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Candescence

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,253
So, I finally got around to recording a full video of my progress with my prototype and nearly all of its features so far. Unfortunately, OBS was strangely unable to record full-quality, so I had to lower the recording quality some to avoid frame-hitching. But it should be a lot more full-fledged than my last one in terms of showing what I'm going for with the game.



So I am using Unity at work but I am not coding myself, I am more of an animation and graphics person. I would also like to get a bit of a different perspective on game engines for indie game development.
What would be the better (I know, that question is probably old and too broad) engine for quick "visual coding" and protoyping 2D games? Construct or Gamemaker?

Construct, without a doubt. Game Maker relies on scripting, which isn't a bad thing, but its visual scripting system is garbage. Construct 2/3 is possibly the best game engine for 2D prototyping.
 

SaberVS7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,237
Oh boy, so they finally added this thing to GameMaker Studio 2, putting an end to the hacky method of manually editing Instance Creation Code to change variables per-instance.

6dyGIPC.png

L1yACyM.png


Time to spend an evening converting things over to this new format after a solid year of using the old Instance Creation Code method.
 

Camille_

Member
Oct 26, 2017
224
Angoulême, France
So I am using Unity at work but I am not coding myself, I am more of an animation and graphics person. I would also like to get a bit of a different perspective on game engines for indie game development.
What would be the better (I know, that question is probably old and too broad) engine for quick "visual coding" and protoyping 2D games? Construct or Gamemaker?

If you're specifically looking for visual coding and fast prototyping, I'd recommend Construct 2 over Game Maker. Both are very versatile tools, of course, but as far as the visual scripting tools are concerned, I give the edge to C2's - GM's feel like they're there more as a crutch until you get the hang of GML, while C2 is designed around their use entirely and completely.
(Of course, my own biais leads me to favor C2, so others might have divergent advice on that, but for my money, as another graphics person, you can't go wrong with C2 - I'd avoid C3 for now, until the runtime is released, and it has had a little more time to really develop, especially in regards to community plugins).
 

derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,355
Austria
Impressed what you folks pull off alone, keep up the good work :)

Construct, without a doubt. Game Maker relies on scripting, which isn't a bad thing, but its visual scripting system is garbage. Construct 2/3 is possibly the best game engine for 2D prototyping.

If you're specifically looking for visual coding and fast prototyping, I'd recommend Construct 2 over Game Maker. Both are very versatile tools, of course, but as far as the visual scripting tools are concerned, I give the edge to C2's - GM's feel like they're there more as a crutch until you get the hang of GML, while C2 is designed around their use entirely and completely.
(Of course, my own biais leads me to favor C2, so others might have divergent advice on that, but for my money, as another graphics person, you can't go wrong with C2 - I'd avoid C3 for now, until the runtime is released, and it has had a little more time to really develop, especially in regards to community plugins).

Thanks for the responses!
As with Construct 2 and 3 - will 3 definitely get a runtime version? Also how much different will it be in terms of interface and stuff like that. Like when I learn C2 now - will I feel at home when C3 "launches"?
 

Darkset

Member
Oct 28, 2017
59
Impressed what you folks pull off alone, keep up the good work :)





Thanks for the responses!
As with Construct 2 and 3 - will 3 definitely get a runtime version? Also how much different will it be in terms of interface and stuff like that. Like when I learn C2 now - will I feel at home when C3 "launches"?

3 is online only, however it downloads the application when you first use it then in subsequent visits it'll use the offline version (unless it needs to update).
 

jahasaja

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
793
Sweden
Oh boy, so they finally added this thing to GameMaker Studio 2, putting an end to the hacky method of manually editing Instance Creation Code to change variables per-instance.

6dyGIPC.png

L1yACyM.png


Time to spend an evening converting things over to this new format after a solid year of using the old Instance Creation Code method.

That sounds Amazing! I am still in Studio since I already finished half of my game. Do you know if it is easy to port the game over to GM2?
 

