Daily Dot: Twitter is falling in love with this anime’s zombie trans girl

FriskyCanuck · Nov 30, 2018

Spoilers for Zombie Land Saga below:

https://www.dailydot.com/parsec/twitter-zombie-land-saga-trans-girl-idol/

Trans women just received representation from an unexpected source: a comedy anime about zombie idol girls. Cygames' Zombie Land Saga revealed that idol Lily Hoshikawa is a young transgender girl, and the series' trans fans are ecstatic.

For the uninitiated, Zombie Land Saga follows a zombie idol group called Franchouchou. Its members come from various walks of life across Japanese history, from courtesans to biker gangs, and they're all zombies. That's right, they're all undead. That includes a young child actress named Lily Hoshikawa, who passed away when she was 12 years old.

In the series' eighth episode, Lily reveals that she was previously assigned male at birth under her deadname, "Masao Go." She passed away after noticing her first black whisker on her face, causing her to die from sheer anguish.

Of course, being a zombie is a blessing for Lily; now that she's undead, she won't go through puberty. She proceeds to come out to her fellow idols, who struggle with her trans identity at first, but ultimately accept her as a fellow girl.
...
It didn't take long for fans to confirm that Lily is a trans girl. The series' creators treat her as a girl, gender her as such online, and previous episodes hint to her trans identity. In short, Lily's character arc is a trans one—and it's pretty obvious.
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For trans Twitter users, Lily is an easy character to love. She isn't just petite and adorable, she literally dies from gender dysphoria. That's way too relatable. She's more than ready to stand up for herself, too, and assert her gender identity. She's the perfect trans girl role model.

It goes without saying that trans fans received plenty of pushback over Lily. Some anime viewers keep calling her a "trap," a derogatory term used against trans women that conflates trans girls with crossdressers. Lily's fans have since hit back, pointing out how the show pretty explicitly treats Lily as transgender and criticizes anyone who says otherwise.

Pretty cool to see some trans representation in places where you don't necessarily expect it. Of course, that doesn't stop all the asshole anime fans from purposely misgendering or denying it even with confirmation from the show's creators. Some were claiming that the dub mistranslated it deliberately to push an agenda because Crunchyroll "has a history of it".

JeffGubb · Nov 30, 2018

Let's be clear: Twitter is incapable of love.

Deleted member 48897 · Nov 30, 2018

I was going to ignore the show because it sounded like it was just a deconstruction of the idol genre which I'm not that into besides increasingly obscurant remixes of Snow Halation, but hearing the praise people've been heaping on it definitely makes me want to reconsider.

SigmasonicX · Nov 30, 2018

This thread earlier this week went more into the "trap" pushback.

Anyway, this was pretty neat to see from this show, especially the way the manager acted.

hydrophilic attack · Nov 30, 2018

wow that's really cool

some legitimately non-trash anime? kudos

JEFFREY GRUBB said:
Let's be clear: Twitter is incapable of love.

i couldn't speak to that, but from my own observations, at least it is certainly capable of horniness

atomsk eater · Nov 30, 2018

Some were claiming that the dub mistranslated it deliberately to push an agenda because Crunchyroll "has a history of it".

Hilarious little story about that, one of the main people pushing the "CR is just mistranslating to push an agenda!" thing claimed to be a native Japanese speaker. People pulled posts from like a month ago where they talked about being a weeb and learning Japanese from anime and visiting Japan, and said person claimed to have recently taken over the account from a friend since they wanted a throwaway account (instead of just making their own, for some reason). They also absolutely failed to correctly type "Hello, thanks" in Japanese, mangling it in a way most people who have studied halfway seriously for a week can avoid.

Deleted member 48897 · Nov 30, 2018

atomsk eater said:
Hilarious little story about that, one of the main people pushing the "CR is just mistranslating to push an agenda!" thing claimed to be a native Japanese speaker.

was it that mombot weirdo

atomsk eater · Nov 30, 2018

muteKi said:
was it that mombot weirdo

It was someone else IIRC, but I blocked them after having a sensible chuckle so I can't remember. If I come across screencaps I'll post them.

preta · Nov 30, 2018

atomsk eater said:
It was someone else IIRC, but I blocked them after having a sensible chuckle so I can't remember. If I come across screencaps I'll post them.

こんにちわ、ありがとごしました

Slayven · Nov 30, 2018

a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

effingvic · Nov 30, 2018

I guess I'll catch up with this show. I fell off after the second one.

Hollywood Duo · Nov 30, 2018

Sure beats TWD

Choppasmith · Nov 30, 2018

Oh, how nice to see. Ultimate Otaku Teacher had a real Pro-Trans moment too as I recall. I was wondering about giving this series a shot.

