Who was more insane?

  • Hiroshi Yamauchi (Nintendo)

    Votes: 133 56.6%
  • Ken Kutaragi (Sony)

    Votes: 99 42.1%
  • Neither

    Votes: 11 4.7%

  • Total voters
    235

laziboi

Alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2019
1,918
Your Anus
The late Hiroshi Yamauchi was Nintendo Co. Ltd's Longest standing President. Turning what was once a family-owned toy and card company, into one of the biggest players in the Video Game industry. Yamauchi was also a controversial figure, a brash and shrewd individual, Yamauchi cared about winning at all costs. He wasn't afraid to say exactly what he thought, use dirty tactics to maintain leadership, and terrify hardware and software developers into making the best products possible. While not everything he did was for the better, It's hard to imagine where Nintendo would be without his leadership. But one of Nintendo's contemporaries, also has a similarly shrewd and controversial leader at the helm.

Ken Kutaragi, Co-Founder and Former President of Sony Computer Entertainment, Inc. Also known as "The Father of PlayStation". He originally was a hardware designer at Sony Corporate, and designed the sound system for the Super Nintendo, giving it unrivaled sound quality compared to any other platform at the time. Impressed with his work, Nintendo asked Kutaragi and Sony to help make a CD-based add-on for the SNES to compete with the Sega CD. After Nintendo bailed on that deal due to a contract clause that gave Sony full licensing rights to all games for the add-on, an Infuriated Ken convinced the board at Sony (who weren't on board with the gaming industry to begin with) that the so called "PlayStation" can both be salvaged, AND destroy Nintendo. Sony approved, and brought in Sony Music to start up a new subsidiary solely dedicated to developing and marketing this new system and its games.

Much like Yamauchi, Kutaragi was a shrewd visionary who fought hard for products he believed in. He wasn't afraid say controversial stuff, or terrify his staff to get his vision made. His insanity would be truly shown with the PlayStation 3. A console designed around the Cell Broadband Engine, a complex architecture that he believed would be the future of computing, even outside of games. Unfortunately, this complicated development on the system for game creators, and inflated the system's price to $600, which Ken believed people should get 2 jobs to afford.

Between these two, who did you think was the more insane visionary, based on famous quotes, actions, and rise and fall of their respective brands at the time?
 
Last edited:

eraFROMAN

One Winged Slayer
Member
Mar 12, 2019
3,091
Yamauchi was so crazy that he made Kutaragi go crazy with PlayStation, so I WANT to say Yamauchi, but they're super close
 

Cess007

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,585
B.C., Mexico
Both were crazy geniuses. One was a business kind of genius and the other a hardware/engineer kind.

So, can I get a 'both' option?
 

Zultima

Member
Mar 4, 2020
611
Kuteragi. You have to be insane to think people would spend that kind of money (they still lost money at $600). The ego was real. Yamauchi failed with GameCube by betting on a pure games platform with a good price (that got the kiddy stigma). Not an insane bet, just wrong at the time.
 
Last edited:

Wanace

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,075
XGXWnfA.jpg
vs.
UifcV11.jpg


Whoever wins we all already won.
 

Etain

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,801
Ken Kutaragi didn't buy a baseball team (and save it from ruin no less)
Isn't that pretty common among rich execs and CEOs anyway?

I'm voting Ken Kuteragi. Yamauchi said crazier shit but he was reasonably business smart, while Ken made his odd dream architecture that seemingly wasn't practical for anything consumer level.
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,892
i don't know about kutaragi other than him really really enjoying super convoluted hardware. yamauchi strangely knew what to do in a business sense for a lot of the 80s but he was also a tremendous asshole. doesn't make him crazy though.

kutaragi seemed to have the same kind of tunnelvision that miyamoto had when it came to the games industry. yamauchi probably didn't care as long as it continued making money.
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
Kutaragi (not Kuteragi) might've bet on the PS3 wrong, but there's a reason the PS2 is still the top selling console of all time and the PS1 ushered a very tangible revolution in games. And frankly, seeing how the PS3 managed to produce some very impressive exclusive titles, while also setting the standard for years of what a console should have (Blu-Ray discs, HDMI output, HDD and Wi-Fi), it's clear he was ahead of his time. Let's not forget the 360 required adapters for those things for a long time.

Edit: or did all 360 consoles had ethernet but not Wi-Fi? I'm sure an Xbox 360 Network adapter was a thing at one point.
 
