Pokémon Let's Go Eevee/Pikachu (Switch) announced; coming Nov 16th 2018

Include said:

You are free to your opinion and I am free to mine, it's not entitlement to want improvements and more features from a next generation game and not less, else I won't buy as simple as that, I am free to be disappointed and if you are excited about it, good for you I don't have to feel or react the same way you do. Crazy concept, I know.

It's naive to think that if this versions is a huge success they won't follow the same formula in the future, maybe not for the next year one (after all this game is testing the water) but perhaps for what's yet to come. Corporate follows money it's as simple as that and thus my comment (which regardless I knew it wasn't nice and I said as much) but I feel what I feel and again I am free to do so and express it.

The argument for kids accessibility is laughable, I played Pokémon as a kid and as of now my nieces who are 6 years old and are playing just fine as well. And so far from the sales on all of these years kids all over the world were playing Pokémon with no issues. Pokémon has always been accessible and family friendly, removing features doesn't make it more so. No reasons to remove Pokémon battles and breeding, they are rooted in the concept of the game.

Anyhow, removing features that have been part of the franchise from the beginning is reason enough for me to worry for the future as well as following a more mobile phone games formula and be disappointed, so get off your high horses please and drop the unnecessary name calling and higher than thou attitude.

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My thoughts exactly.

fourfourfun said:

Was Pokemon capturing before basically Quina FF9's Eat but for the entire game? Because if so, that can be dumbed down and fat reduced to the maximum.

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No, because you can capture pokemon even if they more than a quarter of their HP and you always see how much HP they have left.

Firestorm said:

This contempt for players coming from Go and chest thumping about mainline games is really stupid. It's not that capturing being simpler this way that's important so much as it's more engaging and familiar. This is going to be more enjoyable for kids too and makes use of the joycons. And let's them sell a probably $40 - $50 accessory. Pokémon makes a lot more profit on the accessory than the game.

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I like Go, but I feel this game doesn't capture what makes Go or the mainline games interesting.

I have no doubt it will sell well. 10-15 million is likely, but I do doubt that it will be a good game and that people will be satisfied with it.

For Go only players, it lacks dynamism. Instead of being able to go anywhere, you are hinged to the story which is certainly going to be more linear than Gen I. The back and forth between gym ownership, the idea that ANY Pokémon could appear right next to you, exploring new places in real life to find new creatures, AR goofiness, community events, none of that is here. Only the brain dead catch mechanic.

For lapsed fans who haven't played since Gen I, it's going to be jarring if this game is loaded with Sun/Moon tier cutscenes interrupting you instead of the relative freedom and quick storybeats from the original games, or unengaging due to simplified mechanics. And who are these people? Did they not get their fill with Pokémon Go? They weren't enticed to pick up Sun/Moon? I can just see people who go from Gen I to this thinking, "Was Pokémon always like this?"

For current Pokémon fans, this game has no new features, simplified mechanics, and probably no way to connect past or future titles. What's here for these players? I get to dress up Pikachu? Ok that's good I'll give them that.

In short, given what we know and what we have seen, I don't think this game is going to satisfy any camp.

Forkball said:

I like Go, but I feel this game doesn't capture what makes Go or the mainline games interesting.

I have no doubt it will sell well. 10-15 million is likely, but I do doubt that it will be a good game and that people will be satisfied with it.

For Go only players, it lacks dynamism. Instead of being able to go anywhere, you are hinged to the story which is certainly going to be more linear than Gen I. The back and forth between gym ownership, the idea that ANY Pokémon could appear right next to you, exploring new places in real life to find new creatures, AR goofiness, community events, none of that is here. Only the brain dead catch mechanic.

For lapsed fans who haven't played since Gen I, it's going to be jarring if this game is loaded with Sun/Moon tier cutscenes interrupting you instead of the relative freedom and quick storybeats from the original games, or unengaging due to simplified mechanics. And who are these people? Did they not get their fill with Pokémon Go? They weren't enticed to pick up Sun/Moon? I can just see people who go from Gen I to this thinking, "Was Pokémon always like this?"

For current Pokémon fans, this game has no new features, simplified mechanics, and probably no way to connect past or future titles. What's here for these players? I get to dress up Pikachu? Ok that's good I'll give them that.

