This is the Replicant script, but you played like, this much of it.
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Someone explain to me what makes Nier Automata *so* good? (no spoilers)
- Thread starter Kingpin Rogers
- Start date
How can I explain it in a non spoilery way...
There's a puzzle that a friend taught me once that reminds me of Nier Automata. You take 6 toothpicks (or 6 pens, pencils, whatever similarly sized/length object) and try to make four triangles out of them without crossing them or breaking any of the 6 toothpicks. First time he told me this I tried every combination I could and then he
. He also said the reason I was having trouble solving the puzzle was because I was forcing myself to look at it from one single perspective, but as soon as you shift your perspective the solution becomes obvious.
And that's what makes Nier Automata great. It gives you a very straight perspective on the world and the things you are trying to achieve in it, and each time you play a different route it gives you a new perspective, which sheds more light onto the story, and then previous elements of the story gain new light and meaning and when you reach the final route you finally see the story for what it actually is and what was really at stake.
It's impossible for you to appreciate what the full story is, if you're only seeing one very narrow side of it. It would be like trying to solve a Rubik's cube while only looking at one side of it (yes I know it can be done, that's not the point I'm trying to make).
Now, I'm not saying that all people have to play all the routes to appreciate the game and those that don't have invalid opinions, replaying what is essentially recycled content over and over with some alterations can be quite boring for some people and I don't fault anyone for that but it is in those repeated runs that the game's story really unveils itself and it's quite a unique and resourceful way of telling a more complex story without ballooning your project's budget to infinity, which is something a lot of other modern games struggle with.
But if the gameplay doesn't drive you enough to play the different chapters I recommend just looking at one of the many dozens of youtube videos that tell you the story while cutting out what you may not be appreciating.
There's a puzzle that a friend taught me once that reminds me of Nier Automata. You take 6 toothpicks (or 6 pens, pencils, whatever similarly sized/length object) and try to make four triangles out of them without crossing them or breaking any of the 6 toothpicks. First time he told me this I tried every combination I could and then he
made a triangle on the table, then held the tip of three toothpicks and put each of their edges over the corners of that triangle, with the other ends centered around his finger, essentially a pyramid.
And that's what makes Nier Automata great. It gives you a very straight perspective on the world and the things you are trying to achieve in it, and each time you play a different route it gives you a new perspective, which sheds more light onto the story, and then previous elements of the story gain new light and meaning and when you reach the final route you finally see the story for what it actually is and what was really at stake.
It's impossible for you to appreciate what the full story is, if you're only seeing one very narrow side of it. It would be like trying to solve a Rubik's cube while only looking at one side of it (yes I know it can be done, that's not the point I'm trying to make).
Now, I'm not saying that all people have to play all the routes to appreciate the game and those that don't have invalid opinions, replaying what is essentially recycled content over and over with some alterations can be quite boring for some people and I don't fault anyone for that but it is in those repeated runs that the game's story really unveils itself and it's quite a unique and resourceful way of telling a more complex story without ballooning your project's budget to infinity, which is something a lot of other modern games struggle with.
But if the gameplay doesn't drive you enough to play the different chapters I recommend just looking at one of the many dozens of youtube videos that tell you the story while cutting out what you may not be appreciating.
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Yeah I mean more for the merging of hack n slash with bullet hell, I found one to pull it off way better than the other. They're different genres of game outside of that with one being arena boss rush as you say and the other more of an action rpg.
Even then Furi is more the classic top down perspective. I do like Furi's bosses more, but thats like the entire game.
Well then perhaps they should've worked those into fewer, more engaging routes rather than a shorter route that's offputting. Some people like to replay and find alternative routes I guess but I'd take a longer story where I cover more of the source material, but when I'm done I'm doneThis is the Replicant script, but you played like, this much of it.
Yeah thats the only bit that was knock against Nier for me tbh. After Furi I guess I just wanted something closer to that level of intensity in the bosses, but as you say that was the whole game so all resources could go into refining it alone. Its probably just me wanting more Furi since there's never really been another game like it lol.
That said, I'm thankful for Nier still even if it's not quite what I'm after cause its the closest I'm probably gonna get for a pretty long time I guess. And the more Nier succeeds the better chance there is of getting more weird hybrids like that.
It's a rare game where you legit need to finish it completely to get the full context. I personally enjoyed it from beginning to end, but trust me when I say you need to finish it three times. Though it's best to see it as chapters instead of play-throughs.
But if after 18 hours (which seems very long for chapter 1 btw, but I might be misremembering) you don't like it much, I doubt you're gonna appreciate the whole.
But if after 18 hours (which seems very long for chapter 1 btw, but I might be misremembering) you don't like it much, I doubt you're gonna appreciate the whole.
I mean, I get similar vies from games like Hades. I assume you enjoy the chaos in some XIV bosses too.
This is the Replicant script, but you played like, this much of it.
I feel like this will just discourage them more!
