Zan

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,610
My dream rep would be Lilimon (my fav Digimon) but no way is that even happening so yes Agumon.

My idea would be an evolution gimmick based on the original Virtual Pet. Basically Agumon has a meter that fills up every time they get hit or strike a successful attack, similar to a super meter in SF that when fully charged can allow you evolve them into Tyrannomon (if you focused on melee and basic attacks) or Greymon (if you focused on Specials); Agumon's original exclusive evolutions (which also have similar bodytypes, allowing easier asset reuse with rigging etc) that also acknowledges of Digimon does evos in a neat way. The Final Smash then is Metal Greymon.

I'd also have it that if you attempt to evolve before the meter is filled you evolve into Numemon but that would be a lot of work for something likely not that fun to play as.


See, Agumon is in this weird grey area of where the Anime far outclasses the virtual pet origins in terms of recognizability. I feel most would just see him as a Anime character and be like "ADD EVERY STRAWHAT, SAKURAI YOU COWARD." And I just dont think Sakurai wants to open Pandoras Box as it were.
 

Roliq

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Sep 23, 2018
6,352
I always find this articles so dumb cause people online lose brain cells (not talking about here, but rather on Twitter)

They think that the devs are just saying this out of nowhere when is in fact the interviewer asking them and answering like anyone would because who would say "no"?

Literally the same thing with that Overwatch post people like to post
 

Naiad

Member
Aug 27, 2020
1,192
Again with the claim that Horizon is some sort of "pet project" that gets unwarranted push and not like a series that has sold over thirty million copies or anything.

Really weird!

How on earth is Horizon a pet project to some people? It sold over 30 million copies worldwide, it has merchandise (figures, t-shirts, lego sets, artbooks, visual novels etc), people cosplay the hell out of Aloy and other characters, it's going to have a Netflix adaption, It has a VR game, a soon-to-be lego game, it has Digital Foundry's seal of approval, a Genshin cameo, a Fortnite cameo....there's probably more to the list.

Like, just outright say you don't like the game then and that's why it shouldn't be in Smash. But, don't call it a "pet project".
 

Celestial Descend

Corrupted by Vengeance
Member
Aug 15, 2022
3,721
Again with the claim that Horizon is some sort of "pet project" that gets unwarranted push and not like a series that has sold over thirty million copies or anything.

Really weird!
Whether a series should be expanded is not entirely dependent on sales. Aloy is not a gaming icon, it's just a fact. Doesn't matter if her games sell more than Sonic or Cloud. People don't buy Horizon for Aloy. People buy Horizon because it's a high production value AAA open world game with cutting edge graphics and decent game design. Lego Horizon, or a Horizon TV show, is devoid of everything people like about Horizon in the first place.
 

Regiruler

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,552
United States
imagine a Smash reveal for Switch2 with aloy as the first DLC character, people would lose their minds
Lose their minds at what a colossal waste of time it was, maybe.
Resident Evil feels like a bigger omission than Monster Hunter to me.
Japanese series that has sold over 100 Million Copies, GC Exclusivity back in the day, worldwide appeal.

Chun-Li is a big agree though. I get why we got Ken (easiest to implement) but yeah Capcom reps in Smash feel like an area that could be expanded on if things get changed roster wise.
See, I don't care about survival horror, but I can get behind a RE rep.. provided it's Leon exactly. And there's actual history there.
 

Regiruler

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,552
United States
Smash is never going to go back to a "Nintendo focus". The only ones with Nintendo focus are 64 (a cheap side product the suites at Nintendo wouldn't do anything) and Melee (had infamous crunch, Sakurai was considering adding James Bond and Solid Snake during development either way).

Plus there isn't many big Nintendo characters left. After the ring fit adventurer you only have D listers like Dixie Kong and Dillon from Dillons rolling western
There's a wealth of characters that are third party, but have extremely storied histories tied to Nintendo. Travis Touchdown is a Wii icon.
 

GreenMamba

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,600
Whether a series should be expanded is not entirely dependent on sales. Aloy is not a gaming icon, it's just a fact. Doesn't matter if her games sell more than Sonic or Cloud. People don't buy Horizon for Aloy. People buy Horizon because it's a high production value AAA open world game with cutting edge graphics and decent game design. Lego Horizon, or a Horizon TV show, is devoid of everything people like about Horizon in the first place.
Unfalsifiable nonsense trying to explain away the series' success--sounds like a Horizon topic for sure.

Kratos is even higher on the list for me, as he appeared in Fortnite
aloy_fortnite.jpg

She's in Fortnite too.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
86,530
Houston, TX
Some big "bro thinks he's on the team" energy here. Aloy is just not on that level.
To be fair, this is the same roster that has the likes of Terry, Min Min, Pyra/Mythra, & Olimar. And their games don't sell anywhere near a fraction of what Aloy's does. But in Terry's defense, Smash owes its entire existence to him.
 