In short, given what we know and what we have seen, I don't think this game is going to satisfy any camp.

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If it won't satisfy both camp, how would it sell 10-15M?

Include said:

You are free to your opinion and I am free to mine, it's not entitlement to want improvements and more features from a next generation game and not less, else I won't buy as simple as that, I am free to be disappointed and if you are excited about it, good for you I don't have to feel or react the same way you do. Crazy concept, I know.

It's naive to think that if this versions is a huge success they won't follow the same formula in the future, maybe not for the next year one (after all this game is testing the water) but perhaps for what's yet to come. Corporate follows money it's as simple as that and thus my comment (which regardless I knew it wasn't nice and I said as much) but I feel what I feel and again I am free to do so and express it.

The argument for kids accessibility is laughable, I played Pokémon as a kid and as of now my nieces who are 6 years old and are playing just fine as well. And so far from the sales on all of these years kids all over the world were playing Pokémon with no issues. Pokémon has always been accessible and family friendly, removing features doesn't make it more so. No reasons to remove Pokémon battles and breeding, they are rooted in the concept of the game.

Anyhow, removing features that have been part of the franchise from the beginning is reason enough for me to worry for the future as well as following a more mobile phone games formula and be disappointed, so get off your high horses please and drop the unnecessary name calling and higher than thou attitude.

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To be fair you saying "I want the game to bomb" is quite a selfish attitude. It basically you saying that you want them to keep making the games just for you and that they aren't allowed to cater to anyone else just because you are a hardcore fan.

Serebii said:

A core gameplay element isn't "trimming the fat".

Removing redundant items is trimming the fat. Removing useless elements is trimming the fat

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What is the point of wild pokemon battles ? I would say that it can be to catch a new species or train your current Pokemon, don't you agree ?

- Training/grinding could be still found in these games by having an item that let you challenge again trainers like in previous games. It would also be more efficient because it gives you more EXP.

- The catching part is interesting. What is essential about it ? The system of weaking the wild Pokemon is indeed rewarding. However with the hunting methods, you can catch 90% of the Pokemon by your second turn. What is the challenge/reward in that ? I am hoping that you'll have to face the legendaries/event Pokemon (like in Go with raids), that wy you won't lose the tension in the 10% of interesting Pokemon to catch.

- If you don't really want to do either of those you still could use repel in the previous games. However, you don't want to miss the rarest Pokemon of the zone that have low chances to appear and sometimes you'll endure the Zubats because of this hope. With this new system you can do both.

It might not be the best idea/implementation at the end of the day but I think it is an interesting take and deserves to be tried.

Lelouch0612 said:

They already said that the games next year won't be influenced by GO.

Is it impossible/unthinkable to have a more accessible game to help GO players, kids, lapsed players, family demographic to enjoy and discover the world of Pokemon ?
.

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1. I don't believe them, especially when this game sells a ton.

2. Sun/Moon was already too simple and too easy for my damn niece who was 8 at the time. Unless you are trying to get into the competitive scene the game is already insanely simple.

iamsgod said:

If it won't satisfy both camp, how would it sell 10-15M?

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Marketing. The ultimate proof would be the pre-owned bin in retail, if it's filled to the brim with used LGP/E copies a month after the release date there you have it. We've seen it before with other high-profile "too big to fail" series.

Nilaul said:

I hope they keep some of the let's go changes for the 2019 game as they might actually be positive. I like the idea of wild pokemon roaming around.

Wasn't it also rumoured that the battle system would be revamped and potentially be real time? I can't see that being the case in Let's go, perhaps its the case for the 2019 game?

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It was stated that the new game next year won't have anything to do with Pokémon go

iamsgod said:

If it won't satisfy both camp, how would it sell 10-15M?

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Pokemon being an incredibly strong brand + TPC's being really good at marketing + novelty of a "mainline" Pokemon game on consoles.

Beje said:

Marketing. The ultimate proof would be the pre-owned bin in retail, if it's filled to the brim with used LGP/E copies a month after the release date there you have it. We've seen it before with other high-profile "too big to fail" series.

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What you've just explained is pretty much every single player focused game out there (yes Pokemon will have battling but it's not exactly a major multiplayer experience). I've seen plenty of GoW on pre-owned shelves and that's not exactly a bad game now is it?

