Synohan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,100
jpg


Around the beginning of this year, I finally got around to playing the Danganronpa series. What I first mistakenly confused for a regular run of the mill Visual Novel waifubait, turned out to be an incredible and memorable series full of surprises and headache inducing twists. I loved every minute of it, I even went as far as reading the DR0 translation. A few months after finishing V3, I had that itch for an experience as close to Danganronpa as possible. A bit later, the same people who recommended Danganronpa, recommended Zero Escape, and here I am.

I was a bit skeptical at first, wasn't sure what to expect with the focus on solving puzzles and the requirement of doing a few playthroughs in order to get to the true ending. I was pleasantly surprised with how it was handled. Different routes give you different groups of characters to learn about and connect to. In one route I learn about the game changer that is Snake's prosthetic arm, and in another route I learn about Lotus' children and a more in depth look at Seven's memories. I enjoyed the idea of being slowly fed information in different groups. The build up to the Ace reveal was a highlight. Once I saw the picture of Ace and his other associates, everything quickly came together. The identity of 9, Ace, Cap, and Not Snake all at once.

Regarding the ending, I was confused as events unfolded, but the entire story clicked once the game shifted to June/Akane's perspective. The safe ending really helped narrow down the 'true' purpose of this Nonary Game. I also loved the small details in regards to the correlation with the first Nonary game. The test subjects in Building Q in Nevada had to transfer the answer to those on the Gigantic. In Junpei's case, he transferred the message in Building Q back to Akane in the past who was on the Gigantic at the time.

Now for hasn't been solved yet. Junepei mentions Seven having a satisfied look on his face. Is it possible that Seven was in on it as well? There's also the case with who we saw at the end. It was Allice trying to hitchhike in the middle of the Nevada Desert. Does she actually exist then? Ace said that the Coffin was empty when he examined it. He only found a single fruit that supposedly helped him in some sort of experiment. Yet here she is standing in the middle of the Desert.

I hope some of my questions are answered as I continue to move forward.
Onto VLR.

maxresdefault.jpg

I couldn't help but laugh when this showed up. It's just hilarious for no explainable reason
 

Namyu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,562
999/VLR are both amazing games, I'm seriously tempted to replay them with the Nonary Games compilation

Anybody here who's played it that way and can recommend which mode of the 2 is best to use/if I should even bother with that release?
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.
 

Rika

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,610
USA
A friend has been trying to get me into the series, but I do not feel like playing the DS original and would rather play the Nonary Games compilation. I do not want to buy a copy of 999 for the DS when there's a compilation out.
 

Strings

Member
Oct 27, 2017
32,103
Yay, now you get to experience VLR :D Alice will be expanded on, but maybe not in a way you'll want. Otherwise, that game is fucking phenomenal.

ZTD is fun too, but not nearly on the same level. Lots of Uchikoshi goodness with the Infinity series too.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
A friend has been trying to get me into the series, but I do not feel like playing the DS original and would rather play the Nonary Games compilation. I do not want to buy a copy of 999 for the DS when there's a compilation out.

999 on the ds/3ds is completely worth it and it was made for the system, much like undertale is made for the pc.

vlr is not that awesome.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,857
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.
I was warned to not play ZTD by friends as it wouldn't answer the questions I wanted. So, I went in with lowered expectations and I legitimately feel like I wasted 20 hours of my time.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
The original DS version has a different scenario?

the game was made for the ds.

the top screen is what junpei sees and the bottom screen is akane's narration of what she is seeing through the morphogenetic field. puzzles are done on the bottom screen because puzzles used the touch screen. during the sudoku puzzle, the game reveals that akane has been there the entire time by turning the images upside-down, so that akane is receiving the information future/current-junpei is sending. the only way the information is relayed is by forcing the player to physically turn their ds upside-down so that the touch screen is now on the top.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
I was warned to not play ZTD by friends as it wouldn't answer the questions I wanted. So, I went in with lowered expectations and I legitimately feel like I wasted 20 hours of my time.

honestly the way it wastes vlr makes vlr not worth playing. i still have a hard time believing that uchikoshi just kind of gave up on ztd the way that he did, after fans raised such a stink about it that it revived the series.
 
