The FIFA and Madden situation on Switch just feels... strange?

tutomos · Jan 30, 2020

OrbitalBeard said:
....did you even read my post

GTA V is currently around 70gb on PS4 (and continues to grow in size), that's a far more likely reason for its absence on Switch. Again, Nintendo has absolutely zero issues with games like GTA Online existing on their platform.

GTA V is also on the PS3. Nintendo has no issue, but other publishers have an issue, not just EA.

SyndicateWars said:
What about Fortnite and NBA 2K? I want to hear your explanation, if you don't mind.

I see Fortnite and Overwatch being on the Switch with several factors:
1. ESRB rating T (more family-friendly, as opposed to M rated games like COD) fits the Nintendo audience
2. Not technically demanding so all versions are similar (no gimped version!), cost of port vs return makes sense
3. Epic focuses on one game and can allocate resource to the Switch once other console versions are done

NBA 2k is a good example, and I had to look up the financial report for Take 2 and EA. In the Q2 FY20 report, Take 2's net income was $72mil vs EA's net income $272mil. EA obviously has more games but they have 3 times more profit. They are very successful in milking their digital revenue, so I think the cost of being on the Switch is not worth the effort at this point if it's not drastically improving their profit margin. Take 2 needed to be on more devices to make up for lower margin.

Plinko · Jan 30, 2020

The blowup that happened between Nintendo and EA that involved the "unprecedented partnership" for Wii U damaged their relationship almost irreparably.

ItWasMeantToBe19 · Jan 30, 2020

tutomos said:
GTA V is also on the PS3. Nintendo has no issue, but other publishers have an issue, not just EA.

I see Fortnite and Overwatch being on the Switch with several factors:
1. ESRB rating T (more family-friendly, as opposed to M rated games like COD) fits the Nintendo audience
2. Not technically demanding so all versions are similar (no gimped version!), cost of port vs return makes sense
3. Epic focuses on one game and can allocate resource to the Switch once other console versions are done

NBA 2k is a good example, and I had to look up the financial report for Take 2 and EA. In the Q2 FY20 report, Take 2's net income was $72mil vs EA's net income $272mil. EA obviously has more games but they have 3 times more profit. They are very successful in milking their digital revenue, so I think the cost of being on the Switch is not worth the effort at this point if it's not drastically improving their profit margin. Take 2 needed to be on more devices to make up for lower margin.

1 and 2... also very easily apply to FIFA and Madden?

Aokiji · Jan 30, 2020

Their market research has shown them the switch is not a key market for their games. That's all there is to it. To them the juice is not worth the squeeze.

RedOnePunch · Jan 30, 2020

Maybe they figure the FIFA and Madden crowd are on PS4 and Xbox. I don't think it's anything "political" or some agenda.

ShinJohnpv · Jan 30, 2020

Anyone who thinks there's no market for people to play Madden and Fifa on the go is naive, IMHO.

tutomos · Jan 30, 2020

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
1 and 2... also very easily apply to FIFA and Madden?

EA did release gimped versions on the Switch so maybe Frostbite can't run on the Switch yet...

skeezx · Jan 30, 2020

Plinko said:
The blowup that happened between Nintendo and EA that involved the "unprecedented partnership" for Wii U damaged their relationship almost irreparably.

EA doesn't give a dick about "bad blood" if it means $$$. though during the pre launch/launch window of switch it was a factor, surely

eraFROMAN · Jan 30, 2020

EA half asses anything that isn't PS4/Xbox, so it's probably better for everyone this way. No one's buying half made games and EA isn't getting criticized for it.

Soapbox Killer · Jan 30, 2020

Jiraiya said:
Tell Nintendo to make a system more in line with Microsoft and Sony.

By every available metric it is reasonable to assume there are now more Switches in the hands of gamers than Xbox Ones .The thinking that Nintendo fans don't play or invest in these games is laughable. Switch is a potential 100 Million seller but EA doesn't believe it is a profitable endeavor for certain titles and shame on them for that.

Deleted member 19702 · Jan 30, 2020

tutomos said:
GTA V is also on the PS3. Nintendo has no issue, but other publishers have an issue, not just EA.