Worth bringing up: These were two of those "Unannounced Titles" for Switch that Amazon listed a while back.

Lelouch0612 said:

X/Y shipped 4m WW at launch (2 days).

It sold 125k in France in a week. S/M sold 425k in its first week with the same shipment as LGP/LGE.

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See, I find that a lot more interesting. It implies they're expecting it to sell better than X/Y did at a similar point in the 3DS's lifecycle. Which is both a testament to how well they think it's going to do on its own merits and how well the Switch is doing.

steviejd1 said:

What you've just explained is pretty much every single player focused game out there (yes Pokemon will have battling but it's not exactly a major multiplayer experience). I've seen plenty of GoW on pre-owned shelves and that's not exactly a bad game now is it?

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I know it and that's normal, but I refer to the scale of other games like Final Fantasy XIII, I remember a period where a local GAME I went to wouldn't even accept more trade ins of that one because it felt like 30% of all the volume in the pre-owned bin was FFXIII. The same has happened with other high-profile long-hyped releases that eventually flopped with the audience despite "selling well".

I'm not really understanding people who want new Pokemon all the time. Like are you actually looking forward to a day where there are 1500 different Pokemon to catch ? The more new Pokemon, the more elitist the franchise becomes because there's no way you can "catch em all" anymore which, mind you, is the whole motto of the franchise.

I am very glad when there are games with 0 new Pokemon.

Lelouch0612 said:

What is the point of wild pokemon battles ? I would say that it can be to catch a new species or train your current Pokemon, don't you agree ?

- The catching part is interesting. What is essential about it ? The system of weaking the wild Pokemon is indeed rewarding. However with the hunting methods, you can catch 90% of the Pokemon by your second turn. What is the challenge/reward in that ? I am hoping that you'll have to face the legendaries/event Pokemon (like in Go with raids), that wy you won't lose the tension in the 10% of interesting Pokemon to catch.

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With Quick Balls, you can catch most Pokémon without even fighting them already

Do we have any idea how the stat system will work for these games? Seeing as they need to be compatible with GO they surely won't have the traditional Attack, Defence, Sp. Atk etc of old. This reboot could be the chance for GF to finally address balance and power-creep issues in the series but if they use GO's system, I fear they will make the problem worse. Giving us only two options for ghost types and steel types will be awful too

Pokémon fans are the worst... i don't really understand the complaints here.

Let's Go P/E are meant to Go users, kids, nostalgics and fans who wanted for so long a Pokémon game for the TV at least in HD.

Capcom did the exact same thing with Monster Hunter World, making MH much more accessible with QoL improvements but also cutting off more than half of the contents, and people are happy.

Here people hope the game to bomb, despite Game Freak is giving love to everyone with:
- Pokémon Quest which is already available, very light action-rpg free to play;
- Let's Go P/E for the audience described above;
- direct sequel to Sun/Moon for hardcore fans next year;

Yes, we do have so many questions without an answer about Let's Go P/E but that's perfect cause now all eyes are on them, and they can show more in new Directs or E3.

wiill64 said:

With Quick Balls, you can catch most Pokémon without even fighting them already

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You get quick balls very late

I think people are seeing this the wrong way around.

Sure, it will help get some Go players to try a Switch and the mainline games.

But it will also get more mainstream players into Go. The integration will mean that playing Go is a big help. And the more players that play Go, the more revenue that the Pokemon company get. Go is where the big money is at, not in the RPG instalments.

Phil Good said:

I'm not really understanding people who want new Pokemon all the time. Like are you actually looking forward to a day where there are 1500 different Pokemon to catch ? The more new Pokemon, the more elitist the franchise becomes because there's no way you can "catch em all" anymore which, mind you, is the whole motto of the franchise.

I am very glad when there are games with 0 new Pokemon.

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"catch 'em all" hasn't been the motto of the franchise since like 15 years ago. And all games offer a curated selection of 150-250 different Pokémon in the region between new and old to capture so it's always very self-contained so I don't get the complaint and the obsession of always going back to the old 151 most people are already sick of. What's that bad about not knowing what will pop out next, what typing is it, how can you counter it if a trainer throws it at your face, and in what kind of monster it evolves? Since Black/White we've almost completely lost that feeling.