As someone who recently back and played Automata again before playing Nier Replicant, it confirmed why I don't like Automata. The game IMO is all flash and no substance. The characters are a downgrade from Nier/Kainè in Replicant/Gestalt, the story is laughable at some times, the combat system is improved, but shallow, etc. It's like everything opposite of what made the original Nier games cult classic.
I want to chalk it up to everyone falling in love with the casual friendly, uwu-esque nature of 2B and 9S and the game in general. While I'm glad more people are interested in the Nier series now, I feel like it lost its soul to get there.
I want to chalk it up to everyone falling in love with the casual friendly, uwu-esque nature of 2B and 9S and the game in general. While I'm glad more people are interested in the Nier series now, I feel like it lost its soul to get there.
It's not one specific part for me, but more the sum of the whole. It feels like a retread of the first game and throws so many cliche, existential dread and lost hope tropes at players that I was rolling my eyes by the end of Route A. I tried to keep it going until the end of the routes with A2 since everyone said that was what wraps the entire game up and all I got was an ending that tried to draw upon the same heartstrings as the original Nier, but with no impact or the same emotional gravity. It didn't feel earned. This is obviously just my opinion as I'm sure there are plenty of people that feel the opposite of me.
I've been meaning to try Hades, I've heard good things. And yeah XIV is basically filling that niche for me these days. Haven't quite stepped it up to new savage content yet but hopefully soon.
I don't see how you can say the story is laughable at times and then not even be able to name a single example of a laughable part of it to demonstrate what you mean. I don't know how being a retread of the first game is an inherently bad thing either. It is a sequel after all. It'd be like saying Terminator 2 does bad thing and you rolled your eyes because it's a retread of the first movie.
yea, i'm at the start of Route B rn and while I enjoyed my time with route A.... I don't know if I can stand replaying it just from a slightly different perspective. Having the worst part (at least that's what I gather from discussions) of the game be this far in and being so long is quite bad I think.
IMO what makes it good (not great) is the whole package.
Story is nothing special but has some interesting themes and moments, combat is not great but is more enjoyable than what most action JRPG have, music is overall good and visuals are sometimes beautiful but mostly dull.
I don't think Nier Automata has anything especially great, but at the same time everything is solid enough to make the whole experience good.
Story is nothing special but has some interesting themes and moments, combat is not great but is more enjoyable than what most action JRPG have, music is overall good and visuals are sometimes beautiful but mostly dull.
I don't think Nier Automata has anything especially great, but at the same time everything is solid enough to make the whole experience good.
Good thing that Automata is a very good game from the very start.
I'm very much of this opinion on most things. But Nier Automata was an exception to this rule.
It takes too much to the story gets good, the road to reach there is something i'll never play again. The soundtrack is great and in retrospective it has an amazing story who pays every hour you invested but it will stay on my memory, i have many games who has better initial hours.
This in particular is a mystery that is answered in a satisfying way.
I also ended up not ~loving~ the game--I thought it was fine, and interesting at times, and visually striking, I really don't have anything bad to say about it except that I did kind of hate the combat (I am really bad at any form of bullet hell) and that dimmed the experience.
But in general, I do think you can give the game this much credit: when something seems odd, strange, or unexplained, you've just found a clue to a mystery that will have a satisfying solution. And that's actually pretty impressive.
i found the entire village of robots eye rolling front he first time you get there to later on in the game when it was attacked. The game did a poor job of giving me reason to care or empathize with them and even after the twist reveal, I laughed at how silly it was. The main villains were cartoonish and came across like Jesse and James from Team Rocket with how inept and speed bump like their appearances were. Like I said before, these are just all of my opinions and I know I'm not going to convince people like yourself as to why I didn't like the game, but it is what it is.
It was always good. It becomes more than good by the end (and less than good during route B). Its a game that's all over the place.
If you don't connect with it on an emotional/existential level, you simply won't enjoy it as much. It addresses things like depression, hopelessness and nihilism in way that I haven't seen since Silent Hill 2. It's also the best example of a game subverting expectations in a way that's not contrived or hamfisted. It was a heartfelt and moving experience that I needed at the time.
Likewise. I think the pitch of this as "it only gets good after route B" is misguided. To me, it was enjoyable from the start, and only got better and better from there. While I do think it's a game that improves the more that you play it, I don't think the fundamental experience of the game changes so significantly that someone who hated Route A in every respect, would magically like what they do in Route C.
Furthermore, holding up Route C as the point where things "get good" just sets people up for disappointment, and generates a feeling of resentment toward Routes A and B. If you're told that Route C is the "good part" you're going to naturally see A and B as the chores you have to slog through to get to the good stuff.
What we should be telling people is: If you like Route A from the start, you're probably going to like the rest of the game even more. If you don't like Route A from the start, maybe playing more will change your mind, but it's not guaranteed. And if there's nothing you like about Route A, then you probably won't like the rest of the game.
great combat,a nicely designed open world,unique ideas with change from 3d to 2.5d etc., amazing music and great sci fi story.
