Batgirl vs Batwoman

[fireflame]

I only heard about Batwoman recently and I was wondering which of the two characters was the most interesing. In the cartoons airing on Toonami channel, there are sometimes references to batwoman and characters keep saying dontconfuse me with batwoman, and there is even one special animation movie with three batwomen.

What is better, Batgirl or Batwoman?

 

[DiipuSurotu]

Batgirl all the way

I didn't even know Batwoman was a thing before the other thread

 

[Sgt. Demblant]

Oracle is #1.

 

[Metallix87]

Batgirl is the more iconic character and the one with the richer history, but I feel Batwoman is a character with a lot more potential. I'm hoping the CW show gives her a lot more exposure.

 

[fireflame]

Oracle is #1.

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She is interesting although I feel sad about the reason why she becomes Oracle(I know it is a dark universe and all but still).

 

[Sgt. Demblant]

She is interesting although I feel sad about the reason why she becomes Oracle(I know it is a dark universe and all but still).

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Yeah she became Oracle for a bad reason for sure. I don't like how that happened either. And that Killing Joke movie sure didn't help. But thanks to John Ostrander and many others, she slowly grew into a truly unique character. One that was a true pillar of the DC universe. Batwoman and Batgirl will always be derivatives of Bruce. Oracle grew beyond Batman.

 

[Pau]

Well, there are three* Batgirls and one* Batwoman so which one are you talking about?

My favorite of the bunch is Cass Cain who was Batgirl. Barbara Gordon as Oracle is utterly amazing and should be in every Batman/DC universe related media.

I enjoyed the first few arcs of Batwoman but her story was pretty isolated from the rest of the family. Not sure how it's been with Rebirth and all of that. That always kept my hype for her a bit down. That's not to say she's a bad character; I just have my obsessions. :P I do think her military background mixed with the more magic side of Gotham is pretty interesting and can make for an interesting show.

Ultimately, the two characters, despite being female "Bat" members, serve very different roles. One is traditionally a younger, daughter/daughter-figure for Bruce. The other is her own thing. What you find more compelling depends on you.

The movie you're talking about is pretty removed from the comics. Completely different characters.

 

[Penguin]

I think different characters and hard to compare.

Batgirl (assume talking Babs) will have the leg up for being around more decades and having gone through evolution with her transition to Oracle and leading the Birds of Prey.

But I like that Batwoman is her own person and one of the few people who don't take Batman's crap.

 

[Jessie]

Don't do this to me OP.

But Batgirl.

Batwoman is the more compelling vigilante, but she's rarely written well. Batgirl is a super important part of the Gotham side of the DC universe.

 

[Z-Beat]

Batgirl. Batwoman's lack of adherence to the Bat Family's rules kinda puts her at odds with them.

 

[Jessie]

I feel like neither Batwoman or Batgirl have great villains.

But Batgirl had a leg up because her brother is a villain and her father is an important Batman support character.

And Batgirl's relationship with the Joker is much, much different than Batman's.

 

[Officer Big Mac]

Batwoman is infinitely more complex

 

[Pau]

I feel like neither Batwoman or Batgirl have great villains.

But Batgirl had a leg up because her brother is a villain and her father is an important Batman support character.

And Batgirl's relationship with the Joker is much, much different than Batman's.

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Batwoman has Alice. I think they could do a lot of interesting stuff with her.

 

[TheBaldwin]

I highly recommend reading Batwoman : Elegy as a one off. really cool comic

 

[Slayven]

I only heard about Batwoman recently and I was wondering which of the two characters was the most interesing. In the cartoons airing on Toonami channel, there are sometimes references to batwoman and characters keep saying dontconfuse me with batwoman, and there is even one special animation movie with three batwomen.

What is better, Batgirl or Batwoman?

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Neither. Let me educate you

Anita Fite, one of the few people that can put Superboy and Robin their place.

misfit, who brought and energy into the Batman universe, so she they had to get her the fuck up out of there

 

[BWoog]

Stop making people remember Misfit!

 

[Cipher Peon]

Batgirl all of the way. I love Oracle too!

 

[Deleted member 17092]

I guess I don't really understand why there is even a separate batgirl and batwoman, unless batgirl is like specifically targeting children as it's target audience.

 

[Pau]

I do miss Empress. Has she ever shown up in the Young Justice cartoon?

 

[Jessie]

I'll give her this, Batwoman has the best art. In the entire DC lineup, not just versus Batgirl.

