That's the case of a lot of people tbh.
But it's not super important when he ultimately says he walked out because of black people music.
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Gaspar Noé explains his hatred for ‘Black Panther’: ‘I had to escape the cinema after 20 minutes’
- Thread starter Deleted member 15428
- Start date
But it's not super important when he ultimately says he walked out because of black people music.
OH really? That was Mr. Noé's statement after all...no one is specifically arguing that just because he watched the movie for only 20 minutes, that he's a racist, which is what the above post is describing. I am saying that there was no R&B music in the first 20 minutes, and he's stating that this was one of the reasons why left the theater in 20 minutes...
And my initial post was "don't get hung up on the 20min as it's most likely a number he pulled out his ass" you then said the amount of time is not relevant. Then further down the discussion you said " there is no R&b in the first 20min! So clearly he's racist".
At least that's what I got from your reasoning.
I did not say time is not relevant...I said no one is criticizing Mr. Noé specifically because he mentioned 20 minutes, they are criticizing him because he said "he hated the R&B music," as many others have stated in this thread, there is no R&B music in the first 20 minutes.
None of this is really relevant to anything. You guys are arguing the granules of an ignorant, ill-informed, unnuanced OPINION of an inconsistent director (my OPINION) who didn't like and walked out of a film a lot of people, myself included, loved. Why do that, what's the point?
Not liking hip hop or R&B doesn't mean you dislike black people.
I think this post is very helpful. He's a director, let's not pretend like he hasn't thought about the elements of a movie. At best, he's not being honest about the reasons he disliked the movie.
The Too Short song in the beginning has like a runtime of 10 secs....
You might be pretty racist if that turns you off a film...
And yeah, there's no rap other than that in a 20 min period.
20 mins takes you from the beginning to the end of the flashback pretty much.
The first 5 mins is the backstory of Wakanda...
Lol y'all so petty, caping for a dude who ran out the theater due to imaginary music that doesn't even exist during the timestamp.
I don't really give a fuck, but at least recognize it ain't the music that turned him off
You might be pretty racist if that turns you off a film...
And yeah, there's no rap other than that in a 20 min period.
20 mins takes you from the beginning to the end of the flashback pretty much.
The first 5 mins is the backstory of Wakanda...
Lol y'all so petty, caping for a dude who ran out the theater due to imaginary music that doesn't even exist during the timestamp.
I don't really give a fuck, but at least recognize it ain't the music that turned him off
Yeah it must be the black people thing, all the blackness must have caught him by surprise, it's not that he didn't like the movie
He left after 20 mins.... What did he see?
Y'all the same cats that would pop a blood vessel if I said I played BOTW for 30 mins. It was garbage and I noped out as soon as I heard all the rock music in it.
But he is racist because he called the music R&B? Then I'd say the evidence for either argument is pretty slim.
Someone says something bad about something many people like, so of course people respond with drive-by comments as similarly "edgelord-ish" as they claim his to be, and left at that, no real response or discussion of the points he raised.
I don't know anything about him but I'm not surprised that he doesn't like Black Panther. I liked it myself but it is typical Marvel and summer blockbuster fare - and as predictable as these films go. You can't claim that it isn't a typical and predictable film. You know that
Typical, entertaining but absolutely predictable Hollywood fare. He seems to be a fairly "out there" director so Marvel/summer blockbusters not being his cup of tea I can understand. We all don't like the same thing. And you can appreciate a person's opinion while disagreeing with it, but of course it's easier to just type up a quick one or two-line snarky response.
I can't remember the music in Black Panther. I definitely don't remember there being R&B in the first twenty minutes. Far be it for me to defend his mislabelling the music, but could it have been an error in translation? The way he is quoted suggests that he spoke either in French or in English and still hasn't the greatest grasp of the latter. It was a stupid thing to say however he came to it, and outside of mistranslation there is no defending it.
I don't know anything about him but I'm not surprised that he doesn't like Black Panther. I liked it myself but it is typical Marvel and summer blockbuster fare - and as predictable as these films go. You can't claim that it isn't a typical and predictable film. You know that
T'Challa is going to survive, that Killmonger will be defeated, that at some point M'Baku and his forces are going to turn up at the end.
I can't remember the music in Black Panther. I definitely don't remember there being R&B in the first twenty minutes. Far be it for me to defend his mislabelling the music, but could it have been an error in translation? The way he is quoted suggests that he spoke either in French or in English and still hasn't the greatest grasp of the latter. It was a stupid thing to say however he came to it, and outside of mistranslation there is no defending it.
