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DOOM Eternal will launch on PC, PlayStation 4, Xbox One, and Nintendo Switch
- Thread starter Dancrane212
- Start date
Sorry but I'm a little tired of this.
So you don't think trying to say 60 fps isn't noticeable over 30fps and then going on about power consumption and our planet is troll-like behaviour?
There's reaching and then there's whatever Gusy did
Yes, 60fps is definitely noticeable over 30. Yes, of course, Switch version will be technically inferior to more powerful consoles versions.
But there are other reasons than spec superiority or inferiority that can lead people to choose a version of a game.
So you don't think trying to say 60 fps isn't noticeable over 30fps and then going on about power consumption and our planet is troll-like behaviour?
There's reaching and then there's whatever Gusy did
... that's not his point.
The person he's arguing with is saying that 30fps (and the reduced graphical settings) make this the worst version, period. Not worst looking or worst performing, but just plain "worst". The power consumption rebuttal is literally him just finding a technically correct and quantifiable example of something this version does better than the others.
To be fair, the alt-right themselves have amplified the argument by believing the game WAS pandering to them, and getting YouTube to bombard everyone with their videos about "angry SJW libtards".
I haven't seen anyone say this in this thread.
What I have seen though, in this thread and others, is people saying outright that the game is catering to the Alt-right.
He's technically right from a tech standpoint, but I've never had 30fps actively ruin a game for me tbh, it'll play fine on the switch.
Going from some gamefaqs 30 fps vs 60 fps discussion/argument to power consumption and the impact it has on the planet is a monumental leap though.
These are also the same people who convinced themselves, without any evidence, that a restaurant in DC was actually a secret pedophile ring.
They will spin anything to fit their narrative, no matter what. We should not be giving these people or what they think any credence.
Again he's not trying to compare framerate with power consumption at all.
He's proving- with quantifiable data- that the Switch version is not objectively the worst version in every possible aspect, which is what the person he's arguing with was trying to claim. Of course it's an absurd comparison but that's kind of the point.
I know, but people aren't infallible at finding sources, and it's not a stretch to think some people would believe those things are endorsed by the gamemakers after seeing how the alt-righters are gleeing over it.
Edit: you just have to look at the YouTube comments of the gameplay reveal video to see that they fucked up with the marketing or they took the lines out of context on purpose to pander to the alt-righters.
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I guess I should just be more specific and say "when it comes to the actual game experience, the Switch version is objectively the worst." Things like portability and power consumption exist outside of the game experience.
Doesn't part of the game experience include your surroundings? Like, if I was on a packed subway, my game experience would be different than it would be if I was at home by myself in front of a television. Likewise, if I'm not able to spend time in front of my TV but I can play during transit or at work (or whatever), wouldn't that be my best gameplay experience given the context?
You just need to say that it's the worst version of the game from a technical standpoint with regards to what you care about. That's all. You don't need to use this "game experience" stuff, and frankly you should know that.
And again you're omitting gyro aiming.
Like Niceguydan says, we should leave it as "objectively the worst looking and performing version".
The switch version is going to absolutely suck from a technical point of view if compared to every other machines except for the xbox1 which I expect not to be that far off (it was already struggling with Wolfenstein 2). It is no news that the switch isn't as powerful, and that's the cost of hybrid gaming.
But the switch will probably have gyro aiming, and that only is a game changer for those who have tried it and gotten good with it. Even at 30fps, the skill ceiling using gyro aiming is miles ahead of anything else except mouse and keyboard. For people like me, gyro is the best and only way to play on consoles. If gyro is implemented on ps4, it'll be the ultimate console version, no discussion. If it isn't, then the debate is only about personal preferences. I made my choice in that regard.
But the switch will probably have gyro aiming, and that only is a game changer for those who have tried it and gotten good with it. Even at 30fps, the skill ceiling using gyro aiming is miles ahead of anything else except mouse and keyboard. For people like me, gyro is the best and only way to play on consoles. If gyro is implemented on ps4, it'll be the ultimate console version, no discussion. If it isn't, then the debate is only about personal preferences. I made my choice in that regard.
Are you fucking serious right now? It's a motherfucking doom game!
