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Asian ERA |OT| We don't AGE
- Thread starter Pet
- Start date
Oh, I'm surprised her parents didn't teach her Chinese. I guess that's what happens though.
If I guess, considering the name she was given... Her parents wanted her more to fit in with British life so it wouldn't have really been important. That and the UK doesn't really hold people to their heritage the way I felt the US does.
First off, you do not come in this house and get to say that Your Asian Friend(tm) would punch someone in this thread, muchless over a comment you don't understand or by appropriating her voice. That shit would not fly anywhere, so I don't know what the fuck you think you're doing in THIS thread of all places. You wouldn't pull that shit in the BCT. How do you think it would go over if I said that My Black Friend would punch someone in BCT for saying that he's an American first over being black to explain why they support Trump? I would get dragged by everyone in that community.
If a Chinese person speaking mandarin triggers you, that's a fucking problem outside of the mandarin speakers "ignorance." I also wouldn't be so crass to shit on someone with limited english proficiency by calling them ignorant when they're reaching out to make a connection either. That's some white supremacist shit.
I'm not here to argue but I was here to inform. That is exactly how she would react, not me.
This isn't really a point of being Asian but being a minority in the UK. It does get frustrating when you're never seen as a native from the country that's everything you know and in this instance, that's why she is not keen on it. Her seeing herself as English is not white supramacist shit and it's very easy for me to empathise with.
Also these masters students speak perfect English, I serve mostly the same customers. The point isn't that they need to, but as the only Asian girl at her work (which is full of white Manc girls) she is the only one they assume speaks Chinese. The fact that it gets annoying for her shouldn't be so hard to understand. And I introduced this story of her because at the time it was humorus to the language discussion.
As for BCT it's not like I care for a place that loves and doesn't even bother telling of a user who said the most racist shit to me anyway, eh. But to drive that point, the French guys that I cooked for today? If anyone called them black first instead of French... Well I've actually seen that reaction in person already.
To some people their heritage is important but to others they identify with their country. Both can coexist and that's okay.
But above all.
Please, and I beg you on this, don't assume that I have a mean tone with you. I know I'm not Asian and I'm not saying she would punch you because what you say is offensive, but that's just the Mancness in her. Haha.
Posting food before I'm kicked out :D
Bunch of new frenches moved in so I tried to fuse some cuisine. Salmon in Yuzu Butter sauce (thyme), red potatoes in garlic, black pepper (and a bit of beef stock)... Chinese Leaf mixed with iceberg lettuce and of course brocolli and asparagus.
Cooking for 10 people wasn't easy..
And I'm informing you that I have a friend that would punch you for not understanding how racism works or maybe it's just how he is because it's the Bostonian in him! Nothing personal!
It's not hard to understand, man. And neither is understanding that Chinese people speaking mandarin to her isn't the same as how it was weaponized against her while growing up by not being a white Brit.
For the record, I got an ear full from BCT for pushing bad language. Speak on what you know, not what you assume.
Actually, the second paragraph is making more sense to me... I did confulate the two. Admittedly, in this case, I felt that I assumed it felt the same to her because I don't spoken to in any particular foreign language in the UK. So when she says it bugs her I shouldn't assume it bugs her the same way, I don't know what that feels like...
...
I usually don't like meet and fruit together but a friend sent me this picture... Damnnnnn
Sounds like former Aussie PM Kevin Rudd. His vocab is pretty good but there's always something about this enunciation that is a little off. That said, my enunciation is likely way worse than his because I'm told I speak like a foreigner. And my vocabulary is like beginner level.
Yeah, my nail took the brunt of the cut. Just a little off the top of the skin under that.
I made sure to switch to the guard after that lol. I don't like it though cause it has spikes on the underside which tears up the meat.
I have a lot of Uber drivers ask where I'm from and assuming I'm going back to my home country since most of my Uber trips are to the airport. I don't know how they don't realise that I'm a local when I have a local accent.