That's the #1 go to opinion of someone who hates black people and doesn't want to own it. Not saying that not likeing those genres makes you racists, but racists 100% never like those genres for some reason
So you understand the exact parallel I gave you there? How uninformed and dumb of a critique that would be if I was serious?
It's obvious he didn't like the film because it was a conventional blockbuster. As for the weird music statement ... without any substantial reason to believe otherwise, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that his inaccurate comments stem from a place of genre confusion and run-time miscalculation rather than coded prejudice.
User warned: Disingenuous argument and bad faith posting
Yes, and it makes you look extremely silly. For someone who doesn't care about the cultural importance of BP, it's just a fucking movie. And it really isn't as good as some people make it to be. If people don't like then who cares, but it doesn't make them racists
Nah, it's not really "caping" nor "petty" to suggest that the bar for labelling someone a racist be higher than "they didn't like this movie/genre with black people in it".
It's the reason he gave that makes black Americans figure he's racist because that's how he statement comes off, it's racial at least. He didn't like the modern black music in the Black movie and had to escape. It's pretty overt
It's like if I played The new Zelda game and shut it off before it really started for a completely made up reason and then had assholes claiming that reason is legit. He didn't watch the movie, his opinion of it is uninformed and his given reason for not watching it is seems pretty racist for the perspective of black Americans
You keep making this straw man argument that people are calling him racist for not like the movie, that's not what anyone in here has said. Stop saying that. No one cares if he didn't like a movie he didn't even finish the first act of
When are people going to stop telling black people that something isn't racist when it clearly is and we've explained how it is many times
Stop the straw man bullshit. No one has said anything about him likings the movie, but why he left it
I'm European and I don't know the difference between r&b, rap, and hip hop because it's not music I ever listen to. I mean, I'm sure these genres exist here, but it's not mainstream in the least.
So apparently I'm a racist now. Thanks America, for letting me, a person in a different country, on a different continent, know that I'm a racist for not being in the loop with your culture. May I suggest you mail out a couple of billion education kits to the rest of the world, filled with movies, music, and the rules to baseball and such, so that we can study and learn to not be racist against America?
Okay, okay, I'm not going do dismiss the whole thread as crazy talk. There's been some reasonable criticism of Noe too. Maybe he is racist. I know I wouldn't leave a movie because of occasional music I wouldn't personally choose to listen to. That part is suspect. But that he doesn't know the difference between a few music genres popular mostly among foreigners on the opposite side of the planet, not so much.
So apparently I'm a racist now. Thanks America, for letting me, a person in a different country, on a different continent, know that I'm a racist for not being in the loop with your culture. May I suggest you mail out a couple of billion education kits to the rest of the world, filled with movies, music, and the rules to baseball and such, so that we can study and learn to not be racist against America?
Okay, okay, I'm not going do dismiss the whole thread as crazy talk. There's been some reasonable criticism of Noe too. Maybe he is racist. I know I wouldn't leave a movie because of occasional music I wouldn't personally choose to listen to. That part is suspect. But that he doesn't know the difference between a few music genres popular mostly among foreigners on the opposite side of the planet, not so much.
User warned: Disingenuous argument and strawman building
No, because some of us don't like pulling nonsense out of our ass.
Jesus, this forum reminds me of the new Fahrenheit 451 sometimes.
This thread is just black people being told what's not racist by non black people. What's the point?
The guy makes an ignorant comment, how can that ever be racist too?
How could an ignorant statement by an edgy European filmmaker be racist? He even cast a black person once!
Obviously the real racists are the blacks; this forum is such a dystopia with them having opinions
The guy makes an ignorant comment, how can that ever be racist too?
How could an ignorant statement by an edgy European filmmaker be racist? He even cast a black person once!
Obviously the real racists are the blacks; this forum is such a dystopia with them having opinions
Lol look at how you sound. And that's ironic because my point is "look how silly this critique sounds" in which you seem to agree. At that something.
"For someone who doesn't care about the cultural importance..."
Haha that's pretty shitty. Looks like I understand why you backed off. It's because you truly have no argument... Bringing in stawmans and claiming me as silly without expressing why.
Yeah it's dumb as shit to try to write something off after 20 minutes of exposure and trying to talk shit about one of it's elements (music) and not being informed enough to cite the correct genre.
Mad suspect when it's one of the biggest films of the year by predominantly black production crew.
You look like a clown staning for ol boy. You do you.
Jesus Christ y'all have shit reading comprehension.
It's because he left early and couldn't even properly cite the genre of music. It's just a shit critque overall.
