Why is Dragon Quest largely ignored by the Western JRPG Community?

ULTROS! · Nov 8, 2018

I know this may sound hearsay but I have friends who love JRPGs but don't really talk or even recognize Dragon Quest. Basically they usually talk about Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, Tales, Persona, Xenogears, and even Suikoden. I know VIII and IX sold decently (millions of copies) but sometimes I feel like there's no dedicated Western fanbase for this series.

So Era, in your experience, do the people you know who are into JRPGs talk frequently about DQ?

Theswweet · Nov 8, 2018

I see more talk about DQ titles than I do about Suikoden, or even Xenogears, in western communities.

Deleted member 46641 · Nov 8, 2018

Square Enix isn't making a serious effort to push this in a west. No marketing, bad release dates.

Unknownlight · Nov 8, 2018

You have friends who regularly talk about Xenogears?

You need to hold onto those friends for dear life.

sir_crocodile · Nov 8, 2018

Poor marketing, seen as cutesy, failure to bring snes games west meant a lot of DW fans didn't continue with the series.

My personal experience is if someone knows Suikoden or Xenogears they're going to know DQ though. They're nicher then DQ nowadays

cw_sasuke · Nov 8, 2018

Thats not really true - VIII and IX sold +1m in the west....and even XI has still a bunch of sales left in its lifetime.

How many JRPG series sell much more outside of the bigger ones (Pokemon,FF, Persona)?
Its all about having the right set of expectations - the series shouldnt have to set the world on fire to be viable for SE and grow the community in the west. A steady release schedule and somekind of marketing will be enough - they are quality titles after all.

FiXalaS · Nov 8, 2018

It is probably not the case.. but I feel I need lots of patience and milk tea with biscuit to not feel bored.

I'm not a fan of the series but I liked DQ9 a lot, so maybe having XI on a handheld would be fun, I had hoped that the 3DS version would come over.

SMD · Nov 8, 2018

ULTROS! said:
I know this may sound hearsay but I have friends who love JRPGs but don't really talk or even recognize Dragon Quest. Basically they usually talk about Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, Tales, Persona, Xenogears, and even Suikoden. I know VIII and IX sold decently (millions of copies) but sometimes I feel like there's no dedicated Western fanbase for this series.

So Era, in your experience, do the people you know who are into JRPGs talk frequently about DQ?

I never even heard of it until my 20s cos the marketing was piss poor in the UK.

Isayas · Nov 8, 2018

The only JRPG fans that will talk about DQ/DW are folks in their mid 30 to mid 40s and they don't post on forums.

Deleted member 2254 · Nov 8, 2018

It's ignored? It seems to do decently for what it is. Keep in mind Dragon Quest never quite had its Final Fantasy VII moment of ultra-mainstream relevance, and I think it's doing well considering.

hank_tree · Nov 8, 2018

Because SE do a terrible job promoting it. Imagine if DQ11 was given the same marketing love and release slot as Octopath traveller?

Instead it was released to no fanfare the same week as Spider-Man, Destiny and SE's own Tomb Raider.

LiquidSolid · Nov 8, 2018

Masozi said:
Square Enix isn't making a serious effort to push this in a west. No marketing, bad release dates.

This plus the infrequent releases (we shouldn't have to hope they get localised), bad soundtracks and KH-like bouncing from PS2 to DS to PS4/PC (there's Wii and 3DS in there too but DQX wasn't localised and DQVII/VIII were very late remasters).

sredgrin · Nov 8, 2018

Story, I'd wager. It isn't to say they are bad, but a lot of other JRPGs have a lot more interesting stories, lore, and characters which helps their long form discussion.

The Praiseworthy · Nov 8, 2018

- Poor western marketing.
- Too classic for western taste.
- The overall art style might not be too appealing for many.

Ratrat · Nov 8, 2018

It's not cool/sexy and doesn't lend itself to fanart/fan fiction.

sir_crocodile · Nov 8, 2018

Isayas said:
The only JRPG fans that will talk about DQ/DW are folks in their mid 30 to mid 40s and they don't post on forums.

I'd put that as an age bracket pretty likely to post on forums tbh

Deleted member 35077 · Nov 8, 2018

I only played eight, but I hated how slow the level progression was as it took too long to see any results. As a twelve year old kid I would have stopped so much earlier if Jessica and her boobs weren't there.

