Incredibles II |OT| It's More Than Fantastic (Unmarked spoilers)

Shadownet · Jun 16, 2018

Trigonometrize said:
Well, remember his entire memory of Violet was pretty much just what happened the day of the track meet. Tony barely even knew her name. Dicker didn't wipe his memory of her negligently or anything; it was just the very few events that led up to Tony witnessing Violet take off her mask. Him not thinking much of it makes sense, especially when Bob gave him Tony's name without any stipulations.

Considering he is the liaison for an entire family of superheroes for this program and Bob seems to like him, I trust him to be a pretty good judge of what's important.

Now this would actually be negligent, just going "mind wipe done." And it would be really out of character for him, since he was explicitly helpful to Bob after the incident with the boss at the insurance company.

And not believing the words of a teenage girl who has an overactive personality? Again, he is the liaison for a family of four super heroes. It's his job to manage them and pick up on what is going on in their house. What would be so unbelievable about her story to him? Overactive does not mean actually crazy. And if he didn't think her story had any credibility to it, why wipe her in the first place? Sounds illegal to me.

The cause was a person RIGHT in front of him, whom he was interviewing about her interactions with super heroes, telling him about an exploding baby, whom he proceeds to mind wipe. That would be the way someone finds out a baby has super powers, someone witnessing it.

"Sounds illegal to me" lol he work for the government. His mind wiping is as "legal" as it gets. Also even if he didn't believe her, the fact that a villain show up to the Parr family home, took their baby, and their house got destroyed as the result of the confrontation is enough to warrant a wipe.

HiLife · Jun 16, 2018

If this is the spoiler thread then we can start talking freely?

Flamed Jack Jack throwing those chairs out the way was hilarious.

Timeaisis · Jun 16, 2018

Well, I really liked it. Not quite as good as original, but great compared to other Disney sequels. I enjoyed the new spin on family drama as per Bob taking care of the kids, but it did feel a little less "adventurous" than the original.

Trigonometrize · Jun 16, 2018

Shadownet said:
"Sounds illegal to me" lol he work for the government. His mind wiping is as "legal" as it gets. Also even if he didn't believe her, the fact that a villain show up to the Parr family home, took their baby, and their house got destroyed as the result of the confrontation is enough to warrant a wipe.

OK, so let's recap.

Rick Dicker, who is the head of the Super Relocation Program, is in correspondence with a family of 5, 4 of whom are superheroes + an infant. He begins an interview with the babysitter of the infant. She tells him about the infant displaying miraculous feats like "exploding" and all of the other crazy stuff he did during Jack Jack Attack. The babysitter apparently handed the baby off to some guy at the door and then left. At the end of the interview, Dicker wipes the mind of the individual because it's legal I guess (his mind wiping has restrictions I assume is what I was implying. He can't just wipe people willy-nilly; he would need to have a reason that someone's knowledge would compromise a super's identity. I know he works for the government) and she maybe would've heard later about a villain attacking their house and detectived that that must mean they're superheroes and the wipe had nothing to do with her experiences with the infant that she described in detail. Dicker then proceeds to for the next three months never mention anything about what he heard from the babysitter in the interview to the family and then his organization gets shut down and then he fucks off to a vacation, but not before meeting Bob and Helen again, still not mentioning it.

This all just sounds insane to me. It's a retcon or Jack Jack Attack is not canon, which would make this 20x easier to explain away.

Soupman Prime · Jun 16, 2018

HiLife said:
If this is the spoiler thread then we can start talking freely?

Flamed Jack Jack throwing those chairs out the way was hilarious.

Reminded me of the amazing Baymax destroy scene.

Really enjoyed the movie, so many laughs. Even loved the short before the movie.

Shadownet · Jun 16, 2018

I thought this movie was better in that you get more out of Frozone, more into the world building of other superheroes, family bonding and individual developments. But the villain is slightly weaker, Screenslaver is a pretty cool villain if you just look at her and what she can do. But pale in comparison to Syndrome with his personality and speeches. It does feel less adventerous but I'm glad other characters got a chance to shine, like JackJack, Violet and Elastigirl. (I hope Dash get a bigger arc next time, although he got the bigger arc out of all the siblings in the first one in my opinion. So it balanced out this time.)

