• Light/Dark

The BBC has released every episode of Doctor Who (barring lost ones) on BBC iPlayer (Minus An Unearthly Child and The Abominable Snowmen)

TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
Lihwem

Lihwem

Member
Mar 17, 2020
709
As someone who doesn't follow Dr Who at all, how come some episodes are "lost"? I'm curious
 
OP
OP
TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
Lihwem said:
As someone who doesn't follow Dr Who at all, how come some episodes are "lost"? I'm curious
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
A lot of 50s/60s UK TV episodes were destoryed in order to save space. While some episodes have survived, others have not or are in collections from pepole not wanting to give them to the BBC
 
BLEEN

BLEEN

Member
Oct 27, 2017
22,099
Lihwem said:
As someone who doesn't follow Dr Who at all, how come some episodes are "lost"? I'm curious
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Reruns and stuff didn't exist at the time so the BBC didn't see the need to save the tapes (they would just overwrite them) lol

This has happened with much media from the time.

At least that's how I've read it.
 
OP
OP
TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
BLEEN said:
Reruns and stuff didn't exist at the time so the BBC didn't see the need to save the tapes (they would just overwrite them) lol

This has happened with much media from the time.

At least that's how I've read it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Pretty much,i do worry that only having a few parts of certain episodes may confuse newcomers though
 
OP
OP
TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
Lemony1984 said:
It's don't think it's every episode. I believe the first four episodes of the first doctor aren't included because of a rights issue. There might be more. Not sure.

Doctor Who's first story won't be included in BBC iPlayer back catalogue | Radio Times

Doctor Who's first story, An Unearthly Child, won't be included in BBC iPlayer's classic series back catalogue to celebrate the 60th anniversary.
www.radiotimes.com
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
that's the only one that isn't there barring lost ones and the recent animated one
 

bid0

Member
Mar 22, 2022
84
Lihwem said:
As someone who doesn't follow Dr Who at all, how come some episodes are "lost"? I'm curious
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It came from a time where actors acted on stage and TV was in its infancy. There was a worry then that acting in a TV episode would mean your work could be repeated endlessly forever (imagine an actor performing night 1 on Broadway and never being hired for the part again). These episodes literally aired a single time back in the day and were left to people to talk and retell.

As well as that, the tapes that they recorded on were expensive (especially so for an entity like the BBC who didn't have large budgets) so the tapes would be reused again and again to record new material. There was no home media back then either so there was no need to preserve them.

The episodes we have now are a miracle as they exist usually from overseas where the BBC sold the show to other countries and those tapes were either lost (and then later found) or someone forgot to destroy them.

In the case of the newer animated versions, they come from fans who would have recorded the episodes live back in the day on audio (no VHS then!) and the BBC has funded animated recreations of those certain episodes.

There are many videos on YouTube of the stories of found tapes and the state of TV at that time. Some tapes have been found in the strangest places (usually thanks to staff keeping tapes and taking them home and misplacing them and such.
 
Lihwem

Lihwem

Member
Mar 17, 2020
709
Very interesting stuff about those missing episodes and the state of TV from that time. Thanks all.
 
Wrexis

Wrexis

Member
Nov 4, 2017
22,141
The same issue applied to the moon landings by the way. There was a higher res version.

en.wikipedia.org

Apollo 11 missing tapes - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

As the real-time broadcast worked and was widely recorded, preservation of the backup video was not deemed a priority in the years immediately following the mission.[1] In the early 1980s, NASA's Landsat program was facing a severe data tape shortage and it is likely the tapes were erased and reused at this time.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Lee Morris

Lee Morris

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,724
are any of the series that have been released on blu ray been uploaded in HD to the iPlayer?
 
hsojlightfoot

hsojlightfoot

AVALANCHE
Member
Apr 6, 2020
4,561
Not sure I'd like the B&W episodes but I do love, love the newer series. I'm on season 7 now. Not sure who my fav Doctor is so far is it Tennant or Smith? Wish we could keep these guys forever.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
I can't check currently, but are the Confidentials the original full-length versions? And do they have the music intact too? Those felt challenging in rights terms as well.
 
Dwebble

Dwebble

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,720
mclem said:
Okay, I said I couldn't check, but it's my lunch break, so... both the I'll Stand By You and Run montages are intact in 1.13, which happen to be the ones that really stuck in my mind.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
There's a lot about the Whoniverse roll-out that's remarkable, but getting the original Confidentials up is one of the most surprising things they've managed - I honestly thought they'd never see the light of day again.
 
Axe

Axe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,885
United Kingdom
I'm intrigued by people recreating episodes. Are there still scripts from that time, or are people reciting them from memory?
 

B.K.

Member
Oct 31, 2017
17,343
Lihwem said:
Very interesting stuff about those missing episodes and the state of TV from that time. Thanks all.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If you fall into the lost media rabbit hole, you'll find that there is almost as much media lost as there is preserved. The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson is another good example. Almost the entire fist decade of Carson's run on the show is forever lost due to tape wiping.