In comparison to Kingdom Hearts were I was gaining plenty of levels in less than one hour.

Ricky · Nov 8, 2018

I play on consoles 98% of the time. The last console release outside of XI was VIII which I believe was in 2005. SE doesn't push this series which I sad because XI is possibly the best JRPG this gen imo.

Cyber Jim Davis · Nov 8, 2018

This might be a stretch, but I think part of it is because Enix didn't localize the SNES games. V in particular is such a masterpiece that I can't imagine it not being talked about with the same reverence as Final Fantasy VI and Chrono Trigger had it been released. While not nearly as good, Dragon Quest VI is a gorgeous SNES game and surely would have garnered some attention.

Instead, we had to wait until like 2001 for VII, which is like a game out of time. It had no chance. VIII and IX certainly made some inroads, but there isn't enough of the historical base to build from and support a big success without a huge, huge push.

(Before anyone says anything, having to give the first game away with Nintendo Power isn't much of a historical base to build on.)

Kanann · Nov 8, 2018

Need more memes.

Rival · Nov 8, 2018

I don't think it's very good. Story barely exists, character development is poor, and it just ignores the last 15 years of RPG advancements l.

Looks good though

skeezx · Nov 8, 2018

for starters there's not much to "talk about". DQ9 came out almost a decade ago, and we finally got a new one and it's great but lets be real it's not so amazing it's lighting the jrpg fan collective on fire

lucebuce · Nov 8, 2018

Kanann said:
Need more memes.

Bhonar · Nov 8, 2018

I think the art style is garbage

Isayas · Nov 8, 2018

sir_crocodile said:
I'd put that as an age bracket pretty likely to post on forums tbh

I understand but I never hear people rage over a lack of DQ game in the top 5 western JRPG fans list.

Mister X · Nov 8, 2018

Probably the greatest consistent JRPG series ever imo.

Anyway, europe got f'd when it came to Dragon Quest for years. And marketing was bad + seen as a childish rpg.

Cyberninja776 · Nov 8, 2018

I'd say it's just one never ending string of bad decisions, staring with not localizing most of the games during a strong Era of JRPGs in the 90s.

Plus I'm going to be real for a moment, the games while fun, probably aren't compelling for outsiders if they don't already have any affinity for older style games without hooks.

sir_crocodile · Nov 8, 2018

Isayas said:
I understand but I never hear people rage over a lack of DQ game in the top 5 western JRPG fans list.

The DQ game that has a shout for that position is DQV which never came west in its time.

Isayas · Nov 8, 2018

sir_crocodile said:
The DQ game that has a shout for that position is DQV which never came west in its time.

So? It's in my top 5. I didn't play any SNES JRPG until the early to mid 2000s. Why only stop at when you're a kid or at the time of the release? Lmao, that's silly. There games that exists before I born that I love.

Nuclear Muffin · Nov 8, 2018

The games just aren't really very interesting from a mechanical standpoint (yes I know this is by design).

Without the huge nostalgia factor that helps make it so successful outside of Japan, it's always going to struggle to catch peoples' eyes over here.

That being said, it can find decent success in the west. DQ8 and DQ9 both managed to top 1 million copies in the US and EU combined. Those are very respectable results; JRPGs really aren't that big in the west in general and most other JRPGs do not ever manage 1 million sales worldwide (or even 500k for that matter!).

Deleted member 8593 · Nov 8, 2018

I've said this before but if you aren't already into Dragon Quest and know more or less what to expect, the games come off as extremely bland and boring. Not to mention that a lot of their appeal is based on nostalgia. Unless you are willing to give them a chance, you're never going to notice the small things that make them stand out as incredibly polished JRPGs. If Square-Enix isn't willing to give the game a proper marketing campaign, they should do what they did with Bravely Default and Octopath Traveler: Release a demo and let people see what's the big deal by themselves.

Dreamboum · Nov 8, 2018

It was a million seller twice.

sir_crocodile · Nov 8, 2018

Isayas said:
So? It's in my top 5. I didn't play any SNES JRPG until the early to mid 2000s. Why only stop at when you're a kid or at the time of the release? Lmao, that's silly. There games that exists before I born that I love.

Is this a serious post? Nostalgia plays a massive role in those kinds of lists, and many people don't go back and play old games.