SaberVS7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,237
That sounds Amazing! I am still in Studio since I already finished half of my game. Do you know if it is easy to port the game over to GM2?

Yes, 1.4 projects easily convert over to 2.1 - I believe a converter tool is one of the things the IDE will shove in your face when you first boot it up and start a project, so...

I'd highly recommend it. You'll get far better productivity out of the new toolset, whereas with 1.4 I contemplated switching Azure Jaegers over to Unity or Unreal several times.
 

Sean Noonan

Lead Level Designer at Splash Damage
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
384
UK
I'm a big fan of Construct 2 and 3. Construct 3 is super convenient; being able to just drop in and out of projects across all of my devices is really awesome. Though I do hear that there are some limitations, especially if you want to launch on Steam.

I actually have a Construct 2 game basically ready to go on Steam (I passed greenlight an' all that) I just don't really know the next step. Anyone have ideas :)?
 

Camille_

Member
Oct 26, 2017
224
Angoulême, France
Still very early, I especially need to add lots of properties/anim transitions to the puddles, but here's a WIP for a "spreading fire" system:

FlamboyantAcidicKoala-max-14mb.gif

Undecided as to whether I need to do more fire anims to have more visual variety... well, lots of stuff I still need to try. For now, just happy it works at all!
 

dean_rcg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,270
Still very early, I especially need to add lots of properties/anim transitions to the puddles, but here's a WIP for a "spreading fire" system:

FlamboyantAcidicKoala-max-14mb.gif

Undecided as to whether I need to do more fire anims to have more visual variety... well, lots of stuff I still need to try. For now, just happy it works at all!

Very impressive!
 

derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,355
Austria
I'm a big fan of Construct 2 and 3. Construct 3 is super convenient; being able to just drop in and out of projects across all of my devices is really awesome. Though I do hear that there are some limitations, especially if you want to launch on Steam.

I actually have a Construct 2 game basically ready to go on Steam (I passed greenlight an' all that) I just don't really know the next step. Anyone have ideas :)?
That sounds very convenient indeed. What might those limitation be regarding Steam (or maybe PC) support?
 

Camille_

Member
Oct 26, 2017
224
Angoulême, France

Thanks :-)

As with Construct 2 and 3 - will 3 definitely get a runtime version? Also how much different will it be in terms of interface and stuff like that. Like when I learn C2 now - will I feel at home when C3 "launches"?
That sounds very convenient indeed. What might those limitation be regarding Steam (or maybe PC) support?

The main difference between C2 and C3, at this point, is C3's online functionality. C2 uses a runtime editor, while C3 uses an online editor that allows syncing/editing on multiple devices. In theory, it's supposed to be a strength, but it comes at increased memory costs and more unstable usage, along with a number of troubles when keeping local-only projects. C3 also isn't compatible with previous community plugins as far as I'm aware (they need to be ported individually). Unless you specifically intend to use C3's online capabilities, C2 is a safer bet for now, both for its stability on local use, and its wide number of available plugins.
C3 is supposed to get a runtime editor down the line (supposedly "soon") that should bring it closer to how C2 operates as far as local projects are concerned, but that's mostly theory for now, and the philosophy of C3 as far as its been detailed so far is to move towards an overall online experience.

Construct is an HTML engine, which has its ups and downs. Main ups being it can run fast preview/exports on browsers and its performance is actually somewhat impressive. Main downs is that HTML is a big no-no for consoles - any console export will require workarounds, or switching engines entirely. There are exporters out there, but they're usually developed in house for internal use only. It was designed primarily for rapid PC prototyping, small PC games and mobile games. That doesn't mean it can't do more than that, but those are its core focus.
That leads to it having a reputation of only having "smaller" games, but the gif I've posted above is from a C2 game, as are these: Klang, Yonder, Honey Rose , The Next Penelope (actually coming soon on Switch thanks to one of these precious few exporters). C2 may not be an optimal choice for "big" projects, mainly because of its lack of console portability, but performance wise it more than holds its own.

