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Oct 28, 2017
660
Anyone have any advice for me in this online tournament set? The Yo Tornado ? I got completely destroyed.

Hmm. There's not really a full-tilt moment where a rectified error would've turned things around. I guess the main thing I saw looking back was resource management? In that second game the level 3 with Broly that ended up blocked really hurt you, as that became a large meter deficit. Then later on you did a three bar combo on 16 and he was left alive, that left him with 4 bars to your none, and 16 ended up getting the hit which exacerbated the issue. I know it started with a 2H so your options were limited; was there any way activating sparking there could've got a kill? I also felt like your main goal there was getting 21 out, not necessarily getting a kill on 16, so would it have been possible to Z-Change Super into Goku without wasting her bar? I haven't played 21 essentially since the last time I used her against you, so I'm not sure. They tech quickly after her j214M but Goku has pretty fast start-up. There was a similar issue in the first game too where you dumped three bars on 16 post dragon rush and he was able to raw tag out, and both of those moments felt like they set up the biggest obstacles in your path.

You both had hair triggers, he established the first time he went into the corner in the first game that he wasn't afraid to 2H. With that in mind, I think the raw tags in the corner when trying to get out hurt you, as I'm pretty sure he was ready for every single one and punished. Maybe looking for a moment to guard cancel would've been better? It's a wack mechanic and costs a bar but all three of those characters do have gaps to sneak one in during their basic corner blockstrings, as hard as they may be to come by lol.

All the times we've played I felt you were scariest at the start of the round. 21 genuinely terrified the fuck out of me and I pretty much always lose if she gets the first touch, yet in all of these matches you backed off at the start, and oftentimes had to use an assist before you got your hit. I know Cell's opening gambit is just as good if not better, but he's also much more capable without resources than she is, so the longer you two played neutral the more of an advantage he was at.

Broly didn't get to do much as a point, which the commentators noticed, but that assist was also failing you at times. He got hit out as a defensive pushback a few times due to him extending forward before becoming active. I'm certainly not going to tell you to drop the character because you're a loyalist and I respect that, but I dunno. The most noteworthy thing he did this set was make you waste three bars trying to save his giant trapped in the corner ass. I dropped him super early so I can't comment on how to tighten up his play, but on point he seemed to be the one who was most prone to having your defensive playstyle be blown up.

As for that third game yeah that was just a snowball, and I feel similar in regards to mental strain in sets in this game. Matches can take so long and so many hits yet in certain circumstances your opponent will get a huge momentum string in their favor, either a godlike read or succession of successful hits and you'll already be telling yourself "this match is over, they got the juice." That's not always the case, but after multiple games I find it's much harder to battle back resignation once it starts creeping up. I don't have an answer for that, but if you do please let me know. >_>

Overall, you guys seemed comparable in terms of neutral and defensive ability so it's not like he was an unreachable plateau of skill you couldn't overcome. I think you just hedged your bets on situations that would've worked out if you got a hit afterward, but he was able to escape and pretty much negate your work to that point. There were unfortunate events too, like in the first game you dropped a beam assist conversion with 21 that would've killed. In the end though, outside of that last game where as you said you were mentally resigned, they were even games. Sorry for the wall of text that didn't say much, I tend to stream of consciousness shit like this lol
 

Korezo

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,145
I bought this game at launch but started playing online now, and omg these auto combo people get me enraged like no other fighting game. I have the most problem against auto combo mashing players the most, can't even play casuals to fucking learn in this game. Knew this system was going to make me hate the online and is reason I waited so long to even go online. mash super dash mash super dash, can't do shit with the lag.
 

Karsticles

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,198
I bought this game at launch but started playing online now, and omg these auto combo people get me enraged like no other fighting game. I have the most problem against auto combo mashing players the most, can't even play casuals to fucking learn in this game. Knew this system was going to make me hate the online and is reason I waited so long to even go online. mash super dash mash super dash, can't do shit with the lag.
It sounds like you aren't as good as you think you are.
 

Korezo

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,145
It sounds like you aren't as good as you think you are.

I don't think I'm good, I just said I started playing ,and that mashers are the hardest to deal with right now because I don't know enough about the game, I know super dash can be punished, but its hard online because I end up getting punished trying to punish it online.
 

Karsticles

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,198
I don't think I'm good, I just said I started playing. And that mashers are the hardest to deal with right now because I don't know enough about the game, I know is super dash can be punished which is hard online cause I end up getting punished trying to punis it online.
What's your frame delay? If it's longer than 4 frames, you might be wireless or have a connection issue. I don't think anyone has trouble pushing super dashes on reaction - the game is very generous in this regard.
 

closer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,170
I bought this game at launch but started playing online now, and omg these auto combo people get me enraged like no other fighting game. I have the most problem against auto combo mashing players the most, can't even play casuals to fucking learn in this game. Knew this system was going to make me hate the online and is reason I waited so long to even go online. mash super dash mash super dash, can't do shit with the lag.

