[iFixit] Here’s Why Controller Joysticks Drift (and Why They’ll Only Get Worse)

[SinCityAssassin]

Here’s Why PS5 Joysticks Drift (and Why They’ll Only Get Worse) | iFixit News

Why are the PS5’s joysticks drifting? They use the same fallible hardware as most game controllers. Here’s what’s happening inside, and how we could fix it.

www.ifixit.com

A tech breakdown on what's causing some DualSense controllers to drift so quickly. More details in the article and video breakdown, but tl;dr one of the reasons is using cheaper off-the-shelf joystick modules can scratch the surface of the stick's potentiometers to alter how it reads. Spring Fatigue, contamination, and material stretching are also touched on.

"The real fix is better choices by console makers"

Mere months have passed since the PS5's hotly anticipated launch, and already there's a class-action lawsuit brewing over joystick drift on Sony's high-tech DualSense controllers. Who could have seen this coming? Well, as it turns out, everyone. Everyone should have seen this coming. Because for all its exciting new tech, the DualSense uses off-the-shelf joystick hardware with a long history of predictable, preventable issues. And now we've investigated those issues in excruciating detail.

[...]

Sony isn't the only company to use off-the-shelf joystick modules, but, like Microsoft, they've made it difficult to repair this consumable component. Joysticks have a known life expectancy—it's listed right in a product sheet from the manufacturer. It's predictable they would fail, which makes you wonder if it's a willful cost-saving calculation on the console makers' part to not offer more reliable, or replaceable, sticks.

Click to shrink...

The joystick modules themselves are manufactured by Alps—a name familiar to anyone who has fallen down a deep keyboard hole, or struggled with a trackpad driver. The Japanese company (formerly Alps Electric, now Alps Alpine) specializes in input and sensing devices.

Tempting as it may be to blame Alps for the PS5's drifting issues, they probably aren't the villain of this story—because, brand name notwithstanding, this joystick module looks extremely familiar. You may already recognize it from the prior-gen PlayStation's controller, the DualShock 4. Or from the Xbox One controllers. Maybe the Nintendo Switch Pro controller. Or, somewhat confusingly, the $180 Xbox One Elite controller. Underneath that plastic cap, the dirty secret is that they all use the same joystick hardware.

Click to shrink...

The first potential cause of drift is the hardest to avoid: wear to the potentiometers. Over time, the wiper scrubbing back and forth against the resistive pad creates imperfections, altering the voltage readings across the terminals—think of a skipping record or scratched CD. It's worth noting that, while the Switch's infamously drifty Joy-Con sticks look quite different internally, with wipers moving across flat pads instead of circular tracks, they can fail in exactly the same way: wear to the pads, resulting in incorrect readings.

Click to shrink...

If you're experiencing drift on your controller, you have three real options: Fix it (either yourself or through an experienced tech), send the controller back to the manufacturer and wait for a fix (if it's warrantied/covered), or buy a new one. It's bizarre to us that the console makers, who spend countless thousands of hours obsessing over their controller designs, don't just concede that joysticks are consumable parts, and design them as such to be more easily replaced.

No device, rated for 2,000,000 cycles, especially a vessel of frustration or obsession, can maintain perfect performance forever. They should be designed with that reality in mind. Nintendo, for all its extended silence on Joy-Con drift failures, at least chose an easily replaceable joystick secured by Phillips screws and a flexible cable, not 16 solder joints. And even if a joystick needs the stability of solder beneath it, it's possible to design a "breakout board," such as we often see on phones and other portable devices. A smaller circuit board would hold the joystick and its necessary wires and chips, then connect to the main board with a detachable cable.

Click to shrink...

In the end, then, the real culprits of drift are humans, and profits. These controllers are cheaper to produce up-front, but more expensive to fix when they fail. Perhaps gaming companies can't reconcile the obvious truth that joysticks fail with the image of their technology as immaculate, bleeding-edge, a completely seamless entertainment experience. But we think most people would prefer to be a bit more realistic about something as unglamorous as a thumbstick. It beats mailing out a controller, or buying another $70 controller to replace an 88-cent part.

