Greg Miller and Andrea Rene handwave Notch and PewDiePie racist, transphobic and anti-semitic behaviour (UP: GM and AR respond; see threadmarks)

[Wolfgunblood]

It's not hard to read up on MAJOR figures in your industry and figure out how much they are shit.

Repudiating white supremacy and bigotry isn't some heroic or brave act, it is the fucking baseline.

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No argument here. It is however worth noting that repudiating white supremacy and bigotry to an audience of gamers is courageous to some extent, that's how fucked this medium and hobby is. My expectations are quite low for anyone in this godforsaken industry.

 

[JakeNoseIt]

We're so desperate for heroes in these troubling times that we expect everyone who has a voice and who seems perceptibly decent to step up and be courageous, even though it's not entirely fair to expect that.

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If I have a friend, and that friend spreads around alt-right rhetoric or has used harmful language toward women and minorities, but they have always been polite and a good friend to me, I am still very much complicit in the bad things they are doing. If I know they are doing those things, but choose to continue my comfortable relationship with them instead of having to confront and condemn them, that's not being a centrist, that's choosing a side.

I am not expecting anybody to be a hero. I'm expecting them to not choose the side that's bumping elbows with White supremacists.

 

[SolidChamp]

Always thought Greg Miller was a tool.

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Being internet "famous" is hard, yo.

lol

 

[spman2099]

The Notch defense is pretty icky. I am surprised Andrea Rene was so quick to defend him. That being said, I think I vaguely recall being disappointed in her in the past.

I think PewDiePie deserves shit for the genuinely shitty things he has said and done, but I do think that people are extra critical of him at times (to the point of occasionally being a little unreasonable). That being said, he dropped the hard N-word too naturally for me to lose sleep over people putting him through the ringer.

 

[TheLoCoRaven]

I'm surprised Greg didn't take the liberal PC out like his over-reaction to Colin's joke.

 

[Jebusman]

Like I want to believe that Greg is genuinely trying to change, I mean cutting Colin out of his life despite the many years they were friends obviously was a hard thing to do.

But I need to see it on camera, or in audio, not just him letting someone walk all over him while he tries to maintain the peace in a very Boogie like manner that only serves to give the hatred some credence. It's not good enough to let this stuff slide unchallenged and then say you're sorry afterwards, it has to be shut down right there and then.

 

[Deleted member 23212]

I love how Boogie has essentially become the centrist.

 

[Gorion's Ward]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

 

[Ganado]

Always thought Greg Miller was a tool.

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Amen!

Just listened to this garbage and both of them comes up as really ignorant in almost all of the topics covered. What a sad pair.

 

[BlackJace]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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Calling Notch's tweets "wacky" is most certainly downplaying his behavior

what

See like, this is the problem women and minorities are always talking about. The fact that hateful rhetoric is distilled into "wacky" shows that a lot of y'all simply don't give a fuck.

 

[gschmidl]

Youtube are fucking cowards who refuse to deplatform a white supremacist because of money, but at least there's a tiny amount of worth to YouTube.

Twitter is a completely worthless Nazi-enabling, 24/7-hatevomiting trash fire run by a Nazi that should be nuked from orbit, then have the remains salted, collected, and fired into the sun.

There can be no ifs and buts about it.

 

[marrec]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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His hateful and bigoted tweets aren't "wacky" they're terrible.

 

[Kurdel]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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Wacky white pride and transphobia 🤪

 

[Igniz12]

Ah yes, the tried and true method of ignoring white supremacists with millions of followers until it just goes away by itself.

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They were ignoring them just fine before, then they decided to wade in without doing any research and also not really taking any kind of stand. I rather ppl like this stfu than promote peace love and harmony in front of the camera and then when the time comes and I need their support they go"....ummm actually, both sides."

 

[Eumi]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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How the hell is calling Notch's bigotry "wacky" not downplaying?

 

[awilliams213]

Y'all should stop putting so much stock in people just cause they like the same games you like.

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FACT

 

[Deleted member 23212]

FACTS

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I think it has more to do with sharing the same skin colour.