I don't think it's a better movie than the original, but not necessarily worst overall either. They're both pretty even, I would watch both at any time. It's about as good as you can hope for in a sequel.

UltimateHigh · Jun 16, 2018

RyanW said:
.

The review thread is completely dead and this is actually the only place on the site to hear people's impressions.

Shadownet · Jun 16, 2018

Trigonometrize said:
OK, so let's recap.

Rick Dicker, who is the head of the Super Relocation Program, is in correspondence with a family of 5, 4 of whom are superheroes + an infant. He begins an interview with the babysitter of the infant. She tells him about the infant displaying miraculous feats like "exploding" and all of the other crazy stuff he did during Jack Jack Attack. The babysitter apparently handed the baby off to some guy at the door and then left. At the end of the interview, Dicker wipes the mind of the individual because it's legal I guess (his mind wiping has restrictions I assume is what I was implying. I know he works for the government) and she maybe would've heard later about a villain attacking their house and detectived that that must mean they're superheroes and the wipe had nothing to do with her experiences with the infant that she described in detail. Dicker then proceeds to for the next three months never mention anything about what he heard from the babysitter in the interview to the family and then his organization gets shut down and then he fucks off to a vacation, but not before meeting Bob and Helen again, still not mentioning it.

This all just sounds insane to me. It's a retcon or Jack Jack Attack is not canon, which would make this 20x easier to explain away.

Yeah, he just hand wave the babysitter away and wipe her memory. Didn't think her story has any credibility. You can see how little he care about things beside keeping the family identity a secret. That's his only job, mind wipe people and move heroes around to new locations. He mind wipe Tony and was like "yeah, yeah kid. Whatever. You'll forget about her. Period."

You can bet your butt he probably mind wipe that little kid on the tricycle too.

We can argue this until the end of time, so let's just agree to disagree.

Trigonometrize · Jun 16, 2018

Shadownet said:
Yeah, he just hand wave the babysitter away and wipe her memory. Didn't think her story has any credibility. You can see how little he care about things beside keeping the family identity a secret. That's his only job, mind wipe people and move heroes around to new locations. He mind wipe Tony and was like "yeah, yeah kid. Whatever. You'll forget about her. Period."

You can bet your butt he probably mind wipe that little kid on the tricycle too.

We can argue this until the end of time, so let's just agree to disagree.

It's exhausting for him, but I get the sense he cares about the Parr family. Even after he has his little frustrated talk with Bob, he gives him the option to relocate and help him out AGAIN after it'd apparently happened several times. On the drive back to the Parr household at the end of the first, he compliments Bob's super work and is clearly on "their side" going forward.

And if his #1 priority is to protect the identity of the family, he would want to verify/discredit Kari's story directly.

Darkmaigle · Jun 16, 2018

My kids loved it, was a lot of fun and lived up to the original. The fight between Jack Jack and the raccoon was good tier.

rude · Jun 16, 2018

I loved all of the little things that reminded you that there was actually risk/danger in the movie. Elastigirl mishandling the motorcycle and hitting things during the chase, the motorcycle bashing against the train window, the train not coming to an immediate stop, the ambassador just barely being saved, Elastigirl almost losing several times during the apartment scene, Void fucking up etc.

What a movie. This is the new reference material for how to film action sequences, take note Marvel/DC.

Ultimadrago · Jun 16, 2018

When I originally saw JackJack at the end of the original. I feared it would be "Add a Baby" Sequelitis bullshit in The Incredibles 2. I am so glad to be wrong on that front. The implementation of JackJack joining not being a complete comedic disaster alone gives this film some major props.

Also the raccoon fight was a fantastiiiic idea!

