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Khanimus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
40,437
Greater Vancouver
"Not being able to masturbate to video games" is apparently the only thing these dorks care about in life
It's not about them jerking off. It's that they think women should only be included for a very specific reason - be hyper-sexualized objects for their amusement. If they just wanted to masturbate, they could look for porn anywhere on the internet. They don't want women treated as equals.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,811
"Not being able to masturbate to video games" is apparently the only thing these dorks care about in life
that's not even the problem

the problem is worse its actually " Not being able to host mods for masturbatory purposes on a games official reddit and being so much of a soccially inept dingus that you can't understand why people wouldn't want that"

its just sad
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
My friend is in the Bethesda modding community and some of the people there are full on 110% creeps. Like rape fantasy no women in combat creeps.
 

baconcow

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,818
I personally think the change looks bad, but I thought the point of video game mods were so that people could make games suit their wants. I do think the subreddit moderators should do what is best for their community. However, I am not going to go so far as to judge or insult the actual people who want this, despite having a differing opinion than them.
 

Sieglinde

Member
Feb 20, 2019
970
They should just open a new subreddit to share this type of content for the people who want to make it and download it, it's not that big of a deal honestly most communities i frequent usually have seperate NSFW subs so that clashes like this don't happen.
 

RedSwirl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,101
If someone wants to make and use those mods on their own installs on their own time no one can really stop them, but that subreddit also has the right to determine what it wants posted and distributed there. Take that stuff to Nexus or somewhere. This is why there are multiple mod networks for Bethesda game mods, each one has different regulations.
 

Garlic

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,687
That mod is ridiculous. I do think this highlights another issue of the power/importance given to these communities around subreddits and things, and that is why I don't think the developers and CMs should even bother going there at all and giving it even a semblance of legitimacy. If they stick to their own forums that are tightly moderated without the laizzes fair attitude that other places on the internet have, it'll force people to go there to get real information and interaction with actual important people like the developers or community managers.

The problem is Reddit has almost completely killed forums, and this highlights the grey area reality that subreddits have largely become quasi-official forums because devs naturally want to meet players where they actually are. The problem of course is that devs naturally don't want to be seen as tacitly endorsing seedy shit that commonly goes down on Reddit.
 

DukeBlueBall

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,059
Seattle, WA
User Banned (1 Month): Rationalizing Sexism as Historical Purity Over Multiple Posts; Prior Severe Infraction Related to Gender
My friend is in the Bethesda modding community and some of the people there are full on 110% creeps. Like rape fantasy no women in combat creeps.

I disagree with no women in combat people being labelled creeps. More like historical purists.
 

karnage10

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,546
Portugal
Bethesda is easy to imagine though. Their games are first person and talented modders can create animation loops and such to emulate sex scenes. And of course it's easy to add sexy dialogue and such.

Total War is a top-down view RTS game or a map-mode grand strategy game. I literally can't imagine where the sexy stuff would come in.
In the campaign where you upgrade the skills of the char you have a full body portrait of the char.

Interesting (not really but bare with me) how they removed her smile.in the sexualised pic and replaced it with a dead expression.
In the game she can go from angry/sad to happy/smiling. It depends on the satisfaction of the char. Because of that i think the "dead expression" is the default (0 satisfaction) face.
I might be wrong and the author could have used the face like you think. It is highly disturbing if you are right.

It's pretty cool that she is available at all considering there are few notable women in that era. Should have just made Lady Wu the Wu warlord since she bossed around Sun Quan so much anyway lol. I would totally play this game if I thought my laptop could handle it.
Lady Wu is in the game but she is a "generic" char (this emans she doesn't have an unique portrait). She is playable.

What laptop do you have? i think the game is relatively soft if you don't mind small scale battles and bad graphics.

Is the issue here that a previously not sexy character was made sexy? Or just where it was posted? Like would it be "fine" to post that kind of mod on the sites that host nude, sex and sexy mods for games or is all that stuff in general seen as bad?
IMO the problems are
  • heavily sexualizing a female char
  • Doing so in a way that makes 0 sense for the time period
  • Posting the mod in a semi-oficial "forum"
  • harassing the community manager because she feels uncomfortable with the 3 above points
Each point by themselves are bad enough. Together? it is mind boggling people like this exist.


