Lol flaccid dicks are not universally disliked. Dicks are flaccid most of the time, do you think people who appreciate the male form are limited to that narrow of a window? No reclined, resting, or candid nudes? That the desirability of men is reduced simply and solely to their potency?
Nudity in those movies was used to dehumanize robots and AI as just machines (among other things in BR2049 specifically). Like Joi shown as a product and the maids in ex machina that were made to please Nathans fethishes.
Oh you right, but its still kinda iffy. Those scenes in BR2049 were made a lot more unsettling because they lingered as long as they did. Especially the Leto stabbing one.
Also BR kinda lingers on everything so its not like its specific to naked women.
Nudity in those movies was used to dehumanize robots and AI as just machines (among other things in BR2049 specifically). Like Joi shown as a product and the maids in ex machina that were made to please Nathans fethishes.
Pancracio17 is kinda right about this, the big reveal in Ex Machina is based around it, and it's central for the most important scene in BR2049, if you've watched those movies. Though I suppose the main characters could have had any love interest (by being gay, for example)
do you guys have any idea how hard it is to show a 50 foot tall butt ass naked ana de armas and have the takeaway clearly and obviously not be 'gawdamn'
The fact that they were young women being nude objects of (passive or not) desire opposite of male actors is relevant to the narrative in the sense that it was a male creator crafting the narrative according to his own tastes.
Also I'm not sure there's anything quite to misogynistic as Villeneuve turning one of his film's few female characters into a literal sex object so that his young male hero has a female body to fuck.
The fact that they were young women being nude objects of (passive or not) desire opposite of male actors is relevant to the narrative in the sense that it was a male creator crafting the narrative according to his own tastes.
Also I'm not sure there's anything quite to misogynistic as Villeneuve turning one of his film's few female characters into a literal sex object so that his young male hero has a female body to fuck.
Also I'm not sure there's anything quite to misogynistic as Villeneuve turning one of his film's few female characters into a literal sex object so that his young male hero has a female body to fuck.
Yep. It's always a coincidence. Totally. I mean, male filmmakers just can't help it to think of women as objects and men as subjects.
Cyberpunk 2077 is gonna suck, seeing at how widespread these attitudes are and how lazy that kind of writing is. It'll probably be full of it :/
Also I'm not sure there's anything quite to misogynistic as Villeneuve turning one of his film's few female characters into a literal sex object so that his young male hero has a female body to fuck.
This is incredibly disingenuous. Literally every main character of importance in BR2049, aside from K and Deckard, were women. His boss, the "love" interest, the central "mystery", and the main antagonist. There weren't just a few female characters. There were a few male characters if anything
Just earlier today (technically yesterday as it's post midnight) I finally got around to watching Blade Runner 2049 with my younger brother. I've seen it numerous times, he hasn't.
He liked it well enough, but when
we got to the scene were the hookers approach K he rolled his eyes at the moaning naked women against the opaque glass. This scene being not too long after Jared Letos bit with the other naked woman.
That's to be expected, because he's my brother and it's awkward enough, but I asked him "what?" cus I'd jokingly warned him there was a lot of nudity, to which he replied "every film about AI!"
While technically not true about all AI films, he was reffering to a similar comment he made a while back when we first saw the trailer for Ghost in the Shell were Scarlet Johansen kisses a woman in the trailer and dances on a strip pole at another point.
I also thought about how Westworld, a show he hasn't seen but I have, is like Blade Runnder filled with a
lot of gratuitous nudity, specifically of relatively young-ish hot women.
Ex-Machinima as well, as much as I like that film,
absolutely did not need its two main women to be as naked for as long as they did.
And I haven't even gotten into Altered Carbon yet.
But I suppose the thing is that it's not just AI or even sci-fi. A lot of media that's supposedly approching topics about philisophical or mature concepts just see it it as a convenient excuse to fill themselves with unecesary gratuitous female nudity because "nudity is mature guyz!".
So does anyone else see it as a bit weird that we're seeing this eccessive rise in specifically good looking young-ish naked women in film and TV the past decade? Like Cyberpunk the game suposedly has nudity, but after Witcher 3 I expect it to be just a ton of hot 20-30 year old women for 90% of the time.
Edit:
Cus some of you are incapable of critical thought let me be clear. I'm not saying that nudity is bad or should be gone. I'm just making a point that a lot of films and TV shows see the inclusion of nudity as a mature topic as instead an excuse to go overboard with it.
