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khamakazee

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,937
Of course if Ms delivery people will buy their products. Now you have many ways to consume Xbox games(PC and console) and will have more in the future with xcloud.

I have no idea how this will impact theirs sales on hw department.

But for sure services and features are not attractive for consumers like people think here. Every year Xbox sales are declining worldwide. If they want to expand their audience they need to focus on games. And not only Western taste for games.

To me games are games, what Playstation games are made exclusively for the German audience compared to Xbox that explains the higher ratio? Do we not see Xbox also get Final Fantasy and Devil May Cry and Kingdom Hearts? They get the main staples and some of you put way too much effort in thinking the more obscrure titles makes all the difference when software sales are quite small. Maybe Microsoft should purchase From Software, would that all of the sudden change things or are some so deep rooted in Playstation that no matter what they will never support Xbox over them?
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,256
Some people really want Sony to fail, it's hilarious.

"I really want to play GOW 2, but man there's no crossplay..."
I've noticed this from a lot of outlets. There's definitely a push to the narrative that because XBox had few games last gen they will have many games next gen, and because Sony was successful last gen they will stop using their successful strategy next gen. Just doesn't make much sense to me.
 

khamakazee

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,937
It's wrong Sony allow crossplay with PC and mobile since a long time (FF11,FF14,Street Fighter, Rocket League, Fortnite.......) It's only with Xbox and Switch

That's true but tell me, what makes more sense to you as a Playstation player, to play with PC gamers or other console players? I hear this excuse all the time but in reality it would be far better to have Nintendo and Xbox play with Playstation than Sony allowing PC crossplay. So to say "it's only with Xbox and Switch' is rather amusing.

I've noticed this from a lot of outlets. There's definitely a push to the narrative that because XBox had few games last gen they will have many games next gen, and because Sony was successful last gen they will stop using their successful strategy next gen. Just doesn't make much sense to me.

To take the context that some want Sony to fail is absurd. It's more of less that their dominance may be in question, which is a GOOD THING. When you get too dominant then the pro-consumer attitude goes out the window. We see this reluctance to get along with others, to push more for exclusive dfeals with third party and so on.
 

Son Goku

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
4,332
I don't think not playing PS4 games will make it fail but I think being able to launch with the whole ps4 library will put them in a good position. Also they would basically lock in all exciting ps4 users.

Crossplay is a fart in the wind in the big picture.
I do agree BC is much bigger than crossplay. While I think online profiles is already a pretty big "stay with us you're comfortable here" factor BC is even MORE in that camp. Even if they were $50 more than Xbox it would likely lock in the vast majority of those PS4 owners next gen
 

The_hypocrite

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,953
Flyover State
soraEYR.gif
Deaded.
Wow! Shawn Layden was fired? RIP PS5.
Pulitzer level fact checking.
 

Son Goku

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
4,332
That's true but tell me, what makes more sense to you as a Playstation player, to play with PC gamers or other console players? I hear this excuse all the time but in reality it would be far better to have Nintendo and Xbox play with Playstation than Sony allowing PC crossplay. So to say "it's only with Xbox and Switch' is rather amusing.
Honestly I have more friends that game on pc than other consoles (many of them own PS4 but also do pc). In fact with many Xbox games coming to pc it makes more sense for the combo to be PS4 or switch with a pc than ps4 or switch with an Xbox
 

Equanimity

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,992
London
captureicj0x.png

No, it doesn't. This is from the official PS Now site. "Download most PS4 and PS2 games..."

This entire argument is fruitless. You don't own a PS4, you are not subscribed to PS+ or PSNow, you don't care much for PlayStation exclusives. But for some strange reason, you're terribly concerned with everything PlayStation on this forum.
 

Firima

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,491
A major difference is that Microsoft learned their lesson and is demonstrating as such. Sony, as much as forum warriors try to exclaim that when humbled, learned its lesson and redoubled its efforts to put the consumer first, did no such fucking thing. They dropped the price of the PS3 because it was grossly overpriced in the console market, and actually REMOVED features as they did. They had to have free online by design as PSN was garbage for most of that generation and they'd have looked positively foolish trying to charge for it next to Microsoft's offering. PS+ was a smart way to get more people back on PS3, though.

It's a testament to how much the Xbox One's disastrous reveal window dominated the press in 2013 that back in February/March 2013 when hackers found the old PS3 software emulator from the 2nd-gen 80GB PS3 just sitting there on every modern PS3 SKU, being used to run PS2 ISO--er, "PS2 Classics," but being locked down from disc access, the post didn't even leave NeoGAF. Sony was caught red-handed not even repackaging games, just reselling you stuff you could play existing copies of if they flipped a switch, and nobody cared. They were caught doing this well after they had supposedly learned a valuable lesson. The next console they put out couldn't play PSX, PS2, OR PS3 games. This is why I believe that if there's PS4 BC on PS5 it'll be more like PS4 BC* then what we can be fairly certain Microsoft is doing.

