Nvidia CEO says next gaming GPU announcement won’t be for ‘a long time’

Buran · Jun 6, 2018

I'm sitting in my 1070 for a long time and probably will remain there for a year and half or two.

Nvidia should tread carefully; there's a risk that some of those companies that are utterly crushing Nvidia, AMD and Intel in the smartphone landscape end making something competitive in the discrete GPU segment.

Remember the days in which you spent the money in korean tv brands because the japanese ones (Pioneer, Panasonic, Sony.. ) were too expensive? But one day those cheap Samsungs and LGs got so much share that their resources for I&D eclipsed the competence, so now Samsung reigns supreme in LCD share and qaulity and LG does the same in OLED displays. Nvidia should be more sensitive towards their potential customers, if wants to avoid the same fate as Kodak, Blackberry or Pioneer...

Kieli · Jun 6, 2018

Buran said:
I'm sitting in my 1070 for a long time and probably will remain there for a year and half or two.

Nvidia should tread carefully; there's a risk that some of those companies that are utterly crushing Nvidia, AMD and Intel in the smartphone landscape end making something competitive in the discrete GPU segment.

Remember the days in which you spent the money in korean tv brands because the japanese ones (Pioneer, Panasonic, Sony.. ) were too expensive? But one day those cheap Samsungs and LGs got so much share that their resources for I&D eclipsed the competence, so now Samsung reigns supreme in LCD share and qaulity and LG does the same in OLED displays. Nvidia should be more sensitive towards their potential customers, if wants to avoid the same fate as Kodak, Blackberry or Pioneer...

Those companies have 0 interest in dedicated graphics. I guarantee you this. The lucrative money is not in graphics. Integrated graphics is a necessary beast, so they spend nominal R&D dollars on it.

Buran · Jun 6, 2018

Kieli said:
Those companies have 0 interest in dedicated graphics. I guarantee you this. The lucrative money is not in graphics. Integrated graphics is a necessary beast, so they spend nominal R&D dollars on it.

And Disney had 0 interest in super-hero comic books, and Apple had 0 interest in the automotive industry. Times change; some of those could end buying AMD and injecting the resources to put them ahead the same way that VW bought Bentley and now is selling 12k units a year at base price above 200k €.

Plus, even if nothing happens, that doesn't grant that people will keep buying your products: sales in the discrete GPU market for games are shrinking and when the cryptocurrency mining bubble explodes maybe Nvidia could find that players are no longer interested in their products. I myself have currently no hype for new "graphic milestone games" since the arrival and fall of Crysis. My last three GPUs (including a GTX 690 nad a GTX 1070) were well above the 500 € (paid near 1k € for the 690 at the time). I have 0 plans to pay above 300 bucks for trhe next one, despite I'm currently planing to replace my DellU2711 display (~970 €) for a 21:9 1k+ € in a year or so (because high res in widescreen is cool, even for passive uses as Netflix or Twitch).

thisismadness · Jun 6, 2018

Thats fine with me. My 1080ti hasnt yet been stressed @1440 and it'll probably be another year or two before 4k/HDR is well supported and at comfortable price point for me.

Deleted member 33887 · Jun 6, 2018

I'm trying to imagine AMD making a similar statement without their stock imploding over night. Yeah... can't see it.

Deleted member 22630 · Jun 6, 2018

Huh, I wonder why I don't believe him.

shark97 · Jun 6, 2018

ShinySunny said:
Game graphic requirements are slowing down.
The best graphic right now is ironically coming from a console.
I still haven't see a wowzer game on PC that matches up with UC4, Horizon, and GOW yet.
I guess the only close contender would be TW3, and it is a 3yrs old game.

If you like 1080P 30 FPS

It's easy to subjectively say "look, teh best graphics". Objective metrics though, they fall plainly short of the best.

I think BFV if it approaches that trailer (which I'm guessing on maxed PC at least it will), beats all those anyway.

Anyways I doubt you've seen maxed PC games in person, on a nice ultrawide monitor. Even lowly Destiny 2 on PC/1080 Ti rig, there's something about it, it might look better than the best console game. Lowly Destiny.

shark97 · Jun 6, 2018

AlsoZ said:
Considering AMD has been steps behind Nvidia for years now, that would only put them on equal footing.

If by several steps you mean a whopping 0-20% slower at the highest end depending on generation. Hyperbole.

