User Banned (1 Month): Downplaying sexual assault allegations.
Considering the stakes and the timing there is reason to doubt her.
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New Evidence Supporting Credibility Of Tara Reade’s Allegation Against Joe Biden Emerges
- Thread starter Xaszatm
- Start date
Considering the stakes and the timing there is reason to doubt her.
The timing that it's been corroborated she told two other people right after the assault happened, in 1993? She also tweeted, in October of last year, that there was more to her story than previously revealed.
Farrow's producer for NBC, who helped him break the Weinstein story, says he never would have gone public with her report if he didn't find her highly credible.
So again, what reason do we have to doubt her?
Honest to god, some of the posts in this thread make me terrified for this women in the scenario where the Democrats lose this election cycle.
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That would mean Biden stepping down and I don't see that happening unfortunately. Biden's gonna push that "only he can beat Trump" narrative and use that as protection. God this election was a mess.
Changing your allegation from harrassment to assault is a big deal. There has to be more than her word and the word of close family/friends. That's why Biden should release any and all Senate records with regards to allegations of misconduct (for this and anything else for that matter).
If he refuses to do so it's grounds for everyone to call for his head.
Extremely unlikely imo. Biden will likely try very hard to minimize these allegations, while the party itself rides or dies with him. I don't expect any DNC officials to call on him to step aside and give the nomination to anyone else, let alone Bernie lol.
Well, I agree that he should release those records. But that has nothing to do with casting doubt on Reade for no reason, when all narratives designed to do so have failed.
She is credible. And until there is evidence to contradict that, there is no reason to think she could be lying.
Again, just because they are friends and family doesn't make them not credible. Her allegations didn't change, she just revealed more information once she worked up the courage.
I don't know legally, but 30 years ago people didn't talk about it as assault unless there were ripped clothes, bruises, and an ambulance ride. The bar between harassment and assault was much higher culturally.
People that don't believe her by now simply choose not to or are too scared of shaming this fool into stepping down and course correcting. Those people are cowards that will ensure the death of the soul of the party if their negligence wins and we send Uncle Rapist.
What pieces do people think will even be there to assemble again after this bastard loses the election? After the party paves over the most vulnerable to make the road that leads right off a cliff. It's dead after that.
or we could not do that and have an ounce of decency and consistency and do the right thing even if its hard.
What pieces do people think will even be there to assemble again after this bastard loses the election? After the party paves over the most vulnerable to make the road that leads right off a cliff. It's dead after that.
or we could not do that and have an ounce of decency and consistency and do the right thing even if its hard.
The stakes are that all Democrats need to unite behind a candidate and vote Trump out, right? Who cares if it's Biden or not? He needs to step down ASAP.
only if you're feeling protective of Joe. You can give her some benefit of some credence without condemning Joe, unless there is a real drive to want to believe what Joe says over her.
Yep and Reade even stated as much herself. She said she didn't even consider it sexual assault at the time and felt she had let down Biden because of the way he reacted when she pulled away. Like she did something wrong. There is a lot to process, especially when it's someone you admire. It's a shit feeling.
He has roughly eight or so, actually. Not too far off. But this thread isn't a numbers game between how many people are needed to justify an investigation.
I think everyone needs to take a deep breath and let this play out. None of this is simple and straight forward. In a perfect world she would have had the opportunity to come forward with her claims and had the cover of the MeToo movement back in the 90s. Sadly that is not a luxury she had.
What everyone needs to understand though is that given who these accusations are against, and given what is happening in the country right now, the outcome you want is not what you are going to get. This story is going to become a political football tossed around like a hot potato. The other side won't want to play with it too long cause it brings out their own skeletons, and the Ds want the WH back. I am sure there are a lot of people that look at this and are saying to themselves "I think she is credible, but I just don't know.. We can't risk 4 more years of the current disaster for 1 person".
In my personal opinion, unless there is a smoking gun or some other accuser coming forward saying that Biden sexually abused them in similar fashion with similar corroboration, this will simply be a foot note during the Presidential Campaign. Had the Republican candidate been anyone else and COVID19 not being a thing, this would probably Prime Time news and Biden would need to drop out.
Personally, I am and always will be a "Vote against Trump no matter what". I'll still vote to get Trump out, but this has dampened my enthusiasm to vote for Joe instead of just voting Trump out.