 

[WiZaRdOuS]

If I know they are doing those things, but choose to continue my comfortable relationship with them instead of having to confront and condemn them, that's not being a centrist, that's choosing a side.

I am not expecting anybody to be a hero. I'm expecting them to not choose the side that's bumping elbows with White supremacists.

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Well said!!

 

[marrec]

I think it has more to do with sharing the same skin colour.

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Bit of a leap there lol

 

[saenima]

Of course it's our onus to educate people.

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As a white dude i'm just gonna go with no here. I never needed anyone to teach me that slavery and racism were wrong, i figured it out myself and it wasn't that fucking hard either. Anyone who thinks for five seconds about slavery and doesn't see what's wrong with it it's also not gonna learn by having the concept explained to them. More likely than not they just don't give a shit to begin with.

And as a queer man you can bet your ass it's not my job to explain to any old bigot why i deserve the same respect they demand for themselves. Tired of bigots being babied like they're 3 year olds suckling at the ignorance teat.

 

[ghostcrew]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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Andrea says...

I would honestly be pretty surprised if notch had expressed an interest in wanting to be involved and MS said no thanks. That to me would be disappointing on Microsofts part.

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She'd be 'disappointed' if MS said that they didn't want him to be involved. That's not downplaying his behaviour?

 

[doof_warrior]

gonna just copy paste my response to this from another forum:

greg miller doesnt care about anything. he just wants to act like a dope and get famous and make money
this is on brand for him

 

[Dante_727]

Some of you guys really need to tone it down. Especially OP.

 

[WiZaRdOuS]

So it does, but it doesn't end there.

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Lmao try harder

 

[marrec]

As a white dude i'm just gonna go with no here. I never needed anyone to teach me that slavery and racism were wrong, i figured it out myself and it wasn't that fucking hard either. Anyone who thinks for five seconds about slavery and doesn't see what's wrong with it it's also not gonna learn by having the concept explained to them. More likely than not they just don't give a shit to begin with.

And as a queer man you can bet your ass it's not my job to explain to any old bigot why i deserve the same respect they demand for themselves. Tired of bigots being babied like they're 3 year olds suckling at the ignorance teat.

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While most moral people have no trouble seeing the problems with slavery and racism, it much harder for privileged white people to understand how some of their actions may support the bigotry of others.

It's certainly not up to minorities to educate however, that should be up to other privileged people.

 

[Gorion's Ward]

Andrea says...

She'd be 'disappointed' if MS said that they didn't want him to be involved. That's not downplaying his behaviour?

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Fair enough then, I didn't remember this part. IMO MS can do whatever they want as they own it now.

 

[Dante_727]

There isn't a single person on this planet who is using that word without knowing the connotation.

And no not a lot of Europeans use that word, except racist people.

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Well, I am from middle east and I am quite brown. Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

 

[saenima]

I just listened to it and I most certainly didn't get the impression Andrea downplayed Notch's behavior. She just says he doesn't care about not being invited and that this statement could just be PR talk. On the contrary, she actually said he tweets some wacky things.

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'wacky things'

 

[Budi]

Lmao try harder

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rotflmao, keep going.

 

[Jebusman]

Well, I am from middle east and I am quite brown. Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

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You have a 1000+ post thread with examples that prove otherwise.

 

[TheRuralJuror]

As a white dude i'm just gonna go with no here. I never needed anyone to teach me that slavery and racism were wrong, i figured it out myself and it wasn't that fucking hard either. Anyone who thinks for five seconds about slavery and doesn't see what's wrong with it it's also not gonna learn by having the concept explained to them. More likely than not they just don't give a shit to begin with.

And as a queer man you can bet your ass it's not my job to explain to any old bigot why i deserve the same respect they demand for themselves. Tired of bigots being babied like they're 3 year olds suckling at the ignorance teat.

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Yep. It's a bummer to see people still using those arguments and painting those not interested in continually explaining basic decency to white folks as the "real" bad guys.