Toxik · Jun 6, 2018

ShinySunny said:
Game graphic requirements are slowing down.
The best graphic right now is ironically coming from a console.
I still haven't see a wowzer game on PC that matches up with UC4, Horizon, and GOW yet.
I guess the only close contender would be TW3, and it is a 3yrs old game.

Either you don't have a powerful PC or you don't have a PC at all.

Khamsinvera · Jun 6, 2018

ShinySunny said:
Game graphic requirements are slowing down.
The best graphic right now is ironically coming from a console.
I still haven't see a wowzer game on PC that matches up with UC4, Horizon, and GOW yet.
I guess the only close contender would be TW3, and it is a 3yrs old game.

Ra · Jun 6, 2018

The whole "they are purposely delaying because AMD is giving no competition" angle is embarrassingly laughable. Nvidia hasn't treated AMD like competition in how long now? Nvidia never left billions sitting on the table because AMD hadn't lunged for them yet.

Try thinking more critically. Has the GDDR6 memory controller completed mass production yet?

Freshmaker · Jun 6, 2018

GameZone said:
Is it that stupid to buy a 1080 at this point?

In a sense. A 1070ti makes more sense in a lot of respects right now.

DopeyFish · Jun 6, 2018

Ex-Actarus said:
Do we know why ?

Moore's Law is coming to an end.

We're nearing the physical constraints of silicon and are working on replacing with other materials or vertical stacking. This stuff may take a while to solve. We've got 2 solid shrinks left and that's it. Companies want to spread out as best as possible but truth be told we may hit a wall for at least a decade or more when we hit 5nm.

OryoN · Jun 6, 2018

K.Jack said:
Try thinking more critically. Has the GDDR6 memory controller completed mass production yet?

This was what I believe Nvidia is waiting on. Architecture refinements are minor these days. Their next line of GPUs are gonna need the kind of significant performance boost from things like better memory tech.
It's unlike Nvidia to not take advantage of the newest standard for memory tech, as soon as it makes sense for them to do.

They're not on the HBM2 bandwagon. It's great tech but far from "industry standard." This statement from Nvidia may be directly related to their Gddr6-GPU roadmap, so whatever "a long time" means, the minimum waiting period would be around the time that memory is good & ready. With AMD still pushing HBM2, trying to get it cheaper & faster, it seems unlikely they'll get that Gddr6-GPU ball rolling anytime soon. A "long time" is truly begining to sound... umm... long! :o

Anything 'new' in 2018 seems hopeless. 2019 around this time, perhaps?

Ra · Jun 6, 2018

OryoN said:
This was what I believe Nvidia is waiting on. Architecture refinements are minor these days. Their next line of GPUs are gonna need the kind of significant performance boost from things like better memory tech.
It's unlike Nvidia to not take advantage of the newest standard for memory tech, as soon as it makes sense for them to do.

They're not on the HBM2 bandwagon. It's great tech but far from "industry standard." This statement from Nvidia may be directly related to their Gddr6-GPU roadmap, so whatever "a long time" means, the minimum waiting period would be around the time that memory is good & ready. With AMD still pushing HBM2, trying to get it cheaper & faster, it seems unlikely they'll get that Gddr6-GPU ball rolling anytime soon. A "long time" is truly begining to sound... umm... long! :o

Anything 'new' in 2018 seems hopeless. 2019 around this time, perhaps?

My question was a sarcastic rhetorical, as a jab. The SK Hynix GDDR6 they are contracted to use is supposed to start mass production this month, according to a GamerNexus source. They may also be using Samsung, of course, but everything still points to a Q3 or early Q4 launch.

ShinySunny · Jun 6, 2018

Toxik said:
Either you don't have a powerful PC or you don't have a PC at all.

Sure, my i5 and 1080 can't do high/ultra+4K combo like most of your guys higher end, but it is good enough for everything else.
Clearer and sharper resolutions of environment, shadow and objects and even draw distance don't really impressive me since those stuffs have always been a part of PC gaming.
So I don't know why you guys are still impressed by those kind of things too. It is just there and has always been there.
It is just another one of those check the boxes stuff when you are talking about PC gaming.

But if we are talking about facial animations and textures, they aren't good enough on PC when I compared PC games to Horizon/UC/Detriot/GOW.
Even MGS5 with its focus and close ups of NPC faces aren't that impressive. I wouldn't notice a difference if you do PS MGS5 vs PC MGS5 during those close ups.