 

[Pau]

I guess I don't really understand why there is even a separate batgirl and batwoman, unless batgirl is like specifically targeting children as it's target audience.

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Yes, Batgirl is usually a child or teenager. Batwoman is an adult. Batgirl was the mantle given to female kid sidekicks although the Robin title is technically gender neutral. (There has been one character who has been both Batgirl and Robin.)

But DC is dumb and decided to make a character who had grown out of the Batgirl mantle go back to it as an adult. Book is still targeted at the young adult audience from what I've seen.

 

[elyetis]

Can't speak much about batgirl. But the art of Batwoman made me buy all the volumes even thought I didn't have any Comics at that point ( something I often do with manga, art alone can sell me on one).

Ended up loving the character.

edit just because I didn't stress enough how amazing I find the art of Batwoman

 

[mrmoose]

I love Peter David and I loved Young Justice, but no way is a character named "Anita Fite" going to be taken seriously. Which was the point, I guess.

 

[Jessie]

I guess I don't really understand why there is even a separate batgirl and batwoman, unless batgirl is like specifically targeting children as it's target audience.

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Wait until you hear about Supergirl and Powergirl.

 

[Deleted member 13798]

Batwoman hasn't been around as long. Batgirl (Barbara Gordon) is more interesting imo.

Kate has some interesting character elements but I haven't found her too engaging in solo stuff besides Elegy. The first 4 volumes of her New 52 series are fairly good but it didn't have a proper conclusion really.

I think Batwoman works better as an ensemble character, wile Batgirl works well standalone.

 

[Zhukov]

Batwoman as in Kate Kain?

If so, then yeah, her. That's a killer design.

I remember her character being kinda cool too. Although by now it's probably a whole mess of comics continuity bullshit.

 

[VeePs]

I remember her character being kinda cool too. Although by now it's probably a whole mess of comics continuity bullshit.

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She's been getting tons of focus recently.

She has her own series, and was a key member of the Gotham Knights in Detective Comics.

 

[geomon]

Batwoman, unless we're talking about Cassandra Cain as Batgirl, then it's Batgirl.

 

[phaeb]

I never heard of either only Catwoman.

 

[ninjabot]

Prolly nostalgia taking over but I like Batgirl more. Granted I didn't give Batwoman much of a chance because of her origin and stuff. I mean the current version is cooler I think, and I like what's happening in Detective Comics... but still like Babs more.

 

[Deleted member 32822]

Batgirl by far. Batwoman always feels like some kind of very very distant spin-off with no relevance to anything happening in Batman's universe.

 

[Keym]

Remember that one time Barbara started using Venom and turned into Bane and recruited three other Batgirls to help her out?

 

[Heshinsi]

Batgirl all the way

I didn't even know Batwoman was a thing before the other thread

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Same lol.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Batgirl, it's not even a contest.

 

[Karateka]

all the bat people are embarassing.
Just get your own persona people.
Why I respect Nightwing the most.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

all the bat people are embarassing.
Just get your own persona people.
Why I respect Nightwing the most.

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Cass and Steph both have persona separate from Batman/Batgirl.

 

[Thrill_house]

Oracle will always be my favorite batgirl

 

[mrmoose]

Cass and Steph both have persona separate from Batman/Batgirl.

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Well if you include Oracle, all of the Batgirls do. Batwoman on the other hand...

 

[FRANKEINSTEIN]

I just started reading Stephanie Batgirl. So far I like it. Still prefer Cain Batgirl. I did read Batwoman once and didn't love it, didn't hate it. I liked how she wore a wig though.

 

[SOLDIER]

I think the idea of a Batwoman is ridiculous and severely undermines the existence of Batgirl.

The latter came first, but now sounds like the sidekick compared to the former's designation.

Keep in mind I've never read anything about Batwoman. I'm just talking about the concept, not the character herself (themselves?).

all the bat people are embarassing.
Just get your own persona people.
Why I respect Nightwing the most.

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Seriously, this.

Having like four Robins active and out on the field at once is ridiculous. I just think the idea of a "Bat Family" is silly considering the solitary nature of Batman.

Yes, I know we literally had a whole movie debunking this (Lego Batman), but it's still ridiculous that Batman has the equivalent of a Power Rangers team in Gotham and yet the crime rate doesn't drop even a single decibel.

 

[SOLDIER]

dp

 

[shiftplusone]

I think the idea of a Batwoman is ridiculous and severely undermines the existence of Batgirl.

