explosions and space sound, so it is clear that space oxigen exists




...or maybe it is better not try to rationalize it that much =P

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Wasn't the explosion in Last Jedi silent? They're not even consistent with it.

Spoiler

The bombers' rails are built in a way where the bombs are accelerated fast enough for Space Friction not to be in issue until impact.

 

[SirMossyBloke]

Absolutely the worst SW movie since the prequels. That whole middle sequence shouldnt even exist.

 

[DeltaRed]

I thought the Holdo maneuver was the stupidest thing in Star Wars but the Sith Dagger in TROS quickly surpassed it.

 

[Transistor]

A movie that tried its best to move Star Wars forward, and then The Rise of Skywalker ruined everything

 

[Crossing Eden]

One tried too hard to be edgy and subversive, the other tried too hard to be safe and generic.

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There's nothing edgy about TLJ.

Yes.

I'll add that Holdo is cool and this movie made Poe extremely unlikeable which isn't a great idea for one of your main trilogy heroes. He sucks so much that Holdo has to commit suicide.

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Holdo was always planning on committing suicide. They even foreshadowed it multiple times.

 

[Deleted member 3208]

Only movie of the entire sequel trilogy worth watching. It isn't perfect, but at least it tried to do something unique. Also loved Luke's arc.

 

[lmcfigs]

I think not going through w/ the Rey Finn relationship was cowardly. And it's insulting that they just write it off in the sequel. so like even an Asian romantic interest was too much

 

[wingkongex]

Only movie of the entire sequel trilogy worth watching. It isn't perfect, but at least it tried to do something unique. Also loved Luke's arc.

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This is my feeling on it as well. It's also the best looking Star Wars movie.

 

[Loud Wrong]

The best and worst thing I can say about it is that it was boring.

 

[lmcfigs]

Yes.

I'll add that Holdo is cool and this movie made Poe extremely unlikeable which isn't a great idea for one of your main trilogy heroes. He sucks so much that Holdo has to commit suicide.

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but she wasn't cool tho. that whole subplot only happened because she refused to tell anyone her plan, to the point where her subordinates were going to mutiny. that's just awful.

 

[SealedSeven]

The Last Jedi at least had a storyline that was fluid / moved at a reasonable pace. The Rise of Skywalker on the other hand......



I don't think the first hour of the movie stayed in one spot for more than 30 seconds....

 

[Cognitive Genome]

TLJ is a great movie trapped inside a terrible one.

Love Luke, love Reylo, love the «nobody» thing, loved Snoke.

Everything else is straight up bad.

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This is kind of where I'm at, sans Reylo (the ship if that's what you're referring to, I loved the interactions between the two in a platonic/enemies sense.) Everything else was garbo tho outside of visuals, which I think were absolutely amazing.

 

[svacina]

This is kind of where I'm at, sans Reylo (the ship if that's what you're referring to, I loved the interactions between the two in a platonic/enemies sense.) Everything else was garbo tho outside of visuals, which I think were absolutely amazing.

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On the casino planet even the visuals are bad. A cursed place.

 

[Deleted member 7051]

TLJ is a great movie trapped inside a terrible one.

Love Luke, love Reylo, love the «nobody» thing, loved Snoke.

Everything else is straight up bad.

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It needed to be standalone, divorced from the sequel trilogy and all the Resistance nonsense, focusing only on the relationships between Rey, Ben and Luke. Luke's fear of failing Rey like he failed Ben, Rey's fear of no longer having a purpose if Luke won't train her, Ben's fear of never being able to let go of his past...

The three of them being on a collision course with each other, each trying to save another in their own way, would have been far more compelling without the Resistance stuff getting in the way.

 

[Luckett_X]

Paraphrased, but the fact a morally grey character says "the real problem is these Star Wars" says all you need to know about how 'clever' the film actually is.

 

[ghostemoji]

The lightspeed kamikaze is the coolest thing Star Wars ever did.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

You mean it made everything better. Fantastic movie. Best SW anything since Empire.

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.

 

[FF Seraphim]

He was a major focus of the movie....I don't understand...

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His whole subplot was almost pointless. You can take anything related to him out of the movie and you would still get the same outcome. If they have a hyperspace tracker they would of surely find the few resistance troops that escaped.

 

[PeskyToaster]

Not liking a movie makes you alt right now?

FWIW I'm just sorta meh on it. Some of it really like (Luke, Kylo and Rey), some it I really don't (everything with Finn and Rose, Leia Poppins).

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Obviously not. It just means you agree with them and have the same opinions as them with pretty much the exact same bullet point list of "grievances". I think it hints at someone's worldview when they, for example, have an issue with a nonviolent resolution to the movie when it seems to happen very rarely in these sorts of movies and also be a core tenant of the Jedi.