I see Fortnite and Overwatch being on the Switch with several factors:
1. ESRB rating T (more family-friendly, as opposed to M rated games like COD) fits the Nintendo audience
2. Not technically demanding so all versions are similar (no gimped version!), cost of port vs return makes sense
3. Epic focuses on one game and can allocate resource to the Switch once other console versions are done

NBA 2k is a good example, and I had to look up the financial report for Take 2 and EA. In the Q2 FY20 report, Take 2's net income was $72mil vs EA's net income $272mil. EA obviously has more games but they have 3 times more profit. They are very successful in milking their digital revenue, so I think the cost of being on the Switch is not worth the effort at this point if it's not drastically improving their profit margin. Take 2 needed to be on more devices to make up for lower margin.

1) 1 and 2 can easily be afforded to EA and their sports line-up, well, even NFS.

2) If NBA 2K wasn't worthy then Take-Two would have pulled it off from Switch at this rate. We keep seeing it being released annualy since Switch's release.

Your points are contradictory and not really good reasons to justify EA's stand.

mrmoose · Jan 30, 2020

How does NBA 2K do on the switch? I didn't buy this year's version but I bought the last two years and the online, which is forced on basically everyone, has been sparse at best, even in season.

Doskoi Panda · Jan 30, 2020

Neither Nintendo (as a platform holder), nor the Switch (as a platform), are as conducive to the sale of microtransactions, and deluxe/premium/alternative edition content, as the competitor platforms are. That's not a knock on PS4 or Xbox, I'm just calling it like I see it. The PS Store/Xbox Store are designed to facilitate such endeavors, and Sony/Microsoft are receptive to them too. Additionally, Sony and Microsoft are likely far more proactive in enabling and creating opportunities for promotion of content on their platforms (through the storefront, through the platform UI, and through multimedia) - which I'm sure plays a big part in EA's reluctance to support the Switch more meaningfully.

plagiarize · Jan 30, 2020

Technically, I'd figure any 60 fps console game a plausible porting target for switch. It's completely doable but they don't want to do it. Even if porting the engine would be expensive, it would open up many avenues for other games to get ported.

I think ignoring the switch is bad business. They obviously don't. Missed opportunities don't really show up on balance sheets do we shall never know.

Deleted member 36708 · Jan 30, 2020

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Bethesda and Activision release plenty of games on Switch, IDK.

COD?

tutomos · Jan 31, 2020

SyndicateWars said:
1) 1 and 2 can easily be afforded to EA and their sports line-up, well, even NFS.

2) If NBA 2K wasn't worthy then Take-Two would have pulled it off from Switch at this rate. We keep seeing it being released annualy since Switch's release.

Your points are contradictory and not really good reasons to justify EA's stand.

No, each game and publisher is different. 1 and 2 are specifically about Fortnite.

Take 2's profit margin is so low that they need to be on as many platforms as possible.

Mbolibombo · Jan 31, 2020

It's weird. It really is, Madden should have been a slamdunk by now. I think most of their sports games makes sense to release.. but EA has taken that business stance for whatever reason and that wouldnt change even if the Switch had a 100M user base.

Reinhardt Schneider · Jan 31, 2020

Jiraiya said:
Tell Nintendo to make a system more in line with Microsoft and Sony.

Ew no. Please let at least one company to add hw variety.

About the OP, EA refuses to invest money in porting frostbite, add to that the fact that they haven't exactly nurtured an audience inside the Nintendo ecosystem since... GameCube (being generous) so their sales are nowhere near what they are in Microsoft and Sony

Alek · Jan 31, 2020

Probably because their staff are going to be quite strained to get FIFA and Madden out year on year within their cycle and adding a new platform into the mix places even more demand on their studios.

It's not as simple as just porting it over, since games like FIFA usually only come together during the last few months of development. If they were working on FIFA for Switch with all of the features of the mainline console titles it would need to be worked on in parallel with the other versions.

That means spending at least an extra third on QA and playtesting resources, not to mention the time it takes to develop the Switch build of the game, with its various compromises and differences.

