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Kusagari

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,606
GOP should really be wary of the fact that Texas didn't include exceptions for rape and incest. Americans overwhelmingly support those exceptions for abortion. All you need is one story about an underage girl being raped and being unable to get an abortion to go national.
 
Aug 12, 2019
5,159
You guys do understand Manchin and Sinema are who you should be writing to right?

The idea that voters are ever going to specifically go out of their way to blame Manchin and Sinema and not the Democratic party as a whole for failing to act with a trifecta is the kind of laughable fairy tale nonsense that overly invested political forum goers believe in. Manchin and Sinema's failures will be the party's failures save for them truly doing some heinous turn coating more than they already do. You can scream it's not fair all you want and have some point (I still think moderates are hiding behind them in much more meaningful ways, and we probably need to overcome a further 5 or 6 Senators of moderate idiocy), but the Democrats have exactly zero political apparatus to control the conversation that will effectively pin the blame on just those two as opposed to the party at large.

And of all the people who would genuinely respond to their constituents, I really doubt Manchin or Sinema remotely care. They're both absolutely resolute in their dumb as hell moderate "my way" bipartisanship ideas and regularly don't care for any amount of criticism. If the other rich Senators and officials in DC who have known Manchin for years can't sway him, a bunch of angry out of state Democrats definitely can't do it either, and I honestly don't really think Manchin would respond much to those from his state to begin with lol.
 
OP
OP
SSF1991

SSF1991

Member
Jun 19, 2018
3,263
This has been the worst week Dems have had so far this term.

So, of course, this is Manchin's cue to be an attention--seeking asshole again.
 

greatgeek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,816
GOP should really be wary of the fact that Texas didn't include exceptions for rape and incest. Americans overwhelmingly support those exceptions for abortion. All you need is one story about an underage girl being raped and being unable to get an abortion to go national.
Or a rape victim sued by their rapist, rapist's family, or some shitheels.
 
Aug 12, 2019
5,159
No substantive reason other than this:


A bunch of mega corps have been in his ear begging him to "pull a Manchin" and he does what he's told.


This is also exactly the kind of shit I expected from Manchin. He was never fully on board with Reconciliation even if he voted to start proceedings and I thought it was extremely odd they passed the Bipartisan bill only for everybody to suddenly shout how great things were with the Reconciliation bill as a lock. I think there's an above average chance Manchin sinks the bill because a self interested jackass and in that self interest he's got a much greater stomach for fucking people over than the few in the progressive caucus of the House.
 

Dierce

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,000
This is also exactly the kind of shit I expected from Manchin. He was never fully on board with Reconciliation even if he voted to start proceedings and I thought it was extremely odd they passed the Bipartisan bill only for everybody to suddenly shout how great things were with the Reconciliation bill as a lock. I think there's an above average chance Manchin sinks the bill because a self interested jackass and in that self interest he's got a much greater stomach for fucking people over than the few in the progressive caucus of the House.
I agree with your assumption. It's more likely that manchin sinks the reconciliation bill than the house reciprocating with the bipartisan bill. It's also a good time to point out the companies that are against the reconciliation bill, apple and disney among them. These are companies that this forum loves to praise or at least help to heavily advertise their products. Companies such as Apple, Disney, and ExxonMobil are swarming Capitol Hill in a desperate attempt to squash Biden's tax plan to pay for free college and childcare

These ultra rich companies that have billions stashed oversees dont want to see a single extra penny go towards taxes. The environment and the public well being of the population be dammed.
 

Poodlestrike

Smooth vs. Crunchy
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
13,514
This "Dems clearly don't want to do anything!" narrative is still mad fucking dumb. Yes, there are procedural challenges that mean even with the House, the Senate (sorta) and the White House, there's some stuff we simply can't do. That's the way the system is built. Wanna change it, yeah, you need more Democrats. For God's sake, I beg you, read a civics book. I get that the average voter doesn't get the details but if you're posting in what is nominally the politics enthusiast thread you should really be able to figure out why things happen the way they happen and not just go for the immediately cathartic answer.

Short of kidnapping their families or blackmailing them, nothing is going to get Manchin and Sinema to vote the way we want them to vote on the filibuster. Shit sucks. Gotta figure out another way, that way almost certainly *not* including the only politically potent group in the country actually opposed to the Republican agenda!

Look at what's happening in Texas! Look at the effects of the climate crisis! If you wanna have an intra party slap fight after we've gotten shit done, be my guest but until then it's gotta be all hands on fucking deck.
 