The largest difference between console and PC would be the gameplay part, but overall, graphic to me hasn't improve at all for the last 5yrs.
Just more crisp imagery to me.
You guys played a lot of PC games, and you guys don't have that feeling?
Stuff aren't hyper-realistic enough and we are just stuck with close enough realistic graphic instead while facial and animation haven't really improved.
I guess fur physics is beastly on PC year after year, so there's that right?

Gxgear · Jun 6, 2018

Me: My Radeon 7950's still good right?

7950: Kill...*gasps*...me...

Doctor Shatner · Jun 6, 2018

Nvidia is focusing *hard* on the machine learning market right now, I wouldn't be surprised if that much R&D has delayed their gaming line more than usual (along with the mining craze). But I still think they'll start to drop a new line before the year is over.

TSM · Jun 7, 2018

Doctor Shatner said:
Nvidia is focusing *hard* on the machine learning market right now, I wouldn't be surprised if that much R&D has delayed their gaming line more than usual (along with the mining craze). But I still think they'll start to drop a new line before the year is over.

AMD waved the white flag for the high end stuff, and both companies immediately sell out of every video card that hits the market due to miners. There's just no incentive for Nvidia to hurry the next hardware out right now. As you said it's probably more profitable to concentrate on the machine learning market until either AMD steps up or consumer card sales slow down.

BananasAreMyLife · Jun 7, 2018

This is awesome news!

Durante · Jun 7, 2018

Buran said:
sales in the discrete GPU market for games are shrinking

Source?
NV's games revenue was growing even before the crypto boom.

Deleted member 198 · Jun 7, 2018

So basically they're holding their GPUs back while waiting to see what AMD does next. The same way Intel held Coffee Lake back.

Hoxworth · Jun 7, 2018

GameZone said:
Is it that stupid to buy a 1080 at this point?

Considering the leaks have pointed towards a 1080-level AMD card at a $250 price point next year, I'd say if you do end up doing that, make sure you sell it before the AMD cards are announced.

KingOfDyslexics · Jun 7, 2018

I bought the 970 3 years ago and no game except Arkham knight has gotten a full play through. The quality games are on console now. I don't see a single pc game I wish was playing.

CthulhuSars · Jun 7, 2018

Magwik said:
So basically they're holding their GPUs back while waiting to see what AMD does next. The same way Intel held Coffee Lake back.

If they are holding anything back I doubt it is a wait and see approach to AMD. NVIDIA cards are flying off the shelves still so why release or talk about releasing things in the near future if there is still a market for what they currently have.

Pooh · Jun 7, 2018

The Bookerman said:
I've had my 970 for 4 years now. I want a big jump in performance on new architechture for god's sake.

Yep, same

AlsoZ · Jun 7, 2018

shark97 said:
If by several steps you mean a whopping 0-20% slower at the highest end depending on generation. Hyperbole.

I didn't mean "generational step" or anything, but in terms of performance per watt they were simply behind (except on a few particularly programmed/optimized games) and had no answer for the Ti line.
At no point in the last few years did any AMD card seem attractive for gaming, particularly with the jacked up prices from mining that hit AMD harder than Nvidia. And believe me, I would have loved to buy a decent AMD card since I have a FreeSync-capable monitor.

Cripterion · Jun 7, 2018

shark97 said:
If you like 1080P 30 FPS

It's easy to subjectively say "look, teh best graphics". Objective metrics though, they fall plainly short of the best.

I think BFV if it approaches that trailer (which I'm guessing on maxed PC at least it will), beats all those anyway.

Anyways I doubt you've seen maxed PC games in person, on a nice ultrawide monitor. Even lowly Destiny 2 on PC/1080 Ti rig, there's something about it, it might look better than the best console game. Lowly Destiny.

Toxik said:
Either you don't have a powerful PC or you don't have a PC at all.

Khamsinvera said:

So what?! I play on pc with GTX1080 and a 27"Gsync monitor @144hz and while the higher framerates are always nice and make it hard to go back to 30fps games, I definitely agree with the him in saying the output on PS4 has been quite impressive as of late. Games like Far Cry 5 look and play nice on pc with all the bells and whistles but I haven't impressed in comparison to Detroit, God of War, Horizon or the Uncharted expansion.

dgrdsv · Jun 7, 2018

Doctor Shatner said:
Nvidia is focusing *hard* on the machine learning market right now, I wouldn't be surprised if that much R&D has delayed their gaming line more than usual (along with the mining craze).