And then you have the Vampire Coast which is female dominated faction.
billy-christian-win-vampire-final-post.jpg
That artwork is so good! i never saw it since they sold me the DLC with the trailer...
Creepy as fuck to dress a teenager like that.
In the game she can be 18 to 100+ with that portrait. Personaly speaking whether she is 18 or 100 is still a disgusting image.
Darren of course, being the slimeball he is, is taking the side of the angry whiners. Dude is disgusting. Should have banned him associating with Arch.
I'm so glad he isn't "offical" anymore.
This truly is oppression. #GamersRiseUp.
Gamers get mad over the stupidest shit, I swear.
Wait until you hear how total war fans got mad with female generals in rome2.

I really enjoy total war games but the (vocal) fan base is horrible people.
Grace's last comments on the sub are a depressing read. Seeing the subreddit just turn on her abruptly like that makes me sick.
i shouldn't have clicked.
I disagree with no women in combat people being labelled creeps. More like historical purists.
This is sarcasm right?
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,966
My friend is in the Bethesda modding community and some of the people there are full on 110% creeps. Like rape fantasy no women in combat creeps.


One of my favorite modding showcase youtubers from Fallout and Skyrim not too long ago full on embraced the really disgusting mods and started showcasing it on their channel. Easy but sad unsub.
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,986
This all makes me realise how gaming is still heavy with gatekeeping from "fans". A mod that made Sekiro or Dark Souls easier would be "against the artistic purity of the dev's vision", but a mod that sexualises and demeans the women in a game is fine, because "Huh huh boobs are great amiright? And if you don't like tits in your face, you suck!". The fact that the community manager was so quickly rounded on is appalling.
 

Spaltazar

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,105
This all makes me realise how gaming is still heavy with gatekeeping from "fans". A mod that made Sekiro or Dark Souls easier would be "against the artistic purity of the dev's vision", but a mod that sexualises and demeans the women in a game is fine, because "Huh huh boobs are great amiright? And if you don't like tits in your face, you suck!". The fact that the community manager was so quickly rounded on is appalling.
well it could be argued that ez mode actually alters how the game plays, but this mod is just a visual change, isn't it?

also this mod looks like some weird photoshop mash up for some reason.
 

karnage10

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,546
Portugal
CA has a mode to cater to this crowd called records mode. Some enthusiast might not find it faithful enough to Records of the Three Kingdoms and make their own changes along with removing female generals.
Could you tell me about those changes? because i'd bet most people are just misogynist and not historical purists.

Go on reddit (or whatever forum you desire) and tell me how many posts you see about historical purist complaining about the spear depictions?
(if you don't know spear in the game lose against sword units; which would be impossible to happen IRL)

  1. How many people you see complaining about how unrealistic the tactics are?
  2. How many people you see complaining on why the units are so responsive?
  3. How many people are complaining about the Imaginary male units in the game?
  4. What about rome 2 female generals? how come i don't see any historical purist defending that? (or are you saying Cleopatra and Boudica didn't exist?)
  5. How come nobody complains about sieges happening in the game very often? (historically speaking there are very few actual sieges)

The only time i see historical purist is when the ladies are given power and its to put them down.

I'm sorry, maybe you truly are a historical purist but I don't see any posts of yours complaining about the above in any strategy game title. Total war hasn't ever been an realistic historical title, how come the line is drawn with women getting representation?
 

SofNascimento

cursed
Member
Oct 28, 2017
21,526
São Paulo - Brazil
Could you tell me about those changes? because i'd bet most people are just misogynist and not historical purists.

Go on reddit (or whatever forum you desire) and tell me how many posts you see about historical purist complaining about the spear depictions?
(if you don't know spear in the game lose against sword units; which would be impossible to happen IRL)

  1. How many people you see complaining about how unrealistic the tactics are?
  2. How many people you see complaining on why the units are so responsive?
  3. How many people are complaining about the Imaginary male units in the game?
  4. What about rome 2 female generals? how come i don't see any historical purist defending that? (or are you saying Cleopatra and Boudica didn't exist?)
  5. How come nobody complains about sieges happening in the game very often? (historically speaking there are very few actual sieges)

The only time i see historical purist is when the ladies are given power and its to put them down.

