Agreed, let people break the game in fun and creative ways. Don't try too hard to keep it balanced when that's ultimately never what makes an arpg enjoyable.
Agreed, let people break the game in fun and creative ways. Don't try too hard to keep it balanced when that's ultimately never what makes an arpg enjoyable.
Gah, I really hate how they want stats as simplistic as "attack" and "defense" to be your main stats. The attack stats in particular is just dumb, it's just gonna lead to a lot of cases where caster classes like sorceresses run around with big melee weapons just like it did in D3
MrLlama video up-- one of the best D2 speed runners, dude breathes diablo 2. Very long video, but it's as deep a dive you can get from someone who is a literally a master of D2.
Why do I need to get screwed? Diablo 3 looked good, this looks good.Yeeeeeeeeeessssssss!!!!!!!!!
See Blizzard? You can make Diablo look like Diablo after all!! Screw all the D3 art apologists!! This looks amazing
Enigma was broken purely because teleport was the best skill in the game. Teleport is not a skill that a class doesn't need, you know what I mean. There isn't any drawbacks to using teleport and it improves everything about whatever build was using it. Having that kind of mobility is just OP.Enigma isn't really the problem. The real issue is that a) battle.net forces you to play in a certain way and b) teleport is indispensable to playing in that way and 6/7 classes need enigma to get teleport.
Enigma is not nearly as relevant in single player because you don't have to worry about eating a temporary ban for making games too quickly. Accordingly, the game doesn't completely revolve around doing the most you can in ~5 minutes like playing on battle.net does.
Ironically, outside of the context of battle.net enigma actually probably contributes quite a bit to class balance since it gives a lot of mobility to otherwise very slow classes. Offline it's a gear choice to be weighed, not an item you are basically forced to get.
Physical builds didn't really want it. You needed some kind of faster cast rate for it to work well which depended on the class you used. Javazon is one of the more popular endgame builds and it doesn't use Enigma. At least not for Teleport.Enigma was broken purely because teleport was the best skill in the game. Teleport is not a skill that a class doesn't need, you know what I mean. There isn't any drawbacks to using teleport and it improves everything about whatever build was using it. Having that kind of mobility is just OP.
This. They had different art directions, but that doesn't mean D3 looked bad by any means.Why do I need to get screwed? Diablo 3 looked good, this looks good.
D3 didn't look bad, but it was too cartoonish considering it's roots. It didn't help that the whole tone of the game was very cartoonish. Cutscenes, characters and all.This. They had different art directions, but that doesn't mean D3 looked bad by any means.
Heck, if we ignore the difference in tech (lighting in D4 looks great), I think the art in D3 is better than D4 so far.Why do I need to get screwed? Diablo 3 looked good, this looks good.
You're talking about vanilla D3. Current D3, not anymore. They're all using wands (and certain sword/dagger) because legendary affixes are more important than the damage number of the weapon. Even then, a sorceror running around carrying a big melee weapon is not a problem by itself. PoE lets players who know what they're doing, build a witch who is melee attacker wielding two handed hammer crushing endgame, with the right setup.
Exactly, the interplay between skills/items/passives is completely different with one giving you infinitely more latitude to create something weird but fun, whereas the other gives you almost none of that freedom.I'm glad if they fixed it in D3. Though I'm curious if that's something that only really goes into effect once you hit endgame and start getting all the cool legendary's through farming? For instance, are you still feeling the need to use big 2handers while leveling a wizards when a new season rolls around because it's dps is higher and your spell dmg is tied to that weapon dps? Because then the fundamental stat issue is still there.
And D3 and PoE are two completely different beasts. Something like 2hander builds for a witch in PoE is the result of the game having an incredible amount of build freedom. In D3 it's the exact opposite where using 2handers was basically just a forced choice for you due to bad and restrictive game design
No build really needs it. Teleport is just so good that it was the optimal armour choice purely because teleport is OP.Physical builds didn't really want it. You needed some kind of faster cast rate for it to work well which depended on the class you used. Javazon is one of the more popular endgame builds and it doesn't use Enigma. At least not for Teleport.
Any words if they will support modding on this one? It was one of the big reasons why i didn't get 3 despite playing the hell out of 2.