Click to shrink...

 

[CarpetSalesman]

"But we think most people would prefer to be a bit more realistic about something as unglamorous as a thumbstick. It beats mailing out a controller, or buying another $70 controller to replace an 88-cent part."

Surely it's more like "the controller sells for $50, costs $10 to make, distribute. If we let them repair it themselves, we lose $40 when they don't buy another."

 

[KTroopA]

Damn this looks like a serious PITA to fix!

WTF sony

 

[The Hiveking]

Why is this a bigger problem that the DualShock?

 

[Rurunaki]

Controller drift is just hard mode unlocked

 

[BackwardsSuggestions]

Do all current controllers use the same sticks? Feel I hear about JoyCon and DualSense drift more than Xbox and even pro-controller drift.

 

[BoobooGanger]

Shame on Sony for selling their pad like that.

 

[behOemoth]

Do all current controllers use the same sticks? Feel I hear about JoyCon and DualSense drift more than Xbox and even pro-controller drift.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, they pretty much say it's a problem for all main controllers out there.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Article also touches on how older joystick sensor tech from the Dreamcast and N64 were more reliable in continuing to work, which is eye-opening to me.

 

[Deleted member 23046]

Do all current controllers use the same sticks? Feel I hear about JoyCon and DualSense drift more than Xbox and even pro-controller drift.

Click to shrink...

The current class-action focus on warranty and service. For now no one has provided equivalent retails numbers or surveys we have about the JoyCon, were the design is in fault and not only a weak part.

My guess is that consumers associations are on it, but it takes time to harvest enough case to expose what could be a higher failure rate than what is considered like normal wear. In this case an exchange could be extended longer than the current warranty.

 

[Centzontotochtin]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little one of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

 

[DaCocoBrova]

I really wanted one for PC, but not now. I will wait for a revision.

 

[The_Inquisitor]

Sorry this is a bit of FUD. 1) The industry standard for defects for commercial products is 200 dppm or 200 defective parts for million. The only industry where they strive for 0 dppm is medical/hi-rel/auto 2) Datasheets are heavily guard banded. That is to say the parts are actually much better than the sheet says. Electronic semiconductors for example are rated for 10% max load duty cycled for 10 years. But a lot of stuff obviously lasts longer.

What I suspect is that Sony did a lot of lifetime testing and found that the part lasts for what the consider is an acceptable lifetime. Pointing to a data sheet alone is not enough.

 

[Nanashrew]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

They actually mention those methods in the article and how that's only temp fix. If you're experiencing drift from dust, dirt, grime or plastic from the joystick, all canned air and contact cleaner only pushes that stuff around in the box.

 

[Doskoi Panda]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

Just like with Joy-Con, that's really only a temporary fix in most caes. Could keep your sticks from drifting for a month, or a week, or a few hours... but the drift
almost certainly will crop up again, and you'll either have to reapply the contact cleaner (with increasing frequency), or replace the sticks/controllers.

 

[Cheesetriangles]

Article also touches on how older joystick sensor tech from the Dreamcast and N64 were more reliable in continuing to work, which is eye-opening to me.

Click to shrink...

Hall Effect sensors are real nice.

 

[Gwyn]

How come after all these years we are stuck with the same shit sticks.
Is there only one company making them?

Especially in elite controllers that cost 150-180$.
Only good news is that MS replaced mine after 1.5 year

 

[AlanMoore]

Yeah I'm not getting this for PC

 

[modiz]

So the reason is "it's still the same sticks as with all controllers"? Kinda clickbait headline if it's just "well it's roughly the same likelihood to drift as every other modern controller"

 

[Raylan]

I just hope this won't become a huge widespread issue like the Joy-Con drift.

 

[Mubrik_]

Why is this a bigger problem that the DualShock?

Click to shrink...

This.

If it's the same as the dualshock 4 then personally I have no reason to be worried.

 

[Kuro]

Yeah I'm not getting this for PC

Click to shrink...

I hope you don't have any other modern controller than because they all use the exact same tech lol

 

[Bansai]

Wasn't that also the reason for joycon drift? Did sony cross their fingers and expect their cheap surface that can easily scratch to somehow work just fine?

