night814

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 29, 2017
15,100
Pennsylvania
There's like a 90% chance they're gonna try to get some old-timer back on in order to get a bump.

How big of a check would they have to cut for the Rock to make an appearance.
Easy money would be on Taker imo but who knows what Vince is thinking and who he can get to come in.

Fuck WWE, AEW has made moves to be a much more desirable place to work so it's no surprise people are passing on big money deals to work there instead
 

Deleted member 5491

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,249
Because it's on Fox now. Actually well under what Fox were hoping from it too.
Til this day I still can't beleive that those at FOX thought SD! would be sports oriented or draw way bigger number than RAW because of the nature of network TV. Like have they not seen the product, the stubborness of VKM and the dwindling crowds?
 

night814

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 29, 2017
15,100
Pennsylvania
I've never really got the "WWE talent in AEW" thing. WWE has spent the past few years buying up most of the industry. When most wrestlers have been or are at WWE then yeah, you're gonna get a lot of ex-WWE talent in other promotions. And AEW books them way better so who cares other than WWE fans?
It's a super silly notion that was pushed a lot when TNA was basically the "back up plan" for a lot of people if they got released from WWE. Should other wrestling companies not pursue free agents or people with their contracts coming up because they were in WWE? They absolutely should and them getting people like Danielson who main evented WrestleMania THIS YEAR and Cole who was just on a TakeOver in feud ending match a few weeks ago is a big deal. it's a lot better to get these people when they are still fresh as well instead of waiting some arbitrary time when now it's ok to sign them as opposed to right away.
 

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,770
Cape Cod, MA
AEW coming off what many called one of the best PPVs of recent memory, threw the kitchen sink against a regular ass RAW show and squeaked by with 3k in the key demo. And lost by 500k overall to a Raw with Lashley and MVP in a tag match against AJ & Omos

Things will be back to normal next week, or until TK signs another star.
Everything? They didn't even need to being out the demo God.
 

BFIB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,882
Vince is in real trouble. Way more than he was in with WCW in the 90's.

Vince took his father's business and despite his father's wishes, did exactly what his father feared: he killed the territories. Vince Jr. raided talent from all the territories, and to his credit, managed to merge and make professional wrestling mainstream. He rode that train all through the mid 80's/early 90's until that talent he raided was on the way out, and new talent had to be built. His idea? Gimmick after gimmick after gimmick. Doink, Duke Droese, TL Hopper, etc. He rode the talents hard during that era with a brutal road schedule, no time off. WWF in '93-early '96 was a taste of what was going to come without competition. When Hall and Nash jumped, WCW got hot and Vince stuck by his warped way of thinking, pushing people like Mabel. Talent flocked because of the easier schedule and more money WCW was offering. Vince was backed into a corner, he panicked, we got Billionaire Ted era and the fake Razor and Diesel. He sat on great talents, and only pushed them when he was forced to. Talents like Stone Cold, who was extremely unhappy at the time, and actually was leaning to asking for his release. He approached Vince about a character change into the Stone Cold character, and Vince's genius ideas were: Fang McFrost, Otto Von Ruthless, Ice Dagger. He had a talent in Dwayne Johnson, and instead of realizing the guy was a natural heel, he instead shoved him down the fans throats (doesn't this sound familiar?) until Vince was forced to let Dwayne turn heel and become The Rock. He had a talent in Mankind that he legit only hired to try and send a message to Jim Ross. Vince's words to Ross on hiring Foley were "He's going to break your heart." He turned WWF into trash TV because he literally had no other choice and had a wider net with USA Network than WCW did with Nitro at the time. Sure, we all know how it ended, but it wasn't BECAUSE of Vince, it was IN SPITE of Vince. Once competition was out of the way, the company has honestly been shit since 2003-2004, outside of a few bright spots.

Vince is in the same boat again, and this time it was his own doing. All Vince had to do was let Jericho put Owens over at WrestleMania for the title. All Vince had to do was let Cody build out a program with Dustin. AEW in their first year was barely a mention on the WWE shareholder talks. Second year, a little more, now his shareholders are pissed because talent is wanting out left and right, and Vince has no avenue for them because he honestly has no clue on what he's doing, and hasn't for a long, long time.
 

Strax

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,302
Did they beat them overall or just in 18-49 demo. Because the OP and headline don't match, unless I'm missing something.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,577
AEW coming off what many called one of the best PPVs of recent memory, threw the kitchen sink against a regular ass RAW show and squeaked by with 3k in the key demo. And lost by 500k overall to a Raw with Lashley and MVP in a tag match against AJ & Omos

Things will be back to normal next week, or until TK signs another star.

And they still couldn't beat their first Dynamite. All that for a piddly-ass demo lead.
 

