Daisy Ridley: "I literally was told that [Rey] was no one"

[John Harker]

From what I've read between the lines, after Trevow was let go, there was such a rush to get this out the door, Kennedy/Disney had strong ideas on where they wanted it to go and JJ and Terrio came in pretty much to deliever on it. Seemed based on what Chris said in interviews a lot of major points were already decided on, their job was how to get there.

for better or wors, ROS has a lot of people accountable for it.

I don't put it all on JJ

 

[OptiveLink]

Luke, one of the greatest Force wielders of all time couldn't even beat a practice droid on the Falcon with his eyes blinded in ANH and an untrained nobody is going to best a trained Sith because of 3 excuses you've given him? Nope. Not going to buy it. I'm ok with Rey being exceptionally strong in the Force — perhaps even stronger than anyone — but not as a lightsaber expert in her first fight. That ability needs to have been honed somewhere.

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Not really no. You say that it needs to be explained because you can't believe the "excuses" that were provided to you, even if they're the most obvious observations that one can make when watching the movie.

 

[zoltek]

After he had been wounded multiple times and was emotionally devastated aka unfocused as fuck due to killing his father.


Again, yes you can, once you start trying to nail down the force to rules instead of using it as a narrative metaphor for one's belief in themselves you've lost the entire point of telling a story in the first place.

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Apparently if you believe you are an expert lightsaber fighter, who needs training!!? By golly, be an expert lightsaber fighter. Just gotta believe! Just make sure you find an opponent with the flimsy excuse of "unfocused as fuck". That's a mockery of everything Star Wars stood for since its conception. Sure. You can have greatness inside you. Anybody can. But you have to work to realize said greatness. Not just pick up a stick and beat experts swordsmen.

 

[Trigonometrize]

TFA wedge issues like "could Rey have REALLY beaten Kylo in a fight?" feel so quaint after TLJ and TROS lmao

 

[gforguava]

After he had been wounded multiple times and was emotionally devastated aka unfocused as fuck due to killing his father.

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The bolded is right on the money and something I don't think even crosses some people's minds, it makes me think that some people really don't understand Star Wars at all, which is crazy considering how archetypal and simple they are.

Ben had just murdered his father and since he isn't the capital E evil figure he pretends to be, he is a complete emotional wreck and that is basically the one thing you don't want be as a Force user. Luke's petulance in Empire is a big enough hurdle to hamper his training under Yoda, imagine the chaotic storm Ben's feeling after what he just did.


And, because it should be required in every thread about Star Wars: The Force isn't a power level.

edit:

Apparently if you believe you are an expert lightsaber fighter, who needs training!!? By golly, be an expert lightsaber fighter. Just gotta believe! Just make sure you find an opponent with the flimsy excuse of "unfocused as fuck". That's a mockery of everything Star Wars stood for since its conception.

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It is like I'm in Bizzaro World.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Apparently if you believe you are an expert lightsaber fighter, who needs training!!

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At one point during that fight does she ever look like an expert lightsaber fighter?

By golly, be an expert lightsaber fighter. Just gotta believe!

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And to be an expert xwing pilot who can make a one in a million shot using the force you just gotta believe. But for transparently obvious reasons you don't question that. ANd have never, and will never question it. All it takes is one line of exposition and boom, 19 year old farm boy can fly a ship he's never flown before with expert precision in perfect formation. Right? 😃

Just make sure you find an opponent with the flimsy excuse of "unfocused as fuck".

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Yes because the character with multiple precedens of being emotionally unstable being peak off his rocker due to doing something self destructive is definitely a flimsy excuse. 🙄

That's a mockery of everything Star Wars stood for since its conception.

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Luke didn't even know what a lightsaber or the force was until four years before ROTJ. Why do you think he beat Vader, the war veteran?

The bolded is right on the money and something I don't think even crosses some people's minds, it makes me think that some people really don't understand Star Wars at all, which is crazy considering how archetypal and simple they are.

Ben had just murdered his father and since he isn't the capital E evil figure he pretends to be, he is a complete emotional wreck and that is basically the one thing you don't want be as a Force user. Luke's petulance in Empire is a big enough hurdle to hamper his training under Yoda, imagine the chaotic storm Ben's feeling after what he just did.


And, because it should be required in every thread about Star Wars: The Force isn't a power level.

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RJ even included a scene in TLJ explaining this exact thing just in case some goobers aren't capable of understanding a movie for children that shows things instead of telling.