Exactly, Route A hit the point of no return so suddenly that I liked having Route B to do sidequest clean up for the ones I missed. Which is also a good way of allowing you to discover a certain B sidequest.
What did you do with the chips? Any good setups you can clue me in on?
Still on Route A. Makes sense. You really have to play the other routes for the whole narrative.
My favorite thing about the combat system is the fact you max out your chip capacity like four or five hours in Route A so you never really feel like you're getting more powerful after that point. And god help you if you die while using all your good chips.
That depends how much you want to put up with this absolute garbage of a system
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It doesn't, though. I had a great time with the first part of the story. The only part that jarred a bit for me was replaying the early sections again. But when you start the third playthrough it's worth it for how absolutely bonkers it gets.
I've already forget most of the story. The combat is fine but gets repetitive. Hacking is entertaining, but eventually is repetitive too. The sound track is good. The visuals are bleak. And the extra routes are necessary for story, but were an unnecessary design.
If you're still completely disinterested in what's going on after Route A then it's probably not for you. Personally, it was good from the start and continued to ramp up all the way through, and I'm already a fan of the themes it's telling so I was invested from the start.
It makes me wonder what more people want... I guess the blame rests with the people who try to sell this game as a life-changing experience, but still. It's a quality and unique action jrpg through and through, from beginning to end. There are very few of those, and it feels impossible not to appreciate that personally.
God doesn't need to help you with reloading your manual save where your chips are perfectly safe even if you fail your corpse run for one reason or another. They stress the thing about manual saves for a reason.
I think going in completely blind and not expecting a "masterpiece" or anything like that helps a lot, and end of the day its not gonna be a game for everyone. I went in blind and loved it from the start, it has that weird Matrix/Blade Runner/Western mish-mash I really enjoyed, and any game where you are just basically chilling out with your pet (pod) doing shit and wandering around a post apocalyptic world is my jam.
Its a game I felt payed off the more and more I played, especially in the layering of story and world, but its definitely a game I don't think is for everyone and I totally understand how some people would consider it mediocre or bad.
It was one of the first "japanese games" I had played (other than stuff like Mario) and to me, used to the Western RPGs where you play the game and finish and never play again, it was surreal playing a game, finishing, and then playing a totally different character and stuff in a new playthrough. It was a thing I was just not used to ALL, after stuff like Mass Effect, Bioshock, Uncharted, Halo, etc.
Its a game I felt payed off the more and more I played, especially in the layering of story and world, but its definitely a game I don't think is for everyone and I totally understand how some people would consider it mediocre or bad.
It was one of the first "japanese games" I had played (other than stuff like Mario) and to me, used to the Western RPGs where you play the game and finish and never play again, it was surreal playing a game, finishing, and then playing a totally different character and stuff in a new playthrough. It was a thing I was just not used to ALL, after stuff like Mass Effect, Bioshock, Uncharted, Halo, etc.
This is...an interesting take.
I would disagree with the assessment that you "finish and play a totally different character on a new playthrough." Route B, C, etc are just the second part of the game. You aren't actually "done."
A (console) game that ACTUALLY does the "finish the game and play as a totally different character on a new playthrough" and does it very well would be Dragon Age Origins- a game that predates even the first Nier by a year.
I'm sort of with you OP...finished the first section and had my fill. I didn't care to return to that world 2 more times, even if things get better.
I think I've realized through the years that I play games first for visual/audio variety (environments, character intros, set pieces, etc.) and second for story. Perhaps this is why Automata didn't click with me the way it has with so many.
I think I've realized through the years that I play games first for visual/audio variety (environments, character intros, set pieces, etc.) and second for story. Perhaps this is why Automata didn't click with me the way it has with so many.
Even without the Nier 1 context, the Nier: A track is fucking amazing, but again, what track in either of the soundtracks isn't. The games themselves are definitely not for everyone (the first one more so, probably), but calling any of the soundtracks "inconsistent" is among the closest things one can have to a truly, profoundly wrong opinion on the subject of art.
I agree with every criticism you said, even the part about some tracks getting a bit too repetitive or annoying (except for some of the story ones because those involve spoilers), but I still really really liked the game by the end. Nier Automata is one of those titles where I want to vaguely sum up my relationship with it as being a "love/hate" kind of deal, but in reality the final whole is much, much greater than the sum of it's parts, to the point of being a great, albeit heavily flawed game.
Whenever I think about the game it's with a bit of bitterness at x or y or z annoying element. But then I remember one other part of it, and that starts a trail of connected branches leading me down to an "aha, yea, now that's why I love this game!".
Whenever I think about the game it's with a bit of bitterness at x or y or z annoying element. But then I remember one other part of it, and that starts a trail of connected branches leading me down to an "aha, yea, now that's why I love this game!".