Because it's a doom game. There are no politics in a damn doom game. You kill demons. That's the game. If you are trying to insert politics in a doom game you are just trolling.
id Software says they are taking the Switch into account when developing this game and engine, hopefully this means the comparison is closer to "Base XBOX One Fortnite vs Switch Fortnite" than to "Base XBOX One Wolfenstein II vs Switch Wolfenstein II".
If it is, then it's going to be a sight to behold in portable mode.
The first game already had a plot, and lore, and of course politics. It was deeply anti-corporate, which is why DOOM Eternal is most likely making fun at how corporations hijack progressive language, but of course there are politics. There's a set of embedded political assumptions in everything.
I didn't make Doom political now. We've had decades of Dooms that were not pandering to the alt-right, can we have that back indeed? Just don't kill the messenger. And btw, accusing me of trolling with this has to be the laziest way of debating this you could have come up with.
It's not pandering to anything it's a damn doom game. There isn't anything to pander because story isnt ever the point of a doom game. Jfc
This one is no exception save for a few people trying REALLY hard to make it a thing.
Well, I'll be damned, I must be completely schizophrenic because after how much fun I had with Doom 2016 and seeing how great the footage looked I really don't understand why I'm complaining about apparently literally nothing.
No need for the snark. BBQ_of_DOOM made a great post on the previous page, which you ignored for some reason.
This phrase really doesn't apply when you're offering your totally subjective opinion, especially when that opinion is based entirely on two lines of background dialogue in a game that hasn't even been released yet.
If you believe, based on what little we've seen, that this game was intentionally designed to appeal to an alt right audience, you're certainly welcome to that opinion, but spinning it as if you're an objective "messenger" reporting a truth that exists outside of your own perceptions is disingenuous.
It's been explained time and time again, but the jokes in that trailer are poking fun at the tendency for businesses to clumsily co-opt progressive terminology and ideas so as to forward their own corporate agenda.
The reason it seems like you're trolling is that your words don't seem to reflect an understanding of that fact. You're deliberately choosing to interpret this a certain way despite a wealth of context existing that should dispel such vacuous notions.
I didn't ignore it because if people were making the smallest effort to read what I said you'd have seen that my position was "I think Bethesda is pandering to the alt-right with the writing in this game after literally two jokes and I'm gonna wait and see and hope that's not the case". BBQ_of_DOOM understood my position and offered a perfectly reasonable alternative take on those jokes, but the conclusion is still the same, isn't it? We'll have to wait and see.
The only comments I've been answering since then have been those that, unlike those of BBQ_of_DOOM, have been misrepresenting my position, accusing me of being a false fan, of being the only terrible human being here associating demons and immigrants, of coming in with a secret agenda, of trolling, etc. None of which are true and all of which are incredibly shitty given what I feel are very valid concerns about two phrases that were uttered in the trailer that made me think Bethesda may be trying to bank on alt-right democraphics. And I'm waiting, like I said, for them to come clear on this or show more of the game so we can clear this whole thing up.
The only objectivity I was trying to bring into the discussion is that there's some of us concerned about what we perceived as Bethesda or ID pandering to the alt-right. I never claimed such pandering to be an ultimate truth given that the game isn't even out and we can't really make a definitive judgment on this yet, can we?
You've got your take on it and I got mine. Are you really sure you have enough proof yet to dispel my concerns?
I will say that maybe the wording id used is a bit unfortunate, seeing as it can indeed be interpreted as a poke at the US immigration situation.
I'm 100% sure that was not their intention and I don't think the majority of people playing/watching made this connection, but the fact that some people are making it is indeed unfortunate.
I'm 100% sure that was not their intention and I don't think the majority of people playing/watching made this connection, but the fact that some people are making it is indeed unfortunate.
That's a fair response and I can respect that.
However, when you say shit like "we've have decades of Doom not catering to the alt-right, can we have that back?" it's obvious that you already made up your mind on the issue.
I'll drop the subject now. We probably need a new thread about it, the last one was closed though.
I don't agree that the game is pandering to the right or whatever, but the game does have politics, most games have some sort of political message in them.
DOOM 2016 was clearly anti corporations/capitalism, and DOOM Guy doesn't give a fuck which is awesome. Also the fact that he just doesn't give a shit about the story and just wants to kill demons is political in some way.
I love DOOM 2016 haha.