Just need some more time playing youll be alright

Waiting in games like this will prob result in this though, like i think 10s of thousands of ppl (?) have stopped playing this and a lot of the ppl still here have been playing since the beginning + some ppl make smurfs to get matches.
___
18 has a sparking route similar to hit's where you omit the scaling from hitting the sparking

 
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FluxWaveZ

Persona Central
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
10,890
Seems mainly mental to me, he had you playing defensive sometimes when you didnt have to. I dont wanna generalize on your habits off of two games tho. It seems like you up back in a lot of situations (maybe to reset your brain/create space), but i feel like it often gave the other player time to claim the momentum. I like that you adapted to the downtech after 21's soft kd, that was sick. Im not a huge fan of staying down after 16 ends with command grab, but that's usually cuz i get bopped after, i like to back tech and if i see them going for iad i parry (theyll prob catch on and empty jump you at some point tho). All in all tho, the way id read it is that he got some reads, claimed the mental game, and then the match played out.
I suppose I oftentimes play more reserved than I perhaps should, but that's because this game is pretty scary. Might tie into my movement issues, where I'll just hold up back at times because I don't feel comfortable in moving around the screen in neutral situations. Perhaps I don't move around enough.

I know it started with a 2H so your options were limited; was there any way activating sparking there could've got a kill? I also felt like your main goal there was getting 21 out, not necessarily getting a kill on 16, so would it have been possible to Z-Change Super into Goku without wasting her bar?
At that moment, it wouldn't have been possible to kill with only 2 characters on my team. You're right, though, I just wanted to get 21 out. I'm going to have to lab the hitstun scaling that allow me to Z-change from 21's combos more thoroughly. I avoid them because I've had problems with that in the past, but resource management is important.

Maybe looking for a moment to guard cancel would've been better? It's a wack mechanic and costs a bar but all three of those characters do have gaps to sneak one in during their basic corner blockstrings, as hard as they may be to come by lol.
Guard Cancel is such a scary mechanic to use. I'll have to recognize the pressure strings characters use where it can be used safely. I do need to make better use of that and reflect, though. And less use of panic Vanishes out of the corner.

All the times we've played I felt you were scariest at the start of the round. 21 genuinely terrified the fuck out of me and I pretty much always lose if she gets the first touch, yet in all of these matches you backed off at the start, and oftentimes had to use an assist before you got your hit. I know Cell's opening gambit is just as good if not better, but he's also much more capable without resources than she is, so the longer you two played neutral the more of an advantage he was at.
Makes sense. I feel the most confident at the start of the round. It's just that trying to do my own opening, it's a rock-paper-scissors scenario that I sometimes just don't want to engage with (barring point Bardock, who pretty much always has to be respected).

If I 2H + Goku assist, a 5H from the opponent will usually win. If I jump forward j.M, a 2H from the opponent will win. If I 2M or 5M, an IAD jumping attack will win. It's why a lot of the time I will just back off, because the risk is notable, despite the potential reward.

Broly didn't get to do much as a point, which the commentators noticed, but that assist was also failing you at times. He got hit out as a defensive pushback a few times due to him extending forward before becoming active. I'm certainly not going to tell you to drop the character because you're a loyalist and I respect that, but I dunno. The most noteworthy thing he did this set was make you waste three bars trying to save his giant trapped in the corner ass. I dropped him super early so I can't comment on how to tighten up his play, but on point he seemed to be the one who was most prone to having your defensive playstyle be blown up.
Yeah. I had sets earlier on in that video where I was doing much better with Broly; it's just that I felt suffocated against my opponent in general here. Broly's assist is the best for me when it's neutral and I can zone for a bit with 21. In pressure situations or to convert, it's not that great. I much prefer Hit's assist when it comes to conversions and pressure, but it's pretty useless in neutral.

As for that third game yeah that was just a snowball, and I feel similar in regards to mental strain in sets in this game. Matches can take so long and so many hits yet in certain circumstances your opponent will get a huge momentum string in their favor, either a godlike read or succession of successful hits and you'll already be telling yourself "this match is over, they got the juice." That's not always the case, but after multiple games I find it's much harder to battle back resignation once it starts creeping up. I don't have an answer for that, but if you do please let me know. >_>
Heh, that's the issue. If one's in a certain state of mind, and they get 2H'd or 5H'd by the opponent for the first clean hit in a match, it's easy to think "welp, I'm done." I need to build that mental endurance, but it's so hard.

Sorry for the wall of text that didn't say much, I tend to stream of consciousness shit like this lol
Nah, thanks. That's pretty much what I need to put my own thoughts in order to see what I should improve on.

I'll try to pick Hit back up again and refamiliarize myself with him. I don't like how much of his gameplay basically requires hard reads to get anything going, but maybe I'll be able to make it work if I give him more time.
 

closer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,170
On one hand I wish guard cancel was better, like I guess I agree with people saying that there needs to be a better tool to deal w/ pressure monsters. But on the other hand I like that little minigame where you have to read their blockstring for the right time to do it and then the other guy can read that and heavy early or something, like the game is still new enough where that's cool to me lol
 

Tan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
449
Is there any way to know when there's gonna be a server maintenance? And when it'll end?
 

sandboxgod

Attempting to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,919
Austin, Texas
Anyone have any advice for me in this online tournament set? The Yo Tornado ? I got completely destroyed.