WetWaffle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,644
Whether a series should be expanded is not entirely dependent on sales. Aloy is not a gaming icon, it's just a fact. Doesn't matter if her games sell more than Sonic or Cloud. People don't buy Horizon for Aloy. People buy Horizon because it's a high production value AAA open world game with cutting edge graphics and decent game design. Lego Horizon, or a Horizon TV show, is devoid of everything people like about Horizon in the first place.
I'm sorry, but it's so funny how boldly you're speaking, like an authority or something. Says who? How do you know people don't buy these games because they also like Aloy? Are you really going to say that people buy/bought Final Fantasy 7 for Cloud but it's absolutely impossible others did the same for Aloy?
 

Derbel McDillet

▲ Legend ▲
Banned
Nov 23, 2022
16,487
There's a wealth of characters that are third party, but have extremely storied histories tied to Nintendo. Travis Touchdown is a Wii icon.
No More Heroes is one of my favorite games and even I can admit this is a bit dramatic. It was the go to game to point to and go "see, we have M rated titles" in console warring conversations and a solid, but hella janky game otherwise.

Yeah, Aloy just isn't on the same tier as Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B., or Olimar.

I can't tell if this is sarcastic or not with Olimars inclusion.
 

Derbel McDillet

▲ Legend ▲
Banned
Nov 23, 2022
16,487
That's the spirit of all Smash's threads
Taking hypotheticals way too personally and arguing something you like is more famous than it is.

Smash is more about personal validation than anything else at this point.

No number is gonna be a good enough. Something is always snubbed. And when you finally get the thing, it's onto the next thing that's not there.
 

Mazzo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,465
Brazil
I'd take her over Kratos, but I'd take Crash, Ratchet, or Rivet over both

edit: Parappa would be fun too!
 

SilentStorm

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,042
Crazy how hard people will fight about made up rules that don't matter.
Smash is serious business...it's also, like, the only big gaming crossover title that isn't Gacha, F2P or a battle royale and which has been about celebrating gaming longer than it has been about just Nintendo characters at this point.

It makes any character inclusion a serious deal, because it's like the one franchise where they can be in a mass crossover that, again, isn't gacha or F2P and is on a big main console.

And seeing how gaming has so many characters...you get people dismissing those they don't like and finding rules to take them out and make rules to justify the ones they want in.

I honestly think gaming needs a 2nd Smash Bros like franchise that isn't just made by Indie developers but no one other than Nintendo is willing to make it, so you get everyone focusing on it with various camps, some of which still remember just 64 and Melee and act like any non-Nintendo character is something that should not happen.
 

TheDinoman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,173
There's a wealth of characters that are third party, but have extremely storied histories tied to Nintendo. Travis Touchdown is a Wii icon.

The cold harsh truth here is that Nintendo and Sakurai don't exactly intrinsically care about third parties having "extremely storied histories tied to Nintendo". Like, our very first guest character was Snake lmao

They've generally been about going after the biggest and most popular characters from each company. The real two 'exceptions' in this regard are Banjo-Kazooie and Bayonetta, which admittedly do have Nintendo connections going for them, but they were also said to be amongst the highest ranking characters on the Smash ballot.
 

thecaseace

Member
May 1, 2018
3,243
Yeah this thread is always very much an 'Era' conversation about Playstation characters in Nintendo's much loved crossover game.

In reality the deal Sony did to get 1st party characters in Fortnite is probably infinitely more effective in terms of brand visibility, it's just that Era projects a level of 'prestige' on Smash roster spots.


I honestly think gaming needs a 2nd Smash Bros like franchise that isn't just made by Indie developers but no one other than Nintendo is willing to make it...


I mean isn't that Fortnite?
 

slothrop

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Aug 28, 2019
4,025
USA
It's so funny when people think there are rules for smash characters, or that the rules aren't totally arbitrary and could be changed at any time for any reason. They could even say there's a rule and change their mind the next week.
 

TheDinoman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,173
It's so funny when people think there are rules for smash characters, or that the rules aren't totally arbitrary and could be changed at any time for any reason. They could even say there's a rule and change their mind the next week.

Once again, there is at least one clear rule: be a video game character.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
86,530
Houston, TX
except Horizon isnt that big in Japan? All third party guests were big in japan in one way or another
Oh, then I guess the person I quoted was misled.

That said, we do sometimes get characters who aren't huge in Japan. But not only are they mostly first-party characters, they're few & far between (Little Mac, Ridley, etc.). So it Aloy isn't big in Japan, that's pretty much a death kneel to her chances.
 