While I wouldn't say it's self-hate, from a customer service perspective, that does come across as rude. They're just more comfortable speaking their native language and would prefer to speak with someone who they can communicate with easier. Unfortunately, that can lead them to make the wrong assumptions.
When I get approached for help from Asians, I always try to help them to the best of my ability, with the limited non-English language skills that I have if necessary. Seems like a given to try help people out.
I think one of the most important things in any customer-facing job is making sure they are served respectfully (barring some outrageously unreasonable people), and I think she's failed at that part of her job. She can easily just apologise, say she can only speak English and then try to assist them in English.
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Or just not interested in learning the language, not sure how strict Chinese parents are in that way. My mom tried to teach me and my little brother some tagalog but we didn't want to learn it. Hell I pretty much ignored my Filipino part for almost 18 years. Till like in 2016, when I kinda did some internal reflection and said why didn't I put more effort in discovering/exploring my Filipino heritage.
Still can't speak tagalog tho :(
So you don't see how popping off about how your friend would punch someone isn't out of bounds especially in the context in THIS thread? Get your shit right.
I'm conceding but that is the type of person she is. If someone argued she wasn't English first she'd punch anyone.
Going to Vancouver the weekend after Thanksgiving and leaving Boston early that Thursday for a mileage run turned into a short family trip. Anyone got food recs?
Also going to Chicago/South Bend for the Winter Classic. Any recs there too?
Also going to Chicago/South Bend for the Winter Classic. Any recs there too?
Possible? Sure. Likely that they didn't teach her any Chinese? Probably not.
Having a realized racial identity, regardless of choice, is about being comfortable in your own skin. Some people are never comfortable and try to disassociate themselves from their heritage because it's been used against them for so long. I'm sure everyone here experiences that weaponization of their heritage. For me, that is why "make yellow beautiful" is such a powerful statement by John Chu. Shit hit me hard and I'm cynical as fuck. If there's a template for creating an Asian-X culture, that's it right there.
That's cool. The language is a huge component, but not everything. I've felt the same way myself about not really being interested, but I also lived in an enclave so in a way, it was normalized for me? Some people never make that journey and I think it's kinda sad.
That's not conceding; that's reinforcing your position. It's QED.
There's a big gap between fluent and a few words though. To a certain extent, I'm pretty sure most 2nd gens can identify the language of their heritage is being spoken to them even if they don't understand it.
I'm also second gen and my mom wasn't a good teacher. And since my dad didn't speak it and we were pretty isolated back then I just couldn't pick it up. I even took 2 years of it in college and I still can't speak and understand Mandarin. Sure, I can identify that it's Mandarin it is when I hear it but I can do that with several languages. I wish more than a couple of things would stick but I think I need some actual immersion to pick it up enough to function now.
How long are you in Boston and what part? I can definitely give you some recs.
Do karaoke. I'm serious. That shit legit helped me.
Sorry that was worded a little awkwardly. I'm from Boston, heading to Vancouver then for a long weekend
tbh one of the things going to mando school for years 'taught' me was that I was bad at language and it seriously took years to unlearn that when it came to a language I actually wanted to speak. i honestly think it damaged my self confidence in language learning really badly
I'll go back to mandarin one day, but on my own terms
I'll go back to mandarin one day, but on my own terms
I've been watching T-dramas (and C-dramas) to improve my Chinese.
Can I just say jesus christ these characters annoy me to no end. I hate the way all these stories are written, I hate all the characters, this is all awful. My god.
Can I just say jesus christ these characters annoy me to no end. I hate the way all these stories are written, I hate all the characters, this is all awful. My god.
I find almost all Asian dramas to have no redeemable characters.
My family's addicted to them though.
What are some tips to karaoke in a language when you can't read 80% of it?
I liked that HK show from the 90s about that judge with the moon birthmark on his forehead. Good mix of historical setting, action, crime/mystery and supernatural stuff IIRC. I didn't understand most of what was going on though.
