...and we're talking about current elections and idealogies yes
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NPR: Group of Democrats moving to oppose Nancy Pelosi's campaign for speaker of the House
- Thread starter Stellar
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Yeah, I can't wait to root for progressive lion Pelosi
What are they gonna compromise on ? Climate change ? Human rights ? Gun control ?
Pelosi is a democrat that still doesn't get that politics is about power, something that republicans have learned a long time ago. But of course, her and many people here are more concerned with the process and "looking good" than actually being an opposition. They'd sooner want to compromise with far-right and fascists than socialists
What are they gonna compromise on ? Climate change ? Human rights ? Gun control ?
Pelosi is a democrat that still doesn't get that politics is about power, something that republicans have learned a long time ago. But of course, her and many people here are more concerned with the process and "looking good" than actually being an opposition. They'd sooner want to compromise with far-right and fascists than socialists
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User Banned (1 day): Trolling
She is fantastic at her job, which is getting liberal policies enacted even under a heavily-conservative government.
She is terrible at the job young liberals want her to do, which is go on the news and spit hot fire at how hypocritical and corrupt and downright evil Trump and the GOP are.
And if I could be honest, it's not a completely terrible ask. Dems could use some more fire from the top.
She is terrible at the job young liberals want her to do, which is go on the news and spit hot fire at how hypocritical and corrupt and downright evil Trump and the GOP are.
And if I could be honest, it's not a completely terrible ask. Dems could use some more fire from the top.
I don't think people understand what the role of the Speaker of the House is, tbh. Her job is to make sure legislation gets passed, legislation that is supported or needed by the constituency. In order to legislate effectively you need to at least attempt bipartisanship, otherwise you get gridlock.
Nowhere has she said "I'm willing to undermine everything about the party platform and what my constituents want in the pursuit of bipartisanship".
Also Democrats aren't a monolith, not every Rep is going to be 100% on board with every piece of legislation. Getting individual Reps to support legislation is also her job.
Nowhere has she said "I'm willing to undermine everything about the party platform and what my constituents want in the pursuit of bipartisanship".
Also Democrats aren't a monolith, not every Rep is going to be 100% on board with every piece of legislation. Getting individual Reps to support legislation is also her job.
Compare her words to her record.
She said the same shit when we won in '06 and had to deal with Bush for two years.
She's making the hollow "bipartisanship" statement that leaders have to make.
Pelosi haters think there's some magical leftist leader who will somehow convince Ron Kind to get on board with a socialist takeover.
In fact it's a favorite tactic of MAGA Mitch. He puts forward some abhorrent legislation and then tut tuts about how Dems can't be bipartisan and just oppose everything and how he wants to work with them if only they would come to his line of thinking.
Do you... Do you not understand that Dems had no control over the house and the senate at that time. The fuck did you want them to do? Not try at all and make sure that DACA was fucked?
They don't know how legislatures work. They don't know why Ron Kind or anyone like him behaves the way they do. They don't know why politicians say certain things but then do other ones.
Ding ding ding.
I agree in general that Dems need younger leadership, but Pelosi specifically is really good at her job. I hope her eventual, younger replacement is effective at governing, not just spitting soundbites that will get shared on social media.
I mean McConnel isn't lying there, I'm sure he'd love it if every Democrat was like Manchin. He just isn't willing to compromise his agenda in service of bipartisanship. Pelosi isn't either.
I'm more convinced than ever that every American needs to go through a semester of model Congress, so they actually learn how things are done.
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Neither do dems considering they lost power in every single branch of government until just a few days ago! lol
What's the difference between Hillary and Obama? Policy wise, if anything Hilary is to the left of Obama. The difference is Obama was inspirational and Hilary wasn't. She was also very unpopular going into the 2016 election. That's what did her in her unpopularity, had nothing to do with policy.
This thread goes into more depth.
This faction has continuously nominated Tim Ryan for about a decade.
Yes, a Blue Dog white dude from Ohio who's more conservative than Pelosi in every way.
No, Democrats are good at governing and legislating. They know exactly how that works.
They're not good at placating racist white people who freaked the fuck out at the first black president and decided to punish his party.
But guess what? I don't want to be good at that.
Dude did you just turn 18?
Like these Anti-Pelosi fuckers know shit about anyone other than AOC
It's not Nancy Pelosi's job to win House elections.
That's the DCCC chairs job.
So, if you want to complain to Chris Van Hollen, Steve Israel, or Ben Ray Lujan, feel free.
This has probably already been stated, but I think a lot of the Pelosi hate was manufactured by Trump. Apparently she's the devil and poison for Democrats yet Dems got big House gains in the midterms. How many GOP candidates for the House ran on her being terrible? That loser Brat kept calling his opponent at their really Pelosi and he went down.
Saying that, I'm down with a new Dem House majority leader of there's someone that can do the job. New blood is good.
Saying that, I'm down with a new Dem House majority leader of there's someone that can do the job. New blood is good.