It has no inherent limitation preventing it from working with Steam - in most cases, you'll need to use a Node Webkit export (essentially a browser emulator, as far as I understand), and use a plugin to integrate Steamworks. There are two that I'm aware of: Greenworks (by Scirra, I believe) and Steam4C2 (by Mad Spy, the programmer I'm working with on Pachacuti).

Of course, the fastest way to come to terms with it will come through experience - you should try it and see for yourself if it suits your needs :-)
 
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derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,355
Austria
Thanks for the detailed writeup! :)
C3 sounds optimal for me, as I am using different computers all the time. If a game from me is playable on itch.io I will be happy and I guess that's perfect fit for Construct 3.
Thanks! :)
 

Sean Noonan

Lead Level Designer at Splash Damage
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
384
UK
Yeah, that's the thing, I jump between my Mac and my PC depending on which room I am sitting in/if I am at home/travelling. So Construct 3 is super convenient. But like I said, I've been told that Steam plugins aren't available for C3 yet, so for Jack B. Nimble I'll stick to C2... if I ever work out what I need to do :p
 

OllyOllyBennett

BizDev & PR at Cardboard Sword
Verified
Nov 10, 2017
40
North East, UK
Hey, happy to have found this page. Taking suggestions here as I am a CS student and have made games before, mostly in SFML, but I am going to be starting and running a club on campus with the goal of developing games as a group using industry tools and practices with the goal of building portfolios, learning said tools, gaining experience and maybe entering student competitions.

Any suggestions as for engines and such? Seems unity is our best bet for cross platform sake.
Unity or Unreal, for sure. Unreal knowledge is supposedly more in demand and more valuable than Unity from what I've gathered. But this also depends on what kind of job you're looking for. A programmer who knows C# (Unity) can easily learn C++ (Unreal) and vice versa. This is coming from soneone currently outside the industry though :) A portfolio with completed games is a great way to get started for sure.
I concur with the above for engine choice, and portfolios being the best route in.

Regarding jamming with a team at uni, I think it's a great idea. I'd make the following suggestions, though these are simply my suggestions, I'd love to hear if people disagree:

- Make a small-scale game
- Re-make that same game from scratch
- Make a new completely different game
- Make Version 2 of the re-make of the first game

This way you can slowly increase the features of game 1, implement what you learnt from each production process, apply new skills from game 2 to game 1, start adding in refinements and optimisation. Also, working on adapting an existing game by returning to it with more experience, is a skill often used in the games industry, for porting or making sequels.

Be sure to avoid being too ambitious. Having unreachable goals leads to things fizzling out. It's far better to start and finish something small and easy, then iterate, than it is to begin with a MOBA or online FPS etc.
 

TI92

Alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,598
Agreed with the above points but thank you for reiterating them. Me and the other "vice presidents" idea for running the club is to basically, everyone does a note card and it gets passed around and as you get a new note card you add an idea onto that original idea. Eventually we vote as a club which game to pursue. But yes they should still be small titles, definitely not making half-life 3 over here.
 

jahasaja

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
793
Sweden
Yes, 1.4 projects easily convert over to 2.1 - I believe a converter tool is one of the things the IDE will shove in your face when you first boot it up and start a project, so...

I'd highly recommend it. You'll get far better productivity out of the new toolset, whereas with 1.4 I contemplated switching Azure Jaegers over to Unity or Unreal several times.

Great thanks, I should really update.
 

SaberVS7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,237
And now we've finally begun to devote time to those fancy graphics things that apparently sell games far better than actual gameplay these days. Here's a quick comparison shot of a Train Platform early in the game now vs its old Programmer Art.