OP
OP
Synohan

Synohan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,100
the top screen is what junpei sees and the bottom screen is akane's narration of what she is seeing through the morphogenetic field. puzzles are done on the bottom screen because puzzles used the touch screen. during the sudoku puzzle, the game reveals that akane has been there the entire time by turning the images upside-down, so that akane is receiving the information future/current-junpei is sending. the only way the information is relayed is by forcing the player to physically turn their ds upside-down so that the touch screen is now on the top.

Wow, that's actually really clever. There's no way they'd be able to recreate that sort of reveal on the PC version.
 

SMD

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,341
VLR absolutely is still worth playing after 999 but you should just treat ZTD as a different thing.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,895
I really enjoyed 999 when I finished it, but looking back on it makes me realize that the whole visual novel structure doesn't really do it for me.
 

deepFlaw

Knights of Favonius World Tour '21
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,623
ZTD is just flat out bad and it's so disappointing.

I loved VLR, so I'd never say not to play it, but... just know that ZTD is not the third game that VLR kinda needs. Rather, it puts a lot of effort into setting up a third game that does not exist because ZTD is not that game, so try to appreciate VLR on its own terms and then play ZTD to see the conclusion that does exist.

unless Uchikoshi's bizarre claims come true and we see something in a decade...
 

Zacmortar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,383
Virtues Last Reward is the best anime game ive ever played

999 close second, and ZTD is still really great

Semi recently also had a lttp for The Nonary games and god DAMN was that adventure such a fuckin ride
 

milkyway

One Winged Slayer
Member
May 17, 2018
3,043
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.
I've got to agree that 999 was an extremely well crafted game, and has more to love about it than VLR, which is also a very good game. The former is more of a thriller, an aspect that worked very well for it, while the latter has a more intricate/complicated plot. Unfortunately the final game is indeed a let down but probably still worth playing. It just sucks that it almost makes the whole plot of VLR pointless.
 

Yasumi

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,607
honestly the way it wastes vlr makes vlr not worth playing. i still have a hard time believing that uchikoshi just kind of gave up on ztd the way that he did, after fans raised such a stink about it that it revived the series.
Honestly, yeah. VLR set up such a solid premise, then ZTD shat the bed beyond my lowest possible expectations. I've never been so disappointed in a piece of fiction in my life. It's so bad. 999's stand-alone in my mind.
 

Sandfox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,743
honestly the way it wastes vlr makes vlr not worth playing. i still have a hard time believing that uchikoshi just kind of gave up on ztd the way that he did, after fans raised such a stink about it that it revived the series.
Uchikoshi said in an interview that it was all intentional and he didn't understand the complaints from fans.
 

FiXalaS

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,569
Kuwait.
If you're playing the series for the first time, you will enjoy ZTD way more than those who waited 4 years for it.
 

Arthands

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,039
Please tell us you played 999 on the DS, thats the best and definitive way to enjoy that game especially the twist at the end
 

Rayman not Ray

Self-requested ban
Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,486
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.

I have to agree. I mostly enjoyed VLR, but then it just slipped right out of my mind as soon as I finished it. This is in stark constrast to 999, where certain moments are burned into my brain.

I never even finished ZTD. And I kind of don't care? I've avoided spoilers out of inertia at this point.
 

applejuice

Member
Oct 27, 2017
416
Tampa, FL
I liked ZTD well enough, even though its not as good as the others. I'd say just play it to play it. It doesn't ruin the rest of the games for me... also my icon is ZTD.
 

Rika

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,610
USA
999 on the ds/3ds is completely worth it and it was made for the system, much like undertale is made for the pc.

vlr is not that awesome.
I legit cannot play undertale or even stardew on consoles, so will for sure consider getting it for just the other two games if anything.
 