I'm sorry, maybe you truly are a historical purist but I don't see any posts of yours complaining about the above in any strategy game title. Total war hasn't ever been an realistic historical title, how come the line is drawn with women getting representation?

You mean Three Kingdoms or Total War as a whole? Because I believe both, but certainly the latter, have had their share of historical purists forever. Indeed, the most well known mods for the games have to do with just that. So I think when it comes to this particular franchise, this is something that happens. Of course, there is a lot of people who will simply use it as an excuse, but a sort of purism towards history is not new.
 
OP
OP
CenturionNami

CenturionNami

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,230
I miss the days on Total War center when people were complaining about the colour of Roman sandals....
 

karnage10

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,546
Portugal
You mean Three Kingdoms or Total War as a whole? Because I believe both, but certainly the latter, have had their share of historical purists forever. Indeed, the most well known mods for the games have to do with just that. So I think when it comes to this particular franchise, this is something that happens. Of course, there is a lot of people who will simply use it as an excuse, but a sort of purism towards history is not new.
is that really true? I haven't played the latest versions of many mods but many of them still bend a lot of historical consideration to make the game "fun".

For example here is a screen shot of darthmod for shogun 2
Vastator_j5nKkthIjlkTJ.jpg


maybe my history is outdated but when i learned a bit of japonese history sword was a backup weapon, not the main weapon for line confrontation.

If my memory for mods like radiant and divide et impera for rome 2 spears still don't beat most units. IRL spear is an extremely good weapon yet in the mods/game is one of the worst.

Again the line of the "historical purist" is usually women. There might be true historical purists but i doubt those play total war, after all, most of the gameplay of the total war series is not historical accurate.
Total war is like a hollywood movie, i think no historical purists will watch kingdom of heaven for the historical accuracy... How come they would play a total war game for that reason?

Like i said maybe attila, throb and 3ks mods are very historical oriented but the mods for previous games? they weren't that accurate when i played them, specially in battle.

CA banned the mods or conversation about them in reddit?
Neither.
CA community manager said she is uncomfortable with bikini female chars
community gets hostil at her
CA community says she will leave reddit for a few days due to these types of posts
reddit mods ban bikini mods
Community makes outraged at being censored.
 

AllEchse

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,130
There is a place for sexualised content if people like to play that way.
Maybe the offical subreddit is just a weird place for that.
 

SofNascimento

cursed
Member
Oct 28, 2017
21,526
São Paulo - Brazil
is that really true? I haven't played the latest versions of many mods but many of them still bend a lot of historical consideration to make the game "fun".

For example here is a screen shot of darthmod for shogun 2
Vastator_j5nKkthIjlkTJ.jpg


maybe my history is outdated but when i learned a bit of japonese history sword was a backup weapon, not the main weapon for line confrontation.

If my memory for mods like radiant and divide et impera for rome 2 spears still don't beat most units. IRL spear is an extremely good weapon yet in the mods/game is one of the worst.

Again the line of the "historical purist" is usually women. There might be true historical purists but i doubt those play total war, after all, most of the gameplay of the total war series is not historical accurate.

I haven't played many of the mods myself, or at least not for long. Indeed, they are just not fun for me because of how much historical they are. But you are right that they might not be 100% accurate. Indeed, it's literally impossible to be 100% accurate and aiming to be so is a waste of time. My point is that people being petty because of historical accurary is something I've since since Rome 1's days.

The mods I had in my mind were Europa Barbarorum and Total Realism by the way.
 

Deleted member 24540

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,599
It's not about them jerking off. It's that they think women should only be included for a very specific reason - be hyper-sexualized objects for their amusement. If they just wanted to masturbate, they could look for porn anywhere on the internet. They don't want women treated as equals.

Why do you care about the intentions of other people? They don't want to -- fine. Let them have those thoughts. Isn't it enough knowing that there are negative consequences in life for people when they voice such opinions? You've already won. The mods themselves are harmless, just ignore them. The real issue is women's portrayal in media, as that affects people's perception of how a woman should dress, what constitutes beauty, etc. What do you want to accomplish exactly? That all men in the world share your views? To make it illegal to have such thoughts? I find that the more you push your agenda onto others, the worse it gets. Look at Colin Moriarty, by calling his comment out, it led to him getting more money and fame.
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,986
Because sexuality is a facet of humans and interactive media creates a near infinite array of possibilities?