New on the Left, Old on the Right
qx0DVrU.png
FndKagY.png


One of those damned "Website" things that are popular with the kids these days coming Soon™
 

Deleted member 932

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
487
And now we've finally begun to devote time to those fancy graphics things that apparently sell games far better than actual gameplay these days. Here's a quick comparison shot of a Train Platform early in the game now vs its old Programmer Art.

New on the Left, Old on the Right
qx0DVrU.png
FndKagY.png


One of those damned "Website" things that are popular with the kids these days coming Soon™

Seems like a great improvement, though I am a programmer myself so what do I know? Perhaps the tiles are a little bit too busy (a few too many oblique stripes)?
 

_Rob_

Member
Oct 26, 2017
606


Pink is my favourite crayon, pink like the sheets that we lay on... that's some next level lyricism there!

They come out awkward looking in-editor and zoomed out.

Here's a Native-Res screenshot ingame:

imojHdn.png

Oh I'm really liking this, the only thing that stands out to me is the character's lack of shadow; do you plan on adding one?

Just a quick update to the area I posted the other day, making sure there are tricker jumps that take advantage of Clive's newer long-jump!

giphy.gif
 

SaberVS7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,237
Oh I'm really liking this, the only thing that stands out to me is the character's lack of shadow; do you plan on adding one?

I want to by way of proper silhouette-shadows for characters, but I've not figured out a way to do that in GameMaker yet that would look right, and I'm no good with Shader code yet.

I'll probably just end up implementing plain blob-shadows that render under characters the same way as the environmental shadowing works. Dirty and unsophisticated, but it'll probably be my only recourse there. Unfortunately as it stands, my programming and scripting is extremely amateur as it is. I mean, for what matters, I can't for the life of me figure out how I would go about implementing something like the Soliton Radar, so I resorted to a text-based "IFF Sensor" that gets acknowledged in-universe as being "21st Century-junk that can't be traced back to us [the Orion Commonwealth]"

Now after all that talking, I'm in a mood to tell my art team to start jazzing up the HUD, because even my direct inspiration in Metal Gear 2 had a fancy looking HUD back in 1990.

119806-metal-gear-2-solid-snake-msx-screenshot-wow-msx-computers.gif
 
Oct 25, 2017
653
Pink is my favourite crayon, pink like the sheets that we lay on... that's some next level lyricism there!



Oh I'm really liking this, the only thing that stands out to me is the character's lack of shadow; do you plan on adding one?

Just a quick update to the area I posted the other day, making sure there are tricker jumps that take advantage of Clive's newer long-jump!

giphy.gif
I wanna play this game
 
OP
OP
Popstar

Popstar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
877
Autodesk cutting Stingray development. Not surprising since they never really pushed it.

I think this takes them completely out of middleware development.

"We feel we can better serve our customers by working more closely with Unity and Unreal Engine rather than trying to develop our own alternative."
 

Minamu

Member
Nov 18, 2017
1,900
Sweden
Are there any name generators (for titles), that take suggestions into account? Like "I want a name with *your word* in it somewhere".
 

wwm0nkey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,553
Anyone here mess with Octane in Unity yet? I really want to try their lightmap baking beta, but I am not really seeing how to use that. Would love to bake some path traced lighting into my scenes for a visual bump
 

Jump_Button

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,787
Made my first teaser dont want show too much yet, and still need to find some one to help me with music only thing i really cant do myself.

 

Sean Noonan

Lead Level Designer at Splash Damage
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
384
UK
I decided to upload the post jam version of Bad Juju. I was sitting on it for months, guess I just forgot about it.

I added a balance-breaking Shotgun and Uzi for fun :)



Let me know what you think!
 

Minamu

Member
Nov 18, 2017
1,900
Sweden
Dunno, but we are all awesome at naming stuff
Hehe yeah I bet. I got some name suggestions on the old site but the team has had a hard time agreeing on something.

I'm trying to polish up my levels some, but I'm having a real tough time with the horizon and areas outside the play area. I'm not sure how to cover up the end of the world, without there being a sharp edge between the skybox and the end of the geometry, especially in places where you're above sea water so to speak. Anyone got any experience with this? Obviously not all games take place on a sphere lol.

