The slowpoke poaching storyline in Gold/Silver is just so dark and pointed compared to the rest of the series.

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

In other Pokemon games, you have the villain wanting to blow up a reactor because of climate change in a thousand years or you have a dude wanting to kill all life because it's flawed and these are all terrible motivations that are so silly that they don't come off as dark because they're so ridiculous.

Meanwhile, in Gold/Silver, Team Rocket decides to generate funds for their operators by capturing and torturing Slowpokes to get their tails to sell for high prices to assholes.

You can even buy one of these tails for a ridiculous price and it... does nothing in a well-designed usage of gameplay-story integration.

A very direct and well-designed analog in the Pokemon world for ivory and shark fin poaching.

There are other elements of Pokemon that are pointed or dark, but they're usually deep in the background and not directly in the main story like in GSC.

 

[Uncle at Nintendo]

Thats why its the GOAT

 

[Juan]

I guess it's a meta-critic that at the time, we were too young to really understand and it hits us many years later.

So as Uncle said, that's why (among many other reasons) it's probably the best Pokémon ever haha.

 

[Dolce]

I mean Black and White literally has the villain adopting a child and then socially isolating him and essentially abusing him for his own personal goals.

 

[PAFenix]

Thats why its the GOAT

Click to shrink...

One and done.

 

[BasilZero]

I am playing through Crystal now and ya I went through that, never really thought much about it when I first played the game almost 20 years ago.

 

[L Thammy]

Not really. Team Rocket was established as killing Pokemon as part of a poaching businesses in the original games. Pokemon started off with a rough quality to it sometimes.

I think Satoshi Tajiri explicitly said that Pokemon Adventures was the manga closest to his vision at one point - that had Pokemon cutting each other up and trainers actually physically involved in battles.

 

[Atom]

Yeah I love that little arc. Both it and gen 2 feel very grounded as a result of the evil team's motivations and whatnot.

Something that later games struggled with as they need to make everything more "epic" and up the ante.

 

[SanTheSly]

Pokémon is better at smaller, darker isolated stories for sure.

Team Rocket killing Marowak and its ghost continuing to haunt a tower full of other very real ghosts and possessed trainers is creepy.

Pokémon Mansion being burned down and abandoned after experimenting on Mew and creating Mewtwo, along with the fittingly weird music, always stuck with me too.

Team Rocket poaching slowpoke for tails is unsettling, but the creepier stuff is in Gen 1 for me.

As already pointed out by Gravijah, what Ghetsis does to N is incredibly fucked up too.

It's when the stakes get too big and impersonal that I start to eyeroll. Team Magma and Aqua's plans are ridiculous and the world ending threat is over just as fast as it started.

Team Flare's weird genocide plan involving a 3,000 year old space laser from an ancient Pokémon war… I have no nice words for.

 

[Starlatine]

its not really team rocket though, its a bunch of leftovers who are trying a lot of smaller and desperate stuff to get their boss to come back. which is what i like about it, we get to see team rocket at their best and at their worst, usually when the big baddy fails we mostly just hear about it in the end of the game or they disappear completely. the russian dude in cerulean who was the last rocket on his own cause he didnt hear the team had dissolved for good was kinda sad

 

[ash32121]

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

The story that Ruby and Saphire try to tell was also pretty good. Then ORAS kinda muddy water

 

[L Thammy]

Another aspect of the roughness of earlier Pokemon incarnations which I like is that you weren't really established the good guy as with a lot of JRPGs. Like, Team Rocket is bad, but they're pretty much just the yakuza as interpreted in the Pokemon world, and you stop them because they're inconveniencing you on your quest to be the best. It fits in well with the era where all the Pokemon protagonists have mischievous grins. It's all very classic Akira Toriyama.

 

[Chief Malik]

They just cut the tails off and sell them with is fine. There are a couple teams that go around killing pokémon for no reason damn near. so know rocket does.

 

[Aaron]

Another aspect of the roughness of earlier Pokemon incarnations which I like is that you weren't really established the good guy as with a lot of JRPGs. Like, Team Rocket is bad, but they're pretty much just the yakuza as interpreted in the Pokemon world, and you stop them because they're inconveniencing you on your quest to be the best. It fits in well with the era where all the Pokemon protagonists have mischievous grins. It's all very classic Akira Toriyama.

Click to shrink...

It's interesting in the anime too where Giovanni operates a Legitimate Businessmen's Club version of Team Rocket called Rocket Corporation that seems to offer genuine products, services etc. as a front for his mob activity and the police and everyone just seem to be cool with it. Sure, they'll arrest Jessie and James sometimes, but only because they're stupid cartoon villains who can't help getting caught.

 

[Chief Malik]

trainers actually physically involved in battles

Click to shrink...

lmaaaooo they had the trainers knuckling up fr?

 

[Parthenios]

Pokémon was generally more interesting before it sanded all the edges off.