Dezpim

Member
Mar 22, 2024
87
Idk if Aloy is even top 10 PlayStation characters.
Out of all of the games produced by PlayStation, the Horizon games haven't been particularly impactful.
They may be fine but I don't think they are iconic enough.
I mean is there a good way in determining this? In terms of sales Horizon is probably a top five playstation franchise.
 

Naiad

Member
Aug 27, 2020
1,192
I was just browsing the PS blog and caught this from last year. That's actually kind of cool.

sonyinteractive.com

Preserving nature and biodiversity with PlayStation Community

It’s been over a year since the launch of Guerrilla’s Horizon Forbidden West, and we’d like to share an update on our Aloy’s Forest project with you. This initiative is part of our commitment to the United Nations Playing for the Planet Alliance, supported by UN-REDD, to raise awareness on...

sonyinteractive.com

Sony Interactive Celebrates Earth Day 2024

Ahead of Earth Day, held on April 22, we would like to share our annual progress in addressing Sony Interactive Entertainment (SIE)’s environmental impact. SIE remains committed to Sony Group’s Road to Zero plan, which sets targets across four key perspectives; climate change, conserving...

When people think Aloy and Horizon aren't making impacts out of the U.S. They're still continuing Aloy's forest project this year as well.
 

Derbel McDillet

▲ Legend ▲
Banned
Nov 23, 2022
16,487
Even that has caveats though, technically. Considering Dracula's a boss.
Oooooooo

Sorry, it's just been years since I've seen someone make a new (to me at least) and good point regarding Smash.

Original video game character Dracula. In addition to us all knowing Sakurai wanted James Bond.

Idk if Aloy is even top 10 PlayStation characters.

Out of all of the games produced by PlayStation, the Horizon games haven't been particularly impactful.

They may be fine but I don't think they are iconic enough.

What does that even mean?
 

TheDinoman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,173
Even that has caveats though, technically. Considering Dracula's a boss.

Oooooooo

Sorry, it's just been years since I've seen someone make a new (to me at least) and good point regarding Smash.

Original video game character Dracula. In addition to us all knowing Sakurai wanted James Bond.

That is absolutely not the same thing and you know it rofl. Dracula is a public domain character and the one that appears in Smash is very distinctly the Castlevania/Konami version. Not exactly the same thing as going up to Time Warner and asking to put Bugs Bunny in. And in regards to James Bond, Sakurai never actually said that he wanted him, he just said:

sourcegaming.info

The Definitive Unused Fighters List in Smash – Source Translations

The Definitive Unused Fighters List in Smash: Source Translations This page has a compilation of translated sources for the information used in the Definitive Unused Fighters List. So, if new (Japa…

4d0696e3784c40f2a3d59f9920f4c0bd.png


Which really reaffirms what I'm saying.
 

SilentStorm

Member
Apr 14, 2019
2,042
This thread is only telling me people underestimate Horizon's popularity and that whenever the next Smash gets announced, there will be so many threads about possible characters and all kinds of overreactions to any newcomer it won't be funny.
 

Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
86,530
Houston, TX
I was just browsing the PS blog and caught this from last year. That's actually kind of cool.

sonyinteractive.com

Preserving nature and biodiversity with PlayStation Community

It’s been over a year since the launch of Guerrilla’s Horizon Forbidden West, and we’d like to share an update on our Aloy’s Forest project with you. This initiative is part of our commitment to the United Nations Playing for the Planet Alliance, supported by UN-REDD, to raise awareness on...

sonyinteractive.com

Sony Interactive Celebrates Earth Day 2024

Ahead of Earth Day, held on April 22, we would like to share our annual progress in addressing Sony Interactive Entertainment (SIE)’s environmental impact. SIE remains committed to Sony Group’s Road to Zero plan, which sets targets across four key perspectives; climate change, conserving...

When people think Aloy and Horizon aren't making impacts out of the U.S. They're still continuing Aloy's forest project this year as well.
True, but it ultimately won't matter much without popularity in Japan. For better or worse, Smash is more of a celebration of Japanese gaming rather than gaming as a whole. And if you don't have favor in Japan, you probably won't get very far in terms of Smash inclusion without TONS of demand.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,607
Have no where else to post this post this but I wonder why and it's semi-related to the Smash discussion I said before but I always wondered why the Touhou Project, despite it's massive popularity (especially with women) in Japan, never really crossed over to the west? I mostly learned and know from it mostly from Japanese friends and I 100% believe if Reimu Hakurei was announced, Japanese fans would loose their shit with joy and I'd love to see my friends over their be massively happy; but always seemed weird it just never got much attention in the US and UK.