Steroids: an honest discussion

[Deleted member 9838]

So I hear so much conflicting information about anabolic steroids. I've read online that they are super dangerous and also other people saying that the risk and side effects are actually quite minimal if done properly. I've read people saying they are fine to do and other people make them sound worse than heroin. I'm conflicted and making this thread because I'm curious about them and a lot of guys use them. I don't see what the big deal is if guys are using them safely and aren't competing in sports. People use them in sports and people also just use them for themselves. I'm wanting to learn about them because if they aren't so bad and if done properly what's the problem if guys want to use them to make gains in the gym? Please share your experience regarding steroids and also if you think they are bad or not.

 

[Fiction]

I've been on and off them for years due to autoimmune disease. They make me put on a ton of weight but I'm still alive.

For gains: Don't do it. They basically kill your immune system.

Edit: I'm dumb ignore me.

 

[Jindrax]

I'd take them in a heartbeat... If I had a doctor giving them to me, as well as all the other drugs needed to negate the side effects.

 

[negreenfield]

I'll say that if people want to do them then go for it. For me the potential side effects simply aren't worth it so I've never even considered them. You can do just fine naturally but keep expectations realistic. You need to know that most of the more noteworthy physiques you see online, Instagram, YouTube and in hollywood for example are probably all "enhanced" to some degree.

 

[spootime]

My only issue with people who take steroids is if they blatantly lie about it. Be honest or don't say anything about it. People who take steroids and then talk about how hard they work as a natural leads to body dysmorphia and feelings of inadequacy in the guys who believe them.

 

[Lakeside]

Man I had some steroid injections to troubleshoot a back issue.. caused night sweats for a couple of weeks like I was sleeping in soup. And any time I've taken oral steroids I had insomnia and was irritable as hell.

I can't imagine taking them for non-mandatory reasons.

 

[Kirblar]

I'm probably gonna end up on TRT eventually at some point in my life for legit medical reasons. Which probably doesn't count.

 

[Deleted member 9838]

I'd take them in a heartbeat... If I had a doctor giving them to me, as well as all the other drugs needed to negate the side effects.

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So it isn't just injecting occasionally but quite a few other medications as well for safety reasons?

 

[ghostemoji]

It really bums me out that potentially the best player ever, who wouldn't need steroids, would get to the highest level and feel pressured to take steroids in order to compete. Especially considering that the long term health ramifications aren't well understood.

I also think that sports like MMA, boxing, and football are sports in which we are seeing the athlete's lives damaged forever from cumulative damage, and giving performance enhancing drugs that only serve to make people better at inflicting that damage is bad and should not be encouraged on any level.

Utilizing drugs to help people with medical issues is great. Steroids are great at that sometimes and that's what they should be used for.

 

[Weegian]

Just get a couple of tubs of whey protein, OP.

 

[Kirblar]

It really bums me out that potentially the best player ever, who wouldn't need steroids, would get to the highest level and feel pressured to take steroids in order to compete. Especially considering that the long term health ramifications aren't well understood.

I also think that sports like MMA, boxing, and football are sports in which we are seeing the athlete's lives damaged forever from cumulative damage, and giving performance enhancing drugs that only serve to make people better at inflicting that damage is bad and should not be encouraged on any level.

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I think this is actually something that makes more sense once you're older- it's a nihilistic viewpoint of "f it, we're all gonna die eventually, might as well be big/strong/etc. in my prime" If you're more risk averse, it may take a while for the mindset to make sense. (This isn't an endorsement- but personally getting a taste of a few old age-y things hitting early before the underlying problems got fixed was NOT fun and a little bit of an eyeopener.)

It's different than say, the concussion issues, because you'd probably rather be dying early at 50 with a good looking corpse than living till 90 but with massive early onset mental health problems.

 

[LosDaddie]

Your body
Your choice

My advice is always the same; Don't come to Era for life advice.

There aren't any shortcuts to muscle gain and/or weight loss.

 

[hombremalo]

I think they are bad, but who are we to judge what other people do with their bodies. Pro sports is a different thing, is just not fair play.

 

[Cor]

Aint no one preventing me from doing TRT as i get older. Already diagnosed for lower than usual testosterone, sure as fuck wont be trapped in an even more decaying husk as i age.

also afaik no data wrt *just* some steroids, like testcyp, shortening your life span.

 

[aSniperJones]

What's the problem if guys want to use them to make gains in the gym?

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Unless your nutrition and training is already top notch and you've exhausted all natural [over-the-counter] methods for body growth, development, and strength then steroids are, or eventually will be, pointless. Steroids required the same effort, determination and training as if steroids weren't introduced into your body.