Wilsongt · Nov 30, 2018

Which mean some people on my Facebook will be posting pictures if this constantly like with Peach Bowser.

Time to mute againz

PeakPointMatrix · Nov 30, 2018

Honestly shocked that this came from anime of all things, handling it appropriately. Last time I remember an anime tackling a trans topic was the Impel Down arc in One Piece. I can't remember if it was handled well or offensively though.

atomsk eater said:
Hilarious little story about that, one of the main people pushing the "CR is just mistranslating to push an agenda!" thing claimed to be a native Japanese speaker. People pulled posts from like a month ago where they talked about being a weeb and learning Japanese from anime and visiting Japan, and said person claimed to have recently taken over the account from a friend since they wanted a throwaway account (instead of just making their own, for some reason). They also absolutely failed to correctly type "Hello, thanks" in Japanese, mangling it in a way most people who have studied halfway seriously for a week can avoid.

Any link to this? I love me some good ownage in the morning.

edit: just saw your screencap response. Please do post them lol.

infinitebento · Nov 30, 2018

sugoi

Deleted member 19066 · Nov 30, 2018

Slayven said:
a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

I've heard it's actually got some barbed commentary on the idol industry. The girls, being dead, are literally dehumanized. If that's the case I may have to check this show out.

Plus, this is some of the most clearly positive portrayal of a clearly trans person. I feel like a gotta support it, now.

B.K. · Nov 30, 2018

Slayven said:
a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

It sound stupid, but all the reviews that I have seen say the show is actually really good.

Slayven · Nov 30, 2018

BuddyDharma said:
I've heard it's actually got some barbed commentary on the idol industry. The girls, being dead, are literally dehumanized. If that's the case I may have to check this show out.

Plus, this is some of the most clearly positive portrayal of a clearly trans person. I feel like a gotta support it, now.

Yeah that would be meta as fuck. Owning an idol body and soul sounds like thing the real industry is working on

Vic Damone Jr. · Nov 30, 2018

JEFFREY GRUBB said:
Let's be clear: Twitter is incapable of love.

Twitter can only hate, it's built into its dna.

Slayven · Nov 30, 2018

B.K. said:
It sound stupid, but all the reviews that I have seen say the show is actually really good.

Yeah, not shitting on it. They did make an anime about bread making be interesting as fuck

Kalentan · Nov 30, 2018

BuddyDharma said:
I've heard it's actually got some barbed commentary on the idol industry. The girls, being dead, are literally dehumanized. If that's the case I may have to check this show out.

Plus, this is some of the most clearly positive portrayal of a clearly trans person. I feel like a gotta support it, now.

Haven't had a chance to watch it yet, but this is what I've heard as well.

atomsk eater · Nov 30, 2018

He also apparently posted a picture of himself with his eyes squinted and a caption like "not high, just Japanese." Not posting a link to that one tho.
Should be noted the dude seems to have put his account on private or nuked it entirely, I can't find it anymore.

Mr Spasiba · Nov 30, 2018

It must really suck for people who watch this show because I've seen this openly spoiled basically non-stop since it happened and I don't even follow people who watch it.

broncobuster · Nov 30, 2018

BuddyDharma said:
I've heard it's actually got some barbed commentary on the idol industry. The girls, being dead, are literally dehumanized. If that's the case I may have to check this show out.

Plus, this is some of the most clearly positive portrayal of a clearly trans person. I feel like a gotta support it, now.

That is a fairly accurate assessment of what the show is.

Thorn · Nov 30, 2018

Zombieland Saga is legit AOTS.

Deleted member 25606 · Nov 30, 2018

Might have to watch this at some point, I try to avoid the anime hole it's the one part of nerd life that when I have I truly feel like I wasted time but this sounds like I need to see it.

Crossing Eden · Nov 30, 2018

atomsk eater said:
He also apparently posted a picture of himself with his eyes squinted and a caption like "not high, just Japanese." Not posting a link to that one tho.
Should be noted the dude seems to have put his account on private or nuked it entirely, I can't find it anymore.

Weebs continue to be one of the worst things about anime existing.

Zen · Nov 30, 2018

This show is life

SigmasonicX · Nov 30, 2018

About the show itself, I think the peak in terms of entertainment value was episode 2, with the two episodes immediately following it being fairly dull, but there's been enough good stuff to keep me watching.

Hellsing321 · Nov 30, 2018

It was probably one of the most positive depictions I've ever seen of a Trans character in anime.

Thorn · Nov 30, 2018

Matthew77 said:
Might have to watch this at some point, I try to avoid the anime hole it's the one part of nerd life that when I have I truly feel like I wasted time but this sounds like I need to see it.

Its just an animation style.

ShadowSwordmaster · Nov 30, 2018

Slayven said:
a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

We haven't reached the Japan peak, yet.

atomsk eater · Nov 30, 2018

Crossing Eden said:
Weebs continue to be one of the worst things about anime existing.