 

[AppleKid]

Haha yeah, have said it before here but I really disliked this movie. The coolest thing it could have done was have Rey & Kylo team up at the end, each hoping to sway the other and do what's "best" for the galaxy. Instead they just turned it into something completely unremarkable: Kylo going full-on spoiled teenager dictator mode and Rey becoming the last hope for the "good guys".

It doesn't matter how many expectations you subvert in a movie if the end result is not much different than the status quo for the series.

And while I can't agree that Rian Johnson "ruined" anything as I don't know where Abrams would have taken the full trilogy (nor was TFA spotless), I did find it disappointing that he chose to scrap so much of the setup put in place by that movie. The two most exciting things about TFA were that it was finally a Star Wars where I wasn't constantly cringing at the dialogue AND the sense of mystery/potential it laid out as the first movie in a trilogy. For TLJ to ignore most of that for the sake of subverting expectations is definitely what cemented this trilogy's legacy as the most disjointed one of all time.

Wait until you get to ROS OP, it's even worse 😂

 

[lmcfigs]

His whole subplot was almost pointless. You can take anything related to him out of the movie and you would still get the same outcome. If they have a hyperspace tracker they would of surely find the few resistance troops that escaped.

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but like this is the other thing. Removing Finn from the movie would have objectively lead to better outcomes for pretty much everyone. it's not just that his plotline was useless, it's that it actively got tons of people killed. it was worse for everyone. and then his one shot at redemption at the end where he was going to sacrifice himself was thwarted, so he just goes into the third movie like nothing happened... and no one talks about how much he fucked up.

 

[Eidan]

The complaints in the OP are painfully dumb, and I can't believe they're the anchor for this thread.

 

[Crossing Eden]

His whole subplot was almost pointless.

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His subplot had a more direct and tangible effect on the actual plot of the film than Rey's.

You can take anything related to him out of the movie and you would still get the same outcome.

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How does the First Order find out about the Resistance's plan, which was 100% working as intended, without Finn, Rose, and DJ being captured, and DJ, the guy Finn and Rose trusted, spilling the beans, after overhearing Finn being told Holdo's plan? Which eventually led to the hyperspeed ramming and then the Battle of Crait. You'd have to do major rewrites of the film if you were to remove Finn's plot. Meanwhile, how does Finn contribute in meaningful way in the Rise of Skywalker? THAT'S an example of a character being easily removed and it changing little to nothing.

but like this is the other thing. Removing Finn from the movie would have objectively lead to better outcomes for pretty much everyone. it's not just that his plotline was useless, it's that it actively got tons of people killed. it was worse for everyone. and then his one shot at redemption at the end where he was going to sacrifice himself was thwarted, so he just goes into the third movie like nothing happened... and no one talks about how much he fucked up.

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Finn was following Poe's lead. Poe is the defacto leader by the end of the film and thus all of the fuckups can be attributed to him. Finn's sacrifice would've been as effective as Holdo's. I.e., the FO wasn't gonna be stopped. The film very blatantly telegraphs that this is all Finn's "sacrifice" would've amounted to:

Finn's redemption is based n him becoming fully committed in the first place.

 

[Cognitive Genome]

Obviously not. It just means you agree with them and have the same opinions as them with pretty much the exact same bullet point list of "grievances". I think it hints at someone's worldview when they, for example, have an issue with a nonviolent resolution to the movie when it seems to happen very rarely in these sorts of movies and also be a core tenant of the Jedi.

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Yea tho for all the non-violence parts, they always turn around and end w/ someone getting thrown down a shaft or blown up or

Basically

 

[NookSports]

Not liking a movie makes you alt right now?

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I don't think it makes you alt-right, but when you scratch a lot of the issues people have with the movie, I think it surprisingly tracks like a progressive / conservative issue (in the classical sense).

It seems where the biggest fault line in the movie is between people expecting Star Wars to go back to the great en was it had in the OT,

vs people who appreciate TLJ for being a more serious character piece that looked back into Star Wars lore to criticize, yes, but also to move forward in a better way.

 

[lmcfigs]

His subplot had a more direct and tangible effect on the actual plot of the film than Rey's.

How does the First Order find out about the Resistance's plan, which was 100% working as intended, without Finn, Rose, and DJ being captured, and DJ, the guy Finn and Rose trusted, spilling the beans, after overhearing Finn being told Holdo's plan? Which eventually led to the hyperspeed ramming and then the Battle of Crait. You'd have to do major rewrites of the film if you were to remove Finn's plot. Meanwhile, how does Finn contribute in meaningful way in the Rise of Skywalker? THAT'S an example of a character being easily removed and it changing little to nothing.