All my DS4 controllers had a drift to a various degrees, so this is seriously disappointing.

 

[dark494]

Why is this a bigger problem that the DualShock?

Click to shrink...

Because people are more informed and aware of drift now than they used to be

 

[Doskoi Panda]

How come after all these years we are stuck with the same shit sticks.
Is there only one company making them?

Click to shrink...

At least people are actually making noise about it.

*glares at every pc youtube channel and publication that has never called Logitech/other PC hardware manufacturers out, for producing mice with buttons that are almost guaranteed to fail within a year of purchase*

I will say though that there's no better value in gaming than an extended warranty on a Logitech mouse. A brand new mouse every six to twelve months? Almost makes their unreliability worth it... /S

 

[AlanMoore]

I hope you don't have any other modern controller than because they all use the exact same tech lol

Click to shrink...

I've never had a controller develop drift (don't have a Switch tho). The only problem I ever had with a controller was with the 360's bumpers. My Dualshock 4 and Xbox One S controller work perfectly fine. I saw multiple threads here about how people are experiencing drift with the Dual Sense, so I guess I'll wait for a revised model or something.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Wasn't that also the reason for joycon drift? Did sony cross their fingers and expect their cheap surface that can easily scratch to somehow work just fine?

Click to shrink...

The Joycons themselves use a different joystick module than what's seen in these other controllers, but the result is generally the same.

 

[ZeoVGM]

This started for me about a week ago. I find myself randomly looking to the left when playing Destiny from time to time.

 

[Aprikurt]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little one of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

Can confirm that this is a temp fix if it's the same as with joycons.

 

[dom]

Also take note that the DualSense is also tuned for the smallest deadzone of all controllers. So earlier drift can appear on it than others. I definitely see Sony either implementing a larger deadzone in software and also later revisions b/c of this.

 

[Tennis]

Why is this a bigger problem that the DualShock?

Click to shrink...

All of my four dialshock controllers had this problem big time. Some of them even had slight drift after few weeks of use. No issues with my Dualsense at the moment but it's just a matter of time.

Also take note that the DualSense is also tuned for the smallest deadzone of all controllers. So earlier drift can appear on it than others. I definitely see Sony either implementing a larger deadzone in software and also later revisions b/c of this.

Click to shrink...

Interesting. I thought it's the game makers who decide the stick deadzone for their games. sometimes you can even alter it yourself (rocket league for example)

 

[Cotton McKnight]

Article also touches on how older joystick sensor tech from the Dreamcast and N64 were more reliable in continuing to work, which is eye-opening to me.

Click to shrink...

I would love to know what was the caused the change in reliability: size, manufacturing?

More and more reasons to fire up the soldering irons these days.

 

[Deleted member 16876]

What is fucked about all of this is how pricey the controllers are. Just like the joycon, Sony needs to look into fixing this. Even if in this case it doesn't happen to everyone, they need to find ways to eliminate it.

 

[CheapJi]

I am shocked at how many people claim that this isnt a big deal. DS4 was a nightmare. I had to fix my controllers so many times. 2 of my controllers drift. And ALL my friends have drifting controllers. Literally ALL of them. If im buying a controller it better atleast work for a few years.

 

[dom]

All of my four dialshock controllers had this problem big time. Some of them even had slight drift after few weeks of use. No issues with my Dualsense at the moment but it's just a matter of time.




Interesting. I thought it's the game makers who decide the stick deadzone for their games. sometimes you can even alter it yourself (rocket league for example)

Click to shrink...

there is both

 

[Bansai]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little one of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

It's not a permanent fix though. All of my DS4 controllers are probably 40% made of WD40 by now.

Something being easy to fix is not an excusve if we're talking about hardware that costs more than 5$.

 

[LordRuyn]

I am in the process of replacing a DS4 stick for a friend and it is a bitch to get to, de-solder it, and solder a new one on. The part itself is dirt cheap but it a lot of work to replace it, so I am with ifixit on this.

