Mainly because I see alot of people either not know what happened with the Project before and after or get bits confused.
So I just thought as someone whos been in alot of threads like this I thought I would try and sum up the history of Versus Development as best as I could.
To note this is mostly focused on Versus 13 up until Tabata took over and the reboot.
Lets start with the Beginning.
Fabula Nova Crystallis:
FNC began back in 2004 as Square was beginning to work up development on the next Final Fantasy, FNC and its mythos was originally developed by Nojima over the course of a year and when he showed his idea to Square and its Developers they did really enjoy the idea bak in 2005.
The concept was to have a central Mythos a Grand Crystal Tales/Story but then each game in the series would be a Different interpretation/story using said mythos of Fabula Nova Crystallis.
Over the year it was decided there would be three games set in said FNC.
1. Final Fantasy 13 the first game in FNC
2. Final Fantasy Agito 13, Type-0 original title back when it was announced before years later when it was re-revealed to have dropped the 13 from its name and be renamed Type-0 mainly because it didn't have much to do with 13.
and finally
3. Final Fantasy Versus 13
VERSUS before 13's release
As with the title, Versus 13 was developed as in many ways the opposite or turn around of Final Fantasy 13.
13's main color was White.
Versus 13 was Black
13 was set in a fantastical mystical futuristic world
Versus 13 was set in a more Modern World (probably the last one since 8)
More so how the game was when it released, 13 was closed of and section based like 10
Versus 13 was always designed and envisioned to be open in a way and try and replicate a real big open world.
Look at things a bit more:
Lightning Bright Pink Hair, main color of clothes white with a futuristic gun sword
Noctis jet black hair, wears all black and main signature weapon a sword with an engine on it with Ancient Royal Arms
Versus 13 was announced back in 2006 same year as FNC and 13, though unlike its counter part at this stage Versus did not have much people behind it, for its first years most of what we saw and knew of versus was all conceptual not much work behind the game had began at that point due to other projects at Square Enix like Kingdom heats Birth By Sleep but mainly due to projects in the works at
Development Studio 1, the main team tasked with making offline Final Fantasy that was busy working on 13 (same studio would later be the main force behind Final Fantasy 7 Remake).
So for a couple of years no big work was being done on Versus 13 and what fans have seen was so far conceptual but its clear it did hit with fans but it did have ramifications when Versus was eventually rebooted under director Tabata:
www.finaland.com
So yeah until 13's release in 2009 in Japan and 2010 everywhere else Versus 13 didn't see much action, but in 3-4 years time things would change.
Development
Versus 13 was to be built using the tools of its counterpart Final Fantasy 13, which meant everyones favorite engine....
CRYSTAL TOOLS
Problem was Crystal Tool and how its engine and tools were designed was counter productive to what Versus wanted to do, Crystal Tools was good for making the kinds of closed off and narrow (think 10) environments that FF13 was made up from, Versus from the get go was always thought up to be a more open/open world exprience and the tools that crystal tools provided were not up to the task.
to quote Technical Director of XV:
www.gamesradar.com
Luckily Square did have another Priority Engine in the works that was more suited for the open environments Versus was seeking, Luminous Engine so in 2010 the team made the switch to the developing Luminous Engine and Versus 13 went into Full Production.
Common Misconception I see is that people think Versus didn't have much of a development team, true early on as FF13 was still being developed but once that was nearing its end and out the door Versus 13 did have lots of people working on the game.
Roberto Ferrari a character designer that has worked with Nomura since 2010, worked on Versus, 15 and Final Fantasy 7 Remake had this to say:
So from 2010 to late 2012 (thats when Tabata and the Type 0 team came on board so while a good amount of the original team were not there they were filled in by Tabatas group), Versus 13 by Robertos own words had a team of about 200 people, which is about the same amount of people as Final Fantasy 13 had at its height of development.
So 2 years or so of full development and things were not going well to say the least to once again Quote Roberto:
Even after the years of conceptual work and predevelopment as FF13 was being worked on and as the game was in full development Final Fantasy Versus 13 story and concepts were not set in stone, as development progressed the story of Versus kept on changing and as we know from the development history of Bioshock Infinite changing os a story during development that should have been pretty much set can have drastic impacts on the pipeline and production of the game much less morale especially when at this point Versus was no longer a PS3 exclusive but aiming for next gen systems with the game set to be released by the end of the year of 2014.
Along with the idea of Versus 13 being a trilogy of its own games
This was a big task for developers and what didn't help the game and teams confidence was the reaction to Versus 13 inside the company.
Square Enix Internals & Reboot
Despite Square Enix saying Versus was doing well and such with PR, but on the inside of Square Enix it was anything but happiness with Versus 13.
Then President and CEO of the time Wada along with other executives were presented in 2012 what had been done so far with Versus 13.