Narroo

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,819
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.
It took me less that 60 seconds to realize I had made a terrible mistake paying $40 for it.
 

NotLiquid

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,251
Virtue's Last Reward would've been the best game in the series if it weren't for it's let down of an ending. I still kind of think it is.

ZTD is okay. It has the best puzzles at the very least.
 

ZeroX

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,266
Speed Force
I played VLR and ZTD back to back, and I didn't find ZTD that disappointing at all. But I also thought VLR was a huge step down from 999 and was aware ZTD wouldn't answer every question.
 

wrowa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,436
VLR suffers from pacing problems and an ending that is dependent on a third game, but said third game completely fails to deliver on anything VLR set up.

I kinda wish 999 would have stayed on its own, to be honest. It had good pacing, wasn't too short, had a great atmosphere and an interesting story with a great pay off. None of its sequels were quite able to reproduce that.
 

Narroo

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,819
i kept thinking 'maybe it'll get better. maybe it'll get better!' but instead it just kept getting worse and worse.
I originally bought it on steam. But there was some strange glitch on certain graphics cards that causes a black screen when you select a new game. I figured wouldn't get fixed anytime soon, if ever; I always have bizarre issues like this with PC games.

So, I said "Screw it. I'm going to gamestop. I never have issues like this with consoles!" And so I refunded the game and went to gamestop.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,857
i kept thinking 'maybe it'll get better. maybe it'll get better!' but instead it just kept getting worse and worse.
i thought it had a surprisingly good midgame when
everything started to come together and they somewhat abandoned the non-linear style as C team started shifting all over the place
they blew it immediately afterwards though
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
i thought it had a surprisingly good midgame when
everything started to come together and they somewhat abandoned the non-linear style as C team started shifting all over the place
they blew it immediately afterwards though

they were losing me hard with the shit pacing and crappy direction, but yeah - when i realized what was going on with the shifting i thought it was picking up.

and then... alien tech! and some weirdo we haven't seen... was us!

oh no. no no no.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,857
they were losing me hard with the shit pacing and crappy direction, but yeah - when i realized what was going on with the shifting i thought it was picking up.

and then... alien tech! and some weirdo we haven't seen... was us!

oh no. no no no.
yeah, they completely blew all the potential they had right there. it's also really annoying how (end game spoilers)
Akane makes a big deal about how they shouldn't shift, as they're putting innocent versions of themselves in danger but Carlos had already shifted dozens of times at that point.

also MINDHACKING
 
Oct 27, 2017
20,897
Ive been on a ds and 3ds kick lately and always wanted to play 999. Finishing up ace attorney 2 right now so after that I'm thinking of finding a 999 copy
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,062
I played 999 on the DS at the same time as I played Bioshock Infinite (ie launch).

So for me, both games are very similar just by virtue (heh) of that fact.

As time (heh again) passed, whenever I see either mentioned I can't not compare the two storylines.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,410
yeah, they completely blew all the potential they had right there. it's also really annoying how (end game spoilers)
Akane makes a big deal about how they shouldn't shift, as they're putting innocent versions of themselves in danger but Carlos had already shifted dozens of times at that point.

also MINDHACKING

the ideal story for me was going to be
a real long way around to making the events of 999 never happening in the first place, and letting akane and junpei grow up as normal kids

it wouldn't even need to be a happy ending! there could be some bittersweet stuff about the 999/vlr/ztd versions of junpei and akane disappearing from existence in order for other versions of themselves being able to live normal lives. but damn what we got was so tragically dumb.
 

RionaaM

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,852
Glad to hear you liked it, I think it's a fantastic game. There are a few flaws, the biggest one being that the DS version pretty much requires checking a flowchart or guide on the internet to get the true ending (you need to take a very specific set of steps), but I love it anyway. I also loved VLR, and it's as mindblowing as the first game, if not more.