Steenbock · Jun 16, 2018

Cuburger said:
People probably want real-time time skip for whatever reason, but having almost no time skip was weird as well because a natural time progression has an effect on characters and a family dynamic, which is interesting to explore whatever the age, but keeping them exactly the same age would suggest that they wanted the kids to remain the same age because they have more to explore with the characters at the age they were in the first film, but they don't do much with it and it barely plays a factor into Bob and Helen's story that they couldn't have done at any other age.

Maybe it's for marketing and toy purposes in the same way you keep the Simpsons kids the same age forever and how in live-action sitcoms child actors/characters simply grow up, much to the chagrin of the audience who likes the characters forever frozen in time as children.

The lack of a time skip also meant some of the elements at the end of the first movie wound up a little odd; like they had to retroactively change what they meant in order to tell the story they wanted to tell this time. Like, the grand entrance of the Underminer at the end of the first movie implied he was bringing a much larger threat, like conquest or destruction of the surface world (inspired, of course, by the Mole Man). But instead, it turns out he's just robbing a bank. It also seemed like 'suiting up' was at least tolerated by the local authorities (at least the family didn't seem concerned about doing so), Violet seems to have been training her powers a lot since fighting Syndrome (she can 'throw' forcefields now, apparently), etc.

I don't consider any of these to be flaws, just odd hiccups that could have been more easily dealt with if there had been a time skip. Frankly, it's pretty impressive that they are as minor as they are. Trying to start a movie with the ending of another is rough if it wasn't planned that way from the start.

Deleted member 24907 · Jun 16, 2018

Goddamn the movie's gonna make a killing at the BO. Theater was insane with the amount of completely sold out showings.

Liked it a lot but didn't hit the high notes that the first did. Villain was far worse than Syndrome IMO and Incredibles 1 still had some really iconic shit like the Kronos reveal scene. The final fight felt a little weightless, I wanted to see more kids + Jack Jack fighting on their own. Felt like the tension of the whole fight was lifted as soon as the first pair of goggles came off.

Oh well, loved it still and am going to see it again in a couple of days. The action scenes were all amazing.

BWoog · Jun 16, 2018

I thought it was solid but I left the theater thinking this felt more like Incredibles 1.5 than Incredibles 2.

Zulith · Jun 16, 2018

I liked the very deliberate choice to set the film immediately after the first one, because that's not usually what you see sequels like this do. That has its own set of challenges that's very different from, "Where are all of these characters five years later?"

That said, I wouldn't mind them skipping forward a little more in a third film.

Zetta · Jun 16, 2018

Great movie, that Jack Jack vs Racoon fight was so damn funny. I did enjoy the first one more but this was a solid sequel. On another note I had a lot of people laughing at the short during the part where the dumpling was eaten and I found that weird as hell, did it happen to anyone else?

Deleted member 32822 · Jun 16, 2018

I loved it! Some of the conversations between Elastigirl and the evil lady were so complex and hard to follow for me.

ZeoVGM · Jun 16, 2018

Sega Dreamcast said:
Some of the conversations between Elastigirl and the evil lady were so complex and hard to follow for me.

Huh?

Shadownet · Jun 16, 2018

ZeoVGM said:
Huh?

he meant when they talked feminism and science.

ZeoVGM · Jun 16, 2018

Shadownet said:
he meant when they talked feminism and science.

Right. But I don't see how it was hard to follow. Haha.

Deleted member 33 · Jun 16, 2018

Just got back from the movie and really enjoyed it.

The raccoon scene was straight up hilarious, and the action scenes were very well done.

Deleted member 32822 · Jun 16, 2018

Shadownet said:
he meant when they talked feminism and science.

ZeoVGM said:
Right. But I don't see how it was hard to follow. Haha.

There was one conversation they had toward the very end. When they both had drinks maybe? It was very meta and theoretical. Complex too. It was difficult to understand.

No need to tease me :/

Deleted member 24907 · Jun 16, 2018

Zetta said:
Great movie, that Jack Jack vs Racoon fight was so damn funny. I did enjoy the first one more but this was a solid sequel. On another note I had a lot of people laughing at the short during the part where the dumpling was eaten and I found that weird as hell, did it happen to anyone else?