At the same time, they've likely looked at the install base, which is quite small compared to the PS4, where they sell the largest number of these games, and figure that the majority that want to play FIFA are already playing on existing hardware.

Basically, people don't appreciate how significant an undertaking it is to get a series like this on a different platform, and with its annual release schedule it's much more complex to manage than a simple one-off port like Doom. That cost offset against the potential benefit, makes it relatively unworthwhile for EA.

BarryFishFinger · Jan 31, 2020

I'd love FIFA on my Switch Lite, but I'll be fucked if I'm paying full whack for a crappy legacy version.

If they could bring the full version of FIFA, new engine and all, over to Switch I'd be happy to stump up the cash for a game I know I'd play a ton of but until then what's the point.

cw_sasuke · Jan 31, 2020

Tron1 said:
COD?

If you follow these threads you would see that most people wonder why games like Sims don't make it to the Switch and not why the latest Battlefield isn't on there.

Switch owners have pretty realistic expectations about what makes sense and would be feasible on the plattform.

That's the funny thing - expectations are already quite low and EA could meet them without too many issue....yet they continue to setup there business in a way where there isn't a real way to succeed. They are protecting their PS/Xbox business at all cost and don't really want people to buy their games on Switch - even if they put stuff like FIFA out.

Imagine if EA treated Xbox or PS customers like that from.the start and then went on to complain that the charts on those systems are dominated by first parties, Activision and Take 2 lol.

There is nothing wrong with EA not releasing software for Nintendo systems. They don't really need each other....but at least be honest about and unless you are willing to give it your best shot - don't complain. They are acting like they released a couple of GotY contenders on Switch that didn't sell because Nintendo dominates the plattform.

Lunchbox · Jan 31, 2020

EA is a terrible company that's all you need to know.

evilmonkey · Jan 31, 2020

You have Sony, probably Nintendo's biggest competitor ever, currently sitting with a larger catalog of published titles on the Switch than EA, which is supposed to be a neutral third-party that only looks out for the overall market's best interests. MS, another longtime competitor, also rivals their output and is undoubtedly closer to Nintendo than EA ever was.

That should tell you that at this point EA does not even care to keep appearances.

Jimrpg · Jan 31, 2020

Going to be super blunt here. It's super disappointing that FIFA doesn't have the latest game and PES isn't even on the Switch.

I think the two big reasons are, they're not interested in that audience, the switch has a younger audience and also an audience that predominantly buys Nintendo games.

And secondly they want to develop a baseline game using Xbox one and PS4 specs.

Jimrpg · Jan 31, 2020

BarryFishFinger said:
I'd love FIFA on my Switch Lite, but I'll be fucked if I'm paying full whack for a crappy legacy version.

If they could bring the full version of FIFA, new engine and all, over to Switch I'd be happy to stump up the cash for a game I know I'd play a ton of but until then what's the point.

I just wait until it's $15-20 sometimes, I just skip a year, but agree I definitely don't pay full price for a legacy edition. It's kinda embarrassing that they even plaster the words legacy edition on the front.

Lucid · Jan 31, 2020

FIFA on Switch uses the old Ignite engine instead of Frostbite, that's probably the main reason why they don't bother

DXB-KNIGHT · Jan 31, 2020

2K is supporting and soon Sony will join with MLB

Zalman · Jan 31, 2020

They're leaving money on the table. We have seen third-party games succeed on the Switch time and time again.

Gibordep · Jan 31, 2020

FrakEarth said:
Do Microsoft and Sony get a cut of Ultimate Team spending on Xbox and PS4?

I'm just curious.. obviously Nintendo are happy to let Epic sell V-Bucks, other companies are doing it, I've got a Rocket Pass for Rocket League..

I can well believe that online revenues might be a reason they'd stay away but part of me wonders if maybe they tried to strong-arm Nintendo to take a lower cut or no cut at all or something and they weren't having it. It would explain a lot.

As said in the other thread about EA, I'm also wondering if they just think that because it's a portable hybrid - they believe (possibly with good reason) a lot of users play offline and therefore can't spend the mega money on their online services etc.