Last edited:

evilmonkey

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,481
Canada
Genyo Takeda singled out and thanked Yamauchi when accepting his DICE lifetime achievement award. I don't think anyone at Sony today even cares Kutaragi exists.
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
Ken wins this. Some of the comments around PS3 release, woof. Imagine someone saying you need two jobs for ps5 today.
 

lupinko

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,154
Isn't that pretty common among rich execs and CEOs anyway?

I'm voting Ken Kuteragi. Yamauchi said crazier shit but he was reasonably business smart, while Ken made his odd dream architecture that seemingly wasn't practical for anything consumer level.

Yamauchi bought the Mariners as a thank you and to help the city of Seattle in keeping the team in Seattle. He didn't really want to buy the team for the sake of buying it. That's what Ballmer did with the Clippers.
 

Lkr

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,755
I'm gonna go with Kutaragi but it's probably biased since it happened more recently. But that arrogant Sony phase from ~04-07 was something else.
 

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
Isn't that pretty common among rich execs and CEOs anyway?

I'm voting Ken Kuteragi. Yamauchi said crazier shit but he was reasonably business smart, while Ken made his odd dream architecture that seemingly wasn't practical for anything consumer level.
Yamauchi buying the Mariners was super unusual. His being a Japanese person was almost a roadblock to buying the Mariners. Yamauchi also had little interest in the team beyond wanting to do something nice for Seattle.
 

Cess007

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,585
B.C., Mexico
Genyo Takeda singled out and thanked Yamauchi when accepting his DICE lifetime achievement award. I don't think anyone at Sony today even cares Kutaragi exists.

I don't think anyone liked Kutaragi very much even back then. I remember an interview in which Shu said that Kutaragi knew that Yoshida didn't liked him, he just enjoyed what he was able to do by working with Ken
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
Early 360 models didn't have built-in Wi-Fi, hence the Wireless Network adapter. The later slim models did have Wi-Fi though.
But they all had ethernet, right? I mean, they were pushing their Gold service for multiplayer, so these consoles had to have some way to connect to the internet without an accessory.
 

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
17,187
I know people call Kutaragi crazy, but I don't really know if that's a fair assessment of him.

He was a visionary who simply became a victim of his own ego. He created what is now Sony's lifeblood and was steadfast in his belief that gaming consoles should not just be limited to gaming. He made a bad bet on Cell (although the rationale behind it and the subsequent investment behind it was fairly sound at the time).

Also, prior to Sony shock of 2003, and Apple supplanting Sony in portable media players and cell phones and Samsung/LG doing the same in TV's, it was reported that Sony felt that they had no real competitors in the consumer electronics space and thus they had to focus on moonshot dreams to continue innovating. With that environment, it's no wonder Ken was the way he was.
 

Etain

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,801
Yamauchi bought the Mariners as a thank you and to help the city of Seattle in keeping the team in Seattle. He didn't really want to buy the team for the sake of buying it. That's what Ballmer did with the Clippers.
Yamauchi buying the Mariners was super unusual. His being a Japanese person was almost a roadblock to buying the Mariners. Yamauchi also had little interest in the team beyond wanting to do something nice for Seattle.
Yeah, this makes sense then. And still strikes me as... maybe audacious, but not particularly crazy. Just something like "hometown" boosting. Also makes for good PR.
 

JuicyPlayer

Member
Feb 8, 2018
7,777
Didn't Yamauchi same something to the effect that RPG players were lonely losers after the Squaresoft split with Nintendo?
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 12352

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,203
Yamauchi easily, because of some of the childish sounding shit he pulled. Like, I don't think I've ever heard anything as truly pathetic from upper management types of this industry as him "banning" Squaresoft games from Nintendo consoles in retaliation for FFVII releasing on PS1.
 
OP
OP
laziboi

laziboi

Alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2019
1,918
Your Anus
Yamauchi easily, because of some of the childish sounding shit he pulled. Like, I don't think I've ever heard anything as truly pathetic from upper management types of this industry as him "banning" Squaresoft games from Nintendo consoles in retaliation for FFVII releasing on PS1.

What actually happened was that Square didn't want to deal with Nintendo anymore, so Nintendo told them to "Never come back", so they were like "Fine".
 

Cess007

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,585
B.C., Mexico
Didn't Yamauchi same something to the effect that RPG players were lonely losers after the Squresoft split with Nintendo?