 

[The Unsent]

The problem with that is that Kylo ren had seen nothing but defeat so far. He is not a very threatening bad guy, Closer to a little kid throwing a tantrum. So a final fight between Kylo and Rey would have had no stakes really.
Also you're ignoring all the things that TLJ left to try to fix like, Having to Rebuild the rebellion from scratch, Rose feelings for Fin, and Fin's feelings for Rey and Poe's Implied role as the leader of the rebellion.
I mean sure, ROS basically ignored all of those but also ROS was a terrible and non-sensical movie.

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Kylo works better as a mix of a phychological and a pyshical villian.

This is how I imagine the premise. The FO is destroying itself under a civil war, planets are being torn apart in its wake. The resistance has an opportunity to sweep in the chaos and finish of their leaders, plenty of character development here, whilst they unite and target the bases of the vulnerable FO. Rey doesn't want to face Kylo Ren again, she closed the door on him, that's exactly what he wants. Rey decides to confront him whilst there's a vulnerability and an opening. She tries to convince Ren to pull back, to stop him using a weapon that will not just destroy Hux's fleet but could destroy everything around it, them included. The pyshical prowess is not just why Kylo Ren is a threat, its his unstability. There's enough stakes here.

 

[MarcelloF]

I can't believe, 5 years later, we're back at "How could she beat Ben?!?!", when the movie made it obvious how it happened.

 

[Crossing Eden]

I can't believe, 5 years later, we're back at "How could she beat Ben?!?!", when the movie made it obvious how it happened.

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Six years....

 

[zoltek]

Yes Luke did. Quite literally within one minute he goes from this:

to this:

Also Rey isn't untrained. The movie set a precedent that she's experienced with fighting and defending herself:

And on top of all that, Kylo wasn't even trying to kill her. Even with that in mind she still barely won. The movie does far more leg work to justify that win than we would ever get for a male character and yet it's still questioned. 🙄

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You forgot the scene where the minute after Luke beats the droid — after having received training in how to do so, training they you allege Rey never needed — he beats a skilled Sith fighter who, 30 years later, you've now given yet another excuse of "well he wasn't even trying to beat her". And then compare that with the suggestion that because Rey can swing a staff a few times, she can suddenly beat a Jedi/Sith warrior.

Lastly, don't bring Rey being female into this discussion. Nobody has in the least intimated otherwise that she requires additional justification for her skills. Even were Rey male, her ability to best Ren requires a back story.

 

[kowhite]

I'll never understand how or why they didn't roadmap the entire trilogy out.

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You know, what's good a roadmap if you just throw it out. And let's be real, building on the story is what Last Jedi did. Rise of Skywalker did not. So, people complaining about planning? Really, it means nothing, JJ would've thrown it our anyways. And he did.

And yeah, KK let him do it.

 

[zoltek]

And, because it should be required in every thread about Star Wars: The Force isn't a power level.

edit:
It is like I'm in Bizzaro World.

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Likewise. Everyone is a master swordsman in your world. Fair enough.

 

[Crossing Eden]

You forgot the scene where the minute after Luke beats the droid — after having received training in how to do so, training they you allege Rey never needed — he beats a skilled Sith fighter who, 30 years later, you've now given yet another excuse of "well he wasn't even trying to beat her". And then compare that with the suggestion that because Rey can swing a staff a few times, she can suddenly beat a Jedi/Sith warrior.

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If you're gonna keep ignoring the context of the scene despite it being explained in not just TFA but literally in Kylo's first scene in TLJ then you need to be better at watching movies.

Lastly, don't bring Rey being female into this discussion. Nobody has in the least intimated otherwise that she requires additional justification for her skills. Even were Rey male, her ability to best Ren requires a back story.

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Only if you don't know jackshit about what makes for a good story. Again, notice that you do not in anyway shape or form question Luke perfectly flying an xwing in perfect formation and using the force to land a one in a million shot despite not knowing what the force was a mere day earlier. It doesn't mean jackshit if Ren was a trained warrior, if he had a shot in his abdomen, wasn't trying to kill her, and was further wounded while fighting Finn, then ofc he'd lose against a force sensitive. It's literally the force. The force isn't dependent on power levels. She didn't act or behave like a master swordsman. It's as if you're projecting some emasculation. Likewise, she straight up trains with the saber in the next movie the movie does more than enough to show the difference between the two when both are giving it their all.