To me games are games, what Playstation games are made exclusively for the German audience compared to Xbox that explains the higher ratio? Do we not see Xbox also get Final Fantasy and Devil May Cry and Kingdom Hearts? They get the main staples and some of you put way too much effort in thinking the more obscrure titles makes all the difference when software sales are quite small. Maybe Microsoft should purchase From Software, would that all of the sudden change things or are some so deep rooted in Playstation that no matter what they will never support Xbox over them?

I see a lot of EU people talk about this weird disparity in the Xbox and PlayStation libraries like there isn't some enormous library overlap save for a few Japanese games and some indies. At some point, it just reads like "Xbox would need to have Sony games and not Xbox games on it to justify a purchase," which is a perfectly legitimate sentiment to have, just...say what you mean.
 
Jan 17, 2019
964
I don't own a PS4 anymore so I can't check. It would be so simple to put icons next to every game to indicate if they were streaming only or downloadable. Maybe it's in the works? Downloadable PS Now games is still new so there are bound to be changes in their marketing and such coming.

Please explain how it's obtuse. My initial statement was that you cannot tell which games are downloadable or streaming only on the PS Now website. How is that pedantry? Or obtuse? It's a factual statement. It seems like you and others are being obtuse and moving goalposts with comments like "you can tell which are downloadable on the PS4" or "there are so few games that are not downloadable that it's a moot point" etc.

Your problem if you don't own a PS4. But you tried to spread fud. Why someone would check which games are downloadable on PS Now if he does not intend to have PS4, hm?
And you're not moving goalposts, right? Well, maybe i do.
 

Braaier

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
13,237
Your problem if you don't own a PS4. But you tried to spread fud. Why someone would check which games are downloadable on PS Now if he does not intend to have PS4, hm?
And you're not moving goalposts, right? Well, maybe i do.
Why would someone buy a PS4 game on the ps store website if they can just buy it directly on their ps4? Yeah great argument. /s
 

Trickstah

Banned
Sep 16, 2018
214
That's true but tell me, what makes more sense to you as a Playstation player, to play with PC gamers or other console players? I hear this excuse all the time but in reality it would be far better to have Nintendo and Xbox play with Playstation than Sony allowing PC crossplay. So to say "it's only with Xbox and Switch' is rather amusing.

To take the context that some want Sony to fail is absurd. It's more of less that their dominance may be in question, which is a GOOD THING. When you get too dominant then the pro-consumer attitude goes out the window. We see this reluctance to get along with others, to push more for exclusive dfeals with third party and so on.

Crossplay, regardless of platform, should be a standard going forward next gen. I'm fortunate enough to have all consoles and a gaming PC.

I can play Fortnite on my console with ANY FRIEND ON ANY OTHER SYSTEM. That's how it should be. Now, if I play Call of Duty however, I can only match players on that system. It's 2019 and developers should be moving forward and not being stuck in this dwindled separate population for each console bubble.
 

Gxgear

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,160
Vancouver
Same as the arrogance shown at the start of the PS3 era, but Sony is not going to try and pitch a media box to gamers like the XB1 was.
 

Braaier

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
13,237
I have. I'm not confused, are you?
Your screen shot states you can download over 250 ps4 games. Nothing about PS2 games. Nothing about which games you can't download. It does not state which games are downloadable nor which ones are streaming only. My screen shot states most are downloadable. That begs the question which games are NOT downloadable?
 

Lothars

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,765
To take the context that some want Sony to fail is absurd. It's more of less that their dominance may be in question, which is a GOOD THING. When you get too dominant then the pro-consumer attitude goes out the window. We see this reluctance to get along with others, to push more for exclusive dfeals with third party and so on.
outlets did the exact same thing last gen celebrating how they thought ms would run away with everything. They are just trying to push the same narrative.
 

TubaZef

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,568
Brazil
It's just the Sony cycle: they make a successful console -> get arrogant -> new console bombs -> they get humble -> make another successful console -> ...


Nintendo and MS aren't much different actually.

Edit: Bomb is an hyperbole, PS3 wasn't a big hit like their other consoles, don't read too much into it.
 

Psrock1

Member
Oct 27, 2017
657
It's just the Sony cycle: they make a successful console -> get arrogant -> new console bombs -> they get humble -> make another successful console -> ...


Nintendo and MS aren't much different actually.
What
PS1 : 100 million
PS2: 150 million
PS3 : 84 million
PS4: 91 million so far ......
 