 

[L Thammy]

lmaaaooo they had the trainers knuckling up fr?

Click to shrink...

I don't think so, it's more like like they're an alternate target if you want to try that strategy:

 

[mjw]

Sun and Moon is a story of parental abuse and drug addiction

 

[diakyu]

Too bad it's in the most boring pokemon story to ever exist, it's a race to the bottom with XY. Raw enough to hurt pokemon and sell their body parts but their big idea is to go cry to daddy on main. Embarrassing.

Sun and Moon is a story of parental abuse and drug addiction

Click to shrink...

Also this, though I'm blanking on the drug addiction part. You mean the toxin nihilego produces?

 

[Deleted member 34949]

the russian dude in cerulean who was the last rocket on his own cause he didnt hear the team had dissolved for good was kinda sad

Click to shrink...

Always thought it was kinda neat that the dude pops up as an easter egg in Gen 5 with a family and that old life behind him.

 

[TyraZaurus]

I mean the tails grow back and the Slowpoke are fine later.

I'd say the whole deal with N is darker and more pointed, but that's me.

 

[Chief Malik]

I mean the tails grow back and the Slowpoke are fine later.

I'd say the whole deal with N is darker and more pointed, but that's me.

Click to shrink...

right. pokémon are just animals, it's okay to eat them.

 

[CarthOhNoes]

Meanwhile the "evil team" in Sword and Shield want to…. Generate publicity for their leader who…. Is… erm… just a trainer?
Jesus those games were terrible.

 

[mjw]

Too bad it's in the most boring pokemon story to ever exist, it's a race to the bottom with XY. Raw enough to hurt pokemon and sell their body parts but their big idea is to go cry to daddy on main. Embarrassing.


Also this, though I'm blanking on the drug addiction part. You mean the toxin nihilego produces?

Click to shrink...

Yea. Maybe I'm reading too much into that but Lusamine was really out of her mind

 

[diakyu]

Meanwhile the "evil team" in Sword and Shield want to…. Generate publicity for their leader who…. Is… erm… just a trainer?
Jesus those games were terrible.

Click to shrink...

There isn't an evil team in swsh, GF is clearly losing interest in the concept since they've been playing with it since sun and moon. They should just be done with it altogether. Hopefully with arceus they will be.

Yea. Maybe I'm reading too much into that but Lusamine was really out of her mind

Click to shrink...

You're right that it was nihilego causing her to change and abuse her kids, I'd just never seen it as a drug analogy. I can see how it could be taken that way though

 

[MobileSuitReactor]

. the russian dude in cerulean who was the last rocket on his own cause he didnt hear the team had dissolved for good was kinda sad

Click to shrink...

Reminds me of

Shoichi Yokoi, the Japanese soldier who held out in Guam

The story of Shoichi Yokoi, the Japanese soldier who spent nearly three decades hiding in the jungles of Guam after the end of World War II.

www.bbc.com

 

[Punished Dan]

This is why GSC are the GOAT. Well one of the reasons.

 

[Sephiroth]

If Slowpokes weren't meant to be poached, maybe they shouldn't be so delicious.

 

[Xterrian]

That's basically nothing compared to N. Yet anothet thing gen v is superior in.

 

[Rolling Antony]

Calling it "storyline" is a bit generous.

While those actions are indeed a bit dark, there are many other examples throughout the series. RBY Kanto has the ghost of a Marowak killed by Team Rocket appear as an opponent, there was the little girl killed by Darkrai (accidentally?) on B2W2, the Ghetsis/N story and of course, the whole Mauville storyline from ORAS, Lillie and Lusamine's relationship on SM, etc. Those are much better examples than GS "main story". I think the Mauville stuff is bigger and more developed than GS and it's treated as a sidequest.

 

[Fuchsia]

Yeah I love that little arc. Both it and gen 2 feel very grounded as a result of the evil team's motivations and whatnot.

Something that later games struggled with as they need to make everything more "epic" and up the ante.

Click to shrink...

I do actually agree with this. I prefer the "smaller scale" stories. The epicness of it all in recent games has made it feel hollow in a weird way. I'm just like "ok yeah the world is ending yet again."

 

[scare_crow]

It's not SO DARK!! They just trim off the tail and the Slowpoke is fine. It's cartoony "evil."

 

[KillstealWolf]

And then Sw/Sh drops the ball entirely on this and just lets you buy and cook Slowpoke Tails for Curry. It's even got a cutesier name now as "Smoke-Poke Tails".

Smoke-Poke Tail - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net

 

[diakyu]

Oh god yeah the Old Muaville story, that's leagues above this one in how dark and down to earth it is. The horrors of modern capitalism brought to you by Pokemon.

And then Sw/Sh drops the ball entirely on this and just lets you buy and cook Slowpoke Tails for Curry. It's even got a cutesier name now as "Smoke-Poke Tails".

Smoke-Poke Tail - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net

Click to shrink...