Don't do it for physically appearance.

 

[Bramblebutt]

It's your right to pursue body modification, but frankly, I think the overriding male obsession with getting huge at the expense of your overall health is an underappreciated problem. There are people who still idolize Zyzz, despite the fact that he died at a young age as a direct result of his abuse of steroids. That's nuts.

 

[Cor]

Unless your nutrition and training is already top notch and you've exhausted all natural [over-the-counter] methods for body growth, development, and strength then steroids are, or eventually will be, pointless. Steroids required the same effort, determination and training as if steroids weren't introduced into your body.

Don't do it for physically appearance.

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the bolded isnt true.

 

[The Albatross]

I had a thyroid attack caused by an autoimmune disease about 3 years ago and had to take oral steroids, and I didn't like them at all. Poor sleep, agitated, and the worst is my mind would race. Now, they could all be related... I had a medical issue so I slept poorly which caused agitation which caused my mind to race, etc., but once I was off the steroid treatment, it started going back to normal.

 

[Masoyama]

Steroids is such an incomplete name. People use so many things for different parts. Recovery, rashes, gains, injury and autoimmune diseases. For performance you can also get epo, diuretics, etc.

 

[Wackamole]

I have no idea what health issues they can ignite. But i do think you probably look amazing without them.
Why not go au naturel? Of course, if you really love that look then you should do whatever you like, don't get me wrong.
But definitely check how harmful they can be, just to be sure.

 

[SRG01]

I need strong steroid creams for my skin conditions, but in reality there are probably better alternatives out there... It's just a matter of finding a doctor that's willing to prescribe.

 

[shadowsdarknes]

Steroids are probably more common than you think. If you look like you're on them, people at a lot of gyms will start to talk to you and open up about what they take.

Taking a few vials of Test E with a post cycle ain't gonna kill you. You won't turn into an odd shaped freak, either.

 

[Host Samurai]

It's your right to pursue body modification, but frankly, I think the overriding male obsession with getting huge at the expense of your overall health is an underappreciated problem. There are people who still idolize Zyzz, despite the fact that he died at a young age as a direct result of his abuse of steroids. That's nuts.

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Zyzz was a party animal that was potentially using other recreational drugs along with a steroid cocktail. Not to mention his undiagnosed heart disease.

If you're going to take steroids, take it responsibly and stick to a single steroid only. I suggest watching Bigger Stronger Faster on Netflix.

 

[Raguel]

It's your body and your choice. Just be smart about using it. Steroids have been used for plenty of medical reason but the side affects can be detrimental. Theres a reason why it needs to be monitored properly. As a weight lifter of 15 years, I've never had the urge to do roids even though I know I can be stronger and bigger than I am now if I take roids. But it seemed to never matter bc I've had multiple people assume I was cycling. Hah

 

[spootime]

Aint no one preventing me from doing TRT as i get older. Already diagnosed for lower than usual testosterone, sure as fuck wont be trapped in an even more decaying husk as i age.

also afaik no data wrt *just* some steroids, like testcyp, shortening your life span.

Click to shrink...

Thankfully by the time I'm old enough to consider TRT there will be a good amount of long-term medical data on the effects of taking stuff like that long-term. On the surface TRT in my 50's seems like a godsend but I'm still very cautious about the long term effects on heart hypertrophy and blood pressure.

 

[Rayman not Ray]

What's the deal with TRT? Are there actual health benefits? I thought it was some weird trend designed to exploit people's insecurities about aging and masculinity?

 

[Meerkat]

I've done them plenty of times

research research research research research research research research and then do some more before you start taking them

totally fine if you know what you're doing

 

[entremet]

What's the deal with TRT? Are there actual health benefits? I thought it was some weird trend designed to exploit people's insecurities about aging and masculinity?

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No. It's more about optimization than anything.

 

[Rayman not Ray]

No. It's more about optimization than anything.

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Optimizing what?

 

[spootime]

I'll also give two personal anecdotes as I have two friends who took steroids:

My first friend was obsessed with bodybuilding as a teen. He won a "teen bodybuilder of the month" competition but didn't place as well as he wanted to in a local teen show. I say this to demonstrate that he already worked hard as hell: cutting down to 8% bodyfat for a physique show is fucking hard but he did it in high school. Once he hit 20 he started taking large amounts of Test and some other compounds. He gained 30 or 40 pounds of muscle over a year or two, his powerlifting total increased by around 300+ pounds and he won some bodybuilding shows. A few years later he stopped taking them. Looking back he regrets it and believes he was addicted to them in the past.