The withdrawal of their business in the Wii U years did seem like a tangible effort to harm Nintendo's business - I wouldn't be surprised if they had hoped it would work as well as it did when they did the same to Sega... Maybe they just don't *want* to have to factor Nintendo in to their strategy

A think all the store sales gets a 30% cut from Sony and MS.

Herb Alpert · Jan 31, 2020

Jiraiya said:
It doesn't take a boundary pushing game to push the switch though.

What do you mean ?

Deleted member 19702 · Jan 31, 2020

Lol, you can't say now that big gaming corporations have political agendas. The mods believes this is "platform warring" and will warn you. Really? Lol.

justiceiro · Jan 31, 2020

If switch is such a good opportunity for football fans, ridle me this: why isn't Konami putting PES there? Konami has given lots of support to switch, with exclusives, collections, and day and date releases. But they also aren't there.

Shibata100 · Jan 31, 2020

justiceiro said:
If switch is such a good opportunity for football fans, ridle me this: why isn't Konami putting PES there? Konami has given lots of support to switch, with exclusives, collections, and day and date releases. But they also aren't there.

This is a strange one to be honest. A switch version would outsell xbox one!

GSG · Jan 31, 2020

EA's output on the Switch has been embarrassing, they released just one game all of 2019 and it was a shitty port of FIFA 20.

EA, in general, has been disappointing since the early 2010s.

EloKa · Jan 31, 2020

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
FIFA and Madden are extremely popular game franchises that don't really push technical specs to their limits or do things that couldn't be on last gen systems.

Didn't the last gen systems precisley only have legacy versions of the PS4 / Xbox / PC editions because of "things that couldn't be on last gen systems"?

FIFA had full and trimmend-down versions since several years depending on your platform.

MisterR · Jan 31, 2020

They put out FIFA and it pretty much flopped, especially compared to the PS4 and Xbox One sales. They don't feel it's worth the cost, for the potential sales.

RobotVM · Jan 31, 2020

I think EA was scared to be burned when the Switch released. They were full force for the Wii U at launch and it didn't pay off. Once they saw that the Switch was going to be successful it takes time for studios to put games out. EA probably didn't start to consider putting more games on Switch till late 2018 IMO.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

tutomos said:
No, each game and publisher is different. 1 and 2 are specifically about Fortnite.

Take 2's profit margin is so low that they need to be on as many platforms as possible.

You could turn around the bolded to make the complete opposite point. "Take 2's profit margin is so low that they can't afford to spend money porting it to other platforms."

That's not a valid reason.

justiceiro said:
If switch is such a good opportunity for football fans, ridle me this: why isn't Konami putting PES there? Konami has given lots of support to switch, with exclusives, collections, and day and date releases. But they also aren't there.

I remember reading it's an issue of the Fox engine or something, which they have no interest supporting in the future so it doesn't make sense to port it to a new platform. I could be wrong about that.

RobotVM said:
I think EA was scared to be burned when the Switch released. They were full force for the Wii U at launch and it didn't pay off. Once they saw that the Switch was going to be successful it takes time for studios to put games out. EA probably didn't start to consider putting more games on Switch till late 2018 IMO.

I'm sorry, but releasing Mass Effect 3 for $60 shortly after releasing the entire trilogy for cheaper on other platforms is not "full force" support of the Wii U. They pulled support hard before the Wii U ever launched.

MisterR · Jan 31, 2020

SyndicateWars said:
Lol, you can't say now that big gaming corporations have political agendas. The mods believes this is "platform warring" and will warn you. Really? Lol.

It's silly, childish nonsense. Companies care about one thing. Money. They don't hate your favorite piece of plastic.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

MisterR said:
They put out FIFA and it pretty much flopped, especially compared to the PS4 and Xbox One sales. They don't feel it's worth the cost, for the potential sales.

Source for it flopping? I thought FIFA 18 and 19 both sold well over 1M on Switch. 20 was a legacy version which in all likelihood did flop hard.

And before you say "well it sells in the tens of millions on other platforms" there weren't tens of millions of Switches around when 18 (or 19, really) launched. So if those were their expectations they were ridiculous.