Edit: Eh, I wanted a map that's located at the top of an abnormally large pyramid, with the surroundings being below it. But I couldn't solve the aforementioned issue in a satisfying manner, so I went with a pyramid shaped moat around the map with a higher outer height difference compared to the playing field. Then I put a ton of pyramids and other pillar shapes around the map to cover as much of the horizon as possible. It looks alright but I'll need to make proper special prefabs for the different sizes instead of just twisting and turning already existing ones. All in all, the file size is just around 2.2MB for the entire level so I'm relatively happy. Two more maps to go after this one!

Remind me to never self-impose the strange strict rule of only being able to use 45 and 90 degree angles for everything ever again xD
 
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K Monkey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
278
This side project kept me busy the last month as a level designer. They just released a short trailer for it

 

mikehaggar

Developer at Pixel Arc Studios
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
1,379
Harrisburg, Pa
Question for those of you who have implemented a camera and used a lerp or smoothstep function for moving it in a 2D game... How did you handle the fact that the target is (or can be) constantly moving? I suspect most people haven't accounted for that and are happy with the results. However, that's technically not how a lerp function should work as the start position and target position should not change until the lerp is finished. Yet, that is not ideal for a situation where a character is moving and the camera is following using a lerp method. Have you guys just fed the lerp method an updated start position and target position every frame (as the player is moving) or have you implemented something more complex?
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,686
I'm not making a game out of it yet but the knowledge might prove useful for game development: I decided today to finally learn how to make an Android app. I'm going straight from the official documentation, and it looks like my ancient college Java knowledge may come in handy after all.
 

sabrina

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,174
newport beach, CA
Question for those of you who have implemented a camera and used a lerp or smoothstep function for moving it in a 2D game... How did you handle the fact that the target is (or can be) constantly moving? I suspect most people haven't accounted for that and are happy with the results. However, that's technically not how a lerp function should work as the start position and target position should not change until the lerp is finished. Yet, that is not ideal for a situation where a character is moving and the camera is following using a lerp method. Have you guys just fed the lerp method an updated start position and target position every frame (as the player is moving) or have you implemented something more complex?
SmoothDamp was made specifically for this function.
 

JeffG

Member
Oct 27, 2017
857
Edmonton, Alberta
Question for those of you who have implemented a camera and used a lerp or smoothstep function for moving it in a 2D game... How did you handle the fact that the target is (or can be) constantly moving? I suspect most people haven't accounted for that and are happy with the results. However, that's technically not how a lerp function should work as the start position and target position should not change until the lerp is finished. Yet, that is not ideal for a situation where a character is moving and the camera is following using a lerp method. Have you guys just fed the lerp method an updated start position and target position every frame (as the player is moving) or have you implemented something more complex?
This may help

https://youtu.be/aLpixrPvlB8
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
Oh boy, so they finally added this thing to GameMaker Studio 2, putting an end to the hacky method of manually editing Instance Creation Code to change variables per-instance.

6dyGIPC.png

L1yACyM.png


Time to spend an evening converting things over to this new format after a solid year of using the old Instance Creation Code method.

Oh my god, that was always my most hated thing about GameMaker was the whole instance creation bullshit... very nice update!
 

jahasaja

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
793
Sweden
I keep meaning to post in the thread, there's some fantastically inspiring work going on in here! It's just been a busy week so far, what with the snow early on and then this: http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2017/12/sony_uses_fan_art_in_medievil_remaster_reveal_trailer !

However, I managed to carve out a few hours this afternoon to work on this section of CnW's prehistoric/snow level!

Iceceratops-Valley.png

You cannot just say and " then this" without explaining!!! That is huge!! They stole your art for the reveal of the medievil remake!!

How do you feel about it?? On the positive side it must be flattering and should give you soom free publicity. But still..
 
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