I dont see the problem as portrayed. essentially a lot of these films/shows illustrate if say ai is considered inferior while we can we will exploit them from a sexual aspect. etc etc. In many of these things AI is an object if a human can get sexual gratification from an object they will do it etc etc. Now the films/shows ask when does AI stop being an object etc etc.... complex issues... I really dont see the issue here OP
I mean they are literally driving at that question.
more or less this. its basic nature. (similarly why humans like say social status, high skill in any field etc etc) the shows/films just go onto explore where do we draw the line between an object and human when it comes to stuff like AI.
I have no qualms about finding ppl attractive or intelligent or interesting etc etc its normal. its essentially what evolution is based on .
No doubt this happens, like Game of Thrones has had me rolling my eyes on few scenes with nudity or sex. I still remember the most baffling one with Littlefinger monologuing his schemes while two prostitutes were having sex in the background for no apparent reason. But I don't think your examples are valid, especially Westworld which is still fresh on my mind. And for your video game example, Witcher 3 actually stood out to me in how they used nudity also in natural and non sexual way. They had old and overweight women naked too, without making it to be a joke even. I appreciated that, now of course vast majority of nudity was still with very attractive people and women specifically. I'm hoping Cyberpunk would balance the scales on gender department and from what I understand they just might.
Also I don't know if "using it as an excuse" is right way to put it, more like using the opportunity to pander when the show is for mature audiences anyway they can have nudity too.
To the bolded, I WISH! Seeing a penis on television is still a rarity in 2018, let alone an erect one. To be fair, vaginas in TV shows are rare too. Probably about as rare as penises.
I took a whole class on Science Fiction Posthumanism that delved into most all of these movies mentioned, as well as some unique books. A major running theme was how in sci fi men sexualize their robot creations, often in a blazon-esque way, stripping away their intelligent creation's identity and making them a tool for the male protagonist. It was also highlighting the unique power dynamics of sexuality within these works. I wish I could remember more, but I really don't feel like digging through old notes and writing up a whole analysis.
Many movies pull from these sexual literary tropes/devices, and often, when not self aware of their implications, can be problematic. In the example of Ex Machina, most of us did find it crass, and it played into these tropes, however it did seem to do so with purpose, so I would excuse it for that.
Read this back to myself and this comment feels super surface level but eh, just wanted to chime in my experience.
These are movies that kind of rely on themselves to also look Beautiful and Artistic, so they use whats considered "Beautiful" Women when it comes to the nudity part I think, I don't know thats what I assume, I'm not qualified to answer but thats my assumption, I'm not saying it's right or wrong but thats how I feel it is.
If you want the opposite just you wait until the Judge Dredd TV series OP, then you may well get what you bargained for if it goes all out and then some, taking stuff from the comics into consideration but then making it a bit more adult like the last Movie from 2012, then you may see the type Cyberpunk nudity you are looking for (possibly) although saying that there was not a lot of nudity in the comics, but some issues had some stuff
Like old people nudity, overweight people etc etc
Actually thinking about it now maybe they will tone down somethings that may not be appropriate for this day and age, or they may go all out kind of like preacher (side note garth ennis and steve dillon who made preacher comics also worked on some dredd)
"There were some fun adventures in terms of selecting penis sizes," Fuller shared. "The more potty humor biofunction comedy of a post-production process was definitely getting its fill of suppressed giggles because we were looking at giant penises and trying to calibrate what the Jinn's penis would look like. What's too big? What's not too big. If you start to giggle when he drops the towel then that's too big."
Or as Green put it: "What is majestic and still plausible?"
Well in Blade Runner 2049 it actually has a purpose in crafting the world the characters inhabit, as well as in some cases is supposed to subvert the stigma against nudity in film. The prostitutes are supposed to reinforce the viewer's impression of replicants use in society, how they have been created so that their creators can indulge in their fantasies (a theme also visited in Westworld). The nudity with the Wallace scene isn't supposed to be sexualized at all, but instead is supposed to show the viewer how vulnerable and human replicants are, which is juxtaposed with Wallace's treatment of them, once again reinforcing the plight of the replicant in the Blade Runner universe.
This is obviously exploited at some times, but I do think there is merit behind the "it being art" argument in cases like Blade Runner 2049; any time nudity was sexualized, it was a function of the story, and not for the viewer to indulge themselves on nude young women; camerawork is key in determining this, and the movie at no points turns into a soft-core porno like some others.
I actually stopped watching this show for some reason, but not before a certain magical sex scene that blew me the fuck away. Looks like I need to start watching it again!
