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Novak Djokovic just upset Rafael Nadal in the 2021 French Open semi-finals (Nadal was 26-0 after reaching the semis)
- Thread starter MIMIC
- Start date
OP
OP
At worst, he's 3rd best of all time behind Nadal and Federer. At best, he's the GOAT.
I have him at No. 2 behind Federer. He has a much more well-rounded career than Nadal, whose career is heavily clay-skewed. And Federer and Djokovic have way more weeks at No 1 than Nadal.
If anyone wants to get a feel for the level of the third set. Two and a half hours in, and this set alone would go on for another hour after this point - Nadal has a break point chance to level the match:
Entire rallies are made up of shots that would be winners against anyone else on the tour in the best Nadal v Djokovic tussles.
Entire rallies are made up of shots that would be winners against anyone else on the tour in the best Nadal v Djokovic tussles.
This is why these three are the greatest. It's not any one stat. No one else has ever played like this. It's fucking insane.
After watching the last set of the Zverev vs Tsitsipas match, I don't really see what Tsitsipas has to offer Novak. All Zverev had going for him was that big serve, and Tsitsipas struggled to close it out, getting into long rallies with a guy who can't hit with the precision of Novak and definitely can't move as well. A lot of short balls Tsitsipas was playing would be absolutely punished by Novak (as well as Rafa and Fed)
To be fair, that's the only time I've seen Tsitsipas play, not sure if he's the real deal and was just finding a solution to a problem, but he got it done in the end. Hopefully it's not a blowout.
To be fair, that's the only time I've seen Tsitsipas play, not sure if he's the real deal and was just finding a solution to a problem, but he got it done in the end. Hopefully it's not a blowout.
He wins #19 and #20, as much as I don't like him I admire his talent and hunger for the game, absolute GOAT. He took this from Rafa and I think this will be a mental edge from now on. Rafa lost on his best surface in his kingdom of Roland Garros. I think he will, barring an unexpected death or severe injury, will exceed 20. He already has most weeks at #1 and i think the best season ever in win/lose % before. Plus winning records on both Fed and Rafa. GOAT player.
You know even aside from the off court stuff, which really makes me dislike the dude, his game just never spoke to me
I feel like he may be the perfect tennis factory creation, nothing quirky or exceptionally interesting about his game, he's just damn good at it. And that shit just ain't that interesting to root for at the end of the day
I feel like he may be the perfect tennis factory creation, nothing quirky or exceptionally interesting about his game, he's just damn good at it. And that shit just ain't that interesting to root for at the end of the day
I like how he stretches. That's what makes he and Rafa such a great match. Both players can return from so far to the left or right of the lines that there's no safe shot against either of them.
I'll give him that, the most memorable shot of his I can think of is the stretch backhand cross court winners. But I also think Murray in his prime was similar
In terms of the GOAT debate it's hard not to see Novak running away with that record. Though it's always hard to predict the future. Time will tell.
Yeah the level of play from the big 3 has just been insane (though I do think Murray at times has been close to that level). The longevity is what is most impressive. It feels like the dominance of these 3 players has essentially lasted 20.
They're what 34, 35 and 39? Surely someone else will start winning soon lol.
Yeah the level of play from the big 3 has just been insane (though I do think Murray at times has been close to that level). The longevity is what is most impressive. It feels like the dominance of these 3 players has essentially lasted 20.
They're what 34, 35 and 39? Surely someone else will start winning soon lol.
This is the funniest fucking nickname I've heard in a while.
Also if Novak can pull off the French he has a real good shot at the calendar year GS which would be crazy.
Lol might?
He is probably going to go down as the greatest ever and he's already top 3 for sure (probably top 1).
Most impressive part of his game is his return. And the fact he can win on any surface.
Do they hate him because of his play or because of his shit anti vax bullshit?
Because being obnoxious again people for hating anti vaxxers is straight up disgusting imo.
A shame really, I was a huge Djokovic fan before the pandemic, but I cannot support someone with his views and actions. It actually killed my interest in tennis quite a bit.
Doesn't really matter if he doesn't have another two GOAT level players playing at the same time, that's something you'll never take away from these 3. (And Fed got a lot of early slams against the likes of Hewitt and Roddick....)