What everyone needs to understand though is that given who these accusations are against, and given what is happening in the country right now, the outcome you want is not what you are going to get. This story is going to become a political football tossed around like a hot potato. The other side won't want to play with it too long cause it brings out their own skeletons, and the Ds want the WH back. I am sure there are a lot of people that look at this and are saying to themselves "I think she is credible, but I just don't know.. We can't risk 4 more years of the current disaster for 1 person".
In my personal opinion, unless there is a smoking gun or some other accuser coming forward saying that Biden sexually abused them in similar fashion with similar corroboration, this will simply be a foot note during the Presidential Campaign. Had the Republican candidate been anyone else and COVID19 not being a thing, this would probably Prime Time news and Biden would need to drop out.
Personally, I am and always will be a "Vote against Trump no matter what". I'll still vote to get Trump out, but this has dampened my enthusiasm to vote for Joe instead of just voting Trump out.
So, I believe he's up to 8 total accusers, all of them inappropriate touching, but the 8th is also accusing sexual harassment and rape. Not really sure if it's even worth pointing out the differences in this regard anymore. Once you're accused of rape, to me, it doesn't matter if it's one or 10. You're now an alleged rapist with multiple accusations of misconduct.
It's really a bad comparison to make in terms of who is worse in this regard.
Of course it matters how many people are accusing someone of rape. Multiple accusers with claims that are consistent between them makes for extremely damning evidence. Harvey Weinstein and Bill Cosby even without criminal convictions were each far beyond a "he said, she said" situation exactly for this reason. Multiple women accusing Biden of rape would change this thing instantly.
Always believe women. Not just when it's convenient to you.
"LegendofJoe"? Never thought he'd have an Era account.
User Banned (3 Months): Harmful and inflammatory rhetoric regarding sexual assault.
this is nonsense. one accusation of rape vs 10 accusations of rape are quite different.
also, many times people who rape or sexually assault people don't do it once. they usually aren't normal family people who suddenly turn and rape someone and then return to normal at the snap of the fingers. ie trumps huge list, because he's a scumbag, has always been a scumbag, and will always be a scumbag.
i'm not throwing water on reade's story, just saying a point not in her favor is beyond inappropriate touching and such, biden's a pretty normal guy with a normal record. it's hard to convince me, and many people i've spoken to about this, that biden suddenly for the first time in his life, turned evil complete rapist and then snapped back to his current form and maintained it for decades. you can believe women while also understanding a couple pieces of circumstantial evidence is hard to throw someone completely under the bus for.
now if more separate allegations of fucking rape come out against biden between now and november, that's a bit different of course
seriously, a very bizarre post. and once again sexual assaulters and rapists are usually repeat offenders
I was talking about a moral standpoint, not based on how strong it makes corroborating evidence. Once you have multiple allegations of misconduct and also an allegation of rape, I don't think the varying degrees of shittiness matter. Of course they matter in actions becoming completely damning and undeniable. But there is already more than enough corroboration here for me to be morally done.
I'm giving my personal opinion in regards to morality, not providing commentary on credibility.
The Kavanaugh comparisons are not made from the standpoint of morality. It is offered as an example of the press or liberals treating one thing differently than another. The argument is the allegations are the same and therefore the different reaction can only be explained by hypocrisy.
You're not just throwing water on Reade's story with that utter horseshit, you're throwing water on every victim that never got justice because their abuser was "just a normal guy".
I can't believe the shit I see scrawled in this place. Enough is enough.
so in your world, one piece of evidence is equal to 100 pieces of evidence? and circumstantial = physical? you don't work in the courts do you? please for the love of god say no
also, summarizing my post with a shit post and calling my opinion horseshit, miss me with that. thanks. that opinion is shared by most of the population and thankfully the court system. enjoy your bubble bud
do you work in the courts? your victim blaming and whitewashing of abusers would fit right in so i'm just making sure
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Because "he seems like a normal guy", which is the phrase that other poster is angry about, is physical evidence right? "He seems like a normal guy" is a shitty statement period
I've said the corroboration we've got with is enough, that's my personal opinion. Some of those behaviors (inappropriate touching) align with the 7 other accusers. I have no interest in comparing which evidence was more damning between Biden and Kav. Plenty of publications have highlighted Reade's credibility along with the people she's told. Rich McHugh, a guy who helped break the Weinstein story, says he never would have published Reade's story if he didn't find it highly credible. This is not going to look any better for Biden as we move forward.