Almost 80% of all movies from the silent picture era no longer exist.
 
Dead Man Typing

Dead Man Typing

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,239
Obligatory:

lny9Emdv2pG1uyku7EpX5aK8Gm0=.gif


I'm a modern Dr Who fan but my exposure to the old stuff is limited. Hopefully they remain on the iPlayer for a while, it's going to take me a lot of time to work my way through these.
 
Mugenhunt

Mugenhunt

Member
Oct 17, 2019
494
Axe said:
I'm intrigued by people recreating episodes. Are there still scripts from that time, or are people reciting them from memory?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Many fans recorded the episodes on audio when they were first released. Home video recording wasn't a thing yet, but there were enough dedicated fans who had audio recording equipment that we have the audio for pretty much every episode.

That, combined with any behind the scenes photos still remaining, are used by animation studios to make recreations of lost episodes.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
B.K. said:
If you fall into the lost media rabbit hole, you'll find that there is almost as much media lost as there is preserved. The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson is another good example. Almost the entire fist decade of Carson's run on the show is forever lost due to tape wiping.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm quite fond of I Love Lucy, and one of the delightful things about it is that, somewhat unusually for the time, it's incredibly well-preserved.

I don't know of anything contemporary to it that's *so* intact.
 
red mage

red mage

Alt-Account
Banned
Aug 17, 2023
2,300
So my understanding is that "An Unearthly Child" is the first episode of old Who, but what's special about the rights of "The Abominable Snowmen" that makes that one unavailable too?
 
Lee Morris

Lee Morris

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,724
Axe said:
I'm intrigued by people recreating episodes. Are there still scripts from that time, or are people reciting them from memory?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
we have the audio of all of the lost episodes. so in theory they could all be animated. there are production stills for each one, so the production design could be reproduced.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
red mage said:
So my understanding is that "An Unearthly Child" is the first episode of old Who, but what's special about the rights of "The Abominable Snowmen" that makes that one unavailable too?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It might just be that that's an animated reconstruction (only one original episode exists) that came out quite recently (last year)?
The Underwater Menace also has an upcoming animated reconstruction, so presumably we won't get that for a while at least.
 
SPRidley

SPRidley

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,336
The Unearthly Child stuff that has been happening is a travesty, fuck the piece of shit guy for his views and why he is not giving the rights to an historical piece of tv.

Also, this would be great but international audiences are again fucked and only can enjoy what the UK is enjoying by other means.
Just put all this on disney plus also ffs
 
OP
OP
TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
SPRidley said:
The Unearthly Child stuff that has been happening is a travesty, fuck the piece of shit guy for his views and why he is not giving the rights to an historical piece of tv.

Also, this would be great but international audiences are again fucked and only can enjoy what the UK is enjoying by other means.
Just put all this on disney plus also ffs
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Its probalby a rights issue, it might come to Disney+ eventually
 
Uzzy

Uzzy

Gabe’s little helper
Member
Oct 25, 2017
28,888
Hull, UK
B.K. said:
If you fall into the lost media rabbit hole, you'll find that there is almost as much media lost as there is preserved. The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson is another good example. Almost the entire fist decade of Carson's run on the show is forever lost due to tape wiping.

Almost 80% of all movies from the silent picture era no longer exist.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It's crazy to think how much has been lost, and how saddening too. So many things that we know are important gone, but so many other creative works gone that we'll never know about.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
Uzzy said:
It's crazy to think how much has been lost, and how saddening too. So many things that we know are important gone, but so many other creative works gone that we'll never know about.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

The British Film Institute has an annual "Missing Believed Wipe" show where they screen newly-rediscovered media; it's where the most recent Who findings were first displayed a few years ago. I like to keep an eye on it as a quick summary of interesting stuff found from the last year, although I do wish there were ways to actually see it that don't require getting to London!

Buy cinema tickets for Missing Believed Wiped 2023 | BFI Southbank

whatson.bfi.org.uk whatson.bfi.org.uk
 
SPRidley

SPRidley

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,336
TheGamingNewsGuy said:
Its probalby a rights issue, it might come to Disney+ eventually
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Oh i know, its still awful.
Rights being a mess internationally is terrible. Like for example, all the new series is dubbed in Spain, except Jodie, and disney plus is gonna jump directly to the tennant specials dubbed, just becuase it was not doing enough ratings in the UK to bring it aboard in a lot of countries (and we even got the 50th anniversary and the capaldi episodes released in theaters here, so its like the show completely dissapeared for a lot of international markets), so the rights of that era are now in limbo.
Its impossible in my country to watch the jodie series in any legal way.
ANd whith how many rights need to be reversed in different countries, im not so sure if we are gonna get something similar in disney plus in the future.
 
red mage

red mage

Alt-Account
Banned
Aug 17, 2023
2,300
It's ironic that those episodes survived thanks to international copies but the international audience can't watch them lol
 
Blader

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,790
Re: missing episodes, there are reportedly at least 3 that are known to be in the hands of collectors, but the BBC will not pay any more than a standard rate for them (I guess to not create a precedent where collectors can charge whatever they want) and the collectors aren't interested in giving them up anyway. Which is a bummer, because in that case, they may as well not exist at all! Hopefully someone changes their mind one day.