Chrome Hyena

Member
Oct 30, 2017
8,779
Yup.





Actions -- or inactions in this case, I suppose -- speak louder than words.

I've said it before.its time for us to protest and treat democrats like Republicans when they don't want to work for us. It's insane to me that democrats make their voting proposition: " vote for us and all the shit you hate we will slow walk it and sound angry! Really it's the best we can do!" Such bullshit.

Really someone needs to ask Jen why does Biden keep saying "congress should fix" when he knows congress won't do shit?!
 

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,959
This is also exactly the kind of shit I expected from Manchin. He was never fully on board with Reconciliation even if he voted to start proceedings and I thought it was extremely odd they passed the Bipartisan bill only for everybody to suddenly shout how great things were with the Reconciliation bill as a lock. I think there's an above average chance Manchin sinks the bill because a self interested jackass and in that self interest he's got a much greater stomach for fucking people over than the few in the progressive caucus of the House.
And McCarthy just needs to allow enough House R's to vote for the Bipartisan bill to cover any loss of Progressive votes and the Reconciliation bill is as good as dead. Just despondent at the moment. Christ.

I hate Collins as much as most, but that's not the worst defense she came up with, lol.
 

NullPointer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,194
Mars
No substantive reason other than this:


A bunch of mega corps have been in his ear begging him to "pull a Manchin" and he does what he's told.

Wish he included a link to what he's talking about here, because... what is he talking about here? Which corporate interests are in this "Whos who"? And what does this massive lobbying campaign consist of?

Sorry if I've missed the obvious. I don't have reason to doubt it, but I also have no idea on any substance.
 

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,959
Wish he included a link to what he's talking about here, because... what is he talking about here? Which corporate interests are in this "Whos who"? And what does this massive lobbying campaign consist of?

Sorry if I've missed the obvious. I don't have reason to doubt it, but I also have no idea on any substance.
Link in Dierce's post:
www.resetera.com

US PoliEra 2021 |OT 3| Rage Against The Manchin

I agree with your assumption. It's more likely that manchin sinks the reconciliation bill than the house reciprocating with the bipartisan bill. It's also a good time to point out the companies that are against the reconciliation bill, apple and disney among them. These are companies that this...
 

Thordinson

Member
Aug 1, 2018
18,214
Short of kidnapping their families or blackmailing them, nothing is going to get Manchin and Sinema to vote the way we want them to vote on the filibuster. Shit sucks. Gotta figure out another way, that way almost certainly *not* including the only politically potent group in the country actually opposed to the Republican agenda!

Look at what's happening in Texas! Look at the effects of the climate crisis! If you wanna have an intra party slap fight after we've gotten shit done, be my guest but until then it's gotta be all hands on fucking deck.

The other way is voting, yes? How do people in red states, passing voter suppression laws, vote more? It's becoming harder and harder to vote so voting your way out of things may not be an answer soon. I don't know what the answer is in that case, honestly.

I'm cool with all hands on deck. But I understand people, especially minorities, becoming disillusioned with the entire process.
 

Remmy2112

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,142
He's hoping to change his party isn't he?

If he is then he is an absolute moron. He could not possibly survive a Republican primary, no matter how useful he has been to Senate Republicans. They cannot control the far-right and some Trump dingus will primary him and slaughter him in the primary. Manchin's only power and influence is with Democrats, as the only Democrat who can win in a West Virginia senate race, and continue bringing home the bacon to his state, but Manchin is stubborn old idiot who doesn't seem to understand the political reality that if he tanks Democrats they will lose and he'll lose his power.
 

NullPointer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,194
Mars
Link in Dierce's post:
www.resetera.com

US PoliEra 2021 |OT 3| Rage Against The Manchin

I agree with your assumption. It's more likely that manchin sinks the reconciliation bill than the house reciprocating with the bipartisan bill. It's also a good time to point out the companies that are against the reconciliation bill, apple and disney among them. These are companies that this...
Thank you for this. Its exactly what I was looking for.
 

jeelybeans

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
The other way is voting, yes? How do people in red states, passing voter suppression laws, vote more? It's becoming harder and harder to vote so voting your way out of things may not be an answer soon. I don't know what the answer is in that case, honestly.

I'm cool with all hands on deck. But I understand people, especially minorities, becoming disillusioned with the entire process.

