Doctor Who Series 11 |OT|- She’s Here, and It’s About Time

I'll qualify the following statement with an asterisk that means 'so far'

Jodie Whittaker is my least favourite NuWho Doctor*. Doesn't feel like there is much about her. Not very much that is interesting has happened so far, but even then she's often the least interesting 'thing' in a scene.

She's a fantastic actress but she's coming across very bland. In all honesty i'd scrap everyone other than Graham.

I think Graham gets away with it because he's a kindly fellow.

I love how the time vortex looks like

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People here keep saying "bad writing" because it's mostly Chibnall, but I suspect that will change over time.

Chibnall wrote one of my favourite episodes of Life on Mars, the one about police covering up a negligent homicide by one of their own. Sam's disbelief as he witnesses the trusting sister of the victim expressing her faith in the police, who he knows to have destroyed evidence and lied to hide their culpability, is beautifully written. Sam knows what comes next, he knows the stakes are the public's trust in the police, but they don't. That episode in all is a stunning piece of drama that would not look out of place alongside classics like GF Newman's 1978 serial Law and Order.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_&_Order_(UK_TV_series)

Got around to watching Season 11 past couple of days. On episode 4. Pretty meh so far but entertaining enough. Hoping it gets better as it goes on.

Positives:
- Jodie Whittaker is fantastic
- Ryan has a lot of potential as a character
- I'm very attracted to Yaz.

EDIT: Wait, there's no Christmas episode???

Rumours! Rumours! Get your baseless rumours! Series 12 will air next year but will potentially be Chibnall's last:

https://www.starburstmagazine.com/doctor-bbc-confirm-series-12-broadcast-2019

The total lack of basis or sources makes this almost definitely false, but after Chibnall's contributions so far this series I can't say I don't enjoy the wild speculation.

Paradox said:

Rumours! Rumours! Get your baseless rumours! Series 12 will air next year but will potentially be Chibnall's last:

https://www.starburstmagazine.com/doctor-bbc-confirm-series-12-broadcast-2019

The total lack of basis or sources makes this almost definitely false, but after Chibnall's contributions so far this series I can't say I don't enjoy the wild speculation.

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Aren't his view numbers doing better than many other seasons? What possible reason to they have to fire him?

That sounds like nonsense.

Would be quite shocking, though.

Xaszatm said:

Aren't his view numbers doing better than many other seasons? What possible reason to they have to fire him?

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Not that I really buy it, but that rumor is saying Chibnall would leave of his own accord because he's unhappy behind the scenes, not because the BBC is unhappy with him.

Paradox said:

Rumours! Rumours! Get your baseless rumours! Series 12 will air next year but will potentially be Chibnall's last:

https://www.starburstmagazine.com/doctor-bbc-confirm-series-12-broadcast-2019

The total lack of basis or sources makes this almost definitely false, but after Chibnall's contributions so far this series I can't say I don't enjoy the wild speculation.

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Worth noting that they broke the Christmas special move back in September.

RE: Chibnall, it's an interesting one. It seems very believable too. I mean, the show lost its lead due to behind the scenes drama during production of Series 1. It's well documented that RTD and Gardner were machines to do what they did throughout their run. Moffat never had that stability, was plagued with similar rumours and rotated through five EPs by his side while also tackling a different show. Chibnall had the same production company behind him with Law & Order / Broadchurch. Camelot had 11 Executive Producers but was a right mess for it. The BBC is a different beast.

Writer Tim Price was in the room at the start and was credited for the Pting, but he was supposed to write Episode 5 / The Tsuranga Conundrum until it fell through and Chibnall took it - and now it's regarded as one of the worst episodes of the show. An example that shit happens. I would hope if it is causing a problem then the Beeb will provide whatever backup Chibnall needs to keep the show running with some kind of consistency again.

The idea of Jodie leaving with Chibnall after just two years strikes as me more unbelievable than Chibnall wanting to leave, particularly given how much she seems to enjoy being the Doctor -- both on and off the show. But I also remember Peter Capaldi signed only a two-year deal before joining, so maybe she would've only wanted to commit to the show for this long to begin with (and I think, if it weren't for the gap, Capaldi would've been more likely than not to not return after S9).