I think your post is the ultimate proof that the people that complaint the most about Pokémon and constantly demand it to change to fit their rose tinted vision of the series back when the Pokémania happened are the people that, save it for Red/Blue in 1998 and probably Gold/Silver, have never touched a game in the series in the past 18 years and are just talking without even having an idea of what's Pokémon nowadays.

steviejd1 said:

To be fair you saying "I want the game to bomb" is quite a selfish attitude. It basically you saying that you want them to keep making the games just for you and that they aren't allowed to cater to anyone else just because you are a hardcore fan.

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It's just my own feelings and desires but don't you worry I don't have magical powers so it's not gonna happen just because I want it to, and yes it is selfish that's because it's indeed my own desire and hopes, is it not nice? Yes it is not and I said as much. So what's your point?

I'm not supposed to talk about it? Does it offend you to have people not being hypocrite and express their inner feelings, opinions and disappointment? We are in a forum people have different opinions, you don't like mine and it's OK, it doesn't mean people should insults each others for their own worries, concerns and hope just because they disagree.

As an exemple, some people are OK and support lootboxes and micro transactions and some don't and hope the trends stop and games with it to bomb, it's two side with different opinions and hopes, to each their own and to each their reasons, I outlined mine and that's that.

Include said:

You are free to your opinion and I am free to mine, it's not entitlement to want improvements and more features from a next generation game and not less, else I won't buy as simple as that, I am free to be disappointed and if you are excited about it, good for you I don't have to feel or react the same way you do. Crazy concept, I know.

It's naive to think that if this versions is a huge success they won't follow the same formula in the future, maybe not for the next year one (after all this game is testing the water) but perhaps for what's yet to come. Corporate follows money it's as simple as that and thus my comment (which regardless I knew it wasn't nice and I said as much) but I feel what I feel and again I am free to do so and express it.

The argument for kids accessibility is laughable, I played Pokémon as a kid and as of now my nieces who are 6 years old and are playing just fine as well. And so far from the sales on all of these years kids all over the world were playing Pokémon with no issues. Pokémon has always been accessible and family friendly, removing features doesn't make it more so. No reasons to remove Pokémon battles and breeding, they are rooted in the concept of the game.

Anyhow, removing features that have been part of the franchise from the beginning is reason enough for me to worry for the future as well as following a more mobile phone games formula and be disappointed, so get off your high horses please and drop the unnecessary name calling and higher than thou attitude.

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You can spin it in the way you want, wishing a game to bomb is a selfish and negative attitude.

I am playing the games for 20 years now and I look forward to the 2019 games. However I see potential in these upcoming titles and think that some aspects could enhance the experience of the more traditional games (local co-op, wild Pokemon in the overworld...).

The main formula can improve and the best way to do it is by testing features. It is unacceptable that IVs are better explained in Pokemon Go than in the main games for example.

Battling against trainers is still the same and is the core of the game with trading. The catching mechanic is a new take but the previous one was really easy thanks to Rapid Balls. It could be better, it could be worse, we'll know when we try.

Include said:

It's just my own feelings and desires but don't you worry I don't have magical powers so it's not gonna happen just because I want it to, and yes it is selfish that's because it's indeed my own desire and hopes, is it not nice? Yes it is not and I said as much. So what's your point?

I'm not supposed to talk about it? Does it offend you to have people not being hypocrite and express their inner feelings, opinions and disappointment? We are in a forum people have different opinions, you don't like mine and it's OK, it doesn't mean people should insults each others for their own worries, concerns and hope just because they disagree.

As an exemple, some people are OK and support lootboxes and micro transactions and some don't and hope the trends stop and games with it to bomb, it's two side with different opinions and hopes, to each their own and to each their reasons, I outlined mine and that's that.

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You can say what you like and I am allowed to call you out as being selfish. There's not really much else to say.

Shugga said:

You get quick balls very late

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That's a fair point, I know you got them pretty late in D/P/Pt but I think in Sun/Moon you could get them by around the halfway point.

Phil Good said:

I'm not really understanding people who want new Pokemon all the time. Like are you actually looking forward to a day where there are 1500 different Pokemon to catch ? The more new Pokemon, the more elitist the franchise becomes because there's no way you can "catch em all" anymore which, mind you, is the whole motto of the franchise.

I am very glad when there are games with 0 new Pokemon.