Pop-O-Matic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,039
It's a super silly notion that was pushed a lot when TNA was basically the "back up plan" for a lot of people if they got released from WWE. Should other wrestling companies not pursue free agents or people with their contracts coming up because they were in WWE? They absolutely should and them getting people like Danielson who main evented WrestleMania THIS YEAR and Cole who was just on a TakeOver in feud ending match a few weeks ago is a big deal. it's a lot better to get these people when they are still fresh as well instead of waiting some arbitrary time when now it's ok to sign them as opposed to right away.
It's also incredibly hypocritical to try and act like somehow AEW is the only promotion building themselves off of pre-established stars. The Rock 'n' Wrestling/Hulkamania era was built almost entirely off of pre-established territory stars being poached up by Vince and getting to perform the same schticks they'd already developed on a national stage, which got turned on them when WCW started snatching up a lot of that same talent during the MNW era and rode them to their golden period. Hell, a large chunk of the WWE's roster today is made up of hot acts from the US & UK indies as well as Japan that they snatched up in an attempt to smother out those scenes and ensure that no serious competition could rise up (and now that they've failed at that, they're releasing them by the boatload in the name of making their already insane profits even bigger and possible making themselves look good to potential buyers).
And they still couldn't beat their first Dynamite. All that for a piddly-ass demo lead.
Uh...you understand why an 18-49 demo win is actually super important, don't you?
 

GravaGravity

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,267
Til this day I still can't beleive that those at FOX thought SD! would be sports oriented or draw way bigger number than RAW because of the nature of network TV. Like have they not seen the product, the stubborness of VKM and the dwindling crowds?
You have to understand the greatest work in wrestling happens in Vinny Mac's boardrooms, not in the ring
 

Pop-O-Matic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,039
Yup. What they tell investors? 10 million people will sub to the WWE network? Because 5 million Raw viewers and 5 million SD viewers equals 10 million WWE Network subs. Lol.
Honestly, it's more that the networks largely worked themselves. They convinced themselves that the future of linear TV was live, "DVR-proof" sports programming and WWE's product just barely fits that criteria. From there, it was all too easy for Vince to work those marks and squeeze them for every red cent imaginable.
 

BFIB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,882
Honestly, it's more that the networks largely worked themselves. They convinced themselves that the future of linear TV was live, "DVR-proof" sports programming and WWE's product just barely fits that criteria. From there, it was all too easy for Vince to work those marks and squeeze them for every red cent imaginable.
To be fair, AEW was still in its infancy. TNT and TBS have to be patting themselves on the back at every opportunity for locking AEW up when they did.
 

Captain C

Member
Oct 27, 2017
764
Gotta love the moving goalposts for AEW's success. "Can't even hit 1 million!" *hits 1 million* "Can't even beat Raw!" *beats Raw* "Can only *barely* beat Raw!"

This is nothing but a good thing for the industry. Even if you don't like the show, it only makes sense to want them to succeed.
 

BoboBrazil

Attempted to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
18,765
Brian Danielson wants to kick some fucking heads in and we all want to see it
 

vatstep

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,500
I don't really know what WWE can do to get people excited about their product again the same way people are for AEW. The only thing I can think of is The Rock, and they apparently might be saving that for WM 2023? Things could be very different by then.
 

MrNewVegas

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,774
I've been watching a weekly series on the Monday night wars. This is pretty cool this is happening again.
 

BFIB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,882
I don't really know what WWE can do to get people excited about their product again the same way people are for AEW. The only thing I can think of is The Rock, and they apparently might be saving that for WM 2023? Things could be very different by then.

Vince got exactly what he wanted. WWE is the name, it's the Coke of soda products, the Disney of animation. No talent they have will ever get bigger than the WWE again. The entire product is bright, flashy, broad, but not much depth.

Compare the two most recent PPV's from both companies. WWE had constant "entertainment' segments with a celebrity backstage, a super soaker segment, and what they thought was a shocking return, but it was booked so shitty, but they don't care. WWE got the headline they wanted, which was Becky Lynch returning.

All-Out was non stop wrestling in the ring with tremendous matches from top to bottom (ok, Big Show/QT was whatever), but the fans were thoroughly entertained, just in a very different manner than what WWE is doing now.
 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
if they hadn't cut off kaze ni nare early it would have been even higher
That hurt so bad. I was all locked and loaded wanting to yell Kaze ni nare as he hit the ring too. Iwanted to hear the crowd roar it out on us tv.

Worse botch than the weak headbutt with Moxley.

What happened at the ppv? Anything noteworthy?

CM Punks first match in 7 years as he made his in ring return to wrestling

Daniel Bryan debuted

Adam Cole Debuted

What is being hailed as one of the greatest tag team matches of all time happened between the young bucks vs pentagon and fenix in a bloody steel cage match classic

Absolute banget of a title match with Kenny Omega vs Christian ending in an absolutely crazy finish. Huge bump that looked great!

Redhot feud between top super heel MJF to retire Chris Jericho happened and it was solid.

Ruby Riot debuted as a wildcard entrant in a solid womens rumble and won as Ruby Soho.

Shoot wrestling legend from japan Minoru Suzuki appeared to challenge Moxley after Moxley beat Japanese legend Satoshi Kojima


Show was absolutely perfect. Plus solid performances from Miro defending his title vs Redhot street brawler and promo machine Eddie Kingston.
 