I can't say I've seen many Chinese shows since then. Back in the day we'd have a TV in the lounge room with a VCR hooked up. Now everybody just watches their own thing on their own TV or iPad in their own time.
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对面的女孩看过来
Duìmiàn de nǚhái kàn guòlái
看过来~~~~
Kàn guòláaaaaaiiiiii
看过来
Kàn guòlái
Pinyin subtitles.
Girl across from me, look over here / Look over heeeeeere / Look over here
You might know this song.
I've been reading the exchange between D65 and Power of Sparda...
Interesting...
It sounds like you're making it sound like identity is viewed as Zero Sum - that's ssssooooooooo American!
I'm Canadian, and of Vietnamese descent. In Canada, the ideal that we strive to live up to every day is that identity is NOT zero sum. Immigrants to Canada, like myself and my family, are encouraged to not abandon their cultural roots. They can be Canadian just as they are. Identity is not zero sum.
I am Canadian.
I am Vietnamese.
There is no conflict or contradiction in me declaring both of those statements.
As our current Prime Minister declared: "A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian!"
I've lived in Canada since I was 2 years old. I know Canadian culture, more specifically Vancouver culture, very well. I also know Vietnamese culture very well. I even speak fluent Vietnamese. I find that one of the great benefits of having 2 cultural roots is that you can pick and choose the good from each, and, call out and reject the shit from each.
Given how multi-ethnic the UK is, and how LONG it's been that multi-ethnic for, don't people see her as Manchester as soon as she opens her mouth and makes it obvious from her mannerisms that she is Manchester???
She ONLY knows UK culture?
She has no idea about ANY of the following?
- Chinese food, using chopsticks, the etiquette surrounding eating and sharing a meal with others
- Taking off your shoes when entering a home
- Additional respect to elders, not because they've earned it, but for no reason other than they are elders
- Lunar New Year, red envelopes
- Respect and memorializing of ones ancestors (AKA: Ancestor "worship")
- Mid Autumn Festival, Moon Cakes
- The importance placed upon filial piety
- Chinese Wedding customs (She's never been to a Chinese wedding"???)
- Chinese Funeral Customs (She's never been to a funeral of a Chinese person, or person of Chinese descent?)
You sure that she only knows UK culture??? Or are you speaking on her behalf based on your assumptions?
Interesting...
It sounds like you're making it sound like identity is viewed as Zero Sum - that's ssssooooooooo American!
I'm Canadian, and of Vietnamese descent. In Canada, the ideal that we strive to live up to every day is that identity is NOT zero sum. Immigrants to Canada, like myself and my family, are encouraged to not abandon their cultural roots. They can be Canadian just as they are. Identity is not zero sum.
I am Canadian.
I am Vietnamese.
There is no conflict or contradiction in me declaring both of those statements.
As our current Prime Minister declared: "A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian!"
I've lived in Canada since I was 2 years old. I know Canadian culture, more specifically Vancouver culture, very well. I also know Vietnamese culture very well. I even speak fluent Vietnamese. I find that one of the great benefits of having 2 cultural roots is that you can pick and choose the good from each, and, call out and reject the shit from each.
Given how multi-ethnic the UK is, and how LONG it's been that multi-ethnic for, don't people see her as Manchester as soon as she opens her mouth and makes it obvious from her mannerisms that she is Manchester???
She ONLY knows UK culture?
She has no idea about ANY of the following?
- Chinese food, using chopsticks, the etiquette surrounding eating and sharing a meal with others
- Taking off your shoes when entering a home
- Additional respect to elders, not because they've earned it, but for no reason other than they are elders
- Lunar New Year, red envelopes
- Respect and memorializing of ones ancestors (AKA: Ancestor "worship")
- Mid Autumn Festival, Moon Cakes
- The importance placed upon filial piety
- Chinese Wedding customs (She's never been to a Chinese wedding"???)