If Chibnall were to leave after S12, though, I have to wonder what kind of state that would leave the show in. Presumably it'd need to take off a year just to get someone new into place, which feels like a crippling move given how well the ratings have been for this series.

Man, why is the production on this show so tumultuous?

Blader said:

Man, why is the production on this show so tumultuous?

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Creating 10 (previously 12) brand new worlds on a weekly basis just seems like a production nightmare from the off. New casts, new locations, new sets, new scripts every single episode. It's the paradoxical nature of the show that its managed to survive 55 years by redesigning itself week to week.

Again, rumours of rumours, but the Chibnall leaving stuff seems to be coming from him wanting more time to make a series and the BBC being adamant that the show goes out yearly from now on. I mean, compare this to Broadchurch which was very much a self-contained thing, largely in one location, with year long breaks between seasons and you can definitely see how DW would be a bit of a culture shock.

I'm sure RTD and Moffat are sat having a drink somewhere chuckling wildly.

LL_Decitrig said:

People here keep saying "bad writing" because it's mostly Chibnall, but I suspect that will change over time.

Chibnall wrote one of my favourite episodes of Life on Mars, the one about police covering up a negligent homicide by one of their own. Sam's disbelief as he witnesses the trusting sister of the victim expressing her faith in the police, who he knows to have destroyed evidence and lied to hide their culpability, is beautifully written. Sam knows what comes next, he knows the stakes are the public's trust in the police, but they don't. That episode in all is a stunning piece of drama that would not look out of place alongside classics like GF Newman's 1978 serial Law and Order.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_&_Order_(UK_TV_series)

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This is part of the problem, imo. Like, I agree, that episode of Life on Maris is brilliant, as is Broadchurch, but there's a style of dialogue that goes with that sort of deeply naturalistic, down-to-earth, gritty show, and in a show like Doctor Who it can take what is usually a fast-paced adventure show and suddenly keep slamming on the brakes for back-and-forth dialogue that just didn't exist in the last two eras unless it served a specific purpose, unless the show was slowing down to make a particular emphasis, like the difference between the speech patterns of John Smith and the Doctor in Human Nature.

I think people often conflate the term 'bad writing' with other things, anyway. Chibnall writes good episodes of TV. He's a good writer. But for a show like Doctor Who, a lot of the dialogue currently isn't right, imo. So there's a good chunk of bad dialogue. The shows are generally well-written though.

Crimson said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPi2ny1r7rM (same video but noticed embeds being broken a lot so adding the url too)

Something pretty trivial, but I don't think they've actually reintroduced what psychic paper actually is have they? Feels like it's been absent for a while before this season too. Did Capaldi ever use it at all?

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Crimson said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPi2ny1r7rM (same video but noticed embeds being broken a lot so adding the url too)

Something pretty trivial, but I don't think they've actually reintroduced what psychic paper actually is have they? Feels like it's been absent for a while before this season too. Did Capaldi ever use it at all?

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I seem to remember it being used once before already, but I'm not sure in what episode.

Joqu said:

I seem to remember it being used once before already, but I'm not sure in what episode.

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May have appeared in a series preview somewhere. I agree that it looks familiar.

Joqu said:

I seem to remember it being used once before already, but I'm not sure in what episode.

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It was used very briefly in episode 3, I think? That or episode 4. It was definitely used, because I remember thinking it was weird that she just used it and didn't explain it to the others (and thus to the new audience)

APZonerunner said:

It was used very briefly in episode 3, I think? That or episode 4. It was definitely used, because I remember thinking it was weird that she just used it and didn't explain it to the others (and thus to the new audience)

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Oh yeah, you're right. I remember thinking the same thing. And Rosa or Arachnids sounds right to me. Weird how I can't remember which one it was though!

She waved the psychic paper in the Trump guy's face.