It was somehow worse seeing people banging the "CR mistranslated!" drum based on second hand info and when people said "that's not true, that guy doesn't even know what he's talking about and other native speakers and professional translators have said otherwise" they go "oh hmm well I don't know who is right, better just wait for more info (IE wait for the whole thing to blow over and continue banging the drum at a later date).

Exhausting.

sgtnosboss · Nov 30, 2018

Hollywood Duo said:
Sure beats TWD

The walking dead?

to the OT: Its really nice to see representation like this, there is a lot of anime where they just never tell you or you aren't sure or they hint this or that, but never reveal.

Hollywood Duo · Nov 30, 2018

sgtnosboss said:
The walking dead?

to the OT: Its really nice to see representation like this, there is a lot of anime where they just never tell you or you aren't sure or they hint this or that, but never reveal.

Yeah

Crossing Eden · Nov 30, 2018

atomsk eater said:
It was somehow worse seeing people banging the "CR mistranslated!" drum based on second hand info and when people said "that's not true, that guy doesn't even know what he's talking about and other native speakers and professional translators have said otherwise" they go "oh hmm well I don't know who is right, better just wait for more info (IE wait for the whole thing to blow over and continue banging the drum at a later date).

Exhausting.

Reminds me of this stupid motherfucker

Deleted member 25606 · Nov 30, 2018

Thorn said:
Its just an animation style.

That uses and falls back on a lot of tropes that I am not comfortable with in a lot of shows, and also tends to use filler to tread water and stretch out arcs. The animation is what draws me to it.

Besides I didn't say there was anything wrong with it or people shouldn't watch, I personally try to avoid it because if I start I will fall in a hole and I always regret it, I wasn't trying to shit on anyone's binkie.

Deleted member 48897 · Nov 30, 2018

Slayven said:
a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

Any jokes about "un-deadnames" notwithstanding, the zombie metaphor is about portraying the industry as creatively bankrupt more than it is about any level of fetishization. Aside from the idea of ownership of actual women into perpetuity, it's also about how the industry is devoid of new ideas and lacking in making any real social points, serving instead as vapid commercialism.

Ratrat · Nov 30, 2018

What is the target audience for this show? Have all the people saying that representation is rare never seen shoujo anime?

I remember I think it was Precure or something that got some positive buzz about its handling of similar issues recently.

sgtnosboss · Nov 30, 2018

Hollywood Duo said:
Yeah

Who is in the walking dead? I've honestly never noticed

Avinash117 · Nov 30, 2018

People so insecure. Zombies and shit, but a trans girl is too far for some people.

Lotus · Nov 30, 2018

Slayven said:
a zombie idle group? I thought the fad of turning girls into ww 2 planes and ships was peak japan

Lulu · Nov 30, 2018

Alluka from hxh is done pretty well

Thorn · Nov 30, 2018

Matthew77 said:
That uses and falls back on a lot of tropes that I am not comfortable with in a lot of shows, and also tends to use filler to tread water and stretch out arcs. The animation is what draws me to it.

Besides I didn't say there was anything wrong with it or people shouldn't watch, I personally try to avoid it because if I start I will fall in a hole and I always regret it, I wasn't trying to shit on anyone's binkie.

Avoid long ass shonens if you dread filler episodes. They're the only ones that still end up having them.

atomsk eater · Nov 30, 2018

Crossing Eden said:
Reminds me of this stupid motherfucker

Holy shit.

Hollywood Duo · Nov 30, 2018

sgtnosboss said:
Who is in the walking dead? I've honestly never noticed

Heh nah I'm just saying this is better zombie related fiction

Deleted member 19066 · Nov 30, 2018

Ratrat said:
What is the target audience for this show? Have all the people saying that representation is rare never seen shoujo anime?

I remember I think it was Precure or something that got some positive buzz about its handling of similar issues recently.

Even though shoujo is willing to play around with gender norms and queer themes, they're not always tactful, and are often still steeped in a conventionally conservative Japanese mindset. This seems to be a pretty unambiguously positive portrayal of transgender girl.

Joe · Nov 30, 2018

hydrophilic attack said:
i couldn't speak to that, but from my own observations, at least it is certainly capable of horniness

Considering the character was a twelve year old girl when she died, that's probably worse.

Spinky · Nov 30, 2018

atomsk eater said:
He also apparently posted a picture of himself with his eyes squinted and a caption like "not high, just Japanese." Not posting a link to that one tho.
Should be noted the dude seems to have put his account on private or nuked it entirely, I can't find it anymore.

I never knew I could cringe this hard.

Daily Dot: Twitter is falling in love with this anime’s zombie trans girl

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