- Chinese Funeral Customs (She's never been to a funeral of a Chinese person, or person of Chinese descent?)
You sure that she only knows UK culture??? Or are you speaking on her behalf based on your assumptions?
For way too fucking long too many people have viewed Asia in a negative light.
For way too fucking long so many of us have viewed our Asianness as a negative.
So for way too fucking many of us the strategy adopted to try to cope with the racism, discrimination, prejudice, condescension, rudeness, negativity, etc. was to try our fucking hardest to reject every single motherfucking iota of our Asianness - discarding the language/culture/customs, refusing to associate with other Asians, adopting anti-Asian racism, etc. It's sad, but it's also kinda pathetic. Even if you get plastic surgery to get rid of your Asian face, you cannot get rid of the parts of your DNA that will make your kids at least half-Asian.
I dream of a future where people of Asian descent living outside of Asia can feel 100% at ease, if not downright proud, of their Asianness. They won't feel embarrassed or self-conscious when using chopsticks, eating Asian food, consuming Asian media, hanging out with people who are also Asian, participating in Asian rituals and customs, etc.
I sense that the tide is slooooooowly starting to turn. I hope the extinction of the Boomers will give it a huge boost.
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Yeah I'm bracing for a shit load more Sinophobia in the upcoming decades. With extension given how people in the west think every Asian is Chinese Asian phobia will increase. While I like your vision current affairs tells me the opposite will happen for the next couple of decades. Until a new world order(not the conspiracy kind) is established.
In civ terms it would mean Asian phobia will not stop until a Asia secures a cultural victory too.
Had something typed up but edit:
The only thing I actually know is that even she doubted her Manc accent at being super distinct. I get it also that regardless of all the obvious signs I've only really lived in the UK people keep asking where I'm really from.
It's not hate if one's race but when it makes people never assume you're native to the area you grow up it really sucks.
Actually, when we were in Chicago my partner (Japanese) and I used UberPool and she saw a guy she thought he might be Japanese too (appearance). I mean the guy was saying how cool it was that she was from Japan and he only said he was American. (hence my earlier comment that she thought AsAms were cool af)
I think that's probably accepted more in America and London, than it would be in Manchester. I don't think my Chinese British friend is allowed to be seen as a Manc to a lot of people. Enough that we had to have that discussion. I just saidthat she's so obviously northern from the perspective of a Londoner.
The only thing I actually know is that even she doubted her Manc accent at being super distinct. I get it also that regardless of all the obvious signs I've only really lived in the UK people keep asking where I'm really from.
It's not hate if one's race but when it makes people never assume you're native to the area you grow up it really sucks.
Actually, when we were in Chicago my partner (Japanese) and I used UberPool and she saw a guy she thought he might be Japanese too (appearance). I mean the guy was saying how cool it was that she was from Japan and he only said he was American. (hence my earlier comment that she thought AsAms were cool af)
I think that's probably accepted more in America and London, than it would be in Manchester. I don't think my Chinese British friend is allowed to be seen as a Manc to a lot of people. Enough that we had to have that discussion. I just saidthat she's so obviously northern from the perspective of a Londoner.
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It's really about taking what you know and building on it. With youtube, it makes it easier because a lot of songs have translated lyrics. Jay Chou songs are awesome, but he mumbles a lot of his words and not that great to learn from. The great thing about songs is that they're relatively simple and don't have a lot of complex words or grammar. The way most Chinese songs are written(for better or worse), the first verse is repeated again.
I'd say 20% is pretty good start.
Yes....Yes!
This song is my jam. One time, someone picked this song at a karaoke bar I was at and the whole joint started singing along.
GF and I just came back from a weekend trip in Vancouver. I've never tried sushi in Boston so I can't say if the price/quality is great, but we found a place in Richmond called Gami Sushi which has amazing portions for the price and is open most of the day.