The latter came first, but now sounds like the sidekick compared to the former's designation.

Keep in mind I've never read anything about Batwoman. I'm just talking about the concept, not the character herself (themselves?).



Seriously, this.

Having like four Robins active and out on the field at once is ridiculous. I just think the idea of a "Bat Family" is silly considering the solitary nature of Batman.

Yes, I know we literally had a whole movie debunking this (Lego Batman), but it's still ridiculous that Batman has the equivalent of a Power Rangers team in Gotham and yet the crime rate doesn't drop even a single decibel.

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all of this could have changed since the last I read it, but Batwoman is only a bat person because she is based in Gotham and the persona carries a lot of power there. She operates independent of Batman (mostly) and deals with a lot of fucked up Ghost shit and supernatural type stuff

She's also my favorite bat family member since her introduction

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

I guess I don't really understand why there is even a separate batgirl and batwoman, unless batgirl is like specifically targeting children as it's target audience.

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Other than a run like New 52 Batgirl(which was criticised for being overly gritty and dark)
Batgirl typically ranges from a Robin to Nightwing level tone and such.

Batwoman on the other hand is around Batman's tone and direction.

It was pretty weird going from

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suddenly to

in the same continuity.

 

[mrmoose]

Other than a run like New 52 Batgirl(which was criticised for being overly gritty and dark)
Batgirl typically ranges from a Robin to Nightwing level tone and such.

Batwoman on the other hand is around Batman's tone and direction.

It was pretty weird going from

suddenly to

in the same continuity.

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Did they ever explain this? It felt like they rapidly deaged her at the same time, considering in the new 52 continuity she was still Oracle at some point, right?

 

[SOLDIER]

all of this could have changed since the last I read it, but Batwoman is only a bat person because she is based in Gotham and the persona carries a lot of power there. She operates independent of Batman (mostly) and deals with a lot of fucked up Ghost shit and supernatural type stuff

She's also my favorite bat family member since her introduction

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See, I'm totally fine with people putting on independent Bat monikers without Batman's "approval". See the opening of The Dark Knight for one.

But apparently they're all fully funded and stocked by Batman and like, all hang out in his mansion?

Again, the idea of a Bat-Squad or Bat-Buddies or whatever that Batman can call up is just silly for me.

"Oh, Joker has broken out again. Can any of the 20 Bat-Friends bring him down? No? Okay, guess it's up to me again."

 

[Bus-TEE]

Batwoman was created so that Batman could have a girlfriend back in the day because the idea of a bachelor spending his night with a younger man raised eyebrows. She's always been something of a burden, creatively speaking, to the 'Bat-verse' opposed to Batgirl who has always been embraced as a character.

The fact that she's now being played in a TV series as openly gay by an openly gay woman is pretty cool.

 

[SOLDIER]

The Arkham games especially (and probably not intentionally) pointed out how dumb the concept is.

Batman has no less than three physically capable allies offering to help him in Arkham Knight, yet the entirety of the game he's all "No, I must handle this literal army that has taken over the entire city all by myself."

 

[mrmoose]

See, I'm totally fine with people putting on independent Bat monikers without Batman's "approval". See the opening of The Dark Knight for one.

But apparently they're all fully funded and stocked by Batman and like, all hang out in his mansion?

Again, the idea of a Bat-Squad or Bat-Buddies or whatever that Batman can call up is just silly for me.

"Oh, Joker has broken out again. Can any of the 20 Bat-Friends bring him down? No? Okay, guess it's up to me again."

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Batwoman isn't condoned by Batman, though. In fact, none of the Batgirls were (at first) either. In fact, the original Bat-girl, who was the niece of the original Bat-woman, got turned into a character post crisis that was basically just a huge fan of Robin/Dick Grayson (not sure if Flamebird is still in continuity).

It did get a little ridiculous with Batman Inc., but that was Morrison doing his thing.

I mean, you have to suspend your disbelief, it's comics, otherwise just have Superman help him out when he's outnumbered.

 

[Maximum Spider]

Remember that one time Barbara started using Venom and turned into Bane and recruited three other Batgirls to help her out?

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WTF is this. Goddamnit that costume blows. She went full-on Super Shredder.

 

[mrmoose]

WTF is this. Goddamnit that costume blows. She went full-on Super Shredder.

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I was also curious what god awful comic that was from. I hope it was an Elseworlds because that costume, those shorts, the boobs hanging out, what the heck? That's Barbara?