Paradox said:

I'm sure RTD and Moffat are sat having a drink somewhere chuckling wildly.

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Gareth said:

She waved the psychic paper in the Trump guy's face.

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Ah well there we go then. Thanks.

If chibnall/Jodie are leaving next year, tbh, they should just put the show on pause for a couple of years. Bring it back for the 60th.

Paradox said:

Rumours! Rumours! Get your baseless rumours! Series 12 will air next year but will potentially be Chibnall's last:

https://www.starburstmagazine.com/doctor-bbc-confirm-series-12-broadcast-2019

The total lack of basis or sources makes this almost definitely false, but after Chibnall's contributions so far this series I can't say I don't enjoy the wild speculation.

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I would not be disappointed at all

Could Series 12 be an even shorter series to make it for next year?

Crimson said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPi2ny1r7rM (same video but noticed embeds being broken a lot so adding the url too)

Something pretty trivial, but I don't think they've actually reintroduced what psychic paper actually is have they? Feels like it's been absent for a while before this season too. Did Capaldi ever use it at all?

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Not sure about Series 10 but I just watched Under the Lake and he used it in that

While I can't say I'm a huge fan of what Chibnall has done so far and doubt I would be too sad if he left after next year (unless there's a huge turn around in quality which I have my doubts will happen) but hopefully Jodie won't be ready to leave yet.

Also I totally get why BBC would want a new series every year though you cant really take these rumors seriously. Rumors of the new Doctor leaving usually start pretty quickly.

Yeah I think it would be a mistake for another large gap. I'd hope they can get it out around this time next year at least..

Drewton said:

I would not be disappointed at all

Could Series 12 be an even shorter series to make it for next year?

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And yup, rumors are pointing to a five or six episode series in 2019 with Jodie leaving next Christmas.

www.outpostskaro.com/2018/11/17/s12-news-sooner-than-you-think-but-not-as-much-as-youd-like-six-of-the-best-or-short-changed/

On the note of shorter series I was kind of hoping Moffat would have switched to shorter seasons with longer episodes, Sherlock-style.

Drewton said:

And yup, rumors are pointing to a five or six episode series in 2019 with Jodie leaving next Christmas.

www.outpostskaro.com/2018/11/17/s12-news-sooner-than-you-think-but-not-as-much-as-youd-like-six-of-the-best-or-short-changed/

On the note of shorter series I was kind of hoping Moffat would have switched to shorter seasons with longer episodes, Sherlock-style.

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If there was any thought about doing something like that I imagine BBC Worldwide did what they could to kill it, since I'm sure they prefer more shorter (42-45 minute) episodes to sell to their overseas partners. Doctor Who is one of the top earning shows for BBC Worldwide so I'm sure making lots of Doctor Who and making it every year is pretty important to them.

I hope if Chibnall goes, Jodie stays. Her leaving after a year and a bit is just a bad look that would make the anti female doctor idiots go 'AHA! WE WERE RIGHT!!' and honestly I think her interpretation could be served better under a new showrunner.

If that Outpost Skaro post is true, I think it's kinda shit that Chibnall and Whittaker have been put in a position where they took their roles being represented that they would have one workload, only to be told that because they've been successful they have to switch to a different, significantly more intensive workload that from this rumoured outcome they would never have agreed to.

If those rumours are true, it kind of makes me appreciate Moffat more for just how much Doctor Who he pumped out and wrote given how his Doctor Who was mucked about by the BBC.

If Jodie's Doctor doesn't improve I wouldn't mind her going if Chibnall does. I've been surprised by the lack of plot direction in his season so far, given that he is a 'serial' kind of guy. I'd have thought he would have had decades of plot ideas saved up ready to go, but so far I've felt very lukewarm to the whole production.

I imagine half of the rumours are true and half aren't. In an ideal world the rest of this season is very good and Jodie actually feels more like The Doctor by the end.

Don't forget that the show is on at the earlier time of 18:30 this week. Because despite being a big important show, it can't seem to ever get a static time slot.