Finn was following Poe's lead. Poe is the defacto leader by the end of the film and thus all of the fuckups can be attributed to him. Finn's sacrifice would've been as effective as Holdo's. I.e., the FO wasn't gonna be stopped. The film very blatantly telegraphs that this is all Finn's "sacrifice" would've amounted to:

Finn's redemption is based n him becoming fully committed in the first place.

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it's so weird, i feel like we have the same reading of the issue, but i 100% blame The Last Jedi for this. lol. It's like the opposite of an alley-oop - instead of setting up a slam dunk for the next guy, who kind of just fuck him over. there's a lot of problems like this in TLJ.

 

[Lost Lemurian]

His whole subplot was almost pointless. You can take anything related to him out of the movie and you would still get the same outcome. If they have a hyperspace tracker they would of surely find the few resistance troops that escaped.

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He had a whole huge arc, that changed his entire character....

And the entire point of that arc was that he failed...that's why it "didn't have an effect on the outcome"...

And that's still not right, because DJ told the First Order about the cloaked escape ships, which they never would've found otherwise. So it absolutely did affect the outcome.

 

[PeskyToaster]

Yea tho for all the non-violence parts, they always turn around and end w/ someone getting thrown down a shaft or blown up or

Basically

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That's why it's kind of cool that Luke actually uses the force and isn't even there but still defeats the enemy, That's practically "The Point". You are in touch with the binding force of the entire Universe. Fuck the laser sword and use that. Luke using a lightsaber in that moment would be like Magneto using an aluminum baseball bat and not any of his godlike powers.

 

[Garlador]

I respect those who like it.

I personally didn't find it that enjoyable.

I respect what it tried to do.

I personally feel it didn't execute those concepts properly.

I respect the amazing new directions it potentially opened up.

I personally feel like it's even worse now that Rise of Skywalker backtracked on most of them.

 

[NookSports]

I personally feel like it's even worse now that Rise of Skywalker backtracked on most of them.

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This I think we can maybe all agree with. I think TLJ could've been made retroactively more or less beloved, based on its sequel.
And as much as people say TLJ "threw out" TFA plot points, I think it more resolved them in ways people didn't want. ROS straight up just erased TLJ from its memory

 

[Cognitive Genome]

That's why it's kind of cool that Luke actually uses the force and isn't even there but still defeats the enemy, That's practically "The Point". You are in touch with the binding force of the entire Universe. Fuck the laser sword and use that. Luke using a lightsaber in that moment would be like Magneto using an aluminum baseball bat and not any of his godlike powers.

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Oh, I do agree with that, I loved Luke's stuff and I felt his scene there was the perfect way to troll Kylo while also still embodying what should be the Jedi way. Just that in the end, it allowed them to escape. Does make me wonder what the third movie would have been like if Rian had done it, since it's entirely possible to have "won" if Kylo had been converted back to the light side (sans the relationship crap) by Rey. No Snoke or Palps to have to 100% kill because they weren't going to anime friendship their way out of that kinda situation.

 

[Harry Potter Obama]

A good but long read from a few years back:

The Last Jedi From A Certain Point of View: An Honest, In-Depth Analysis

A detailed look at The Last Jedi, both what worked and what didn’t. “This will not go the way you think.”

mmxreviews.com

 

[olag]

His whole subplot was almost pointless. You can take anything related to him out of the movie and you would still get the same outcome. If they have a hyperspace tracker they would of surely find the few resistance troops that escaped.

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It never fails to disappoint me that people actually believe that Finn got character development in TLJ. It's also usually in the vain of, "he learnt not to be selfish"....like the child soldier who left his home cause he couldn't see stand killing people and saved someone cause he thought it was the right thing to do is selfish cause he doesn't want to fight for the rebellion.

And before people go he was too obsessed with Rey then ill retort by asking how many movies had him half naked screaming for the white girl who he was hesitant on helping in the last movie?Just TLJ? Cool.

 

[Crossing Eden]

it's so weird, i feel like we have the same reading of the issue, but i 100% blame The Last Jedi for this. lol. It's like the opposite of an alley-oop - instead of setting up a slam dunk for the next guy, who kind of just fuck him over. there's a lot of problems like this in TLJ.

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The entire film is about the newer generation failing, that failure having grave consequences, and them learning from that failure and using what they learned to survive. The film does not ignore this or the current anxiety of the situation at all:

It never fails to disappoint me that people actually believe that Finn got character development in TLJ. It's also usually in the vain of, "he learnt not to be selfish"....like the child soldier who left his home cause he couldn't see stand killing people and saved someone cause he thought it was the right thing to do is selfish cause he doesn't want to fight for the rebellion.

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Lmao at thinking that Finn saved Poe or Rey because it was "the right thing to do" or that he left the First Order because he couldn't stand killing people. What a total misread of the character in the first film.

 

[mikhailguy]

Anyone who doesn't like the Luke "hologram" doesn't get the movie.