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Dragon Ball FighterZ |OT| Heaven or HFIL
- Thread starter donkey
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I don't know what Kid Gohan offers anyone.
Krillin at least has a pretty strong oki game.
Youre crazy.
and right
Man, lotta hype being built around this
It looks like I'd better swap Freeza out then.
Cell is looking pretty great so far I'll probably go with him.
Cell is looking pretty great so far I'll probably go with him.
Does anybody have any good match footage of SSJ Goku, preferably on point? I know he's the most basic of bitches in the whole cast for the most part, but I'm trying out putting him in my team over Black and I can't really find many players to study, at least scrolling through his character discord.
He's got some pretty decent stuff. jS lets him convert cross-ups into full combos really easily, the jS->j236L hard knockdown off of anything is really nice, he does good damage in the corner, being able to link two level ones, his basic safe jump is pretty easy and pretty good. He's kinda linear, and his pressure and hitboxes are a little weaker than the top tiers, but I definitely think he's legit. I still don't think he's as good as Black, but I think he's close enough to not be bothered by the trade-off.
I also played a Captain America team as my main squad in Marvel 3 so I probably just have a thing for easy mode main characters lol
I play 21 too, but haven't found any good videos other than extremely specific loops with teleport, which of course doesn't cover what you're asking about.
All of the moves are useful in their own way. I think stealing a grounded kamehameha is a pretty good idea. However, using the ground version of the steal grab is a little tricky because of its longer startup. You can condition them to block and then throw that instead of a Dragon Rush, or you can combo into it with the help of some assists (lockdown, or beam in the corner) and if you do it right, you don't necessarily have to end the combo early.
As for the other moves, most of them are actual moves from other characters so you can maybe look into that in order to understand what they allow. Like, how does 18 make her barrier useful? What can Piccolo do after he throws the orb? In which situation does Vegeta use his Continuous Energy Blast (or whatever it's called) and what does he get out of it? And what the hell does Krillin even do with his Solar Flare? I feel like you could check that out and translate it into 21's moveset in order to find something you think might be useful.
The ones you don't really have a reference for are the yellow command grab and the green ki blast that makes the opponent bounce. I like getting the aerial green ki blast and throwing it in neutral instead of j.S, but haven't really found what to do after it hits unless you have a teleport and can do the loops you can find on Youtube. As for the yellow command grab, it causes a wallbounce so it's super useful. If you also have a kamehameha you can press S again to throw the kamehameha and if you ALSO have a beam assist then it gets kind of ridiculous.
However, I think the most important thing with 21 is to get comfortable with her moveset without the stolen moves. If you manage to steal some, great. If you don't, I would't go out of my way to get one unless I'm sure I'll get something I think will work. They are very situational and it's more important to just kill a character rather than keeping them alive to steal a move and then get beat up for being greedy.
It's important to realize that you will be adopting a slightly different playstyle with each move you steal and every new combination you get, and your success will also depend of how well your opponent adapts to that, so I would consider them just extra tools you can get every now and then instead of the key to 21's offense.
I think a fair amount of people are just avoiding the stigma of being that guy who plays Goku in a DBZ game. :P
Thanks, all this is helpful but the end is really what I was looking for, I wasn't sure if the game plan should be developed around the command grab or not. I'm having a ton of fun with her, what position do you play her in? I've been putting her in the second slot and switching her in when I corner someone. I feel like she lacks pressure without assists so I've been avoiding anchor, but she has good and easy meterless stuff so I've been considering switching her to point.
She's really fun, yeah. I play her on point. My team right now is 21/Hit/SSJ Goku and she really gets good use out of those two assists. Like I said, beam assist in the corner let's you use the slower ground command grab in a combo so if I can get something I find useful I usually end a combo with 214M, into Goku assist, into either command grab. I agree with you that she kind of lacks pressure without assists, which can be somewhat fixed with some stolen moves. When she uses a hamehameha she actually takes a quick step back and that can throw people off, but of course if you get predictable then that's that. Her own moves are good enough that I don't think having a game plan developed around stolen moves is necessary.