Last edited:

RBH

Official ERA expert on Third Party Football
Member
Nov 2, 2017
33,366
That hurt so bad. I was all locked and loaded wanting to yell Kaze ni nare as he hit the ring too. Iwanted to hear the crowd roar it out on us tv.

Worse botch than the weak headbutt with Moxley.
Looks like we might get a do-over:



 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
Hope they do it right this time.
I hope Bryan Danielson wrestles Suzuki at some point. Would love to see him lose clean honestly and then get challenged by ZSJ so they can finally rematch now that hes a veteran.

So many dream matches possible now...
 

illmatic22

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,606
Super Bowl LII Champions
AEW is not perfect, but its an ACTUAL pro wrestling show that doesn't treat its viewers like idiots (Vince McMahon seemingly thinks his viewers are too dumb to comprehend that people might have last names). It reminds me of the wrestling shows I loved to watch as a kid. WWE is like, some strange, overly produced, poorly written, micro managed shitty attempt at some sort of action movie meets legitimate sports production.
Amen
 

Huntersknoll

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,722
I heard the ratings were fake and manufactured by Dave Meltzer who happens to be on AEW payroll to make WWE look bad!!!

LOL JK! Lets go AEW!

AEW! AEW! AEW!
 

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,770
Cape Cod, MA
The goal post moving is kind of transparent.

I suppose that unless AEW immediately jumps to beating RAW overall, and unless AEW doesn't maintain that indefinitely it doesn't count for anything? Even if it was guaranteed that AEW would get there (which obviously it isn't) this would always have to be a milestone along the way.
 

Dirtyshubb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,555
UK
The goal post moving is kind of transparent.

I suppose that unless AEW immediately jumps to beating RAW overall, and unless AEW doesn't maintain that indefinitely it doesn't count for anything? Even if it was guaranteed that AEW would get there (which obviously it isn't) this would always have to be a milestone along the way.
They would just get moved again if that happened.

"It's just a one off, they will drop"
"Still isn't as big as WWE was during the attitude era"
"WWE is worth more and gets more money for TV deals"
"WWEs social media platforms are much bigger and TV ratings don't matter"

That last one already gets used.
 

BFIB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,882
It's been a while since we've heard ol' Vinny Mac say "We're not in the wrasslin' business, we're in the entertainment business."

Thinking we'll hear that again soon.
 

Dis

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,026
It's been a while since we've heard ol' Vinny Mac say "We're not in the wrasslin' business, we're in the entertainment business."

Thinking we'll hear that again soon.

He's already claimed aew aren't competition apparently despite them clearly being competition and viable for a lot of the stars wwe spent years doing nothing with except destroying their love of the business as well as even stars who seemed to not have an awful wwe experience but realised the grass was greener elsewhere, so I fully expect the more the questions are asked we'll hear it. Especially because it seems wwe are trying to make their business look as good as possible to sell so they don't want to risk anyone making comparisons too much I'm sure.
 

N7_Kovalski

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,469
WWE is planning legends night as we speak. Roll Hogan's crippled ass down to the ring.

For real though, AEW is such a breath of fresh air. Hopefully this continues. WWE has the luxury of being a household name for decades so they can keep putting out shit with people still watching and record TV deals. A good competitor will hopefully light a fire under someone's ass over there.
 

Stuntman

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
2,185
People really dismissing the demo win, it's the demo that buys shit. It's the demo that made WWF big in the 80's and the demo that made WCW big in the 90's and the very same demo that made WWF huge in the 90's too. The goalpost twitter is pretty apt tbh, AEW is making good business and it shows in the face and health of its wrestlers..
 

Night

Late to the party
Member
Nov 1, 2017
5,262
Clearwater, FL

Just a dumb reference to this

CwRAJs7WgAEEvIy.jpg:large
 

Kurita

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,874
La France
Over 1 million people actually excited about the product versus 2 million (old) viewers mostly sticking with WWE out of habit or cause they're too lazy to switch the channel… the former sounds healthier.
 

Aiii

何これ
Member
Oct 24, 2017
8,314
Shit, we're gonna have to move the goalposts again, huh.

If AEW keeps this up, we're gonna run out of pitch to move them to.
 
Oct 29, 2017
727
I think Bryan Danielson had a quote that was roughly "If you show folks great professional wrestling, they'll think it's awesome", so something like that. I've watched wrestling my whole life, was in it when the IC title was awesome with Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Razor Ramon, etc., there for the Attitude Era. I've been to quite a few ROH shows when they had Bryan Danielson, Punk, Samoa Joe, Styles, etc. But I've been off wrestling for so long now, I had thought I just grew out of it.

Turns out, I was just tired of bad wrestling shows. With AEW, it feels old school. The shows, even prior to Punk, have been so good, and the PPV was fanastic. I love their tag division. AEW, after probably 10ish, maybe more years, has me back in.