R&D for whatever will launch this year has been mostly completed before the launch of Pascal.

tokkun · Jun 7, 2018

dgrdsv said:
R&D for whatever will launch this year has been mostly completed before the launch of Pascal.

I imagine the real issue is that these products are competing for the same limited amount of manufacturing capacity. The severe shortages from the crypto boom suggest that they don't have much excess stock, and they probably get better margins on both their data center products and the current gen gaming cards than they would from the next gen. If they can sell everything they make and there is no strong competitor on the horizon to grab market share, there isn't much financial incentive to switch over to the new products.

1-D_FE · Jun 7, 2018

DopeyFish said:
Moore's Law is coming to an end.

We're nearing the physical constraints of silicon and are working on replacing with other materials or vertical stacking. This stuff may take a while to solve. We've got 2 solid shrinks left and that's it. Companies want to spread out as best as possible but truth be told we may hit a wall for at least a decade or more when we hit 5nm.

I enjoy the conspiracy theorists who post here and say it's about a lack of commitment. Whoever compared them to the fusion crowd nailed it on the head. You've always got someone claiming we're on the brink of that, too, but it seems like you can go back 50 years and find that same belief. We're definitely screwed going forward. That said, give TSMC and GloFo some credit, because their transition to 7nm was shockingly smooth. It doesn't mean squat for the future, but it means we can at least get a rapid transition to 7nm before things really start to settle into a long, depressing slog.

I suppose AI could evolve so rapidly, they solve the issue. Just have to hope they don't elect to terminate us parasites in that scenario.

Yabab · Jun 7, 2018

AgainstTheCurrent said:
GPU technology slowing down is really shit.

Might be good for games though. If we stop chasing that graphics goose, we could start focusing on other things.

Genio88 · Jun 7, 2018

With what console are offering there is no need of new graphics cards at all right now, i'm more interested in seeing the next Nvidia Tegra chip for the future Switch Pro instead

dgrdsv · Jun 7, 2018

tokkun said:
I imagine the real issue is that these products are competing for the same limited amount of manufacturing capacity. The severe shortages from the crypto boom suggest that they don't have much excess stock, and they probably get better margins on both their data center products and the current gen gaming cards than they would from the next gen. If they can sell everything they make and there is no strong competitor on the horizon to grab market share, there isn't much financial incentive to switch over to the new products.

Crypto buyers had about 10% stake in their income from gaming h/w sales during the quarter where crypto demand was on its peak. This is hardly something which would prompt them to delay launching new gaming cards as the other 90% of their gaming market income solely depends on continued improvement of their gaming GPUs. They need new h/w to continue selling it to gamers.

Pwnz · Jun 7, 2018

I'm not surprised. The 1080 ti runs virtually everything at max settings at 4k at near 60 fps. The next generation will probably be on par or a bit weaker than it. They are so far ahead of AMD it makes more sense to redo architecture for power efficiency.

ShinUltramanJ · Jun 7, 2018

I don't believe it. I'm preparing for something to hit this summer.

Arkeband · Jun 7, 2018

I'm somewhat alright with this - I need to upgrade my 970, but I also need to upgrade everything else and don't have the funds right now. Maybe by the time they release their next line I can just grab a new cpu and mobo.

Netherscourge · Jun 7, 2018

4K is a very long plateau, even longer than 1080p was. Once 60 fps+ at 4K becomes a pushover for GPUs, we're probably going to camping out there for a long time.

Heck, I'm perfectly happy at 1080p on my GTX980. I have no desire to upgrade that. 1080p has pretty long legs for the mainstream.

Everyone has a sweet spot and it's not the latest greatest. It's usually the cheapest compromise with the least sacrifice.

Duxxy3 · Jun 7, 2018

Arkeband said:
I'm somewhat alright with this - I need to upgrade my 970, but I also need to upgrade everything else and don't have the funds right now. Maybe by the time they release their next line I can just grab a new cpu and mobo.

What do you have for a CPU?