You can state "he's a trained warrior" all day until you're red in the face. IN THE CONTEXT OF THE SCENE AND STORY THAT DOESN'T MATTER. Just like it didn't matter that Vader was a 40 year old man yet he got beat by a kid who didn't even know what the force was only four years earlier.

 

[The Unsent]

You forgot the scene where the minute after Luke beats the droid — after having received training in how to do so, training they you allege Rey never needed — he beats a skilled Sith fighter who, 30 years later, you've now given yet another excuse of "well he wasn't even trying to beat her". And then compare that with the suggestion that because Rey can swing a staff a few times, she can suddenly beat a Jedi/Sith warrior.

Lastly, don't bring Rey being female into this discussion. Nobody has in the least intimated otherwise that she requires additional justification for her skills. Even were Rey male, her ability to best Ren requires a back story.

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You're talking bollocks, tbh, Ren was fucked up, you don't exactly need to suspend your disbelief to believe Rey could best him in that state.

 

[Arex]

Well nobody knew Darth Vader is Luke's father too until moments before filming the scene, and from what I read only 3 people knew about the twist until the release, so it's not really new in that regards.

Now whether the writers of the trilogy decided that Rey is a Palpatine from the start or not is a different matter lol

 

[matrix-cat]

Rey Nobody will live forever in our fond memories and our TFA/TLJ Blu Rays.

The one saving grace of The Rise of Skywalker is that it made the whole Sequel Trilogy era scorched earth so we'll never have to suffer the indignity of further adventures with Rey Palpatine-Skywalker. I don't know her.

 

[The Adder]

Luke, one of the greatest Force wielders of all time couldn't even beat a practice droid on the Falcon with his eyes blinded in ANH and an untrained nobody is going to best a trained Sith because of 3 excuses you've given him? Nope. Not going to buy it. I'm ok with Rey being exceptionally strong in the Force — perhaps even stronger than anyone — but not as a lightsaber expert in her first fight. That ability needs to have been honed somewhere.

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She literally spent her entire life fighting. She is shown to be a capable fighter early in TFA. And in her fight at the end of TFA her choreography shifts completely from failed sword fighting to half-staff techniques with which she has a life time of experience.

 

[The Unsent]

Likewise. Everyone is a master swordsman in your world. Fair enough.

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Strawman argument, no one said anything of the sort.

 

[BarringGaffner]

I was no fan of Rise but... it doesn't really matter what an actor is told about their character.

 

[Izzard]

Don't know how much longer peeps can keep up the act that RJ was the real "issue" with the trilogy

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I mean, Disney didn't really do the franchise justice, but let's not pretend TLJ didn't have the massive reaction that it did.

 

[gforguava]

Likewise. Everyone is a master swordsman in your world. Fair enough.

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Fun fact: Luke Skywalker never gets trained in swordfighting in the original trilogy.

How does he ever go toe-to-toe with Vader? By your logic he shouldn't have been able to.

 

[Arkanim94]

Still can't believe they caved to the most toxic part of the fandom, what they did to KMT is shameful.

 

[Crossing Eden]

*Film shows that a character doesn't fight perfectly.

Fun fact: Luke Skywalker never gets trained in swordfighting in the original trilogy.

How does he ever go toe-to-toe with Vader? By your logic he shouldn't have been able to.

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Never had any xwing training either. Hmm.

 

[Readler]

Thanos wasn't gonna be the big bad until a few movies into phase 1.

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So you're saying they had set the villain for more than a dozens movies some six years in advance?

Idk sounds pretty planned out to me.
This is the thing though. Nobody's asking for every little detail to be mapped out, but general plot points should at least have an outline.

 

[Arkanim94]

Even were Rey male, her ability to best Ren requires a back story.

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We both know that wouldn't be true, don't lie to us.

 

[Halbrand]

Fun fact: Luke Skywalker never gets trained in swordfighting in the original trilogy.

How does he ever go toe-to-toe with Vader? By your logic he shouldn't have been able to.

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And he doesn't get any training inbetween his two duels with Vader.

 

[Rockstar]

The last REAL Star Wars movie there is.

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But it was dark and gritty and was loaded with OT nostalgia and Vader murked a bunch of randos in a hallway so therefor it's the best SW film since Empire.