It's funny. Half the harassment I've received since being the lovely feature of a certain Sargon of Akkad video has insisted there are no politics involved and I should kill myself for thinking it so, while the other half insist that I'm right, the politics are there, and it's GREAT NEWS! Intentional or not, they released a trailer that Gamergate and co are VERY comfy with, and have been celebrating.
Yes, I do, because I played DOOM 2016, the game which DOOM Eternal is a direct sequel to. I've played it religiously (lol) - I'm probably one of few here who has completed the game on even the permadeath Ultra-Nightmare and who has played every level in Arcade mode again and again just to beat my friend's high scores - and I feel like I've come to understand its specific sense of humor. The jokes in the trailer can be interpreted as being just like the jokes in DOOM 2016 - shit that pokes fun at corporate culture (and the propensity for corporations to selectively co-op progressive ideas and terminology in disingenuous ways to further their own agendas) and which presents corporate culture in the world of DOOM as having become literal cults deeply obsessed with Hell resources for their unprecedented value. I feel as though that interpretation is likely to fall in line with the truth of things.
My take is based on more than just an understandable but still kneejerk response to two corny jokes that may have been taken out of context. My take also isn't predicated on a willingness to make seriously unflattering assumptions about a developer under a publisher whose recent statements and actions have shown moreso than most other publishers that they don't deserve that sort of treatment. IE I'm not going to assume that Bethesda and id are going to suddenly choose to pander to an audience that Bethesda has shown open revulsion to, and a willingness to lampoon and shit on, over this past year.
If DOOM Eternal comes out and it becomes apparent that I was wrong and that your assumptions are closer to the truth, then you can expect a genuine apology in your PMs in a few months, I'm not being sarcastic either. You can even expect me to go as far as to make a thread highlighting it, because I'd be deeply disappointed if that were to turn out to be the case.
I don't think that things will pan out that way, though. With that said, I actually do understand your point when you ask if I have enough proof to dispel your concerns, even if my self-assured response suggests otherwise. I'm not on the dev team. I haven't seen the script. I'm willing to reserve my judgement same as you until I've actually seen and heard more. I'm just making a point of considering context and the history of the publisher when judging what I've seen and heard thus far, and I don't want to assume that they're pandering to assholes based on two jokes that can be explained in a way that's entirely in-line with DOOM 2016's slant on humor.
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Yeah ok I can see that. But political as in alt/right or anything related to racism/white supremacy in any way is preposterous.
I am playing doom on switch right now in my seaside house
I have no other console here, juat the undocked switch
I am really enjoying the game here during the holidays
How exactly this isn't part of my game experience?
If it were not for the internet, I would never have made any connection between a couple of throwaway jokes in the trailer and any sort of pandering to the alt-right. Anyone who thinks this is what Id are actually doing is a fucking nitwit.
This whole thing is so stupid I can't believe I'm even typing this post.
This whole thing is so stupid I can't believe I'm even typing this post.
My notifications go on and on like this for awhile. I eventually just put the profile to private because it was freaking my friends and the people I care about out. I guess it's what I get for posting on the hashtag, but youtubers and the like know exactly what they're doing when they blast individuals like this. It's a video game people. I love DOOM too, which is why I made the post. But come on.
This is what we've come to. I'm still flabbergasted that people think this game is "pandering to the alt-right" based on what we've seen, and just the sheer damn context of who's making this game and their prior work.
I'm going to take this opportunity to bring up the glorious insanity that is the DOOM comic for those who say it isn't political:
https://www.doomworld.com/10years/doomcomic/comic.php?page=11
https://www.doomworld.com/10years/doomcomic/comic.php?page=11
If I had to play splatoon at 30 FPS but retain gyro controls I'd do it. If I had to lose gyro controls to play splatoon in 60 FPS I'd stop playing altogether. And even though I know 60 FPS and 4k is better, I don't mind the loss of graphical quality if the game is good and the console is convenient. Like BOTW, I've gotten like 200 hours out of it, from which 20 hours (at most) were in docked mode.
So the publisher that openly antagonized the Alt-right as recently as 3 months ago is now putting alt right messaging in their games? That's the argument here?