My other friend started taking them very recently, in his mid 20's. I've known him since high school and we've lifted together on and off since then. He's even more dedicated than my first friend (he's logged his food on myfitnesspal 1300+ days in a row...) but he was basically capped out as a natural. Lifted religiously and tracked his calories but couldnt progress. Recently he's started taking stuff and has now gained 30 or 40 pounds of muscle in the past year and already added 100+ pounds to his bench. Maybe he'll regret it, but I don't think so.

 

[Kirblar]

What's the deal with TRT? Are there actual health benefits? I thought it was some weird trend designed to exploit people's insecurities about aging and masculinity?

Click to shrink...

It's legitimately used for transitioning trans men and men with hypogonadism who don't produce enough. Testosterone is a natural steroid that will result in -fat +muscle even if you sit on your butt.

Guys stop producing as much as they age naturally and a too-steep decline can result in legit hypogonadism issues. The flip side of TRT is that your body also stops producing it in normal quantities naturally if you are externally supplementing, which results in guys who have abused it in the past becoming reliant on it as a result. Hence the controversy over it in MMA/Boxing/etc. that led to it getting banned by the UFC, as it effectively let cheaters keep cheating after they got caught. (which was a hilariously bullshit stance as we've now seen with Jon Jones.)

 

[entremet]

Optimizing what?

Click to shrink...

Life.

Feeling better, performing better in athletic pursuits, better libido, motivation for some and so on. That said, TRT is not my thing specifically, but I've done research. It's not plastic surgery.

It's not that people fear aging, is that many want to reclaim the energy they once had in youth. Much of that is hormonally derived.

 

[Heromanz]

Don't do steroids they're not worth it.

 

[Everybody Lies]

I know plenty of people that have used steroids for bodybuilding. One of them became suicidal and unstable, another had a heart attack at 26, another lost their hair in less than 6 months. I know another guy that is just fine without any side effects at all that competes regularly. Taking them seems to me to be a lottery that you don't know how it will play out until you are taking them. You could be fine, you could be a cautionary tale or something in between.

Another thing I've noticed with juice heads is that they tend to be very, very moody and they shrink when they stop lifting or get injured -- which can create a whole host of psychological problems.

This is obviously not for any medical condition and not under a doctor's supervision that I am talking about.

 

[phonicjoy]

I'll also give two personal anecdotes as I have two friends who took steroids:

My first friend was obsessed with bodybuilding as a teen. He won a "teen bodybuilder of the month" competition but didn't place as well as he wanted to in a local teen show. I say this to demonstrate that he already worked hard as hell: cutting down to 8% bodyfat for a physique show is fucking hard but he did it in high school. Once he hit 20 he started taking large amounts of Test and some other compounds. He gained 30 or 40 pounds of muscle over a year or two, his powerlifting total increased by around 300+ pounds and he won some bodybuilding shows. A few years later he stopped taking them. Looking back he regrets it and believes he was addicted to them in the past.

My other friend started taking them very recently, in his mid 20's. I've known him since high school and we've lifted together on and off since then. He's even more dedicated than my first friend (he's logged his food on myfitnesspal 1300+ days in a row...) but he was basically capped out as a natural. Lifted religiously and tracked his calories but couldnt progress. Recently he's started taking stuff and has now gained 30 or 40 pounds of muscle in the past year and already added 100+ pounds to his bench. Maybe he'll regret it, but I don't think so.

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If he does them continiously he will at the very least need to keep using them. Hormone production shuts down when using chronically.

 

[Maneil99]

Don't use lose your gains when you stop

 

[Daitokuji]

If you're trying to gain muscle, you will get short term gains in exchange for long term damage to your body and mind.

So it's up to you if it's worth it or not, but I would say no.

 

[aSniperJones]

Steroids required the same effort, determination and training as if steroids weren't introduced into your body.

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the bolded isnt true.

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I stand corrected, but even after reading the study I stand by: Don't do it for physically appearance.

 

[GodofWine]

If used smartly, they can be OK...problem is most are using UGLs and its hard to know whats in them, or how pure it is.

People look to pro level bodybuilders / physique athletes as 'proof' they are safe, but those guys/gals are not only freaks in how well they respond to them, they are also freaks in terms of how well they can tolerate them. There are plenty of dead bodybuilders who no one remembers though.

 

[Rayman not Ray]

It's legitimately used for transitioning trans men and men with hypogonadism who don't produce enough. Testosterone is a natural steroid that will result in -fat +muscle even if you sit on your butt.