If you want some crazy novelty, try Steveson Pizza Company and try some of the "Castle" sized pizzas. GF and I got the $70 one with 4 lobster tails and everything.
Western Lake Chinese Seafood Restaurant for dim sum was really nice, had huge portions and really good considering Toronto dim sum is some of the best, but Vancouver easily has better seafood-based dim sum.
Self-hate is distancing yourself from your heritage to be accepted and assimilated into the dominant white supremacist culture period, but this conversation isn't new for you, so let's not pretend that it is. It's patronizing as fuck and plain disrespectful to this community...and that's on top of you appropriating and weaponizing your friend's voice on someone OF this community. Frankly, I don't even care that it was used against me because the bigger issue is that you felt and still feel that you were not out of line with that post. If you said that to anyone else in this community, I'd be up in your shit even more.
I'm only speaking for myself here, but if you can't see how saying that your friend would punch someone for some vacuous reason isn't fucked up, then maybe this community isn't for you.
The entire family is going so we'll see what we can fit in. The dim sum place seems easy to get to by public transit.
I'm assuming Richmond to get a Chinese food fix? I've been reading Vancouver Chinatown is not the greatest.
Dude, I think you're taking this too far. D65 is clearly aware that she's in an Asian space and trying to be respectful. At this point you're just being needlessly combative.
Also, identity is a hella complex subject, and, by very virtue of its qualities, an intensely individual experience. Postcolonialism is a framework from which one analyzes society, not a box into which one stuffs random people one doesn't know much about. We aren't Frantz Fanon in here, we don't need to go deep into racial psychopathology over this story.
I disagree with you.
While I don't always agree with Power of Sparda, I appreciate that he is standing up for the expectations of respectful behaviour from non-Asians who chose to participate in Asian-Era. Too often we Asians are, at best, far too accommodating, and, at worst, downright passive when it comes to demanding the appropriate level of respect from other.s We got fucking Confucianism to thank for that shit!
And I believe D65 is a guy.
Keep in mind that everything we have heard about her is via D65...
I'm not trying to be disrespectful. I can only parrot what I hear and emphasise from my own personal feelings. Painfully, I feel that myself and this girl have somewhat the same sense of identity except I don't have a heritage to choose or learn about. Do I learn about Jamaican culture that my grandfather was born in? The Chinese culture he grew up with from his grandparents? Cuban, or Greek? I'm so far away from all of them that even if I take a DNA test none of them feel closer. Ironically as a child Chinese is the only I learnt about because my friend in primary school but that's irrelevant.
But I'm not here to argue despite what it may seem. I held this ground because of my friend, who I insist is happy to be Manc and unhappy that people don't see it, what am I personally supposed to do if that's wrong for her? I don't think it is self-hate the same way her having a white boyfriend isn't self-hate.
Maybe that's a discussion for a mixed space for people without an obvious heritage but the conversations I have with her are cathartic in that way, for us both to state that people are silly and we're just as English as they are.
I hope that makes sense.
I guess this depends on your beliefs.
Anyway I won't post here anymore. At least for a while.
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So 65 telling anyone in this community that their friend would punch them is respectful? Fuck that shit. An equivalent response would be to tell them to straight up fuck off. You think any or the other race/ethnic OT's would accept that?
We can have a conversation about identity, but what 65 said to me about being punched should not be up for discussion. And even beyond that, I've been noticing a trend of "my Asian woman says..." posts on Era and no one pushes back on it like they would "my black friend says"-type posts. So we should accept that here too? If 65 wants to have a discussion about identity, then it's should be using their voice and not their friend's.
65 knows exactly what I'm talking about in my posts and is ignoring it for a reason. It's not a coincidence that there was some weirdness in this thread a few weeks ago.
We don't have to agree in everything and I know I lean more on the militant side of issues compared to most folks here, but there needs to be a basic level of decorum that we should agree on. You take off your shoes when you come in and don't use chopsticks like drumsticks.
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