MisterR · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
Source for it flopping? I thought FIFA 18 and 19 both sold well over 1M on Switch. 20 was a legacy version which in all likelihood did flop hard.

And before you say "well it sells in the tens of millions on other platforms" there weren't tens of millions of Switches around when 18 (or 19, really) launched. So if those were their expectations they were ridiculous.

It's sales were miniscule in relation to sales on the other platforms and EA has decided the money spent putting it on the Switch is best severed elsewhere. End of story, there is nothing really to debate here. If they thought that putting the game on the Switch would lead to worthwhile profit, it would be on the Switch.

fiendcode · Jan 31, 2020

justiceiro said:
If switch is such a good opportunity for football fans, ridle me this: why isn't Konami putting PES there? Konami has given lots of support to switch, with exclusives, collections, and day and date releases. But they also aren't there.

Konami doesn't want to port Fox Engine. When PES shifts to UE4 for next gen (probably 2021) they might start including Switch then.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

MisterR said:
It's sales were miniscule in relation to sales on the other platforms and EA has decided the money spent putting it on the Switch is best severed elsewhere. End of story, there is nothing really to debate here. If they thought that putting the game on the Switch would lead to worthwhile profit, it would be on the Switch.

Why did they put out 18 on the Switch which could only possibly have a ~7-8M user base at the time if they expected sales to be more in line with sales on other platforms? And where even sold in the millions?

Again, what exactly is your source that they flopped? How do you know their sales were miniscule compared to other platforms? All we know is that they were on the million seller list, we don't know how high they actually went.

MisterR · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
Why did they put out 18 on the Switch which could only possibly have a ~7-8M user base at the time if they expected sales to be more in line with sales on other platforms? And where even sold in the millions?

Again, what exactly is your source that they flopped? How do you know their sales were miniscule compared to other platforms? All we know is that they were on the million seller list, we don't know how high they actually went.

My source is at the time they were selling at like 2-3% of the total sales in the UK charts and they now get the legacy edition. If you want to believe that they were smash hits and EA has put gone to the legacy edition on Switch to spite you and your favorite hardware, then feel free to bear that cross.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

MisterR said:
My source is at the time they were selling at like 2-3% of the total sales in the UK charts and they now get the legacy edition. If you want to believe that they were smash hits and EA has put gone to the legacy edition on Switch to spite you and your favorite hardware, then feel free to bear that cross.

So basically you're saying "they aren't supporting the Switch because their games didn't sell well, and I know they didn't sell well because they aren't supporting the Switch now."

That's circular logic. Why even put out a legacy edition if the games weren't selling well?

I think in FIFA's case the bigger issue is Frostbite, yet I don't know exactly what that issue is. It's not a case of technology since engines aren't really dependent on specs in that way, but I guess for whatever reason EA doesn't want to devote resources to porting Frostbite to Switch, even if it seems like a sound future-proofing business decision to most of us (since that'll let them much more easily port over their future games).

hipsterbodega · Jan 31, 2020

Never mind the sports games, I can't even begin to fathom how many people would love to revisit the Mass Effect trilogy on the Switch. That feels like the real money on the table. Farm out a port of last gen's trilogy compilation and release it digital only. EA would clean up.

tutomos · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
You could turn around the bolded to make the complete opposite point. "Take 2's profit margin is so low that they can't afford to spend money porting it to other platforms."

For a smaller publisher that may be the case, but in the context of Take 2 they can afford to.

Shibata100 · Jan 31, 2020

MisterR said:
They put out FIFA and it pretty much flopped, especially compared to the PS4 and Xbox One sales. They don't feel it's worth the cost, for the potential sales.

1m sales is not a flop. EA should be aiming to grow the Nintendo user base

Akita One · Jan 31, 2020

Those games have never sold well on Nintendo systems. And, while some third party AAA games have done ok, they aren't setting the world on fire. It's unlikely that a Switch version of these games would make the money back from having to "down port" them.

SmittyWerbenManJensen · Jan 31, 2020

It's EA.

All that needs to be said, tbh

The FIFA and Madden situation on Switch just feels... strange?

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