I don't understand these takes. Wolfenstein mocked mainstream centrist liberal and right wing ideology pretty heavily. Doom 2016 made a lot of jokes about corporate copying of progressive language. There's a difference between genuine progressive politics and the corporate brand of tone deaf fake progressive politics (think of that Kendall jenner Pepsi commercial). It's obvious as to which Doom is mocking. If you played through DOOM 2016 and paid attention I genuinely can't understand how this is misinterpreted. It's not subtle at all
I don't understand these takes. Wolfenstein mocked mainstream centrist liberal and right wing ideology pretty heavily. Doom 2016 made a lot of jokes about corporate copying of progressive language. There's a difference between genuine progressive politics and the corporate brand of tone deaf fake progressive politics (think of that Kendall jenner Pepsi commercial). It's obvious as to which Doom is mocking. If you played through DOOM 2016 and paid attention I genuinely can't understand how this is misinterpreted. It's not subtle at all
That's an opinion; it's subjective. And I'm saying that as someone whose opinion aligns with yours.
I've played portable versions of console games in the past, and generally speaking, outside of rare AAA fighting and sports game ports, same-gen ports to handhelds have traditionally had to undergo far, far deeper cuts than DOOM Switch's performance downgrades in order to become playable on that hardware.
I'll use NFS: Most Wanted on Vita for example - I enjoyed that game just as much on Vita as I did on PS3 - despite the Vita version having far fewer racers, significantly worse graphics and performance, and far less traffic on the road, to boot. That's because I really liked being able to play that game portably, as a pick up and play sort of experience, and despite that game's cutbacks, it also felt incredibly novel just to be playing a full-fat game like that on a portable platform.
I'm going to be playing DOOM Eternal on PC, because nothing matters to me more where DOOM is concerned than being able to hotkey every single one of my weapons to individual buttons on my mouse for instantaneous switching, and as with DOOM 2016, that won't even be an option on One X or PS4 Pro, not even while using a keyboard and mouse adapter and getting creative with macros (something I've tried with DOOM 2016 on Xbox One X). Because of that, I'm going to wait until I can afford to replace my broken GPU to something real nice before I play this game. Instead of just buying it on One X or PS4 and playing it with my M/KB adapter, which is what I've done with every other SP shooter I wanted to play since my GPU kicked the bucket.
I wouldn't even bat an eye at someone suggesting that they're going to have as good a time as I will with the PC version, with the Switch version, if the novelty and convenience of playing that AAA shooter on a portable platform speaks to them that much. I guess I'm just saying that I 'get it' - even though, in another discussion for another time, I'd openly suggest that the design of DOOM lends itself best to mouse and keyboard controls and that playing the game on any platform besides PC prevents the game's design from shining to the same extent. I might find that to be true, but as with my perspective that DOOM is at its best at higher difficulties, it's an observation that doesn't mean much if scads of people are having a blast playing that way anyway.
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I think Jerykk would tell you that you would have more enjoyment if you closed your eyes and imagined playing DOOM on a 90" OLED TV at 120 FPS instead of tormenting yourself by actually playing the Switch version. Save yourself!
(And am I the only person who keeps misreading "Jerykk" as "Jerkk"? Wonder why?)
I want a pic, preferably on the terrace in the sunset with a cocktail.
Like I said before, I don't want to downplay any concerns people might have and I get why the line might be taken a certain way. I don't know how much a developer should be criticized for someone (or, in this case, a group of people) misinterpreting their joke. And I do think it's being misinterpreted and twisted by a specific group to fit their message. Obviously I don't work at id Software, so I can't speak as to what they were thinking, but there's nothing in their previous work to suggest any ill intent here. Admittedly, most people are probably not going to go out of their way to watch or read interviews with the developers to determine said intent, but I feel like if anyone has played Doom 2016 (which is not some crazy requirement), the over-the-top, satirical tone should be apparent.
Also: I am never going to waste my time reading YouTube comments. You shouldn't either.
Because everything you just described is outside of the game experience?
Think of it like this: if you were reviewing a movie, would you give it a crappy rating because the guy sitting next to you kept talking on his phone? No, you wouldn't. Sure, that guy affected your experience but you were able to discern between the qualities of the movie itself and the qualities of everything outside the movie. Same thing applies here. Is it convenient to be able to play Doom while on vacation? Definitely. Is that convenience a quality of the game itself? No, it is not. I mean, if you had a good laptop, you could play the PC version while on vacation AND get vastly superior image quality, performance and controls (if you used a mouse instead of the touchpad).
The convenience and comfort of when and how you play will affect your overall experience, whether consciously or not.