 

[Mesoian]

Well, I am from middle east and I am quite brown. Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

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Was it that she wasn't racist, or that you didn't want to deal with the fact that you'd have to talk about your girlfriend's grandmother so you decided to laugh it off?

Because that's racist AF my man.

Like, real talk, did that conversation end with, "yes, he is a n-. And that's wonderful" And then she gleefully pulled out cookies for everyone to eat? Was it literally a Mel Brooks sketch from the late 60's come to life in your girlfriend's grandparent's house? Was it literally the climax scene from "guess who's coming to dinner?"

No my dude. Your anecdote carries about as much weight as people thinking the movie Soul Man is still a perfectly funny and acceptable movie because Zwarte Piet is a thing that some countries do sometimes.

 

[Vinc]

Watching this again, it sounds like:

- Andrea is genuinely unaware of the exact things Notch and PDP did, but knows there's been controversy.
- Instead of having an informed opinion, she speaks authoritatively while assuming the internet is just overreacting.
- Greg, not wanting to pick a fight on a live show with a coworker who can is known to be pretty pigheaded, lets it go.

I'm personally disappointed, and really do believe they need to do much better than that. This exact situation happens a lot when they talk about video games, and I'm totally fine with that, but this is not a topic you can handwave for convenience. Either handle it well, or don't talk about it at all. That's the lesson here.

 

[TyrantGuardian]

Bit late to the uh... "party" here but I couldn't not point out what a bullshit statement

because he was Swedish and doesn't understand the connotation of that word

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is.

Every fucking one in Sweden knows exactly what that word means, fuck outta here. I 100% guarantee that pewdiepieceofshit uses that word or the Swedish equivalent (which is the same exact word) on the daily in his private life. I know plenty of people like him. The only "slip-up" he had on stream was being himself for a split second.

 

[Deleted member 18161]

Which company do they keep these days that are unsavory? If it is Colin Moriarty, just be aware they severed ties with him a couple of years ago

Just like Kinda Funny should do more research on stories they report on, perhaps posters here should do the same before commenting. By all means they deserve critisism for how they handled the news story on their show yesterday but there have been a few other shots fired that at Greg in particular that have been quite unfair

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The videogame industry is toxic from the inside out with a few exceptions. I thought this was pretty much agreed on here.

 

[Deleted member 21709]

Watching this again, it sounds like:

- Andrea is genuinely unaware of the exact things Notch and PDP did, but knows there's been controversy.
- Instead of having an informed opinion, she speaks authoritatively while assuming the internet is just overreacting.
- Greg, not wanting to pick a fight on a live show with a coworker who can is known to be pretty pigheaded, lets it go.

I'm personally disappointed, and really do believe they need to do much better than that. This exact situation happens a lot when they talk about video games, and I'm totally fine with that, but this is not a topic you can handwave for convenience. Either handle it well, or don't talk about it at all. That's the lesson here.

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Greg repeated some of the things that Notch said. Andrea has zero excuse.

 

[Aurongel]

...Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

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You'd have to be willfully ignorant to think that the word's history and association with racist attitudes is exclusive to America. Not all racists are American hillbillies with white skin and brandishing Confederate flags. Apparently as you've learned, they can also be "damn sweet ladies".

 

[Mass_Pincup]

Well, I am from middle east and I am quite brown. Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

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Or maybe racism is so ingrained there that saying that is deemed as a normal.

It's not like there's no word to describe black people, the fact that they sidestepped the word without any connotation straight to the N-word is quite telling to me.

 

[Godzilla's Left Toe]

So a guy who's best friend was Colin Moriarty is a also Piece of Trash who saw that coming

 

[saenima]

While most moral people have no trouble seeing the problems with slavery and racism, it much harder for privileged white people to understand how some of their actions may support the bigotry of others.

It's certainly not up to minorities to educate however, that should be up to other privileged people.

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Agreed. Though the onus on this will always lie primarily with the individual imo. Having privileged people help out is good, but we live in a time where all the information available to mankind is readily available, for the most part. While on a large scale this also creates some parsing problems and fascist propaganda is a booming business, no one in the position of Greg Miller has any excuse to spout out uninformed takes on these issues. Do better. If there is one thing in life where i support the bootstraps mentality is precisely when it comes to self betterment through knowledge.