Some people were laughing their assess off until someone said outloud "... This isn't funny?"

Chase · Jun 16, 2018

Really enjoyed the film.

The short that played before it led to the biggest gasp in the audience that I've heard lol.

Shadownet · Jun 16, 2018

Sega Dreamcast said:
There was one conversation they had toward the very end. When they both had drinks maybe? It was very meta and theoretical. Complex too. It was difficult to understand.

No need to tease me :/

I think I know which conversation you're talking about, I can understand why it might be hard to follow.

Fuchsia · Jun 16, 2018

Emily said:
Just got back from the movie and really enjoyed it.

The raccoon scene was straight up hilarious, and the action scenes were very well done.

Yes the raccoon scene! So good. I think that was honestly the highlight for me.

woodland · Jun 16, 2018

I had to go to the bathroom like 5 times so I missed a bit but the raccoon scene was easily the best. Just a great scene to show all his powers with a raccoon that wouldn't give up lol.

No post credits scene though? Lame :/

Jeff ChickenDig · Jun 16, 2018

still a bit confused what the end goal was for the baddy. Trust heroes less. Go to your panic room?

Trust no one?

SolidSnakeBoy · Jun 16, 2018

Bao was a great short, actually made me tear up.

I did not love this film. It was good, heck the raccoon scene was fantastic, but here is the crux of my disappointment: It left me with a (and I hate to say this) The Last Jedi feeling.

The villain makes a fantastic social commentary, she straight up conveys a clean analysis of super hero tropes relevant to all media. I agree that her parents should have seeked shelter, and that believing in superheroes robs us in a way of our own agency and is converted into escapism in our entertainment industry. But just as The Last Jedi presents a critique of Star Wars, it also falls back on its word at the end. In The Last Jedi the legend of Luke is again continued as the children are seen talking about him In the same manner that he wished to be forgotten, and Kylo Ren makes a perfectly good argument for what he wants to turn the First Order into, him and Rey could make a better galaxy that breaks free of these cycles,but she refuses. In this movie the supers again save the day implying that people should put their trust in superheroes.

I find that Disney movies have been dwelling in very interesting matters and yet they always fall short of following through. I wish Incredibles 2 would have had the courage to let the villains point stand, perhaps by making it impossible for them to catch the villain without the help of the common people.

Maybe I'm over analyzing all of this! :D

Trigonometrize · Jun 16, 2018

Sega Dreamcast said:
There was one conversation they had toward the very end. When they both had drinks maybe? It was very meta and theoretical. Complex too. It was difficult to understand.

No need to tease me :/

Maybe it was hard to follow because they had been drinking.

Socivol · Jun 16, 2018

My husband loved the first movie. He doesn't even really like movies so it's a pretty big deal for him to want to go to the movies. I did NOT want to see this at all and I have to say it was amazing. The best movie I have seen all year. From beginning to end it was so engrossing and the writing so so timely. I'm shocked that it was that good!

Deleted member 19844 · Jun 16, 2018

SolidSnakeBoy said:
Bao was a great short, actually made me tear up.

I did not love this film. It was good, heck the raccoon scene was fantastic, but here is the crux of my disappointment: It left me with a (and I hate to say this) The Last Jedi feeling.

The villain makes a fantastic social commentary, she straight up conveys a clean analysis of super hero tropes relevant to all media. I agree that her parents should have seeked shelter, and that believing in superheroes robs us in a way of our own agency and is converted into escapism in our entertainment industry. But just as The Last Jedi presents a critique of Star Wars, it also falls back on its word at the end. In The Last Jedi the legend of Luke is again continued as the children are seen talking about him In the same manner that he wished to be forgotten, and Kylo Ren makes a perfectly good argument for what he wants to turn the First Order into, him and Rey could make a better galaxy that breaks free of these cycles,but she refuses. In this movie the supers again save the day implying that people should put their trust in superheroes.

I find that Disney movies have been dwelling in very interesting matters and yet they always fall short of following through. I wish Incredibles 2 would have had the courage to let the villains point stand, perhaps by making it impossible for them to catch the villain without the help of the common people.

