Are all gyros created equal?
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It had a magnetometer but based on Star Fox Zero and Splatoon it didn't do much to counter drifting. The dualsense seems to have a much more effective solution, not sure how they managed it nor if the sensors perform as well on a PC via Steam, but at least in this one instance it looks miles ahead of everything else:
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Thanks for clarifying that. Looking to expand my gyro QoL on PC, but didn't want to limit the discussion. It'd be fascinating if the controller filters internally. Seems extra but could be a clever way to offload for battery drain.Well it depends if this is a HW or software thread. If this thread about HW, then that's not entirely accurate. That's the rate the controller reports readings. The sensors poll much higher
GitHub - dekuNukem/Nintendo_Switch_Reverse_Engineering: A look at inner workings of Joycon and Nintendo Switch
A look at inner workings of Joycon and Nintendo Switch - dekuNukem/Nintendo_Switch_Reverse_Engineeringgithub.com
Dualsense should absolutely be the best, but I've seen ZERO implementation of it besides Astrobot.
Joycons are next, and the split controller form factor definitely benefits it on a lot of games.
Joycons are next, and the split controller form factor definitely benefits it on a lot of games.
With polls like that, I suspect few of the people who vote are actually familiar with all the choices. So a vote for the Switch gyro might often mean it's the best one they've tried, not the best one listed. And since Switch owners currently outnumber PS5 owners by a large margin, that would favor the Switch.
You really have no clue even though we are on a gaming forum? 😜😙
I get that the Switch has more games with gyro aiming, but you'd think that the DualSense's gyro being objectively better from a technological standpoint would be common knowledge.
I tried once to setup Gyro aiming on my PC with a PS4 controller and noticed massive drifing issues, and wondered if I had to calibrate it more or if my controller was bad (I have had issues with controller but can't justify getting a new one since I sold my ps4)
I haven't really tried again to set it up but its always made me wonder how exactly to worked on Switch and proper setups and how much calibration and hardware specific settings are required for it to really work well
I haven't really tried again to set it up but its always made me wonder how exactly to worked on Switch and proper setups and how much calibration and hardware specific settings are required for it to really work well
Are all gyros created equal?
Yes, this is a direct response thread to what I initially thought this thread was about. However, it is an extremely relevant question. What is your ideal gyro? Is it the traditional lamb? Or does another meat (or hybrid of meats) produce a better product? Personally, I was raised on the...
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Are all gyros created equal?
Yes, this is a direct response thread to what I initially thought this thread was about. However, it is an extremely relevant question. What is your ideal gyro? Is it the traditional lamb? Or does another meat (or hybrid of meats) produce a better product? Personally, I was raised on the...
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The DualSense is objectively the best. I was amazed at how well it tracked in Astro when I tried my absolute best to confuse it.
But we can't implement an aim reset button with the gyro solutions on PC yet, right? That's a big one (but even on console, not all games have it).
I know we can use a gyro off button to readjust the controller when needed, but that's not the same.
Calibrating on a hard flat surface will usually keep drift away for at least an hour for me, when using DS4 on PC with JoyshockMapper. Also, calibrating a few minutes after the controller's been used, rather than at the very start of the session, will probably last longer because temperature change can affect the sensor.
Yeah won't lie that's approaching a level of commitment to setting it up that I really don't care to make, it is super rare for me to play a game that works fine KB+M with a controller and dual stick aiming works just okay enough for me not to care in the other games
Shame theres no way to reset
Is this how nintendo games get away with it so well (BotW for example) because I've never noticed any serious drift when aiming in their games
It doesn't matter how good the tech is if the games don't take advantage.
But the OP was talking about hardware, so the DualSense should have the Switch beat regardless.
Software implementation is still the layman's judge of that. Raw numbers can be better, but the actual feel of using gyro in Breath of the Wild, for example, is far better than the gyro use in other games on other hardware.
that's what happens when almost no games use the gyroscope on the console (PS4) vs when devs actually use it (Switch)
But again, that's just software implementation. If we go by that metric, the gyro implementation in Astro's Playroom was super-accurate. But if you were to use both controllers on PC, you'll have a competitive edge with the DualSense vs. the Switch Pro Controller regarding using gyro aiming in something like Overwatch.
No one cares if the Switch's gyro is technically inferior as long as the Switch is the one platform that consistently sees quality gyro-enabled releases, as opposed to titles released once in a blue moon.
Then that becomes a different question than what the OP is asking.
I'll say the Wii U tablet controller, on the basis that a large, somewhat heavy controller is better suited to making percise small movements. Like, a long-barreled rifle is easier to aim precisely than a pistol because it takes more effort to move it a small distance. A small traditional controller is a little too sensitive to small movements.
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Understandable, and I've warmed up to him since initially being irritated by all the cheeky ad slip-ins. Just that the name didn't convey that it was addressing my issue.
Say, are you still on Rewasd? I set up DS4J yesterday and that looks better except that it doesn't have flick stick yet.
Can't you just set up Flick Stick with DS4J though? You don't need a app to get Flick Stick support, it has a standalone. You can even set up Steam Input to only read the flick stick inputs if you don't want to just use the stand alone setup of Flick Stick. Disable right analog in DS4J (you can do that right? I never used the app), and only assign flick stick commands for Steam Input or whatever.