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Cath Em All hasn;t been the motto of the series for a long time now. They dropped that tag line back when Ruby/Sapphire came out.

New pokemon means more options which means more variety, which means better battles. The more the merrier I say.

Lelouch0612 said:

Gosh what is wrong with you people ?

They already said that the games next year won't be influenced by GO.

Is it impossible/unthinkable to have a more accessible game to help GO players, kids, lapsed players, family demographic to enjoy and discover the world of Pokemon ?

2D Mario didn't threaten 3D Mario despite selling way more during the Wii era. It is infuriating to read all these entitled comments knowing that a lot of new players are enthousiastic about the games and a craving to discover the franchise.

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Well that kinda isn't true since the next 3d Mario games became super linear with a timer like the 2d games.

Godzilla's Left Toe said:

Well that kinda isn't true since the next 3d Mario games became super linear with a timer like the 2d games.

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And Super Mario 3D World is near the best 3D Mario game.

Lelouch0612 said:

What is the point of wild pokemon battles ? I would say that it can be to catch a new species or train your current Pokemon, don't you agree ?

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By that logic, battling any monster in a RPG is pointless. At least give me the option to battle it,there is no excuse for this.

Dark Cloud said:

And Super Mario 3D World is near the best 3D Mario game.

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In your opinion.

Phil Good said:

I'm not really understanding people who want new Pokemon all the time. Like are you actually looking forward to a day where there are 1500 different Pokemon to catch ? The more new Pokemon, the more elitist the franchise becomes because there's no way you can "catch em all" anymore which, mind you, is the whole motto of the franchise.

I am very glad when there are games with 0 new Pokemon.

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Why do you need to get rid of the Pokémon that are already there though? Why do my favorites need to be taken away?

Plus I like seeing new Pokémon. It's fun. Who cares if you can't catch them all? Even in Gen 1 I never cared about doing that.

This game just... Really doesn't look fun to me. I'll wait on 2019 Pokemon

Dark Cloud said:

And Super Mario 3D World is near the best 3D Mario game.

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It's better than Sunshine and 3d Land But 64 Galaxy games and Oddesy are all better.

Godzilla's Left Toe said:

Well that kinda isn't true since the next 3d Mario games became super linear with a timer like the 2d games.

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Wasn't Super Mario Galaxy 2 after NSMBWii ?

I feel like trying new things is important for a franchise and it is very difficult to do it with the core Pokemon games.

So I am glad that they are doing this game to experiment while retaining the series' idendity.

CormoranStrike said:

In your opinion.

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Thanks for telling me. I didn't know that. Better than overrated Odyssey and Mario 64.

Crazy Izanagi said:

Why do you need to get rid of the Pokémon that are already there though? Why do my favorites need to be taken away?

Plus I like seeing new Pokémon. It's fun. Who cares if you can't catch them all? Even in Gen 1 I never cared about doing that.

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I didn't say I like having only the original 151, I said I'm happy that we have one extra year without them expanding beyond 807.

Godzilla's Left Toe said:

It's better than Sunshine and 3d Land But 64 Galaxy games and Oddesy are all better.

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This guy gets it.

iamsgod said:

If it won't satisfy both camp, how would it sell 10-15M?

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Little kids who will buy any game with Pokemon on it. They don't mind if a Pokemon is from gen 1, 3, 4 or 7.

For the other groups that may be swayed, having only gen 1 is a turn off (even for go players that have access up to Gen 3, with Gen 4 likely to be short around the corner.)

Omegamon said:

By that logic, battling any monster in a RPG is pointless. At least give me the option to battle it,there is no excuse for this.

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You can battle trainers.

This give me every option available mentality is what makes the mainline games such bloated messes.

Lelouch0612 said:

You can spin it in the way you want, wishing a game to bomb is a selfish and negative attitude.

I am playing the games for 20 years now and I look forward to the 2019 games. However I see potential in these upcoming titles and think that some aspects could enhance the experience of the more traditional games (local co-op, wild Pokemon in the overworld...).

The main formula can improve and the best way to do it is by testing features. It is unacceptable that IVs are better explained in Pokemon Go than in the main games for example.

Battling against trainers is still the same and is the core of the game with trading. The catching mechanic is a new take but the previous one was really easy thanks to Rapid Balls. It could be better, it could be worse, we'll know when we try.