If he didn't like it... So what... The problem is he decided to use shitty dogwhistles to make his point and comes off like a douche.
But seems 100% cool with y'all so again, do you
Can you elaborate what is nonsense?
Your post means nothing right now, I have no idea what part of my post you have an issue with.
I just saw Black Panther last night for the first time. I wish I had shut it off after 20 minutes. I was so bored the entire time. (Warcraft and Star Wars Prequel level bored).
They never really set up a reason to care for any of the characters. The only one with a bit of humanity was the bad guy (the scene in the Museum) is really the only scene I liked. After reading all this stuff about how important the film is in giving black viewers positive representation, but it all felt sterile. Ryan Coogler's Creed was a decent bit of entertainment, but I didn't think that was great either. I was hoping that he grew as a filmmaker on this effort, but the only thing that grew was the budget. I would like to see the same cast (so much wasted talent in this movie) get a better script and director and try it over again, but since this was such a success, I'm guessing that they're happy. I just wish the movie was even watchable.
Gaspar Noé was right to walk out of it. He was just following the Oscar Brotman advice to Roger Ebert "In nintey-nine films out of a hundred, if nothing has happened by the end of the first reel...nothing is going to happen". BTW, a reel is about 15 minutes. And by 'nothing happens', he means nothing that makes the film interesting outside of the typical formula.
Like Noe, I generally dislike most blockbusters, but I do enjoy the occasional one... Spiderman Homecoming, Thor:Ragnarock, and Wonder Women were all quite good.
They never really set up a reason to care for any of the characters. The only one with a bit of humanity was the bad guy (the scene in the Museum) is really the only scene I liked. After reading all this stuff about how important the film is in giving black viewers positive representation, but it all felt sterile. Ryan Coogler's Creed was a decent bit of entertainment, but I didn't think that was great either. I was hoping that he grew as a filmmaker on this effort, but the only thing that grew was the budget. I would like to see the same cast (so much wasted talent in this movie) get a better script and director and try it over again, but since this was such a success, I'm guessing that they're happy. I just wish the movie was even watchable.
Gaspar Noé was right to walk out of it. He was just following the Oscar Brotman advice to Roger Ebert "In nintey-nine films out of a hundred, if nothing has happened by the end of the first reel...nothing is going to happen". BTW, a reel is about 15 minutes. And by 'nothing happens', he means nothing that makes the film interesting outside of the typical formula.
Like Noe, I generally dislike most blockbusters, but I do enjoy the occasional one... Spiderman Homecoming, Thor:Ragnarock, and Wonder Women were all quite good.
Meh. I'm tired of arguing with people attacking a strawman. If you don't believe it's possible that someone can genuinely enjoy offbeat stuff like Eraserhead or Gummo or Dog Star Man, and that only a poseur would claim such a thing, nothing I say is going to convince you otherwise. Have fun with your insecure, close-minded view of the world and its art. The last word is all yours.
BlackAdder
If the 20 min rule is true then The Godfather is the most boring film of all time.
That first 20 mins is NOTHING.
But it seems I'd be a troll for film snobs to hold that opinion. What a dumb ass "rule".
How many movies exist with shit first acts that fix themselves in screen time.
If you can't give a movie more than 20 mins, then why did you buy a ticket? You didn't want to watch it anyway.
The movie isn't Sharknado or Open Water. To say the quality is similar that you had to walk out is insulting.
If the 20 min rule is true then The Godfather is the most boring film of all time.
That first 20 mins is NOTHING.
But it seems I'd be a troll for film snobs to hold that opinion. What a dumb ass "rule".
How many movies exist with shit first acts that fix themselves in screen time.
If you can't give a movie more than 20 mins, then why did you buy a ticket? You didn't want to watch it anyway.
The movie isn't Sharknado or Open Water. To say the quality is similar that you had to walk out is insulting.
No my comprehension is just dandy but your arguments are weak.
You're calling him a racist because;
1. He left early - so fucking what? Does he only leave "black" movies early?
2. He incorrectly cited the genre of music - so fucking what? You've got plenty of Europeans in this very thread telling you that they consider the terms interchangeable.
Is it a great critique? Nah, but that doesn't make him a racist.
Saying he didn't like the movie or it's music isn't a dogwhistle. Like, at all.
For majority of Europeans it is just a fucking movie. Sorry the world is so cruel
It's an ignorant critique, and for a "filmmaker" one would think you'd have more respect and be able to properly explain shit.
But nah, nose in the air and stick up the ass is what makes this guy so likeable for y'all.
Newsflash, the world is fucking cruel.