He called them "depressed gamers who like to sit alone in their dark rooms and play slow games". Tho, as far as I remember reading, it was not Square 'betrayal' that angered Yamauchi about RPGs, but Enix moving too to PS
 

nampad

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,238
Kutaragi (not Kuteragi) might've bet on the PS3 wrong, but there's a reason the PS2 is still the top selling console of all time and the PS1 ushered a very tangible revolution in games. And frankly, seeing how the PS3 managed to produce some very impressive exclusive titles, while also setting the standard for years of what a console should have (Blu-Ray discs, HDMI output, HDD and Wi-Fi), it's clear he was ahead of his time. Let's not forget the 360 required adapters for those things for a long time.

Edit: or did all 360 consoles had ethernet but not Wi-Fi? I'm sure an Xbox 360 Network adapter was a thing at one point.

I agree, for all the shit the PS3 gets, it was still incredible value for the price.
Having a top of the line BD player at that price with all those other things (even card readers) was crazy.
The issues were with Cell not being a good architecture for gaming. And 600 for a console is just too much for the market.

MS was way cheaper but nickel and dimed you in every possible way. Arcade model without HDD, no wifi and HDMI on early models, HDD not user replaceable and small for the early models.
The built quality between both consoles is also worlds apart.

People seem to forget this easily or maybe they weren't even old enough (weird to say that about a generation that feels so close).
 

evilmonkey

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,481
Canada
Yamauchi easily, because of some of the childish sounding shit he pulled. Like, I don't think I've ever heard anything as truly pathetic from upper management types of this industry as him "banning" Squaresoft games from Nintendo consoles in retaliation for FFVII releasing on PS1.
Yamauchi did not ban Square because of FF7. According to every reliable source he wished them good luck when he learned they were moving it to PS.

He banned them because they went out of their way to convince other publishers to jump ship as well.
 

Future Gazer

▲ Legend ▲
The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
4,361
I don't think you can really compare them. Yamauchi was a genuine piece of shit and history should not remember him kindly. Kutaragi was a genius visionary who just needed someone to reign him in.
 

Deleted member 12352

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,203
Yamauchi did not ban Square because of FF7. According to every reliable source he wished them good luck when he learned they were moving it to PS.

He banned them because they went out of their way to convince other publishers to jump ship as well.

First I've heard of this version of it.

There a source on this?
 
OP
OP
laziboi

laziboi

Alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2019
1,918
Your Anus
I don't think you can really compare them. Yamauchi was a genuine piece of shit and history should not remember him kindly. Kutaragi was a genius visionary who just needed someone to reign him in.

Yamauchi was a flawed person. But I don't think that should invalidate his accomplishments or positive traits. As the saying goes, you need to separate the art from the artist.
 

Cess007

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,585
B.C., Mexico
First I've heard of this version of it.

There a source on this?

I remember reading this as well. The great fallout between Nintendo and Square is that they actually went out of their way to convince Enix to put DQ on Playstation. Let me check if I can find a source. I think I may have read it on a magazine.

Edit. Found it: https://www.polygon.com/a/final-fantasy-7

[Note: In October 2001, then Square president Hisashi Suzuki said in an interview that Nintendo became especially frustrated not when Square left, but later when Square helped convince others, such as Enix, to leave as well. Suzuki declined an interview request for this story.]

Original Quote here:

FkkBPev.png
 
Last edited:

Alpheus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,901
I voted for Kutaragi if only cuz his craziness while some could argue it was bold, it was also more consumer facing so it was given more scrutiny. But they were both pretty damn insane.
 

DXB-KNIGHT

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,224
Someone who you should impress him with your game for 5 min otherwise the project is canceled, yeah Yamauchi.
So nerve wreaking.
 
Oct 8, 2019
9,492
Yamauchi was more ruthless than crazy. He had done the same thing Walt Disney had did which was create a massive brand that would constantly create new customers, so he basically treated the third parties like crap. Talk to a theater owner about how the Walt Disney Company treats theaters. Thy both have the same thinking "I have this brand that spews out money, so if you want to share some of that money you have to play by my rules"
 

Normal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,296
I don't know about crazy. But I heard that Ken Kutaragi is the coolest guy, and handsome to boot.
 

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
A lot of people here are being pretty flip calling either of them insane. Kutaragi made a huge mistake assuming people would be willing to shell out $600 for a PS3, and on top of that, the console had an architecture that was notoriously painful to develop for. Yamauchi meanwhile spent basically his entire adult life in charge of Nintendo, and in his ambitions for growing the company he pretty much had to be a hardass. When he took over, the company was a small playing card designer and manufacturer, about ten million light years away from where they are now.
 

Ramsay

Member
Jul 2, 2019
3,674
Australia
"[People who play RPGs] are depressed gamers who like to sit alone in their dark rooms and play slow games." - Yamauchi, after Square moved Final Fantasy to Playstation.