Bundy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,931
"Bomb" is a harsh word, but the PS3 wasn't selling well at first
It still sold over 85 million. So it's not a bomb. The WiiU is a bomb. The Vita is a bomb. Nintendo and Microsoft would be happy if every console from them would sell 85 million. PS1 sold over 100 million. PS2 sold over 100 million. PS3 sold over 85 million. PS4 will sell over 100 million. The "Sony cycle" you mentioned doesn't exist.
 

Dreamwriter

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,461
The $500 price point alone wasn't that much of an issue, people seem fine with X1X price, it was more paying an extra $100 because of a forced Kinect when the actual hardware was weaker than the $100 cheaper competition.
Totally disagree, the Xbox One was $100 more expensive than the PS4, thus PS4 sold quite a bit better. It was 100% about price. Nobody cared that the Xbox One came with more stuff, they cared that it was more expensive than the competition, so they bought the competition.
 

TubaZef

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,568
Brazil
It still sold over 85 million. So it's not a bomb. The WiiU is a bomb. The Vita is a bomb. Nintendo and Microsoft would be happy if every console from them would sell 85 million. PS1 sold over 100 million. PS2 sold over 100 million. PS3 sold over 85 million. PS4 will sell over 100 million. The "Sony cycle" you mentioned doesn't exist.

Sony got arrogant with the success of the PS2 and the PS3 suffered because of it. They were much humbler in the PS4 and the console became a success... now they're arrogant again, that's all I mean.
 

Dewin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
627
So....MS has learned from the Xbox One Launch debacle, but Sony has been totally oblivious to it?

Yeah...sure...
 

Psrock1

Member
Oct 27, 2017
657
If the next Xbox sells like the Xbox one X which I bought and love, it will lose the console war just as bad as this Generation.
Price and games matter very much into people decisions early on.
 

Dreamwriter

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,461
It's just the Sony cycle: they make a successful console -> get arrogant -> new console bombs -> they get humble -> make another successful console -> ...


Nintendo and MS aren't much different actually.

Edit: Bomb is an hyperbole, PS3 wasn't a big hit like their other consoles, don't read too much into it.
Yeah, what people should be talking about is your entire premise :) How is it a "cycle" when it happened *once*? I mean, Sony only has four consoles. First console won its generation. Second console won its generation. Third console came in third place, fourth console won its generation.
 

Bundy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,931
Sony got arrogant with the success of the PS2 and the PS3 suffered because of it. They were much humbler in the PS4 and the console became a success... now they're arrogant again, that's all I mean.
At least you agree that your "Sony cycle" doesn't exist. Makes sense, because no Sony console ever "bombed".
And yeah, about that "arrogant Sony" nonsense. It's a meme at this point.
If "arrogant" means to you that we will get games like the Game of the Year God of War, Spider-Man, Detroit: Become Human, VR Game of the Year Astro Bot, Days Gone, Ghost of Tsushima, Death Stranding, The Last of Us 2, etc. while getting a PS VR headset and a lot of content... well, then I hope they will stay "arrogant" forever.
 

Godzilla24

Member
Nov 12, 2017
3,371
Sony needs to do a better job on hardware. The PS4 pro was incredibly underwhelming lacking many features that should have been there at launch like 4k blu ray support. Sony is supposedly known for excellent hardware but it didn't really show with the pro. The noise issues continues to be of concern. The system is just too loud and annoying.

PSNow is horrible. The laggy streams are still very much in effect. They really need to do a better job upgrading the service. Lower the prices. Paying more for less is not what gamers expect. Have a list of downloadable titles for PS4. If not all then support all not just some. Have better more up to date titles on the service.

They need to do a better job with backwards compatibility. Its non-existent on the PS4. They should allow PS3 games to be played on the Playstation 4. If not then at least ps1 and ps2 titles. People are saying PS3 games are impossible, then what about PS1 and PS2. Sony continues to show no effort in this area on the PS4 system to this very day. It's not helping when their execs say "why would people want to play old games"

Stop wasting resources on dumb project like PS classics which is an absolute disaster. Nothing more needs to be said about that product. Complete shit.
 

TubaZef

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,568
Brazil
Yeah, what people should be talking about is your entire premise :) How is it a "cycle" when it happened *once*? I mean, Sony only has four consoles. First console won its generation. Second console won its generation. Third console came in third place, fourth console won its generation.

Yeah, my bad. It'll be if it happens with the PS5!
 

Instro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,072
Does Microsoft pay for these types of articles or do these people write them for free?
 

Son Goku

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
4,332
Yeah, what people should be talking about is your entire premise :) How is it a "cycle" when it happened *once*? I mean, Sony only has four consoles. First console won its generation. Second console won its generation. Third console came in third place, fourth console won its generation.
Uh wait the PS3 came in second place