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You're right about that. Obama certainly knew how to please corporate interests by bailing out banks during the great recession while the rest of the country went up in flames. He was also very good at pleasing the neocons in the millitary and droning countless innocent people in the middle east. He also knew how to ignore the massive anti-police movement that was Black Lives Matter. He ignored it like a pro.
but this is getting off-topic now.
Yeah, sorry, but those two statements are mutually exclusive.
I would be excited for some new leadership in the House, myself.
It's like when GOP voters voted out any moderate, reasonable Republicans for the Tea Party.
And now you have a conglomerate of idiots who only how to say no to the other party or yell "You lie" to POTUS.
Nancy Pelosi is a genuine wizard at getting votes through the House. But she is also a huge millstone tied around the neck of the party electorally and image-wise. There is a reason that Republicans try to tie every Dem to her, and why young voters are uncomfortable when the average age of their party leadership is in the 70s. There's no reason she couldn't step down and continue to aid the new leadership more quietly behind the scenes.
That said, I have no idea what the new leadership should look down. Going through the normal order and letting it pass to Steny Hoyer I guess maybe eliminates Pelosi as a bogeyman, but doesn't do much about empowering the next generation. The Tim Ryan insurrection is intolerable to a party that's more liberal than ever.
They. Made. Tom. Daschle. A. Wild. Eyed. Leftist.
Putting up some younger person isn't going to stop the right for claiming they're Mao reincarnated.
Correction. The right has TRIED to make Pelosi an electoral issue, but failed miserably. People voted overwhelmingly on healthcare or race.
I looked him up and he sounds like what you describe pretty much
Had those banks not been bailed out the country's economy would have gone up in flames. The US Government ended up making a profit on that program. Had it not been implemented there would have been far, far more pain and destruction in its wake.
And Holder's DOJ did investigate civil rights violations. But they're federal and not omnipotent and don't have endless resources. Much of that work must be done locally, having control of only the WH is not enough to address those systemic issues.
I disagree with it completely, but one of the most popular things Obama did was drone people instead of sending more people to die in the war. Drones are only unpopular among the isolationist right and the anti-war left.
To be fair, the federal government could create an organization dedicated solely to ensuring police departments are operating ethically and investigate corruption. In fact there are many proponents from police whistleblowers for this organization to be created. Saying "I don't think Obama did enough to prevent corruption in the police forces of this country" is valid criticism.
Similarly, one could criticize the way banks were allowed to operate and how the regulations that were passed to prevent that have been watered down over time or are not being enforced effectively. That's not all attributable to Obama's administration, though.
They are very unpopular among the civilians of the countries where drone strikes are a daily occurrence. You don't need to downplay the harm caused by drone usage.
Anything that he did on those axes in response to BLM would have needed to be by E.O. given the loss of the legislature in 2010 and would have been dismantled last year because of the election results.
I mean, it's terrible to say, but since we're in a thread about politics, not morality, but people in those countries don't vote. There was no world where we were going to pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq. Obama ran on a surge in Afghanistan in 2008. He never said he was an anti-war leftist, so if leftists were disappointed about that, they should've listened to him actually speak and look up his actual policies.
Pelosi has proven to be a bulldog at ramming through legislation.
However, "reaching across the aisle" when the other party is a neo-fascist movement that locks brown children in cages is not acceptable.
You don't offer a hand to Nazis, you punch them.
However, "reaching across the aisle" when the other party is a neo-fascist movement that locks brown children in cages is not acceptable.
You don't offer a hand to Nazis, you punch them.
Sure, absolutely. I don't think that absolves him of criticism. He's not omniscient, for all he knew he would be succeeded by Clinton and his policies would be continued.
No shit, people who are against drone strikes are advocating we replace them with bombers. What a pointless statement.
Criticizing the use of drones when what you actually mean is to criticize our militaristic foreign policy is stupid, not my fault that's what people did
There's definitely room to criticize Pelosi with out parroting right wing propaganda. Fuck wrong with y'all?
And anyone who is anti-war is well within their rights to criticize acts of war. If you are opposed to drone strikes in foreign countries, those drone strikes dont suddenly become more attractive because its Obama ordering them.
No it isn't, they are criticizing the drone strikes because that's what method the US military is using. When the military was using troops they criticized that too. You can criticize both the methods and the policy that encourages the use of those methods.
So, what would you have Obama do in 2008, considering a supermajority of people did not want us to leave Afghanistan?
Like we said, none of these posters even know how any of this works. They blame the wrong people for the wrong things, and expect the impossible because they are too ignorant to know any better. These threads are basically always chock full of trying to teach these folks what the DCCC does, versus what the various branches of government do and are responsible for in addition to how little you can accomplish with no control.
Its depressing, because these people have SUCH STRONG OPINIONS on this stuff, but need to be reminded that Pelosi doesn't run House elections. This shit needs to be taught in High School...
I mean we should've left Afghanistan, literally the point of representative democracy is that sometimes a supermajority of people is dumb and wrong