A gyro by itself sucks. Gotta have some accelerometers and/or other stuff in there for good tracking.
If he was talking HW then saying the Switch gyro HW only polls at 60Hz isn't even accurate
Though that does bring me to the question, how much can you overclock the actual controller's poll rate so the gyroscope isn't bottlenecked?
"But I'm a gyro-netic freak!"
"YOU KNOW THEY SAY ALL GYROS ARE CREATED EQUAL"
the other thing to keep in mind is that gyro quality can vary from unit to unit of the same hardware line, so it's really a bit of a crap shoot
that video is really impressive!
I would assume that the Dual Sense has the best ones as I remember that when Linus was testing gyro flick stick software he mentioned that the DualShock 4 had higher Hz when is used wired than the ones on the Switch.
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I unknowingly had it routing thru ds4j and steam and worked well, but didn't want to tweak at 2 mappers (was getting CoD up on b.net). Also, I appreciate that Rewasd offers service and attention to UI.
Man, I wish Xbox was on this list. They're holding everyone back from making gyro based controls an industry wide thing.
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Wait, do the Nintendo implementations have a recenter button? That's biggest thing I'm missing right now.
Looking for an all-in-one PC solution, it's like every big pad has a fatal flaw. Nintendo's extra frustrating here, regressing their triggers and d-pad.
A dedicated recenter button? No, but just about all their recent games that feature gyro aiming have a button mapped specifically for recentering. But that's something Microsoft could include to "one up" Sony and Nintendo at their own game.
As NoKisum said, it's on a game by game basis - I believe all their own games have it (Splatoon does, of course), and some third party ones do too (Rogue Company and Overwatch do, but Spellbreaker doesn't afaik).
But no native, system-level implementation. I believe this should be the next step on gyro on consoles - gyro as a system-level setting, which games just interpret as mouse movement. But even so, devs would need to tell the system where to put the aim when you ask for it to "recenter" - and we'd need such thing for PC too, since no current gyro tool is able to determine what a "neutral cursor position" would be to recenter to.
A gyro disable button is more important than a recentre option. It's more akin to lifting a mouse off a mousemat to extend the travel space.
Although a horizon recentre can be nice, I feel it should be more of an optional feature.
Although a horizon recentre can be nice, I feel it should be more of an optional feature.
My personal take is that I slightly favour the DualShock 4 and DualSense.
It's true that their gyros report at a slightly higher rate than Switch gyros (250Hz vs 200Hz), and the fact that Switch gyro reports are packaged in threes (controller reports at 66.7Hz with 3 gyro / accelerometer reports packed together) puts it at a further disadvantage (it all adds up just fine, but it means most gyro updates are held back 5 or 10 milliseconds).
However, I think there are more important factors at play. I find that my Joy-Con gyros are more prone to interference from some button presses (not the accidental movement while pressing a button, but actually getting different values while some buttons are held), and that all my Switch controllers need re-calibration more often than my PlayStation controllers (two DualShock 4 and one DualSense). That alone is enough for me to pick the PlayStation controllers.
But I've also heard of people having calibration problems on PlayStation controllers, so it appears to be inconsistent, and I shouldn't assume my hardware is representative of what everyone else has.
I love that video (I'm not biased, YOU'RE biased!) and I'm super grateful they wanted to make it, but I don't think they communicated some of the technical aspects clearly (or understood them fully). Like others mentioned, they appear to be mixing up the controller's report rate and the gyro's rate.
It's true that their gyros report at a slightly higher rate than Switch gyros (250Hz vs 200Hz), and the fact that Switch gyro reports are packaged in threes (controller reports at 66.7Hz with 3 gyro / accelerometer reports packed together) puts it at a further disadvantage (it all adds up just fine, but it means most gyro updates are held back 5 or 10 milliseconds).
However, I think there are more important factors at play. I find that my Joy-Con gyros are more prone to interference from some button presses (not the accidental movement while pressing a button, but actually getting different values while some buttons are held), and that all my Switch controllers need re-calibration more often than my PlayStation controllers (two DualShock 4 and one DualSense). That alone is enough for me to pick the PlayStation controllers.
But I've also heard of people having calibration problems on PlayStation controllers, so it appears to be inconsistent, and I shouldn't assume my hardware is representative of what everyone else has.
I love that video (I'm not biased, YOU'RE biased!) and I'm super grateful they wanted to make it, but I don't think they communicated some of the technical aspects clearly (or understood them fully). Like others mentioned, they appear to be mixing up the controller's report rate and the gyro's rate.
This is only true for real world orientation (motion steering, VR, AR, Zelda BotW's annoying ball-rolling puzzles). For aiming, accelerometers are almost useless, and most games that use the accelerometer only make their aiming worse since the aiming becomes a compromise between what the accelerometer detects and what the gyro detects. If you've got automatic calibration, the accelerometer is a useful additional input for trying to guess if the user is holding their controller still to trigger re-calibration, but apart from that it doesn't help at all.
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