If Jodie leaves, it's disappointing.. She has yet to fully grow into the role yet, Chibnall's stuff I have found very middle of the road mostly, so I don't mind if he goes currently. It's strange he'd leave so soon though..

Lynd said:

If Jodie leaves, it's disappointing.. She has yet to fully grow into the role yet, Chibnall's stuff I have found very middle of the road mostly, so I don't mind if he goes currently. It's strange he'd leave so soon though..

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Depends if the BBC's plan has changed and if the rumours are true. If his 5 year plan wasn't five series but only three, spread out with 18 month gaps and now he's being asked to do a whole series every year, it's understandable. He's not as prolific a writer as Moffat.

I think Jodie has a lot of potential so it'd be a damn shame if she were to leave so soon. I know there are people who absolutely love Eccleston and he deserves that, but such a short run isn't enough for me to grow truly attached to a Doctor. And I think that's just a shame.

As for Chibnall, I've been complaining about him but I'd much rather see him evolve than leave. There are still plenty things that I like about his direction.

And finally I think this could be rather disastrous for the show if true. I really hope it isn't.

I'll be very disappointed if either of them leave this early. Jodie is fantastic so far, and while Chibnall's writing has its faults, the direction he's going in as a showrunner is what I've been wanting from the show for years.

Honestly if those rumors turn out to be true, then choosing Chibnall was a catastrophic mistake.

If you can't even maintain producing 10 episodes a year, which is already quite a bit less than your predecessors, without even a second show taking up your time, then maybe you shouldn't have accepted the job.

I personally don't believe those rumours

TheGamingNewsGuy said:

I personally don't believe those rumours

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My default position, too. I would counsel against bed-wetting at this stage.

LL_Decitrig said:

My default position, too. I would counsel against bed-wetting at this stage.

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Especially since there's always been rumours of an actor leaving in their first or second year

I strongly believe that the rumours about Chibnall's departure are just baseless conjecture.

But then I also said that when Jodie Whittaker's casting was leaked by The Mirror, and when the Telegraph leaked that there was no Christmas special this year. So who knows, maybe the tabloid rumour-mill is correct again?

Chibnall can leave, don't care for his style at all. Jodie and the rest besides maybe Graham are all great though.

There was rumors that Capaldi would leave after one series as the workload as too much.
Always a lot of rumors flying around. If it's on next October they must be shooting soon?

I watched a couple of the new episodes and haven't been motivated to watch the rest, I really hope they don't mess up the next season of Luther. The last season Sherlock wasn't that great either (only the second episode was really good)

BBC America should show the last five minutes of Countryfile before Doctor Who so American viewers can get the full live experience. It's not Doctor Who without "Join us next week when Bob will be inseminating a cow with cryogenically frozen bull semen!" beforehand.

Honestly, I'd love if Chibnall left and Jodie stayed. I love her as the Doctor, but the writing this season has been so utterly bland.

Not putting much stock into rumors yet, however.

Those are some creepy robots.

WhovianGamer said:

Depends if the BBC's plan has changed and if the rumours are true. If his 5 year plan wasn't five series but only three, spread out with 18 month gaps and now he's being asked to do a whole series every year, it's understandable. He's not as prolific a writer as Moffat.

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Looking back on it, I wonder why I assumed Chibnall's "5 year plan" would've meant 5 series. RTD ran the show for five years and, prolific as he was, he didn't do five seasons. And Moffat did 6 seasons over 8 years.

The idea of doing 1 series every 18 months also tracks with Chibnall's pace on Broadchurch, which was also 3 series spread out over 5 years.

infiniteloop said:

There was rumors that Capaldi would leave after one series as the workload as too much.
Always a lot of rumors flying around. If it's on next October they must be shooting soon?

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I think the rumor was him leaving after two series, not one, no? He had signed up for two years, and he and Moffat kinda fanned the flames of the "Capaldi leaving after S9" rumor themselves (which makes sense in hindsight, as Moffat was intending to leave after S9 and Capaldi was getting burned out).

These robots are creepy as fuck.

Also the change in the airing time was annoying