Anyone have the notation for the mid-screen Cell combo that has the j.S xx Vanish xx j.down M near the end?
They are. He's the Ryu of this game in every sense of the phrase.
Stubby normals is the reason why people don't pick up.. he does hit hard though.
one thing i'm noticing from japanese players is that they are just really really fundamentally clean. They may not have super oppressive offense but they are just clean.
probably the highest meterless bnb damage in the game, build's mad meter, can take anyone to the corner with one touch.
stubby normal's, no beam, relies heavily on assist's in neutral, can't really open up well without assist.
I think he's a good character on point with two good assist. He just requires a lot of work to build around unlike Cell or A16
They're gonna literally makes us wait until tomorrow the last day of feb for the patch Jesus lol
It's actually pretty ncie that they got a wrastling thing going so early in the game's life. People love drama.
Those loops are cool and all, but it doesn't look like the training dummy is completely immobile. A typical player will be flipping out of stun at some point especially when they hit the ground. Seems more like combo porn right here
You mean the j.H > j.S > j.2M > Vanish one?
Combo counter is red, it's a true combo. If it were to turn blue, then they could have escaped at some point.
If I didn't love hit so much I'd play 3 flavors of goku as my team. So far just rocking blue goku and vegeta along side hit
As said above, all of those are true combos, and you can tell with the combo counter color. Players cannot tech after touching the ground from an opponent's Sparking Blast activation.
I see now, thanks for the heads up guys
Do the same combo but omit lights and fireballs until the second assist extension and you'll have increased damage.
OP
OP
I don't know scaling rules, but A21's fireball in combos involves 3 hits, so whatever scaling is involved scales the damage of a combo with more hits initially rather than later.
Let's see, if it were me I would start with 5LL > 2M > 5M > j.LL > 2H > SD (super dash) > j.LL > jc > j.LLL > j.S > j.2M > Vanish > (dash up) 5M > j.LL > jc > j.LL > 236L (> 236LM)
You can try to add a j.2H > 236M as the ender instead of 236L, but they flip out immediately on the ground bounce. The reason for all the Ls in the jumps is to maintain the proper height because j.H has a habit of whiffing if you do j.L > j.M. You can also start it with 2LL as a hit confirm instead but it's slower. Ideally, if you can, starting with 2M is better for scaling purposes, but that's mainly for punishes or calling out a backdash.
Like, for sequence 1 do: j.2H > dj.M > 214M instead of j.2H > j.L > dj.M > j.S > 214M
For sequence 2 (juggle after Gohan) do the same change.
For the final sequence, then do something like: 16 hits > j.m > j.2H > j.L > dj.M > j.S > 214M > super
It'll add 200-400 damage to the combo. A lot of people like to add as many hits as they can in their combos in this game, without actually paying attention to the difference in damage output with a more optimized, simpler combo.
basically, in the corner you would add air.H except for the last loop
don't have the game in front of me right now but i'm pretty sure you need the light's where they are currently in that combo cause the auto combo re-positions correctly.
I think the overall balance of the game is healthy enough that even the "low-tiers" are effective - they just aren't as effective as the characters above them.
oh i see. you omit that part entirely. hmm i need to try that when i get home.
I can mostly agree with that. No ones outright bad and can be used well from what Ive seen
Really the tier list should just reflect workloads right now. The games a lot easier with say 16/Black/Gohan than it is with Krillen/Hit/Nappa
Thanks man. I'm re-writing these combos in my native tongue (QCF notation) so it's easier for me to learn. Appreciate the help.
Oh, forgot to mention, you can end with j.LL > 214L if you would prefer to keep them in the corner instead of going for a super if you have meter. I only mentioned 236L because I assumed you might want to go into a super. The way you end it is purely preference, tbh.
Looking at the way the combo is written, wouldn't I have them in the corner even if I decided to super? If I'm understanding right, QCB.L would give an untechable knockdown where QCF Super wouldn't, and I wouldn't need to spend a second meter.
Or would QCF.L xx QCF Super put me on the other side?
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