Devs react to PS5 specs - Twitter edition
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I listened to the podcast because the article seemed pretty bunk but what I got wasn't the fact that the ps5 = 10 TF is bad. It was the belief that Xbox series x with more CUs will perform better RT, that with fixed clocks the series x is easier to get to stability in build and then easier to perform optimisations, that the ps5s boost clocks and power management make it harder to get there as you need to find the optimal profile then find stability then perform optimisations (or his friends said so but who knows). And I think the only reason he really agreed to go on there is because dealer gave the dude a carrot to expand on his points (which has already been taken out of context in other articles) and spoke nicely to him after he received a Twitter skulldragging.
We are in a thread titled "devs react to ps5" where the front page was full of devs (Sony aligned and not aligned, some still in the industry some not) praising the SSD as a secret sauce. Sony fanboys then took this and decided to ram it all around and spread FUD about the design of the Xbox (brute force vs intelligent design). And that's fine, if that's where Sony's priorities are and they decided to make trade offs to get that ssd in there cool. But it's a little disingenuous to then treat everyone who doesn't agree with that hot take like a hobo living under a bridge.
And lastly if your point is that the ps5 has more TF than an ultra budget console designed for low income economies and 1080p displays. Then you got me I guess. The ps5 is better than the baseline, but for what it's worth it really should be given the crow about how incredible the designers are and how much they want to be considered the prestige company of video games
But really this collective insecurity from fans of a hobby which is meant to be about coming get together to enjoy stories and experiences and the temper tantrums it's making is really depressing tbh
he definitely does not have access to a Dev kit, he never claimed he has, so this article is making up crap. He does have friends that are actively working on both consoles.
This is really stupid. The PS5 is 10.28 TF RDNA2. That should be around 15 TF in GCN terms. Add to that 16 GB of RAM, an 8 core 3.5 GHZ CPU, and a blistering fast SSD, and you have an incredible machine. The PS5 won't struggle on any multiplat games, unless they happen to be badly optimised for it.
That said, the Series X is indeed more powerful, and when it comes to raytracing, we might see significant differences between the two consoles. My personal guess would be that PS5 games will go for either RT global illumination or RT reflections, while games on Series X should be able to have both.
Again, just my thoughts. No inside knowledge.
That said, the Series X is indeed more powerful, and when it comes to raytracing, we might see significant differences between the two consoles. My personal guess would be that PS5 games will go for either RT global illumination or RT reflections, while games on Series X should be able to have both.
Again, just my thoughts. No inside knowledge.
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Well if we assume that scaling will only happen on the graphical end, do you think every graphical effect will scale linearly up and down? I don't have the answer myself but I can imagine certain effects to have a fixed minimum cost that might be too high for such a system, where as a bigger system can take the hit.
If you stritcly named AMD, maybe you can try in the NVIDIA Minecraft Digital Foundry thread?
I think this is the safest bet.
Regardless, we should all be excited for Next Gen and stop all of this petty arguing over who has more teraflops, etc. Both systems sound amazing and will do wonders for consumers, so can we PLEASE just be stoked as gamers? Besides, none of you here even know the full list of features for both consoles, so this doom and gloom nonsense over hardware specs is pointless. Just wait for full reveals and pick your console of choice (or pick both).
The problem with Series X isn't 4TF. The problem will be if it has less RAM or is missing RT features.
Do you really expect all 3rd parties to enforce PC users to have 12GB or more RAM in their GPUs and RT as a minimum requirement? So with all games being available on PC for the foreseeable future and very few people owning RT capable GPUs, that will not be an issue.
Honestly, if anybody expects more than low level raytracing or mostly used for flurish and effects, then they are kidding themselves. good developers will use it like magic fairy dust sprinkles in the right amount on the right things, but it wont be "ALL IS RAYTRACED". And thats ok. just look at the tankink of framerates with top end graphics cards in minecraft. So arguing that one raytracing solution is better than the other is kinda missing the point that its more a "nice to have" feature for big budget games, and less a "nececity".