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[matrix-cat]

I'd recommend people watch this movie called Empire Strikes Back; it's pretty good. It's about a goblin who teaches his student about a magic power that gives you the ability to do anything you truly believe you can do. It directly states that the only difference between levitating a small rock and levitating a fighter jet is your own mind's preconception that it should be impossible, and once you un-learn that preconception then you can do a whole bunch of cool stuff. The catch is that unlearning something is still pretty tricky for this character in the movie, but it makes you wonder what it might be like for a different character who wasn't so hard-headed and didn't have the same views about what was and was not impossible. Maybe they'll explore that in a followup movie some day...

 

[Ushojax]

This is what's so annoying about JJ. He loves his "mysteries" and encourages fans to speculate wildly despite not having any clear ideas in his head.

TFA as a script is very clear that Rey is a nobody. She is clinging to the foolish idea that her being abandoned is part of some grand history when her parents were really just uncaring junkers who never gave a shit about her. That is the basic essence of the story. The movie starts with the deranged, Vader-cosplaying son of galactic royalty slaughtering a village and cuts to a nomadic scavenger searching for space junk.

That juxtaposition is the key story idea. This desert nobody is the one who will rise up and face Kylo Ren. Making her actually the secret daughter of one of Palpatine's failed clones is not what the story was supposed to be about. Even in TROS, Palpatine's last line is "You are nothing! A scavenger girl is no match for the power in me!". JJ just couldn't resist his obsession with rehashing moments from the OT and he wanted to do his version of "I am your father" even if it was completely stupid.

Lastly, don't bring Rey being female into this discussion. Nobody has in the least intimated otherwise that she requires additional justification for her skills. Even were Rey male, her ability to best Ren requires a back story.

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But we got the backstory. She's a tough desert nomad who is used to combat. She already has excellent fighting skills with her staff. She is also naturally strong with the Force. When she fights Kylo he's holding back because he wants to turn her and is also seriously wounded by Chewbacca. There was no more explanation required for why she managed to fend him off.

 

[Arkanim94]

I'd recommend people watch this movie called Empire Strikes Back; it's pretty good. It's about a goblin who teaches his student about a magic power that gives you the ability to do anything you truly believe you can do. It directly states that the only difference between levitating a small rock and levitating a fighter jet is your own mind's preconception that it should be impossible, and once you un-learn that preconception then you can do a whole bunch of cool stuff. The catch is that unlearning something is still pretty tricky for this character in the movie, but it makes you wonder what it might be like for a different character who wasn't so hard-headed and didn't have the same views about what was and was not impossible. Maybe they'll explore that in a followup movie some day...

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That seems good, but have you thought about... Eugenics?

 

[darkwing]

Rian Johnson should have finished it

 

[gforguava]

I'd recommend people watch this movie called Empire Strikes Back; it's pretty good. It's about a goblin who teaches his student about a magic power that gives you the ability to do anything you truly believe you can do. It directly states that the only difference between levitating a small rock and levitating a fighter jet is your own mind's preconception that it should be impossible, and once you un-learn that preconception then you can do a whole bunch of cool stuff. The catch is that unlearning something is still pretty tricky for this character in the movie, but it makes you wonder what it might be like for a different character who wasn't so hard-headed and didn't have the same views about what was and was not impossible. Maybe they'll explore that in a followup movie some day...

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Every time some variation of "But Rey's too powerful!" shows up I always think of Yoda shaking his head at Luke's attitude in Empire.

Watch Empire sometimes people, and just pay attention to what Yoda is actually saying.

That seems good, but have thought about... Eugenics?

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lol

 

[fulltimepanda]

how is Rey beating Kylo in TFA still so controversial lmao

 

[Arkanim94]

how is Rey beating Kylo in TFA still so controversial lmao

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"because it felt like Rey was beating me, and thst was weird and scary".

 

[matrix-cat]

Tired: Rey beat Kylo because he had a hole in his guts and was mentally fucked up and Rey already knew how to fight and she visibly started to let the Force guide her

Wired: Rey beat Kylo because her evil Palpatine genes took over and she went full Sheev mode

 

[Jinroh]

Rey Nobody was a great move. That and the kids at the end establish that anyone can be strong with the Force, not just those with famous family names.

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It was established day one, nearly all jedi were nobodies, similar to this kid. The only exception in the movies being Luke and Leia.

I don't understand why people focus on this invalid argument.

 

[Thera]

What is funny is, IX is known to be "fuck episode VIII" but, in fact, is also "fuck episode VII", which is weird.

 

[Arkanim94]

It was established day one, nearly all jedi were nobodies, similar to this kid. The only exception in the movies being Luke and Leia.

I don't understand why people focus on this invalid argument.