The point I was making is that, for me, it doesn't matter if there is one rape or 2 or more when we have 8 accusers, all credible, including one accusation of rape. That's not to say those other victims wouldn't matter, of course they would and should be heard, and I would push hard for that.
yes, imagine the beautiful court system where we locked people away and forever labeled them a sex criminal using a couple pieces of CIRCUMSTANTIAL evidence.
jesus fucking christ you people are insane. and naturally it's the same posters every single time
it's possible to understand weight of forms of evidence and always believe women. that doesn't mean believe all women, every time, under all circumstances, no matter how much evidence there is. just like ACAB doesn't literally mean every single cop, every single one, is bad, and i still tout ACAB myself.
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Who is saying to lock him up now? We want a full investigation.
Again the issue raised in the post you quoted and responded to was with equating the allegations and number of accusers against Biden with the allegations and number of accusers against Kavanaugh. They don't warrant comparison. If you don't want to make that comparison then we both object to the post I was responding to.
Is that honestly necessary in your eyes at this point? It feels like many have already decided. Is it possible you would change your mind?
by "normal guy" i meant he doesn't have a fucking history of rape. but obviously you guys are taking the piss here so enjoy the back and forth between the same 10-12 people.
But he's not a normal guy. No "normal guy" has as many accusations as he had.
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Taking the piss here? What the hell are you talking about?
Just a survivor that was my abusers only victim that has seen and heard alllllll this shit before. The courts are designed to fail victims and we are not in one regardless.
Believe women or don't.
The conversation was about how many accusers Kav has in comparison with Biden. And I'm saying that doesn't matter to me at this point because Biden's actions have crossed a threshold. That's really all there was to my post.
Then again, we both disagree with the post I quoted and responded to.
One of the major political parties largely has morals when it comes to sexual assault. They will vote or abstain accordingly. The other does not give a fuck. They find things like this amusing.
Biden was the wrong horse to bet on.
Biden was the wrong horse to bet on.
Is it that hard to believe that a powerful man in 1993, who believed a woman was sexually attracted to him would, without consent, kiss her and put his hand into her underwear when he found himself alone with her?
Is it that hard to believe that after she reacted in fear and confusion, that he mightn't didn't do it again?
Because I find it depressingly simple to believe. We know of much worse that happened in the White House. Do you think it was all that uncommon that scenes like that played out across DC, and that many of the women (and young men) at the time believed they were at fault?
If Biden had come right out when Reade's account surfaced and told a story where after this event he changed, and that he had no idea how badly he'd made her feel, and that he was sorry, I could maybe have accepted that. Whether Reade ever would is a different story.
But instead we got the denial from the campaign, and here we are.
The story isn't good > evil > good.
It probably goes more like, powerful, vain, horny, stupid, shameful.
None of that changes Reade's experience, or the years of turmoil she's gone through since.
Not every rape is about power and control. A lot of rape is horny, drunk or stupid guys, afraid to ask permission incase the answer is no, thinking that 'making a play' is acceptable behavior due to decades of media normalizing the concept. Or the same horny, drunk or stupid guy happening open an inebriated girl and failing to see the harm in taking advantage of her.
Their intentions or motives don't change the experience from the woman's perspective.
The notion that every rapist is a predator who will always be compelled to attack over and over is patently false, and I'm kind of shaking my head whenever the concept is presented that an accused rapist can't be a rapist unless they're a serial rapist. That's not how it works at all.
ACAB means that to me, given that every single cop chose to become an defender of capital, the status quo, and a broken legal system that preys on the most marginalized and vulnerable members of society. so ACAB literally
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Yes, it's necessary. It's already happening. And it would take a lot to change my mind because of how unfair our system is to victims of this nature by very powerful rich men. But an investigation is still necessary.
User Banned (1 week): drive-by posting and ignoring the staff post
Thank every single dumb fuck Democrat who voted for Biden. Their cowardice and fear towards a more progressive government gave us this shit show. If Biden still runs, when he loses, They deserve what comes. We don't.
Yeah I'm just gonna say that this is very problematic thinking. Basically textbook confirmation bias.
Nobody has a history of rape until they rape someone, so Biden does have a history of rape. Rape is rape, someone who does it once or 10 times is still a rapist, not a "normal guy". You could point to a ton of awful people who seemed like "normal guys".