Wada and Excs were not impressed nor inspired what Nomura and his teams have put up in the time since the game went into full production in 2010, from what Wada and others at Square Enix saw and played of Versus 13 it just wasn't fun nor did they feel confident putting in the resources to finish a game that no one was happy with.
From duckroll
Wada confidence in the game was such that he was seriously considering just cancelling Final Fantasy Versus 13, thats when he decided to give a call to Tabata:
Tabata and his team made a demo of what would become Final Fantasy 15 that Wada and co were more comfortably and confident in and thus the greenlight of versus into FF15 had began.
Though with two big parts that needed to be agreed to.
#1. Final Fantasy 15 would be a standalone game, it would not have a sequel planned/multiple games like Versus 13
#2. Final Fantasy 15 no matter what would be released by the end of 2016
With that in mind I think I will stop it here, I don't think i should now go into 15's production (maybe a thread later) but the intent of this thread was to give just a gist of what we know about Final Fantasy Versus 13.
What I see in Final Fantasy threads is an unawreness to Versus 13's troubles, a rose tinted glass look at the game that most of us only ever saw concept footage and trailers that made the game look as best as it could just like what you see at E3 at times which aren't representative of the true game, remember Cyberpunk?
Like lets not talk about some the bits from Versus like Stella being a ghost the entire game who was killed by Noctis as a kid.
I'm reminded of the Camelot episode in Sopranos, where Tony really has only good things to say about his dad that he was an honorable good man when really as we see in the episode as Tony is foced to confront and meet his fathers Mistress.
He was a crook who didn't really care for his wife and kids and would rather spend time with his sleazy mistress than his own family.
I didn't make this thread to bash or make fun of Nomura or that, far from it he is a talented director who worked and a big part of some of my favorite games of all time.
But no matter the director sometimes projects just never come together, that they may sound good in concept but when you're trying to make it all work it mix it all together into a cake....... it just doesn't come out right.
Final Fantasy Versus 13 was game that just never came together despite best intentions it was a game in development whos story keep changing, whos excs and producers didn't think was fun & had no confidence in, a game that had to get rebooted otherwise it would be canned and more.
A Game that could never take shape.
Thank you all if you stayed to read the whole thread, I would also like to Liam Allen-Miller just cause I think he would like this thread
So I just thought as someone whos been in alot of threads like this I thought I would try and sum up the history of Versus Development as best as I could.
To note this is mostly focused on Versus 13 up until Tabata took over and the reboot.
Lets start with the Beginning.
Fabula Nova Crystallis:
FNC began back in 2004 as Square was beginning to work up development on the next Final Fantasy, FNC and its mythos was originally developed by Nojima over the course of a year and when he showed his idea to Square and its Developers they did really enjoy the idea bak in 2005.
The concept was to have a central Mythos a Grand Crystal Tales/Story but then each game in the series would be a Different interpretation/story using said mythos of Fabula Nova Crystallis.
Over the year it was decided there would be three games set in said FNC.
1. Final Fantasy 13 the first game in FNC
2. Final Fantasy Agito 13, Type-0 original title back when it was announced before years later when it was re-revealed to have dropped the 13 from its name and be renamed Type-0 mainly because it didn't have much to do with 13.
and finally
3. Final Fantasy Versus 13
VERSUS before 13's release
As with the title, Versus 13 was developed as in many ways the opposite or turn around of Final Fantasy 13.
13's main color was White.
Versus 13 was Black
13 was set in a fantastical mystical futuristic world
Versus 13 was set in a more Modern World (probably the last one since 8)
More so how the game was when it released, 13 was closed of and section based like 10
Versus 13 was always designed and envisioned to be open in a way and try and replicate a real big open world.
Look at things a bit more:
Lightning Bright Pink Hair, main color of clothes white with a futuristic gun sword
Noctis jet black hair, wears all black and main signature weapon a sword with an engine on it with Ancient Royal Arms
Versus 13 was announced back in 2006 same year as FNC and 13, though unlike its counter part at this stage Versus did not have much people behind it, for its first years most of what we saw and knew of versus was all conceptual not much work behind the game had began at that point due to other projects at Square Enix like Kingdom heats Birth By Sleep but mainly due to projects in the works at
Development Studio 1, the main team tasked with making offline Final Fantasy that was busy working on 13 (same studio would later be the main force behind Final Fantasy 7 Remake).
So for a couple of years no big work was being done on Versus 13 and what fans have seen was so far conceptual but its clear it did hit with fans but it did have ramifications when Versus was eventually rebooted under director Tabata:
Gamescom 2015 : Interview Hajime Tabata (ENG) - Finaland
Votre site de référence sur la saga Final Fantasy et toute l’actualité Square Enix
So yeah until 13's release in 2009 in Japan and 2010 everywhere else Versus 13 didn't see much action, but in 3-4 years time things would change.