Yeah the master overhaul in Betrayal marks a huge power spike for players due to multimodding made easier and master crafting have access more so many powerful affixes for rares. That said, it's largely for the better, both to get rid of the stupid master missions pre-Betrayal, and making crafted items more assessable, in the expense of power creeping. The good thing was they are still updating uniques, especially the crappy ones to make them more relevant, and they're introducing more and more build enabling or interesting uniques. Your last sentence might be referring to Shaper and Elder bases, which were introduced during the last expansion last year, and yeah they made rares of those bases potentially incredibly powerful.
MrLlama video up-- one of the best D2 speed runners, dude breathes diablo 2. Very long video, but it's as deep a dive you can get from someone who is a literally a master of D2.
Heck, if we ignore the difference in tech (lighting in D4 looks great), I think the art in D3 is better than D4 so far.
I never understood the hate toward D3 art.
Dead on. Frustratingly accurate. How can they think these are worthwhile design principles for a flagship arpg!?The more I hear from Kim and his design goals and itemization philosophy, the more I think he doesn't understand how to make a fundamentally solid arpg. He's taking the worst from Diablo three and the team is just mimicking the art style of two (which I actually like in regards to the latter, they should be more daring to lift components from d2 or other games completely imo). The cooldowns obsession is bizarre and completely restrictive, the legendary affixes still sound boring, the skill trees are too simplistic to stimulate much creativity or room for exploration, and they keep talking about playing games like Last Epoch and POE without having the stones to ripoff the most unique and fun aspects of those games (the economy, passive trees/skill trees and itemization approaches). I guess I don't understand what they're trying to do other than not overwhelm casual players. Which leaves you in a crappy no-man's-land. As someone watching out of intrigue more than anything it's frustrating that they've learned so little from playing these other games. It makes POE 4.0 that much more anticipated for me now ultimately. The main benefit Blizzard has now is time to course correct. I just think they believe so strongly in their core philosophy that they'll never change it.
That's not true though. When you take battle.net considerations out of the equation there are actually a lot of reasons not to use enigma.Enigma was broken purely because teleport was the best skill in the game. Teleport is not a skill that a class doesn't need, you know what I mean. There isn't any drawbacks to using teleport and it improves everything about whatever build was using it. Having that kind of mobility is just OP.
Figures... Hate when companies force online components into a game that's just as playable solo. And i bet offline play will not get patched in when the servers inevitably gets shut down.
Diablo 3 looked nothing like it's predecessors, whether it looked good or not was not the point. It was clearly a shift towards the Warcraft style of art, which was a terrible decision. It pretty much removed all of it's trademark aesthetics. The dark, gory and gritty look of Diablo was a big part of why people liked the series.Why do I need to get screwed? Diablo 3 looked good, this looks good.
Yeah. In fact, you can play the original Diablo online if you want to.Inevitably? I think Diablo 2 servers are still running 19 years later.
Not true at all. The casting delay is horrendous for a lot of classes without fcr investment, which is limited to a number of slots. Physical builds for example want Ravenfrost in one of the ring slots. It's simply ineffective and inefficient to teleport around and farm at the same time. I mean, I guess you could if you want to showboat how many throwaway Jahs and Bers you have.No build really needs it. Teleport is just so good that it was the optimal armour choice purely because teleport is OP.
Hammerdin still works but tp made it OP.
Singer works but again, tp.
Javazon was a great cow build. You could get away without enigma because it didn't optimize the build which just ran around a highly populated area.
You can't really say you wouldn't want tp though. It was just so good for most things you did in the game.
Street Fighter 2 looked nothing like 1, 3 looked nothing like 2.Diablo 3 looked nothing like it's predecessors, whether it looked good or not was not the point. It was clearly a shift towards the Warcraft style of art, which was a terrible decision. It pretty much removed all of it's trademark aesthetics. The dark, gory and gritty look of Diablo was a big part of why people liked the series.
Inevitably? I think Diablo 2 servers are still running 19 years later.
What a weird, weird, comparison. Why not bring up a racing game or something? And I'm not even sure I agree with it. Street Fighter always had a more stylized than real look, something they maintained even after switching to 3D... A better comparison would be if Mortal Combat switched to Street Fighter art style... which would never happen.Street Fighter 2 looked nothing like 1, 3 looked nothing like 2.