The title GOAT is one of respect. He'll never have it, and anyone respecting him should really be looked at with a side-eye considering his attitude around Covid and vaccines.
OP
OP
It's not. You play to win titles and lead in stats. It's the "greatest" of all time. Not "most loved" of all time. An even then, he's respected by his peers and the media. Check out the tennis world's reaction to his win over Nadal (or any of his wins actually).
Message board critics notwithstanding, he'll be the GOAT.
So that is why there is absolutely no discussion in any sport who is the GOAT. Aside from that, being an anti-vaxxer should immediately invalidate anybody from being the 'greatest' at anything except the greatest asshole contest.
Still sad but hey, hell of a match so at least theres that. Obvious bias but for me Rafa at his peak was better than both Fed and Djokovic, eventhough his style was always going to lead to more injuries and missed time. Dude plays like a shonen protagonist come to life, its insane.
Title of GOAT is performance-based. Whether you like the player or not is irrelevant.
should MJ not be GOAT because he refused to back the Democratic candidate because he didn't want to get involved in politics even if he knew that would have done a lot of good for Chicago and he certainly voted for him anyways? Or because he literally bullied his teammates? I think not.
GOAT is performance-based whether you like it or not
User Banned (2 Weeks): Hostility and Ableist Insults
love him or hate him he's a sportsperson that is one of if not the best of his time. Noone will care in 20 years that he was a no-vaxer and a tool, they will still respect his game.
I hate Schumacher with a passion because he was a complete asshole on and off track and rules had to be implemented just to punish his behaviour (and then he was still an asshole in the last round against Villeneuve), because he never bothered to learn Italian while being in Italian teams (whereas fellow drivers learned it even if just briefly joining Italian-staffed teams) and because I never really liked his public persona. Is he still one of the best F1 drivers ever? Yes he is. Are people fucking retarded for being happy he had his skiing accident that left him in a vegetative state no matter how much they dislike him? Also yes.
Similar things can be said for Tiger Woods and other GOATs
Djoko is probably a shitty human being (and that was evident even before the pandemic iirc), still doesn't make him less of a GOAT.
Butthurt children can feel free to disagree
I hate Schumacher with a passion because he was a complete asshole on and off track and rules had to be implemented just to punish his behaviour (and then he was still an asshole in the last round against Villeneuve), because he never bothered to learn Italian while being in Italian teams (whereas fellow drivers learned it even if just briefly joining Italian-staffed teams) and because I never really liked his public persona. Is he still one of the best F1 drivers ever? Yes he is. Are people fucking retarded for being happy he had his skiing accident that left him in a vegetative state no matter how much they dislike him? Also yes.
Similar things can be said for Tiger Woods and other GOATs
Djoko is probably a shitty human being (and that was evident even before the pandemic iirc), still doesn't make him less of a GOAT.
Butthurt children can feel free to disagree
OP
OP
No one thinks Court is the GOAT. She played in a completely different time. Just like Laver. They've been surpassed.
I understand begrudgingly respecting his game but y'all got some pretty fucked priorities if you're up in here talking about haters and shit.
It's impossible to prove, but it's highly likely that prominent dudes like this spreading anti-vaccine propaganda is going to indirectly lead to people suffering and dying.
But hey he hit the ball real good so it's all fine right?
It's impossible to prove, but it's highly likely that prominent dudes like this spreading anti-vaccine propaganda is going to indirectly lead to people suffering and dying.
But hey he hit the ball real good so it's all fine right?
but the person I quote said it was all performance based. She outperformed everyone else to get 24 slams.
OP
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Court is up there as "one of" the greats, but I'm just saying she isn't considered the GOAT because the vast majority of success came before Open Era tennis. So she didn't really out-perform "everyone else" because not everyone was allowed to play.
In the Open Era, Court only has 11 slams. All-time, she has 23, but it comes with a tiny asterisk IMO.
Serena is the GOAT if we are talking dominance. All these boys tryna catch up. Novac has the best shot. I really, really want some of these new guys to step it up and break his heart, though. Thiem, Tsitsipas, Zverev, Musetti. They all have what it takes in one way or another.
If Nadal wasn't a perfect counter puncher to Federer's game, I think Fed would be closer to 30 by this point.