IIRC at least one of them is believed to be a Hartnell ep, but I don't think we know what. There are also good odds that one of these is the missing Web of Fear episode, that was found with the rest of the serial but then 'disappeared' in between the initial discovery and being returned to the BBC.

mclem said:
I can't check currently, but are the Confidentials the original full-length versions? And do they have the music intact too? Those felt challenging in rights terms as well.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
CD_93 said:
I understand the answer to be yes to both.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Oh I had read that the Confidentials up on iPlayer were the cut-down versions. That'd be a shame, if true. Speaking of lost media, those original Confidentials are just completely inaccessible otherwise.
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
Blader said:
Oh I had read that the Confidentials up on iPlayer were the cut-down versions. That'd be a shame, if true. Speaking of lost media, those original Confidentials are just completely inaccessible otherwise.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

You might have missed my second post, but I can absolutely confirm that it's the full Confidential, at least for the one I checked.

X78nRz4.png

HMtGZoF.png


I'm so tempted to watch Do You Remember The First Time? (The one that accompanied Blink, but it's largely just David Tennant running around TVC and talking about childhood memories of Doctor Who) again, I loved that episode.

Edit: I *have* just noticed that the Confidentials are down as 'Available for 11 months', whereas stuff I'd expect the BBC to have available in perpetuity is down as "Available for over a year", so it may only be a temporary rights negotiation.
 
Blader

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,790
CD_93 said:
They're the originals (30 minute ones for Series 1 & 2 - 45 minute ones beyond) :)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Oh nice! I must have gotten on the Confidential train later than S2 then, because I remembered them being as long as the actual Who episodes.

What a great little show that was, glad that RTD is bringing it back. My favorite was the Confidential done for Blink, which had little to say about that actual episode funny enough, and was more about Tennant, RTD, and I think Moffat reflecting on their own childhood memories of Doctor Who. Which I think Tennant is actually doing again this year in a new anniversary doc.

edit:
mclem said:
I'm so tempted to watch Do You Remember The First Time? (The one that accompanied Blink, but it's largely just David Tennant running around TVC and talking about childhood memories of Doctor Who) again, I loved that episode.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
ah, you beat me to it!
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,679
Since it hasn't been said here, it's worth mentioning that there *should* be another component to this coming at some point:

www.bbc.co.uk

BBC Sounds - Doctor Who: The Missing Episodes

Listen to three of Doctor Who’s earliest adventures lost from the BBC archives.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

As was mentioned before, audio still exists for all missing episodes, and in the past that audio has been cobbled together with narration from an actor from that era.

tardis.fandom.com

Doctor Who TV soundtrack releases

Since 1999, BBC Audio — and, after taking it over, AudioGO — have released multiple missing Doctor Who stories on CD as TV soundtracks. They used linking narration from a member of the original cast to provide information in the scenes with no dialogue. Since then, all of the missing or...
tardis.fandom.com tardis.fandom.com

It wouldn't surprise me if we'll be getting a few of those.
 
Lee Morris

Lee Morris

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,724
SPRidley said:
The Unearthly Child stuff that has been happening is a travesty, fuck the piece of shit guy for his views and why he is not giving the rights to an historical piece of tv.

Also, this would be great but international audiences are again fucked and only can enjoy what the UK is enjoying by other means.
Just put all this on disney plus also ffs
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
British Licence Fee payers are getting access to it cause we essentially funded the episodes, to be fair, people outside the UK didn't and so it's up to a company to stump up the cash to make it available to people outside the UK
 
OP
OP
TheGamingNewsGuy

TheGamingNewsGuy

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 5, 2017
31,959
mclem said:
Since it hasn't been said here, it's worth mentioning that there *should* be another component to this coming at some point:

www.bbc.co.uk

BBC Sounds - Doctor Who: The Missing Episodes

Listen to three of Doctor Who’s earliest adventures lost from the BBC archives.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

As was mentioned before, audio still exists for all missing episodes, and in the past that audio has been cobbled together with narration from an actor from that era.

tardis.fandom.com

Doctor Who TV soundtrack releases

Since 1999, BBC Audio — and, after taking it over, AudioGO — have released multiple missing Doctor Who stories on CD as TV soundtracks. They used linking narration from a member of the original cast to provide information in the scenes with no dialogue. Since then, all of the missing or...
tardis.fandom.com tardis.fandom.com

It wouldn't surprise me if we'll be getting a few of those.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah I feel like we might be getting audio Marco Polo
 
You must log in or register to reply here.