Guys stop producing as much as they age naturally and a too-steep decline can result in legit hypogonadism issues. The flip side of TRT is that your body also stops producing it in normal quantities naturally if you are externally supplementing, which results in guys who have abused it in the past becoming reliant on it as a result. Hence the controversy over it in MMA/Boxing/etc. that led to it getting banned by the UFC, as it effectively let cheaters keep cheating after they got caught. (which was a hilariously bullshit stance as we've now seen with Jon Jones.)

Click to shrink...

Well I knew about transitioning, but not hypogonadism.

But I'm still sort of skeptical. From some cursory research, it seems that the benefits for people who don't have hypogonadism are pretty minimal.

But I'm young, so it's easy for me to dismissive. I guess we'll see if I'm singing a different tune as I age.

 

[Kirblar]

Well I knew about transitioning, but not hypogonadism.

But I'm still sort of skeptical. From some cursory research, it seems that the benefits for people who don't have hypogonadism are pretty minimal.

But I'm young, so it's easy for me to dismissive. I guess we'll see if I'm singing a different tune as I age.

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This is taking someone who's in shape and helping them pack on more muscle basically. Good chance you wouldn't realize they're on anything.

 

[Rayman not Ray]

This is taking someone who's in shape and helping them pack on more muscle basically. Good chance you wouldn't realize they're on anything.

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I was talking about TRT as a response to aging, which is off topic from what OP was asking, but came up a bunch in the thread.

 

[Kirblar]

I was talking about TRT as a response to aging, which is off topic from what OP was asking, but came up a bunch in the thread.

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Ah ok- yeah, I'm in my 30s and got a taste of some aging problems temporarily and good lord DO NOT WANT.

 

[Raguel]

If he does them continiously he will at the very least need to keep using them. Hormone production shuts down when using chronically.

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This. I know a few people whose natural hormone production stopped completely and now needs hormone treatment. Which is ironic since roids are hormones.

 

[Rayman not Ray]

Ah ok- yeah, I'm in my 30s and got a taste of some aging problems temporarily and good lord DO NOT WANT.

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Like I said, I'm young enough that I can say "I'm gonna age narurally, I don't need any shit like this." But maybe that will change when I start actually facing those issues. We'll see.

 

[Deleted member 9838]

Unless your nutrition and training is already top notch and you've exhausted all natural [over-the-counter] methods for body growth, development, and strength then steroids are, or eventually will be, pointless. Steroids required the same effort, determination and training as if steroids weren't introduced into your body.

Don't do it for physically appearance.

Click to shrink...

I'm not sure this is entirely true. I know you still have to train and progress your weights and also eat enough but it cut recovery time drastically and allows for tons of muscle to be put on after the muscle has been stimulated.

 

[Nerdyone]

I've done several strongman competitions over the past few years and am friends with several 45+ bodybuilders. Every single one of them has a health issue. Either ligaments, arthritis, or cardio vascular. Yes, they are all strong or look great but I find it odd that they all have issues.

But I get the attraction. I'm almost 43 and have thought about a cycle just to see what it would be like. Then I realize that I'm a husband, father, and executive and can't risk it. But I would love to finally break some PRs.

 

[Kirblar]

I've done several strongman competitions over the past few years and am friends with several 45+ bodybuilders. Every single one of them has a health issue. Either ligaments, arthritis, or cardio vascular. Yes, they are all strong or look great but I find it odd that they all have issues.

But I get the attraction. I'm almost 43 and have thought about a cycle just to see what it would be like. Then I realize that I'm a husband, father, and executive and can't risk it. But I would love to finally break some PRs.

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Gay guys are way more likely to use steroids than straight guys, and the whole "well ain't having kids ever" thing probably plays into it alongside the self-image stuff that's an similar to how women have more eating disorders and such.

 

[Lkr]

Do steroid tainted players like Clemens and Bonds deserve to be in the hall of fame?

 

[maxglute]

I'm natty but hang with pretty level headed users in my lifting crew:

- Don't do it if you plan to have kids. Sides not worth it until after.
- Have a few years of training and dieting experience before you start.
- It's easy to become dependent and extremely hard to quit.
- Most people end up becoming life long users.
- The ones that quit tend to drop active lifestyle entirely, either laziness or crippling injury.
- Get your blood work done regularly, especially if using black market sources with poor quality control.
- Response to pharmacology is individual, be prepared that you maybe respond poorly.
- It's 100% worth it to combat ills of aging (declining mood, physical performance)

Personally, if you look at the massive social cost elderly fall statistics, I think almost everyone in old age should take them just to augment daily performance.