XY actually started this trend. You can buy a dish with it in Le Yeah. Sun and Moon says Slowpoke don't even notice when it's gone.

 

[808s & Villainy]

In D/P they literally blew up a lake and killed a bunch of Pokemon
But yeah, the first 2 gens had some darker elements that I'm a bit bummed were removed when the series got more popular and started leaning towards kids instead of just anyone

 

[Aaron]

And then Sw/Sh drops the ball entirely on this and just lets you buy and cook Slowpoke Tails for Curry. It's even got a cutesier name now as "Smoke-Poke Tails".

Smoke-Poke Tail - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net

Click to shrink...

I believe the in-canon rationalization/distinction is that Slowpoke tails fall off naturally and can grow back, whereas TR just cuts them off.

 

[Weiss]

Yea. Maybe I'm reading too much into that but Lusamine was really out of her mind

Click to shrink...

I mean, that's what I saw in Lusamine too.

She's obsessed with a thing that infects her mind and causes her to neglect and abuse her children, one of whom runs away from home and becomes a chuuni edgelord because he thinks it makes him a real adult, the other stays and timidly weathers it in the hopes of bringing her real mom back until she reaches a breaking point and also flees, and Lusamine is still too broken by her addiction to really care about their feelings.

It's one of the realest and most nuanced depictions of child abuse a game has made me witness.

 

[Starlatine]

Dont slowpokes use their tails like bait for fishing or something and thats how they get not-cloysters stuck on it to evolve
they clearly know it tastes good and it probably doesnt hurt that much

 

[DinoBlaster]

It's not SO DARK!! They just trim off the tail and the Slowpoke is fine. It's cartoony "evil."

Click to shrink...

Doesn't it mirror real life evil? Like shark fin soup

 

[TyraZaurus]

right. pokémon are just animals, it's okay to eat them.

Click to shrink...

I'm not saying it's not wrong what they did. But compared to stuff they did later it's about as dark as a room with a nightlight. They make too concessions and stress that the Slowpoke are fine in the long term, which hurts the impact of the metaphor massively. It's gutless compared to the real manipulation and abuse of children and cult behavior activity in something like Black and White.

 

[TyraZaurus]

Doesn't it mirror real life evil? Like shark fin soup

Click to shrink...

Most sharks don't lose their tails naturally so they feel no pain from this, and are actually, you know, dead. The Slowpoke thing gives too many reassurances the Pokemon are fine in the end for the metaphor to have any applicability.

 

[bloopland33]

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

The story that Ruby and Saphire try to tell was also pretty good. Then ORAS kinda muddy water

Click to shrink...

What is RS's depth and what did ORAS take away if TL;CW?

Oh god yeah the Old Muaville story, that's leagues above this one in how dark and down to earth it is. The horrors of modern capitalism brought to you by Pokemon.


XY actually started this trend. You can buy a dish with it in Le Yeah. Sun and Moon says Slowpoke don't even notice when it's gone.

Click to shrink...

What was the old Mauville story?

 

[Zombegoast]

It grows back

 

[diakyu]

What was the old Mauville story?

Click to shrink...

Essentially it's the story of how Professor Cozmo (the father of the Cozmo we see in-game I think) had his entire life ruined by the terrible work conditions at Sea Mauville when it was still operational. He worked to the bone only to end up growing distant from his family with his son constantly sending him letters that imply the mother has become neglectful and was clearly having an affair. In the end the whole thing is shut down but before then Cozmo was let go because he lost the Odd Keystone he was supposed to look after but it's implied the Spiritomb haunting him was just out to fuck with him. Bulbapedia has all the notes you can read for yourself. The game is very clear about how bad the conditions were and I assume it's a commentary on Japan's work culture.

 

[Opposable]

as has been said, it grows back, and i'm pretty sure it's implied that as they are so slow they don't feel any pain

 

[Spinosaurus]

There's a reason regeneration is Slowpoke family's hidden ability. They're salamanders, they have autotomy.

 

[Deleted member 4034]

GOAT.

 

[Aaron]

The secret saddest story in a Pokemon game is the old man in XY who lives alone and is grieving his dead wife, and asks you to let him borrow a Pokemon to keep him company.

Spoiler

If you visit him again (edit: after beating the Pokemon League), the old man is gone. Instead you'll find your Pokemon on the ground in a Poke Ball, and there's a letter attached from the old man thanking you for your kindness and making his last days meaningful. The Pokemon you left with him will have max affection regardless of where it was at prior to leaving it.

 

[Lkr]

eh I think looking at RSE and climate control, it's a bit more evil

 

[L Thammy]

Most sharks don't lose their tails naturally so they feel no pain from this, and are actually, you know, dead. The Slowpoke thing gives too many reassurances the Pokemon are fine in the end for the metaphor to have any applicability.

Click to shrink...

Illegal shark finning leaves the shark alive. They die from being unable to swim properly after, which they need to breathe.