Maybe I'm over analyzing all of this! :D

Eh, I didn't get that feeling because in the end the critique of super heroes wasn't convincing enough to warrant what she wanted to do and ultimately it was just her way of dealing with her anger over the outcome with her parents.

sabrina · Jun 16, 2018

I really liked it. Best new super is Void. All the different things she was doing with the portals was really cool.

They reeeally didn't even try to hide the twist though. You can't name a character Evil Endeavor and expect anyone to think she's a good person.

ViewtifulJC · Jun 16, 2018

Let's talk about Catherine Keeners stylish threads

Or the fact that Jack Jack is canon wise the most powerful character in Pixar history

Or how about this film having maybe the best goddamn cinematography I've ever seen in a CG movie

Daria · Jun 16, 2018

God. Bao was so good, I think I felt my eyes getting a little watery, mostly because I could relate to the relationship.

But now the movie. It was really good. The CG was excellent, dialogue was hilarious, and the entire relationship between their family showed throughout the film. I really felt as if they were a normal family who just happen to have super powers. What I mean by this is that Mr. Incredible had to babysit Jack Jack and he is POOPED from being a parent. He tries to help his daughter get a date because he messed it up the first time. The children want to help their parents. They all were in this together.

This now leads me to the twist and ending. While it may seem to be a bit predictable, based solely on the siblings family history, I did *not* assume that would be the case. I think the villains were executed well.

And as someone mentioned earlier, Void as a super was really cool. As soon as I saw what she was able to do, I instantly got PORTAL flashbacks.

rude · Jun 16, 2018

ViewtifulJC said:
Let's talk about Catherine Keeners stylish threads

Or the fact that Jack Jack is canon wise the most powerful character in Pixar history

Or how about this film having maybe the best goddamn cinematography I've ever seen in a CG movie

I loved the play on light and shadow throughout the city during the train sequence.

sabrina · Jun 16, 2018

Daria said:
And as someone mentioned earlier, Void as a super was really cool. As soon as I saw what she was able to do, I instantly got PORTAL flashbacks.

Yeah! When she introduced herself I started to think "what kinds of utility does that have?" but boy did the movie come up with a lot of things. Turning your foe's attack against themself seemed especially handy.

I like powers that involve a lot of creative thinking (Elastigirl's included) rather than being pure feats of strength/agility.

EchoChamber · Jun 16, 2018

HiLife said:
ElastiThicc.

She is to Damn thick.

Lunchbox- · Jun 16, 2018

ViewtifulJC said:
Let's talk about Catherine Keeners stylish threads

Or the fact that Jack Jack is canon wise the most powerful character in Pixar history

Or how about this film having maybe the best goddamn cinematography I've ever seen in a CG movie

plus elastigirls thicccccccc

sabrina · Jun 16, 2018

yo can we not with the gross lusting after elastigirl?

Daria · Jun 16, 2018

sabrina said:
Yeah! When she introduced herself I started to think "what kinds of utility does that have?" but boy did the movie come up with a lot of things. Turning your foe's attack against themself seemed especially handy.

I like powers that involve a lot of creative thinking (Elastigirl's included) rather than being pure feats of strength/agility.

HA! That part was fantastic. All of the combat scenes, especially Void v Violet, were so creative with her abilities and those two really matched up well. Void helping Elastigirl getting onto the plane and Elastigirl stretching all over the train scene and then again when inside.

also,can we take a moment to laugh again at
when the train stopped and they thought everything was OK but ... then the second half came up screaming behind lol

NorthandSouth · Jun 16, 2018

Saw it with the fam and loved it! We were literally laughing out loud with the rest of the theatre and the action was just, dare I say it... incredible ;)

Villain was totally obvious, but I felt it was well structured nonetheless! Really enjoyed it and will go a second time at least!