Thats the reason why it was such a big thing when they published the first RT cards, since a lot of tech folks even expected it to take another 10 years before its really usable.
Thats the reason why it was such a big thing when they published the first RT cards, since a lot of tech folks even expected it to take another 10 years before its really usable.
This thread is about dev's reaction/comments/feedback to the console.
We've seen third-party/internal/ex-dev/journalist-talking-to-dev-anecdotes/etc all share their limited thoughts on the product, some with more clarity than others, for obvious reasons cough NDA cough. Not all of them are aligned in their narrative of the consoles, but that's perfectly normal since developers cover a wide spectrum of expertise to begin with. An engine programmer compared to a game designer compared to a technical artist compared to a QA analyst, etc. There's obviously other factors, but I'm not in the mood of entertaining notions of console fanboyism as a factor for lying/spin/etc.
It's fair to have some degree of skepticism or optimism depending on a variety of factors. (E.g. this latest sharing is from someone who hasn't been in game dev for 7+ years, as one example) That's why this thread exist - to discuss the things being said, compare them to the official messaging, what the spec sheets say, and you know - be level-headed and shit.
We've seen third-party/internal/ex-dev/journalist-talking-to-dev-anecdotes/etc all share their limited thoughts on the product, some with more clarity than others, for obvious reasons cough NDA cough. Not all of them are aligned in their narrative of the consoles, but that's perfectly normal since developers cover a wide spectrum of expertise to begin with. An engine programmer compared to a game designer compared to a technical artist compared to a QA analyst, etc. There's obviously other factors, but I'm not in the mood of entertaining notions of console fanboyism as a factor for lying/spin/etc.
It's fair to have some degree of skepticism or optimism depending on a variety of factors. (E.g. this latest sharing is from someone who hasn't been in game dev for 7+ years, as one example) That's why this thread exist - to discuss the things being said, compare them to the official messaging, what the spec sheets say, and you know - be level-headed and shit.
Listen... We need to be clear. "Dealergaming" is a homophobe. I do not understand why people keep posting his content. His rants calling people words that would get any of us perma banned with the quickness is still available online for people to be hurt by if they run into it.
Don't post his trash here. I don't care about what he or who he is supporting. Do not post his trash on era. And no, I'm not a mod. Just human.
Don't post his trash here. I don't care about what he or who he is supporting. Do not post his trash on era. And no, I'm not a mod. Just human.
And do you really expect that one-day 3rd parties won't increase minimum requirements? I'm talking about the console being the baseline for the next 8 years.
Do the effects have the scale? It's a gpu with 1/3rd the power but targeting only 1/4th the resolution. It should be able to have same graphics just as lower resolution unless I'm mistaking how that works.
Its true that I am not involved in the games industry or whatever, so I am just talking from how I understand that these stuff work but I always get confused at the talk about how the RT computational capabilities on Xbox will be 40% better than what will be on PS5 because it has 40% more compute units.
more compute units means you can shoot more rays at a time, higher clock means you can shoot rays more frequently, in the end the result is the same, the amount of rays that could be calculated on each side should be comparable to the compute capability difference, because imagine this, lets say (completely arbitrary numbers) every 1mhz an RT core will trace one ray, now lets say (completely arbitrary numbers) xbox has 52 RT cores while PS5 has 36 RT cores, PS5 can shoot only 36 rays per cycle of RT calculation, but it will also perform 22% more ray trace cycles, so while xbox could shoot 94.9k rays in one second, PS5 will shoot 80.28k rays, which is the same ratio as the compute power difference. we are not talking about 40% better ray tracing performance that some person like the ex developer in the article seems to suggest
I'd be happy to be corrected about this, but it just doesnt make much sense, i'll give another thought experiment to make it clearer: would a 52 CU RDNA 2 GPU running at 1hz have the same RT performance as the Series X?