Development
Versus 13 was to be built using the tools of its counterpart Final Fantasy 13, which meant everyones favorite engine....
CRYSTAL TOOLS
Problem was Crystal Tool and how its engine and tools were designed was counter productive to what Versus wanted to do, Crystal Tools was good for making the kinds of closed off and narrow (think 10) environments that FF13 was made up from, Versus from the get go was always thought up to be a more open/open world exprience and the tools that crystal tools provided were not up to the task.
to quote Technical Director of XV:
How Final Fantasy 15 almost destroyed itself (with help from FF13)
Back in 2008, things weren't going well for Final Fantasy 13. A few short years after it was announced as the leading entry in Square-Enix's Fabula Nova
Luckily Square did have another Priority Engine in the works that was more suited for the open environments Versus was seeking, Luminous Engine so in 2010 the team made the switch to the developing Luminous Engine and Versus 13 went into Full Production.
Common Misconception I see is that people think Versus didn't have much of a development team, true early on as FF13 was still being developed but once that was nearing its end and out the door Versus 13 did have lots of people working on the game.
Roberto Ferrari a character designer that has worked with Nomura since 2010, worked on Versus, 15 and Final Fantasy 7 Remake had this to say:
So from 2010 to late 2012 (thats when Tabata and the Type 0 team came on board so while a good amount of the original team were not there they were filled in by Tabatas group), Versus 13 by Robertos own words had a team of about 200 people, which is about the same amount of people as Final Fantasy 13 had at its height of development.
So 2 years or so of full development and things were not going well to say the least to once again Quote Roberto:
Even after the years of conceptual work and predevelopment as FF13 was being worked on and as the game was in full development Final Fantasy Versus 13 story and concepts were not set in stone, as development progressed the story of Versus kept on changing and as we know from the development history of Bioshock Infinite changing os a story during development that should have been pretty much set can have drastic impacts on the pipeline and production of the game much less morale especially when at this point Versus was no longer a PS3 exclusive but aiming for next gen systems with the game set to be released by the end of the year of 2014.
Along with the idea of Versus 13 being a trilogy of its own games
This was a big task for developers and what didn't help the game and teams confidence was the reaction to Versus 13 inside the company.
Square Enix Internals & Reboot
Despite Square Enix saying Versus was doing well and such with PR, but on the inside of Square Enix it was anything but happiness with Versus 13.
Then President and CEO of the time Wada along with other executives were presented in 2012 what had been done so far with Versus 13.
Wada and Excs were not impressed nor inspired what Nomura and his teams have put up in the time since the game went into full production in 2010, from what Wada and others at Square Enix saw and played of Versus 13 it just wasn't fun nor did they feel confident putting in the resources to finish a game that no one was happy with.
From duckroll
Wada confidence in the game was such that he was seriously considering just cancelling Final Fantasy Versus 13, thats when he decided to give a call to Tabata:
Edge #314 Final Fantasy 30th Anniversary Special Edition.
Tabata and his team made a demo of what would become Final Fantasy 15 that Wada and co were more comfortably and confident in and thus the greenlight of versus into FF15 had began.
Though with two big parts that needed to be agreed to.
#1. Final Fantasy 15 would be a standalone game, it would not have a sequel planned/multiple games like Versus 13
#2. Final Fantasy 15 no matter what would be released by the end of 2016
With that in mind I think I will stop it here, I don't think i should now go into 15's production (maybe a thread later) but the intent of this thread was to give just a gist of what we know about Final Fantasy Versus 13.
What I see in Final Fantasy threads is an unawreness to Versus 13's troubles, a rose tinted glass look at the game that most of us only ever saw concept footage and trailers that made the game look as best as it could just like what you see at E3 at times which aren't representative of the true game, remember Cyberpunk?
Like lets not talk about some the bits from Versus like Stella being a ghost the entire game who was killed by Noctis as a kid.
I'm reminded of the Camelot episode in Sopranos, where Tony really has only good things to say about his dad that he was an honorable good man when really as we see in the episode as Tony is foced to confront and meet his fathers Mistress.
He was a crook who didn't really care for his wife and kids and would rather spend time with his sleazy mistress than his own family.
I didn't make this thread to bash or make fun of Nomura or that, far from it he is a talented director who worked and a big part of some of my favorite games of all time.
But no matter the director sometimes projects just never come together, that they may sound good in concept but when you're trying to make it all work it mix it all together into a cake....... it just doesn't come out right.
Final Fantasy Versus 13 was game that just never came together despite best intentions it was a game in development whos story keep changing, whos excs and producers didn't think was fun & had no confidence in, a game that had to get rebooted otherwise it would be canned and more.
A Game that could never take shape.
Thank you all if you stayed to read the whole thread, I would also like to Liam Allen-Miller just cause I think he would like this thread