I'm not about to moralize about nudity in media. The religious right are on top it for everyone. Liberals actually making titillation out to be a bad thing like it's not a natural part of life is a sad sight. Even if the only point of showing it was to get the viewer all hot and bothered: So. The fuck. What.
Sure, definitely show more male nudity. Nudity equality. And take women seriously -- if they are doing a part that tacks it on distractingly and it lessens the impact of the work, that's always a good critique (the sex scene in Frida that Weinstein shoehorned in for example was just bullshit objectification). But otherwise, it's a part of life, and adults are consenting to make that content, and it's not 1955. Some people are really sounding like they have a problem to even be seeing it at all, and that is not healthy.
Avatar comics is like the vice versa. They'll let you tell whatever kind of story you want as long as you fill the required quota of extremly graphic sex and violence.
As a rule we're too prudish about nudity. A story that's mature and intelligent, and includes nudity, isn't necessarily being gratuitous at all.
To picture an example of gratuitous nudity, I'd imagine a basic exposition scenes where two characters talk about the plot while there are writhing strippers in the background. If there's no story reason for the characters to be in the club or for the strippers to be doing their thing in full view, then the nudity is gratuitous.
By contrast, a show like Westworld uses nudity as a thematic device. The hosts are casually objectified and dehumanized, even as it's clear there is no important distinction between these sophisticated beings and real humans. Nudity plays an important part in the whole narrative thrust of the show.
Nudity doesn't bother me even half as much as swearing/violence as a way to make things "mature".
Westworld the nudity fits. The whole place i about decadence, hedonism, and arrogance being the downfall of humanity. Bladerunner 2049 it also kind of fits, specifically the scene with Jared Leto where he's obviously reinforcing his power on someone/something vulnerable.
As long as it fits the tone, and isn't used more than it has to be I don't really have a problem with male or female nudity...but as with all scenes in film it must have a purpose.
I don't see an excessive rise in nakedness, and don't think blade runner injected to much of it 0_o and I wouldn't call the women of Westworld youngish, I can't speak for the second season but the first has a pretty well rounded age difference amongst all the characters. Sounds like you and your brother have a low tolerance towards nudity or something.
Also The Witcher? has nudity sure, but the setting matches it perfectly, it would seem odd for that setting to be prudish.
You could be right about 20-30 something's being 90% of the cast in cyberpunk, but typically protagonists are young to middle aged so the surrounding npcs are usually not to far from that age either. Besides the cyberpunk target market would definitely be of that age, and gotta make that Dolla dolla
I'm honestly surprised the metoo movement hasn't made a thing out of actresses constantly being required to do nude scenes. It feels like an actress who refused to do them would be locked out of almost all big prestige productions these days, whereas men wouldn't have that problem at all.
Sex and nudity is a part of life, any form of art should be free to explore it. If anything media in general have gotten a lot better with making meaningful (instead of explorative) portrayals of nudity than in the 80's and 90's.
I'm pretty sure flaccid dicks are universally disliked. I don't know a single female or gay friend who thinks they look good. Not saying there aren't people who do
You guys all picked the wrong part of his post I was replying to. I don't really care about the flaccid dick part, I probably should've editied that out.
It's not nudity or even large amounts of it itself that is bad, it's usually the unequal, (overly) objectifying nature of it and how things are framed. By all means have as many nude people as you want but try to have some proper context to it, have naked women AND men and handle nudity like the natural thing that it is.
do you guys have any idea how hard it is to show a 50 foot tall butt ass naked ana de armas and have the takeaway clearly and obviously not be 'gawdamn'
Sex is an integral part of the human experience. I don't get how some of you have bought so thoroughly into the puritanical opposition of it. Acting like showing women naked in movies is automatically degrading to them is something else.
Here's the thing. It's fine you if think flaccid dicks are ugly. It's NOT fine, however, to project that opinion onto literally every other person on the planet. Like, what in the actual fuck?!!
Sex is an integral part of the human experience. I don't get how some of you have bought so thoroughly into the puritanical opposition of it. Acting like showing women naked in movies is automatically degrading to them is something else.
There is plenty of male nudity in media. The problem is that you can tell the intention is completely different when the only women that are naked are young and conventionally attractive. It's rare to see unsexualized female nudity.
How many vaginas do you see, generally speaking, though? I don't remember any in the films OP mentioned, for example. Sure, you don't see dicks that often, but I feel like there's plenty of male ass out here.
I feel like if I still have to go out of my way to find it, it's not common enough. Don't have that problem with female nudity. It's everywhere. Unfortunately the depiction of women in media is still really bad, so it's not necessarily a good thing.