more compute units means you can shoot more rays at a time, higher clock means you can shoot rays more frequently, in the end the result is the same, the amount of rays that could be calculated on each side should be comparable to the compute capability difference, because imagine this, lets say (completely arbitrary numbers) every 1mhz an RT core will trace one ray, now lets say (completely arbitrary numbers) xbox has 52 RT cores while PS5 has 36 RT cores, PS5 can shoot only 36 rays per cycle of RT calculation, but it will also perform 22% more ray trace cycles, so while xbox could shoot 94.9k rays in one second, PS5 will shoot 80.28k rays, which is the same ratio as the compute power difference. we are not talking about 40% better ray tracing performance that some person like the ex developer in the article seems to suggest
I'd be happy to be corrected about this, but it just doesnt make much sense, i'll give another thought experiment to make it clearer: would a 52 CU RDNA 2 GPU running at 1hz have the same RT performance as the Series X?
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Or.. has an even slower SSD. Not sure how possible that is.. but if they come in at $299 .. there has to be bigger sacrifices.
I believe that it will be more than capable, I was just thinking if it's really that easy as having the same game at 1/4 the resolution.
Wait, how in the world does the PS5 struggle with open world games when the gap in power between the 2 consoles only accounts for either a slight resolution difference or a slight framerate difference? Not to mention the SSD? And the PS5 is even easier to develop for than the PS4.....I don't understand why some act like the PS5 is some failed product with shit architecture when nothing supports that. Sure the console will have its limits but its clear for now, its a very impressively designed piece of hardware.
They are fanboys and their opinions should be discarded. Anyone making or believing such absolute claims is a complete and utter joke. By that logic, the Xbox One S is a last gen console compared to the PS4.
I hope their premiere console is not targeting 1080p in 2020 (until DLSS is mature of course)
I am an Xbox fan, but I can't think of something worse than these kinds of comments being aired and put out into the universe for someone to take literally. It doesn't do anything to spread FUD and have people talking inaccuracies. What does it even accomplish?
Cant wait to see games on both these machines, then we can move on. Would be funny if Sony had Horizon to show straight away, and it's some insane open world game never seen before. It would be awesome just to prove that persons comments as incorrect.
It could certainly be possible, I've even heard they could make a REALLY cost-effective 1GB/s SSD if they wanted. If we assume that third party games will only be built around the most basic PC SATA SSD, a 1GB/s drive would still be twice as fast as that.
Oh, you know why. We all do.
*sigh* Well I don't think I'll be believing any of their "information" in the future.
I have no idea why the PS5 would suddenly be terrible for open world games. That makes zero sense. What drivel.
And that is what frightens me lol
SX is the more powerful machine and you'd think they'd just talk up the SX's strengths without the PS5 downplay. But nope. It has to be maximum FUD with PS5 struggling with open world games and silly overheating rumors
For some, console warring is a zero sum game. One must lose for the other to win.
to be fair, playstation fans were ragging on the xbox one and exaggerating the power difference for half a generation. Only when playstation was no longer the most powerful did power stop mattering. (I own both current systems and will own both next gen systems, I'm just pointing out the double standard)
to have RT as standard would mean a GTX 2060 as minimum spec. I think we are a long way off from that - possibly not for the entirety of next gen
yeah. Crazy times, maybe the warz are an outlet right now for a lot of real world frustrationx
User warned: Platform warring
There has been a subset of xbox fanboys who couldn't take this gen. They thought their wounds would be healed with the Xbox One X, but it never did.
A powerful console cannot heal a broken soul.
And now their mantra is:
It is what it is and there are garbage people on other warrior fronts, too. However I notice it way more on the Xbox side of things than Nintendo or Sony.
I expect that as the usual cross-gen cycle finish, it's safe to assume that RT will be required. Especially with consoles pushing it and it being something that can speed up game dev.
Now that's a great post, well thought-out! I'm not a computer scientist my self, but this makes sense. Let's hope soon everything will be clear when the reveals happen and we see both consoles in action