I liked ZTD, I went in with low expectations and enjoyed it more than I expected. Some reveals are good, but others are silly and make some stuff pointless or needlessly complicated. I didn't like the puzzles much, some of them were repeated way too often and they weren't that good in the first place.

ZTD is just flat out bad and it's so disappointing.

I loved VLR, so I'd never say not to play it, but... just know that ZTD is not the third game that VLR kinda needs. Rather, it puts a lot of effort into setting up a third game that does not exist because ZTD is not that game, so try to appreciate VLR on its own terms and then play ZTD to see the conclusion that does exist.

unless Uchikoshi's bizarre claims come true and we see something in a decade...
To be fair, the ending of VLR is so crazy that it's pretty much impossible to follow it up adequately. It also retconned some stuff from the first game, making everything even more convoluted. Because of all this, ZTD must have been a nightmare to design.

yeah, they completely blew all the potential they had right there. it's also really annoying how (end game spoilers)
Akane makes a big deal about how they shouldn't shift, as they're putting innocent versions of themselves in danger but Carlos had already shifted dozens of times at that point.

also MINDHACKING
Speaking of teams, the entirety of Q team's story was uninteresting to me, and I didn't care for any of those characters. That means almost 1/3 of the game was forgettable. Luckily C team was much better, and D team was great.
 
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semiconscious

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,140
now spoil yourself on how the ds original handled the twist because it's the best actual thing.

also this is a series of diminishing returns. some people like vlr due to quality of life improvements, but i think it lacks the spark that makes 999 so interesting, warts and all. zero time dilemma is one of the most disappointing games i've ever played.

yep. & the same's true for danganronpa, imo :) ...
 

Rayman not Ray

Self-requested ban
Banned
Feb 27, 2018
1,486
yep. & the same's true for danganronpa, imo :) ...
I'm so glad Ghost Trick never got a sequel.

And that actually makes me realize that narratively driven video games are almost always better when they aren't part of an ongoing series. Takemi was losing steam on Phoenix Wright, so he went and made Ghost Trick and knocked it out of the park. When he came back to do Professor Layton vs. Phoenix Wright it was... fine.

It made me realize that I'd always rather have a director try something new, rather than deal with the baggage of a series, with its escalating stakes.
 

Dremorak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,932
New Zealand
I still havent played VTD because the hype around it absolutely hit a wall once people started playing it. Is there anyone that actually liked it?
 

ohlawd

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,307
Phantagrande
Ive been on a ds and 3ds kick lately and always wanted to play 999. Finishing up ace attorney 2 right now so after that I'm thinking of finding a 999 copy
I think you are the only person I know in recent memory who is willing to play the best version of 999 which is on DS. you should sleep soundly tonight :D

excuses like muh HD and I want to play them through the collection on single screen systems are just lame, man
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,857
I think you are the only person I know in recent memory who is willing to play the best version of 999 which is on DS. you should sleep soundly tonight :D

excuses like muh HD and I want to play them through the collection on single screen systems are just lame, man
The HD voice acting is great though. In a perfect world we would have gotten a 3DS port of Nonary Games and that would be the best version. I do agree that the impact of the ending is somewhat lost on the HD versions.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,895
I think you are the only person I know in recent memory who is willing to play the best version of 999 which is on DS. you should sleep soundly tonight :D

excuses like muh HD and I want to play them through the collection on single screen systems are just lame, man
The DS version has a lot of its own annoyances too. Somewhere out there is an actual definitive version waiting to be made, and it would probably have to be a romhack that speeds up the text and doesn't make you replay the escape rooms.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,143
999 is a fantastic game. My only real criticism is that the puzzles are too easy. Each room only has like two actual puzzles, and I blew through most of them without much thought.

Specifically in non-DS editions, I don't know if the flow chart really helped the game. I realized a lot of the story felt a lot more mysterious when you didn't have a solid sense of where the paths were leading to and what exactly you had to choose to get to the new ones. It would've been untenable for VLR, but for 999 I think I would consider the flow chart a negative.