Saruzão · Jun 7, 2018

I still have the 780 Ti with 3 GB VRAM

JLP101 · Jun 7, 2018

Gxgear said:
Me: My Radeon 7950's still good right?

7950: Kill...*gasps*...me...

I too am using a hd 7950 and its working just fine at 1080 so far. Granted some games released last year and this year it won't be able to handle it but thats ok. :)

pestul · Jun 7, 2018

I'm still chugging along on this 970 (good overclock) as well. That said, I'm doing a lot more 1080p Steam Link gaming lately, and that card still handles it quite well. Sure there are a few settings (like FFXVs TRAM) that I'd like to crank up, but I'll make do. I'll keep my eye out for a 1080ti performing AMD card later this year on the cheap though.. It feels like we need a big shake up in the gpu market.

Coulomb_Barrier · Jun 7, 2018

There's split reaction to Huang's statement.

Some tech sites say he's likely lying and there will be a new GeForce in July/August. The other half say he's speaking honestly, and we're looking at 2019.

I don't know what to believe.

Arkeband · Jun 7, 2018

Duxxy3 said:
What do you have for a CPU?

i7-970.
https://ark.intel.com/products/4793...ocessor-12M-Cache-3_20-GHz-4_80-GTs-Intel-QPI

Got it for $200 (retailed for $1000) in 2010 through an Intel-Geek Squad promotion, it's been my trusty steed ever since.

It also came with a badass heatsink and fan that I'm still using to this day.

Duxxy3 · Jun 7, 2018

Arkeband said:
i7-970.
https://ark.intel.com/products/4793...ocessor-12M-Cache-3_20-GHz-4_80-GTs-Intel-QPI

Got it for $200 (retailed for $1000) in 2010 through an Intel-Geek Squad promotion, it's been my trusty steed ever since.

It also came with a badass heatsink and fan that I'm still using to this day.

Yeah that's about due for replacement. Maybe sometime between now and when the next GPU's come out.

Damn good deal on that.

Bomblord · Jun 7, 2018

I can see this having the opposite of the intended affect (keep buying our 10 series GPU's guys!) if AMD's next GPU really does have 1080 level performance at a mid-range price point.

Forum
GPUBUYERMAN "Should I get this 1080 level AMD or wait for Nvidia's next offering?"
PCEXPERTGUY "*links to quote* Nvidia doesn't have any gaming GPU's coming soon so why wait? And there's no reason to spend an extra 300 on an Nvidia card for the same general performance"

N00MKRAD · Jun 7, 2018

AgainstTheCurrent said:
GPU technology slowing down is really shit.

It's only getting faster, Nvidia generational improvements always increased over the last years.

Pretty sure 1080>980 is about 70% while it was only around 40% from Kepler to Maxwell.

Anastasis · Jun 7, 2018

I caught the end of AMD's Computex talk and during the GPU talks they had a roadmap with only 2017 on one end and 2020 on the other. But they did say that they commit to having a new GPU every year. It seems AMD is holding their cards pretty close to their chest as well. Wasn't it the 480 announcement that nVidia responded to last time with their 10-series?

Deleted member 11093 · Jun 7, 2018

Wintermute said:
fucksake. still sitting on my 970 waiting for the next gen to come out. no-way i'm getting a 1080ti this late in the game.

I'm on the exact same boat, I really need to upgrade before BF5.
Hurry the fuck up Nvidia.

Lashley · Jun 7, 2018

ShinySunny said:
Game graphic requirements are slowing down.
The best graphic right now is ironically coming from a console.
I still haven't see a wowzer game on PC that matches up with UC4, Horizon, and GOW yet.
I guess the only close contender would be TW3, and it is a 3yrs old game.

KingOfDyslexics said:
I bought the 970 3 years ago and no game except Arkham knight has gotten a full play through. The quality games are on console now. I don't see a single pc game I wish was playing.

Cripterion said:
So what?! I play on pc with GTX1080 and a 27"Gsync monitor @144hz and while the higher framerates are always nice and make it hard to go back to 30fps games, I definitely agree with the him in saying the output on PS4 has been quite impressive as of late. Games like Far Cry 5 look and play nice on pc with all the bells and whistles but I haven't impressed in comparison to Detroit, God of War, Horizon or the Uncharted expansion.

Seriously, what do these posts add to this thread?

Nvidia CEO says next gaming GPU announcement won’t be for ‘a long time’

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