Probably not with Manchin, but I would absolutely encourage Democrats in red states that are not going blue any time soon to help fund/put GOTV energy into whoever is going to be Sinema's primary opponent. There is absolutely no reason for her to act the way she is when Democrats in Arizona do not want her to behave that way and her Democratic senator colleague from the same state is not behaving that way.
 

Thordinson

Member
Aug 1, 2018
18,214
Probably not with Manchin, but I would absolutely encourage Democrats in red states that are not going blue any time soon/tipping blue is unlikely to help fund/put GOTV energy into whoever is going to be Sinema's primary opponent. There is absolutely no reason for her to act the way she is when Democrats in Arizona do not want her to behave that way and her Democratic senator colleague from the same state is not behaving that way.

I only have so much mental bandwidth and I'm organizing and helping the people in my community and state. Arizonans need to do it must importantly.
 

devilhawk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,536
Manchin comes out originally against EVERY Democratic bill. He writes Op-Eds about most of them too. It's all performative garbage.
 

Chrome Hyena

Member
Oct 30, 2017
8,779
I guess one good thing about abortion coming under fire like this is it will directly affect white women, and America acts quickly to protect them. Maybe we will get swift and decisive action like what happened with opioids and not the same bullshit we got with crack.
 
Oct 27, 2017
8,658
The World
You want Biden to sue in SC to block a state law that doesn't deal with anything at the federal level? Good luck with that.

I see some people don't like the fact that more Dems have to be elected to do the things they want done. Guess what, the reason GOP at state level are able to do things they want is that they have massive majorities and not evenly divided houses.
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,858
Fox News often gets their viewers riled up about abortion by framing it in a hyperbolic way, like describing it as frequently late term or "after birth" infanticide. The orange clown often described abortion as the latter. And a large segment of the defund Planned Parenthood crowd still believe clinics sell baby parts. But when GOP state legislatures pass laws to shut down clinics based on nonsense requirements like admitting privileges, this slow erosion of reproductive rights doesn't get much celebratory airtime outside of anti-abortion religious blogs.

There's a vast chasm of ignorance about pregnancy and women's health in general among moderates and conservative leaning types, who support abortion in some cases. They don't quite grasp what 6 weeks means, and the whole insanity around Texas effectively deputizing randos.
 

Kusagari

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,606
I wonder if McCarthy will use the fact they're going after his phone records as a reason to back the Freedom Caucus efforts to remove Cheney/Kinzinger from the caucus.
 

Warhawk4Ever

Banned
Jun 23, 2021
2,514
Yup he officially committed a crime in trying to block the it

im not so sure its criminality he is worried about as much as information that shows he was in discussions a bit deeper with Trump than he admitted originally. His number one goal is to be Speaker and any info released that may hurt his relationship with Trump fucks that over.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
31,282
im not so sure its criminality he is worried about as much as information that shows he was in discussions a bit deeper with Trump than he admitted originally. His number one goal is to be Speaker and any info released that may hurt his relationship with Trump fucks that over.
No I mean there's an actual statute against politicians threatening companies to get them to withhold information from a federal investigation. Not what info may come up
 

Ether_Snake

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
11,306
Might be useful in conversations with conservatives.

NfBFlEc.jpg
 
Oct 29, 2017
2,550
Can you point me to where Joe Manchin promised to break the filibuster to protect abortion rights?

That's the whole problem with the "Democrats aren't doing anything." Joe Manchin determines if the Democrat's do anything. Period.
Here's the thing I want. I want Joe, and other Democratic leaders, to go on national tv, multiple times throughout this week and the next week (and well into the future) to hammer home the point of how bad the Texas law is on abortion. Manchin will do his thing, I can't worry about that anymore as it will give me an ulcer if I keep track of that man closely. I want Dem leadership to make the Texas law a national issue. Use whatever bully pulpit you have to drive home that Republicans want to remove your rights. This is what I want from the leaders I elected. Use whatever power you can in the situation. They run on protecting women's rights. Nows a damn good time to do whatever you can to attain the capabilities, or influence people for next election, to enforce that protection.

edit: Twitter responses from my elected representatives do not fucking cut it for me anymore.
 
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NihonTiger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,544
I wonder if there will be a GOP governor who vetoes.



The only trifecta governor who would is probably DeWine if he's afraid it's too much (he supports overturning Roe v Wade but the Ohio legislature makes Texas look quaint at times, let's just say that) and I only think it's a non-zero chance he would at best
 
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