 

[Chase Lebowski]

I think it has more to do with sharing the same skin colour.

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Holy shit what a leap.

 

[Kilic95]

Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.." It was not as insult or anything

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Because you're not black, you damn idiot.

 

[jviggy43]

No no, I meant On Topic...I agree he made the right call not responding to Colin, I was referring to the issue of the Notch discussion he had with Andrea, he needs to make that right

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Ph my bad, gotcha

Holy shit.

They actually pulled the both sides shit, and used SJW unironically as being as bad as the alt right?

Why can't people just be unequivocally against bigotry, why isn't this simple?

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Because they care about promoting positivity even when that positivity is defending bigoted transphobe antisemites

 

[LuigiMario]

So a guy who's best friend was Colin Moriarty is a also Piece of Trash who saw that coming

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Tbh it mostly seemed like Andrea was saying the gross shit. Still not great that as Andrea said notch said "stupid nonsense out of context" and felt the need to defend Pewdiepie as anti corporation (which is a sentiment I've seen echoed by MANY "independent" content creators) Greg didn't have the decency to say "hey that is wrong and sucks" but also I get it's a live program and your livelihood so maybe you don't want to halt things. Doesn't make it right at all though, but honestly I feel Andrea needs to read up and apologize more than Greg.

 

[StoveOven]

The fact that somebody who literally hosted a corporate press conference at E3 last year would sarcastically say "corporations for the win I guess" is fucking rich.

Andrea seems to be legit caping for these dudes, while Greg is doing his usual shtick of choosing the path of least resistance.

I can't say I'm surprised about any of it.

 

[jviggy43]

I love how Boogie has essentially become the centrist.

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Boogie is only a centrist when it comes to defending the alr right tho so not sure thats actually centrism.

Well, I am from middle east and I am quite brown. Few years ago I went to see my girlfriend's grandparents, and her grandmother said" is your boyfriend a N.."
It was not as insult or anything, she was damn sweet lady but she did use it without being racist. In some parts of the world, the N-word is not associated with racism like in america.

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I know youre banned but what the fuck is this bullshit?

 

[Corky]

Why would anyone even listen to these guys

 

[Complicated]

Watching this again, it sounds like:

- Andrea is genuinely unaware of the exact things Notch and PDP did, but knows there's been controversy.
- Instead of having an informed opinion, she speaks authoritatively while assuming the internet is just overreacting.
- Greg, not wanting to pick a fight on a live show with a coworker who can is known to be pretty pigheaded, lets it go.

I'm personally disappointed, and really do believe they need to do much better than that. This exact situation happens a lot when they talk about video games, and I'm totally fine with that, but this is not a topic you can handwave for convenience. Either handle it well, or don't talk about it at all. That's the lesson here.

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This is exactly the kind of discussion on this topic I would expect from them which is why I don't make an effort to follow them. They don't care enough about the issue to understand what they're talking about, but they talk about it anyways because it's scintillating and will get them views. If it's about video games who gives a fuck, but this is about people and the industry they claim they want to cover in order to improve the lives of the people working within it.

 

[SunBroDave]

Watching this again, it sounds like:

- Andrea is genuinely unaware of the exact things Notch and PDP did, but knows there's been controversy.
- Instead of having an informed opinion, she speaks authoritatively while assuming the internet is just overreacting.
- Greg, not wanting to pick a fight on a live show with a coworker who can is known to be pretty pigheaded, lets it go.

I'm personally disappointed, and really do believe they need to do much better than that. This exact situation happens a lot when they talk about video games, and I'm totally fine with that, but this is not a topic you can handwave for convenience. Either handle it well, or don't talk about it at all. That's the lesson here.

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Tbh this has been KF in a nutshell for several months now.

 

[Jebusman]

Boogie is only a centrist when it comes to defending the alr right tho so not sure thats actually centrism.

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In US politics that's actually peak centrism.