Cool.

Do the number of LGBTQ/kink/bondage/dom mods even come close to the number of titty mods? I'm thinking no. So...

Maybe ask why that shit is so prevalent in the first place

Why do you care about the intentions of other people? They don't want to -- fine. Let them have those thoughts. Isn't it enough knowing that there are negative consequences in life when people voice such opinions? You've already won. The mods themselves are harmless, just ignore them. The real issue is women's portrayal in media, as that affects people's perception of how a woman should dress etc. What do you want to accomplish exactly? That all men in the world share your views? To make it illegal to have such thoughts? I find that the more you push your agenda onto others, the worse it gets. Look at Colin Moriarty, by calling his comment out, it leads to him getting more money and fame.

A community that actively pushes back against a woman who says "this makes me uncomfortable" is a community that by its very actions is neither inclusive for women, or inclusive for men who don't share the wider group's fascination.
 

Echo

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
6,482
Mt. Whatever
User Banned (2 weeks): Sexist trolling, severe ban and numerous accumulated infractions
Cool mods. Good thing they aren't hosted on reddit, but just signal boosted there.
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,986
I'm not seeing the correlation here. The greater the number of mods appealing to a certain sexual preference, the more sinister the reason for their creation?

Maybe these mods aren't just a sexual preference, but speak to a broader frame-of-mind. Maybe some of the people who use these mods like boobs, whilst others veer more to misogyny.

I cannot say. Honestly. But that was the point of saying

Maybe ask why that shit is so prevalent in the first place

Because things like this don't have a single answer, so examining the situation gives more nuance.
 

Deleted member 48897

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 22, 2018
13,623
IMO the problems are
  • heavily sexualizing a female char
  • Doing so in a way that makes 0 sense for the time period
  • Posting the mod in a semi-oficial "forum"
  • harassing the community manager because she feels uncomfortable with the 3 above points

Yeah I was going to come in here and get clearer about what I dislike about this specific mod, but this is basically everything I have to say. The very last bullet point is the most obvious tell for why this shit isn't benign human sexual expression.


Also for some reason for the general in the OP's spoiler, her right, uh, breastplate seems to be askew. Like it's just not a very good mod even as a sexy portrait alternative kind of thing.
 

Deleted member 24540

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,599
A community that actively pushes back against a woman who says "this makes me uncomfortable" is a community that by its very actions is neither inclusive for women, or inclusive for men who don't share the wider group's fascination.

I'm not talking about the incident itself if that's what you are referring to, I agree that the developer rep is in the right here because of the official status of the community, so she gets to decide if the content is appropriate or not for that subreddit. That's a completely fair stance. The "disgusting people" can calmly take their business elsewhere. If they fight back then ban them. But what those people are or aren't is uninteresting to me, as long as they have no influence.
 

Khanimus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
40,437
Greater Vancouver
Why do you care about the intentions of other people? They don't want to -- fine. Let them have those thoughts. Isn't it enough knowing that there are negative consequences in life for people when they voice such opinions? You've already won. The mods themselves are harmless, just ignore them. The real issue is women's portrayal in media, as that affects people's perception of how a woman should dress, what constitutes beauty, etc. What do you want to accomplish exactly? That all men in the world share your views? To make it illegal to have such thoughts? I find that the more you push your agenda onto others, the worse it gets. Look at Colin Moriarty, by calling his comment out, it led to him getting more money and fame.
You're right, let's never criticize dumb shit ever because acknowledging problems makes things worse. Let's ignore how misogyny heavily crosses over with gaming communities, because that will make it go away.

Congrats, you figured it out.
 

dhlt25

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,829
geez if you want T&A in a 3 kingdom setting just go play some Dysnaty Warriors games
 

Deleted member 24540

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,599
You're right, let's never criticize dumb shit ever because acknowledging problems makes things worse. Let's ignore how misogyny heavily crosses over with gaming communities, because that will make it go away.

Congrats, you figured it out.

The only thing you can do is to treat each thing as an isolated incident and complain via the proper channels so to speak. You can't forcefully change people's thoughts...