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You are moving your goal post! You called me entitled for being disappointed and not supporting the game, now you are changing it to selfish? You dropped the arguments that I countered and moved to something else... Is it simply arguing in bad faith at this point?

If it's about being selfish not want the game to succeed, I agree. It is indeed selfish and I said as much. Thank you for pointing out as if it's new fact what I pointed out in my original post, it's bad I knew but can't help it, so sue me I guess?

However, you called me entitled as answer to my first post, is it entitlement to expect the game to keep its root concept? Pokémon as a core is batteling and capturing monsters, other npcs as well as breeding, that's Pokémon, it is not a simple change in graphic design or simple mechanics, for me it is a change in the concept itself, the pitch of the game. When the pitch changes, it's no longer the game that it used to be, thus like I said I don't like the new direction and concept and I'm not supporting it and expressed my disappointment and hope for it not to be implemented going forward.

I gave you counter argument about it being more family friendly and accessible to kids, removing simple features doesn't make a game more family friendly and accessible than it is, battling to catch pokemon, breeding and breeding are fun, so removing fun? Is being more accessible? And I'm not talking about iv, breeding is fun for the heck of it, my niece loves it and a 6vyears old she sure don't do iv. I do it for fun too just FYI, Thus it's disappointment.

If you enjoy this game and are satisfied, good for you man, I am not and that's about it and fear for the future and going the phone games route.

As a closing, you don't need to be hostile and calling names to others to express disagreement.

Firemind said:

You can battle trainers.

This give me every option available mentality is what makes the mainline games such bloated messes.

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So in order to combat bloat, the solution is offering the most feature and content starved title a Pokémon game has ever been since the original releases in 1996? There has to be better solutions.

These games are going to be so much fun to play, especially co-op for the first time.

steviejd1 said:

You can say what you like and I am allowed to call you out as being selfish. There's not really much else to say.

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You can call my opinion selfish nobody stopped you? However, you are not telling me anything new or I didn't express myself initially? So again what's your point?

It's like:
Person A: I wished a bad thing to a game but I know it's bad to do so, I can't help it though.
Person B: you are bad.
Person A: I know already.
Person B: I wanna say it again regardless
Person A: OK, enjoy, I guess?

For how positive the trailer and their upcoming plans seems to be, this thread is awfully depressive to read.

The problem is not having games for the casual audience. The problem is having games for casual audience and games for even more casual audience.

PS: And the lack of effort and ambition.

Include said:

You can call my opinion selfish nobody stopped you? However, you are not telling me anything new or I didn't express myself initially? So again what's your point?

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I said there was nothing left to discuss. You do you but don't cry if people call you out for your opinions. Also you keep saying that you were called names, I would love to see where this happened?

Dark Cloud said:

These games are going to be so much fun to play, especially co-op for the first time.

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Yessssss!!!! I can't wait and it's going to sell like crazy!!!

Beje said:

So in order to combat bloat, the solution is offering the most feature and content starved title a Pokémon game has ever been since the original releases in 1996? There has to be better solutions.

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There is a solution. To release the core Pokemon title next year. This title is meant to be a bride between Go and the core RPG's.

Firemind said:

You can battle trainers.

This give me every option available mentality is what makes the mainline games such bloated messes.

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Pokémon is bloated but wild battles aren't one the reason why.

zoukka said:

There is a solution. To release the core Pokemon title next year. This title is meant to be a bride between Go and the core RPG's.

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Wow if only Game Freak had thought of that! ;)

Seriously though I can't see why people are concerned. Game Freak specifically mentioned the 2019 game because they knew that hardcore fans may not be completely happy with this years offering. They know there are plenty of fans that want a traditional game.

zoukka said:

There is a solution. To release the core Pokemon title next year. This title is meant to be a bride between Go and the core RPG's.

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Well, I still strongly believe that the Go crowd and the lapsed players that haven't touched a Pokémon game since 20 years ago deserve something much better than this uninspired cash grab, especially if they want them to stick around for whatever comes in 2019.

I swear that constantly bending to the whims and demands of people that don't even give a fuck about Pokémon and just had a tangential relationship with the franchise back when it was impossible to avoid it because it was plastered everywhere is what's going to render it eventually irrelevant.