I honestly enjoyed it more than any Marvel movie I have seen in the last few years

sabrina · Jun 16, 2018

Daria said:
HA! That part was fantastic. All of the combat scenes, especially Void v Violet, were so creative with her abilities and those two really matched up well. Void helping Elastigirl getting onto the plane and Elastigirl stretching all over the train scene and then again when inside.

also,can we take a moment to laugh again at
when the train stopped and they thought everything was OK but ... then the second half came up screaming behind lol

I gasped when Void snuck inside Violet's force field! That felt so violating.

Yeah, the second half of the train bumping was funny. I'm glad it didn't actually make the situation worse though.

StrmSrg · Jun 16, 2018

I have a hard time accepting the whole "Make the World Super Again" (no, I don't think that name was an accident. Not that there was any payoff to that though) plotline. I mean, Helen was doing the whole superhero job thing for what...a month at most? Either that or Dash's math class moves really slowly.

So you're telling me that in the span of like a month:

* Helen saves a train

* Then Helen saves an ambassador

* The news of both these things is somehow enough to convince a bunch of prominent world leaders to end the several decade long superhero ban in like no time flat.

* Said world leaders, who are probably all super busy, then not only reach out to each other and all agree on a time and place that all works for them for said meeting again in no time flat, but the meeting is set to happen less than 1-3 weeks away, depending on how much time the first three bullet points take to happen.

And that's assuming that Helen was at the job for even that much time.

BWoog · Jun 16, 2018

Also:

Did anyone else notice the Quest Industries building in the background of one shot?[/QUOTE]

Daria · Jun 16, 2018

sabrina said:
I gasped when Void snuck inside Violet's force field! That felt so violating.

Yeah, the second half of the train bumping was funny. I'm glad it didn't actually make the situation worse though.

Seeing Void inside of the force field make me feel as if this entire movie was a big lie. Like, that should not have happened! But during that scene, it was an ultimate power move Void had to pull and only Void could have done that.

Cuburger · Jun 16, 2018

BWoog said:
Also:

Did anyone else notice the Quest Industries building in the background of one shot?

[/QUOTE]
I did. I thought I was seeing things at first until they confirmed it in the film.

Epcott · Jun 17, 2018

Steenbock said:
The lack of a time skip also meant some of the elements at the end of the first movie wound up a little odd; like they had to retroactively change what they meant in order to tell the story they wanted to tell this time. Like, the grand entrance of the Underminer at the end of the first movie implied he was bringing a much larger threat, like conquest or destruction of the surface world (inspired, of course, by the Mole Man). But instead, it turns out he's just robbing a bank. It also seemed like 'suiting up' was at least tolerated by the local authorities (at least the family didn't seem concerned about doing so), Violet seems to have been training her powers a lot since fighting Syndrome (she can 'throw' forcefields now, apparently), etc.

I don't consider any of these to be flaws, just odd hiccups that could have been more easily dealt with if there had been a time skip. Frankly, it's pretty impressive that they are as minor as they are. Trying to start a movie with the ending of another is rough if it wasn't planned that way from the start.

I'd love to see a significant time skip in the next film. Since this takes place in May of 1962, it'd be great to see how the kids would be as productive adults in the 1980's, maybe have them trying to keep their golden age ideals (while raising their own children) in a world of the edgy 80's anti hero (think of Flash vs the likes of Lobo or Wolverine). I don't think they'd go so far, but it would be interesting.

Cuburger · Jun 17, 2018

sabrina said:
I really liked it. Best new super is Void. All the different things she was doing with the portals was really cool.

They reeeally didn't even try to hide the twist though. You can't name a character Evil Endeavor and expect anyone to think she's a good person.

I was just reading through IMDb to find out the name of her character and the play on words became slowly apparent.

Yeah, it's weird that they played the twist so straight and didn't even try to add a new twist on the evil business person playing both sides cliche besides the villain being a female.

Also, I noticed that it was implied she was a bit of an alcoholic or something. That was surprising because I've seen drunken male characters in a cartoon but almost never a female. Besides, even seeing characters drink alcohol in a cartoon is even something that doesn't seem as common these days. Just something that stood out to me.

Incredibles II |OT| It's More Than Fantastic (Unmarked spoilers)

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