 

[Soap]

There has been issue with them since the PS4 days and it is not acceptable given the price. People who say they aren't having quality issues shouldn't dismiss them, because any pressure put on manufacturers will make it better for everyone.

 

[Nanashrew]

I would love to know what was the caused the change in reliability: size, manufacturing?

More and more reasons to fire up the soldering irons these days.

Click to shrink...

Form factor, different methods and newer tech, and cheaper prices to manufacture came about that changed a lot in how sticks evolved. N64's joystick housed a bowl inside that the contact of the joystick moved around in and was designed very similarly to a ball mouse with good accurate sensors. The issue with it though is the material, it's plastic rubbing against plastic and after awhile you'll see your joystick sag or the joystick falling in because of it, the sensors though, are still perfectly intact and fine. There are replacement parts like from SteelSticks64 that replace it with a highly polished steel bowl, but it costs a pretty penny.

The Dreamcast used hall effect sensors, a non-contact device. Basically it used magnets and the sensors read the magnetic fields. Really neat tech and those sticks still work very well even now.

 

[wrowa]

So, this also means that drift issues shouldn't happen more frequently on PS5 as they do on PS4, Xbox and Nintendo's Pro controllers?

 

[Ada]

The part in question (RKJXK122400Y) costs around $12 each, so if you have a hot air gun repairing the controller shouldn't be too difficult.

 

[Doskoi Panda]

So, this also means that drift issues shouldn't happen more frequently on PS5 as they do on PS4, Xbox and Nintendo's Pro controllers?

Click to shrink...

Technically, but if PS5/Dualsense is really configured with a tinier deadzone than average, then drift will be more apparent on PS5 than the same amount of drift would be on, say, Switch Pro controller (since Switch software tends to be configured with some pretty gigantic deadzones in my experience)

 

[Garlic]

Article also touches on how older joystick sensor tech from the Dreamcast and N64 were more reliable in continuing to work, which is eye-opening to me.

Click to shrink...

Except for some Mario Party-related damage to some N64 controllers all my classic stick controllers work flawlessly, I believe it

 

[Dash Kappei]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little one of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

 

[sirap]

It's a shame trackballs and trackpads never caught on.

 

[Hyun Sai]

Planned obsolescence at its finest !

 

[boris_feinbrand]

It's easy to fix, takes about 15 mins. You need "WD-40 for contacts" and disassemble a gamepad (not the joystick box), then just bend a little one of the joystick box' sides and clear it with WD. It's not that hard as it sounds.

Click to shrink...

That's as much a fix as it is for the Switch Joycons. A temporary mitigation for a permanent problem.

 

[Cotton McKnight]

Form factor, different methods and newer tech, and cheaper prices to manufacture came about that changed a lot in how sticks evolved. N64's joystick housed a bowl inside that the contact of the joystick moved around in and was designed very similarly to a ball mouse with good accurate sensors. The issue with it though is the material, it's plastic rubbing against plastic and after awhile you'll see your joystick sag or the joystick falling in because of it, the sensors though, are still perfectly intact and fine. There are replacement parts like from SteelSticks64 that replace it with a highly polished steel bowl, but it costs a pretty penny.

The Dreamcast used hall effect sensors, a non-contact device. Basically it used magnets and the sensors read the magnetic fields. Really neat tech and those sticks still work very well even now.

Click to shrink...

Thanks for sharing that! It would be interesting to see what the next generations or iterations of the current console controllers (like revision 1) will do potentially mitigate this problem.

 

[Aniki]

What is fucked about all of this is how pricey the controllers are. Just like the joycon, Sony needs to look into fixing this. Even if in this case it doesn't happen to everyone, they need to find ways to eliminate it.

Click to shrink...

This. If they wouldn't cost so much i could stomach it but at 70€ it's just too much to replace them periodically. I'm just happy there's more focus on this now from everybody after the Joycon fiasco and hope both Sony and Nintemdo get pressured to find a solution. Otherwise i would just buy cheaper third party alternatives.

 

[Puroresu_kid]

Absolute joke. The cost of these pads no way represent the build quality and parts used.

They should be much much better!!!