Time stamp is 2:12:55 if the above doesn't do it automatically.

I feel the mental aspect plays a big part for me in this game, and sometimes the longer I play, the more auto-pilot I become. After I got so close in game 2 but still lost, I think I was pretty much done right there.

Sometimes I also feel like I can't move the way I want to; like it's all stiff for me. That part might be because I'm pretty used to playing FGs on a fight stick, so it might still be a transition from that to pad.



Set1- Jesus, dat Cell. Did he even drop a single combo there. just on point
Set2- You got his Cell right off da bat. Excellent. That was so close man. He got you with that Vanish. I wish you didnt use the L3 w/Broly so early. I know you wanted out of the corner though. But we lost Broly right there and 3 bars gone cause he blocked it
Set3- Broly vs Cell, you deflected while you were in the corner but looks like you didnt follow up with an attk? You still got out the corner there tho. Good Lord that L3 Cell finish was off da chain

I am wondering should SSJ Goku be anchor? what does he offer you over Goku Black? I'm just curious. Sure I use SSJ Goku sometimes but its mostly because GokuBlack already on my team. Hard to tell from these matches though.

I should be able to find you on Leaderboard I'll take a look. Esp if I filter 21 I'll find you. I'd like to upgrade my SSJ Goku skills so going to follow you

Man Cell truly is perfect. EVO 2018 gonna be a Cell vs Cell showdown I am guessing. Cell just winning all the tourneys

[edit] Yo grats on 1st place for points
 
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Durden

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
12,511
When's the maintenance over? Finally getting the balls to hop back online and of course it's down.
 
Oct 28, 2017
660
I am wondering should SSJ Goku be anchor? what does he offer you over Goku Black? I'm just curious. Sure I use SSJ Goku sometimes but its mostly because GokuBlack already on my team. Hard to tell from these matches though.

Some people prefer Goku on anchor because of his guaranteed hard knockdown off of any touch. He has some strong sparking loops too. Goku vs. Goku Black is essentially a question of weaker neutral/better consistency vs. better neutral/weaker consistency. Neither has very strong solo mixups so it's a matter of preference.
 

FluxWaveZ

Persona Central
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
10,890
Broly vs Cell, you deflected while you were in the corner but looks like you didnt follow up with an attk?
Reflecting Cell is extremely tricky. You can't just do it once and then it's your turn. His advancing normals makes it so that you need to properly guess which string he's going to do, and then reflect properly (with the right timing) to then try to take your turn. If you do it wrong, you're going to get destroyed, which is why I just did it once to somewhat assess the situation instead of committing to further reflects.

I am wondering should SSJ Goku be anchor? what does he offer you over Goku Black? I'm just curious. Sure I use SSJ Goku sometimes but its mostly because GokuBlack already on my team. Hard to tell from these matches though.
I started playing SSJ Goku a long while back because I figured I needed a neutral assist on my team. I didn't want to play Vegeta or Goku Black because everyone else played them. So wanting a beam assist, SSJ Goku was the logical choice.

[edit] Yo grats on 1st place for points
The league's ongoing, but thanks.
 

sandboxgod

Attempting to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,919
Austin, Texas
Thanks for the post guys

Yeah I thought whenever we deflect, we have to follow up with an attack or something otherwise they can just mash buttons and hop right back into your face. At least thats what I learned from some defense tutorial (think I posted the video) awhile back so I've been following up my deflects
 

Tounsi_Tag

Member
Oct 29, 2017
492
I just bought the game. I really like the mechanisms and I can tell it's an easy game to master. I absolutely love the gameplay and I'm sort of forcing myself to finish the story mode .
However, is it normal that I'm a bit overwhelmed right now? I feel like there's too much to learn despite the easy gameplay. Moreover, missing the game on its windows launch sort of made me detached from the community and all the knowledge regarding the online aspect / characters ( what each character entails, specialties, funny gags ... ) / quirks ...
 

Slaythe

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,856
8c62730552ca6b85b76d4e10e18aa06b.jpg
 

TheCthultist

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,450
New York
Just had the single best (most satisfying, definitely not most well played) matchup I've had in casuals in months now. I was having a really off night and the first round of this one made me assume it was going to be more of the same. May be the best, cheapest comeback I've ever had in the game since launch...

Sorry if it's a bit of a slog to get through; definitely have not been at the top of my game lately.

All I can say is thank god 16 still has enough options available to be adaptable to just about any situation. For that final round in particular.
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,486
Haven't been feeling this game at all lately.

Help me love it again. D:

EDIT: This is the old OT lol.

Someone should lock it so this doesn't happen again. :P
 

Son Goku

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
4,332
Played it for the first time in awhile to try out Vegetto and Zamasu. Love Vegetto. Might stick with Zamasu. Probably won't play a lot though unless era had a get together for 3 on 3 matches
 

BlockABoots

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,548
This might be slightly off topic but feel its probably the best place to ask without starting an new thread.

By fans are the 3 seasons after the Cell Saga regarded as 'good' or was it a downward spiral after Cell?
 
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