Continuity is usually thrown around as an argument ender and its really not. New games are allowed to look different and find new ways to explore themes and expression (most of the D3 art team moved to Riot after its release, btw)
I would prefer people not to take a tone that implies "real" fans prefer the darker look (or that theyre the majority) and people who dare to like something slightly different should screw themselves. A bunch of people who didnt like it were very vocal yes, but it doesnt make you any less of a Diablo fan for liking how 3 looked, we can have range and not be so tied to binary choices when it comes to this stuff.
I take your point about not playing the "real fans only like X entry" game. But I think the real issue is that Diablo 3's art style is just representative of a broader apathy towards the series' qualities in general. Accordingly, it's an easy thing that you can point to and say "look, these guys didn't really know what they were doing" rather than offering an in-depth analysis of the ways in which the minute-to-minute combat in Diablo 3 is fundamentally much different than its predecessors - it is, but to explain that exhaustively would require many more words than simply pointing at a picture.Street Fighter 2 looked nothing like 1, 3 looked nothing like 2.
Continuity is usually thrown around as an argument ender and its really not. New games are allowed to look different and find new ways to explore themes and expression (most of the D3 art team moved to Riot after its release, btw)
I would prefer people not to take a tone that implies "real" fans prefer the darker look (or that theyre the majority) and people who dare to like something slightly different should screw themselves. A bunch of people who didnt like it were very vocal yes, but it doesnt make you any less of a Diablo fan for liking how 3 looked, we can have range and not be so tied to binary choices when it comes to this stuff.
What a weird, weird, comparison. Why not bring up a racing game or something? And I'm not even sure I agree with it.
Also I'm not sure why you decided to quote "real" fans. I didn't say anything of the sorts.
Edit: Asked Jason if he has heard anything about new reboots, this version is one from late 2016
You have to keep in mind that this is a new engine, we don't know when they built it, and they clearly already have a ton of high quality assets already built. I imagine they spent a quite a while making big picture decisions about the game too.
Rhykker asked David Kim about it and I got the impression they're looking to do that, at least one anyway, there was another leak earlier that said paladin and amazon so who knows.I'm hoping at least one of the remaining classes will be new to the series. It would be pretty ridiculous to have nothing new for launch.
Its bad enough we get fucking Barbarian every game taking up a slot.
I'd argue making a Souls clone in a market with many Souls clone is safer than a top down hack'n'slash at this point.Diablo 1 and 2 were plenty stylized with a lot of their art direction. Just cause you make things 80% black doesnt mean its realistic. Different teams come to different interpretations of similar concepts so thats what the team in charge of D3 decided a Diablo game could look like. Diablo 4 is made by a very different team, hell I have it on good authority it started as a Dark Souls clone anyways. It looks quite good, of course, but its a very safe approach.
And yeah, wasnt meant to quote you, meant that as a general sentiment. Apologies.
I'm hoping at least one of the remaining classes will be new to the series. It would be pretty ridiculous to have nothing new for launch.
Its bad enough we get fucking Barbarian every game taking up a slot.
Something I noticed during the world & lore panel; they showed some footage where the lighting was closer to D2, with light emanating from the main character (casting dynamic shadows and all) and a dark vignette around that. I really hope they didn't remove the effect, it looks good imo and they should make it toggle-able.Visually, there is one thing thing I would change in Diablo 4.
Highlighting enemies with red outlines, and having that yellow flashing effect on bigger monsters does not look good. Are these even needed? I think both of these effects look bad. There are more subtle ways of showing the player which enemy he or she is targeting.
What useful information does that yellow flashing effect on that big world event boss provide me? That multiple players are constantly hitting it? I know that already, I would rather look at the monster model without the effects that look out of place.
You are not entirely wrong but there are huge benefits to having trading as well. Players are able to find niches in the market and it attracts certain type of players. It also makes items actually valuable... an item doesn't actually have value if you can't trade it. It also makes it that so you aren't punished by RNG if you can't find the uniques to make your build work.Reading reddit, heaps want open trading to return.... which is the one thing I can't stand. It leads to external real money abuse and time spent in trade chat and not playing the game! Am I wrong?