Breaking news, it is just a fucking movie so why the fuck do y'all have the express need to climb the mountain top to tell the world that the film made you gouge your eyes out.
Alot of negativity being pushed because the movie is popular. Hmm wonder why.
You don't give a fuck, I get. You made your point hours ago.
Who's called him likeable? Who said it was a well reasoned critique?
Nobody? Why are you inventing strawmen?
All some people are saying is that walking out of the movie and referring to hip-hop as R&B doesn't necessarily make the guy racist.
I didn't love Black Panther (there are actually very few Marvel movies I like, I just tend to see them because of friends and family), but in no world is it a movie you should have to "escape" from. I think I have only ever left the theater twice in my life due to movies being not to my liking, and I would expect that a filmmaker would find something to learn about from most films by sticking through them to the end regardless of how you feel about the movie.
The first reel rule is not written in stone, and even Brotman gave exceptions for some movies that were more experimental, or were going for something different. It mainly applied to genre movies, and definitely Black Panther, which didn't fix itself at all.
Personally, I wanted to watch the movie because I liked the few songs I heard from the soundtrack and all the positive buzz around it. I actually sat through it, but I wish I would have saved myself the time. I still like the soundtrack, but the rest is bland Disney bullshit repackaged to give the audience something shiny to look at while they collect their money.
You're right in saying that this movie isn't Sharknado. Sharknado is actually watchable, despite being completely stupid.
Pretty much.
Claiming otherwise is silly. Even him trying to use that as his reasoning for leaving is a coded ass message.
It's literally like 5-7 secs of a rap song... It plays at the BBall court as the camera pans up to the apartment while his dad goes over his plans.
The music fades out so they can have dialouge immediately
I said 10 secs before but it's more like 7.
If listening to 7 sec segment of a rap song (with no swearing or vulgarity even!!!) Is enough to make you walk out of a movie....
What the hell am I suppose to think? That's suspect as shit.
He hates the sound of ANY rap music! He flees as soon as the soundwaves hit his eardrums!!
----
We're here now folks...
Sharknado is more watchable than Black Panther. We've hit the peak.
I hated the R&B music [in "Black Panther"]. The music was so bad that I had to escape.
And Europe exists completely devoid of American film and culture, a veritable island ignorant of the entire world!
Look, I loved Black Panther. I love the soundtrack and I love hip-hop and R&B even more so. Fair to say I disagree with Noé here.
On paper, it's a stupid critique, bordering on ignorant. I can't argue against that.
I just assume that it was some really obvious hyperbole in the context of a jovial conversation so I don't really jive with jumping straight to calling the dude racist.
On the other hand, I don't have to put up with coded language and the other shit minorities do on a daily basis so maybe I'm showing my own ass here.
Two comments:
1] I haven't seen this director's films, but am wondering: has he cast any black actors in any of his filmography? I'm not insinuating anything, just curious!
2] Aren't the first 20 minutes of Black Panther pretty light on mindless action that's commonly associated with blockbusters? The first scene in Oakland is a pretty compelling opening and takes up like 10 minutes or so?
It seems that from Gaspar's dismissive comments that he could not connect at all with the themes of BP, which are made explicit at the film's outset, and him claiming a distaste of the soundtrack as an excuse to leave a movie is the kind of childish complaint one would commonly expect of a shallow viewer used to Hollywood blockbusters but who couldn't endure a film directed by the likes of Jean-Luc Godard.
So, to me, Gaspar's criticism of BP is more of an indictment on himself than the film he found so insufferable he had to leave after 20 minutes.
1] I haven't seen this director's films, but am wondering: has he cast any black actors in any of his filmography? I'm not insinuating anything, just curious!
2] Aren't the first 20 minutes of Black Panther pretty light on mindless action that's commonly associated with blockbusters? The first scene in Oakland is a pretty compelling opening and takes up like 10 minutes or so?
It seems that from Gaspar's dismissive comments that he could not connect at all with the themes of BP, which are made explicit at the film's outset, and him claiming a distaste of the soundtrack as an excuse to leave a movie is the kind of childish complaint one would commonly expect of a shallow viewer used to Hollywood blockbusters but who couldn't endure a film directed by the likes of Jean-Luc Godard.
So, to me, Gaspar's criticism of BP is more of an indictment on himself than the film he found so insufferable he had to leave after 20 minutes.
He was asked by an interviewer. Totally the same as him going out of the way to say that he hated it
12 pages and a lot of strawman arguments to finally arrive at the obvious answer
How do they know America exists at all, what with being so isolated. :o