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The saga was devolving into a "skywalker/kenobi/palatine bloodlines" wankfest, having a story arc that established yet again that the force could be strong with anyone was necessary for the franchise to free itself from the shackles of the OT and PT.
Alas, it was not meant to be, and the fan reaction birthed the worst moment in all star wars canon.

 

[Crossing Eden]

It was established day one, nearly all jedi were nobodies, similar to this kid. The only exception in the movies being Luke and Leia.

I don't understand why people focus on this invalid argument.

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How you gonna say that the only exception was Luke and Leia as if Anakin wasn't literally a christ like figure who brought balance to the force and built C3PO and blew up a space station at the age of 10?

 

[ConfusingJazz]

Living a hard knock life, having to already know how to defend yourself, and then releasing yourself to the force is not match for good eugenics at your side, kid.

 

[The Unsent]

It was established day one, nearly all jedi were nobodies, similar to this kid. The only exception in the movies being Luke and Leia.

I don't understand why people focus on this invalid argument.

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Anyone can be the main hero, that's the point. Or in the narrative, it relates to Rey looking to the legends of the past, hoping for a parential figure in Han Solo or Luke, and the conflict that she's not related to anyone special.

 

[Veelk]

I don't know why I keep going into SW threads when every post in them gives me nothing but pain.

 

[ConfusingJazz]

I don't know why I keep going into SW threads when every post in them gives me nothing but pain.

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We just want to know, do you like the idea of noble blood granted by the divine force running the galaxy or not?

 

[stefanomusilli96]

I'll never understand how or why they didn't roadmap the entire trilogy out.

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That's a take I will never understand. Most sequels aren't even planned. The issue isn't that they didn't plan the trilogy, but that the third movie tried to completely retcon the second one. It's completely normal to not plan a sequel, but good sequels try to make sense with the previous movies. Episode IX didn't, that's the issue.

 

[matrix-cat]

It was established day one, nearly all jedi were nobodies, similar to this kid. The only exception in the movies being Luke and Leia.

I don't understand why people focus on this invalid argument.

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We've seen other Jedi before, of course, but always as side characters, or relegated to EU content or other non-mainstream roles. The implication in TLJ was that the future of the main Star Wars film series wasn't always going to be tied to the Skywalker bloodline (and, in a metatextual sense, the events and characters of the Original Trilogy). That following entries could strike out in new directions without being beholden to the same references and storylines and iconography.

A concept that was entirely rejected by TROS and is now nothing more than a memory. It's Skywalkers all the way down, now and forever. CG-face Luke is going to stalk the halls of Star Wars media forever as a grim spectre.

 

[bushmonkey]

You know, we have the collective power to redefine reality.

Instead of using it to redefine the prequels as being not bad for the sake of memes, we could use it to just wish Rise of the Skywalker out of existence.

Join me. From today forward, when discussing Star Wars just completely omit any details relating to Rise of the Skywalker. Do not bring it up. Completely ignore it. Rey is a nobody. I don't know where you got the idea she's related to Palpatine, that's ridiculous; he's long dead by that point in the series!

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It what I do. I pretend episode 9 never happened and the story ends after episode 8. It's a good ending about hope, we can leave it at that.

 

[Dragoon]

I don't like TLJ but confirming that Rey was a nobody was easily the best choice

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How I feel as well. This was one of the few interesting things, but it got retconned to the special one.

 

[stefanomusilli96]

How you gonna say that the only exception was Luke and Leia as if Anakin wasn't literally a christ like figure who brought balance to the force and built C3PO and blew up a space station at the age of 10?

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Who cares about the prequels?

 

[ClickyCal']

That's a take I will never understand. Most sequels aren't even planned. The issue isn't that they didn't plan the trilogy, but that the third movie tried to completely retcon the second one. It's completely normal to not plan a sequel, but good sequels try to make sense with the previous movies. Episode IX didn't, that's the issue.

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When you know from the very start that you are making a trilogy, it's a little different than the original trilogy that was never actually expected to come to fruition.

 

[stefanomusilli96]

What is funny is, IX is known to be "fuck episode VIII" but, in fact, is also "fuck episode VII", which is weird.

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I don't get this. Was there anything in TFA that was actually retconned in TLJ? From what I remember it did a good job of respecting the previous movie while doing its own thing. The fact that they killed Snoke to make Ren the main villain is not a retcon or a "fuck episode VII" choice, it made sense with the way Ren was established in the previous movie.