Mozendo · Nov 8, 2018

With Tales, Final Fantasy, Persona, etc, those games have more constant releases.

sir_crocodile said:
The DQ game that has a shout for that position is DQV which never came west in its time.

yeah, iirc Enix USA wanted to do V but Enix Japan rejected it. They later were working on VI and ran out of money and had to close down.

blackmass · Nov 8, 2018

I don't think it's getting ignored. But when you release your game along with Spider-Man, a new Tomb Raider and Destiny 2 DLC, your game will certainly bomb.

ULTROS! · Nov 8, 2018

Dreamboum said:
It was a million seller twice.

So is Star Ocean (2 and 3) but no one talks about SO anymore. :(

Jawbreaker · Nov 8, 2018

They need more commercials with Seth Green.

Gio · Nov 8, 2018

Cyber Jim Davis said:
This might be a stretch, but I think part of it is because Enix didn't localize the SNES games. V in particular is such a masterpiece that I can't imagine it not being talked about with the same reverence as Final Fantasy VI and Chrono Trigger had it been released. While not nearly as good, Dragon Quest VI is a gorgeous SNES game and surely would have garnered some attention.

Instead, we had to wait until like 2001 for VII, which is like a game out of time. It had no chance. VIII and IX certainly made some inroads, but there isn't enough of the historical base to build from and support a big success without a huge, huge push.

(Before anyone says anything, having to give the first game away with Nintendo Power isn't much of a historical base to build on.)

Yo that's an interesting point I haven't heard before. I want to add that the Squaresoft name had huge pull and recognition among RPG fans at the time, so games by devs like Enix or Falcom were probably handicapped by having to compete with the Final Fantasies.

Isayas · Nov 8, 2018

sir_crocodile said:
Is this a serious post? Nostalgia plays a massive role in those kinds of lists, and many people don't go back and play old games.

This is why I don't take people seriously. They want to play what it is in. I played the original Metroid recently before getting into Super Metroid. You can't skip games before it you so call love the genre. It is silly.

Dreamboum · Nov 8, 2018

ULTROS! said:
So is Star Ocean (2 and 3) but no one talks about SO anymore. :(

I think there was a lot of discussion around SO5. SQEX believes about the SO/Anime crowd enough to have released Anamnesis. It's just that there was too long a time between SO4 and 5. Same for DQ

Isayas · Nov 8, 2018

Gio said:
Yo that's an interesting point I haven't heard before. I want to add that the Squaresoft name had huge pull and recognition among RPG fans at the time, so games by devs like Enix or Falcom were probably handicapped by having to compete with the Final Fantasies.

Not really on the elitist level yea but for the casuals. Super Mario RPG is the only JRPG that made noise before FFVII was released 18 months later.

Famassu · Nov 8, 2018

Masozi said:
Square Enix isn't making a serious effort to push this in a west. No marketing, bad release dates.

I mean, they do some fairly big improvements to western releases because they know some of the "old school" decisions they still withhold in the original Japanese releases wouldn't fly here in the west. They do try, but something in the games just doesn't gel well with the mainstream JRPG audience in the West.

Yeah, they don't spend unimaginable amounts of money for marketing, but from experience they know it won't lead to millions of more copies sold even if Dragon Quest gets the big bucks for marketing. DQIX had an absolutely massive marketing campaign and it didn't sell much better than DQXI did.

impact · Nov 8, 2018

Not enough waifus for these weeabs

Bitanator · Nov 8, 2018

Never understood the tepid response, it has the best monster designs in the genre.

Rapscallion · Nov 8, 2018

The franchise's mainline entries have been few and far between, especially in the west. Paired with little marketing, and it's just not getting the exposure that Square gives to the FF games.

That said, they're still fairly popular games in the community. The amount of talk around DQXI has been great. Very few JRPGs get huge exposure in general, but certainly DQ games are some of the most revered. We just need more of them!

Bitanator · Nov 8, 2018

ULTROS! said:
So is Star Ocean (2 and 3) but no one talks about SO anymore. :(

They talked about it enough to get a half assed effort that was SO: Integrity and faithlessness

and now I doubt another will be made

ULTROS! · Nov 8, 2018

Cyber Jim Davis said:
Instead, we had to wait until like 2001 for VII, which is like a game out of time. It had no chance. VIII and IX certainly made some inroads, but there isn't enough of the historical base to build from and support a big success without a huge, huge push.

Interesting point though, but I'd like to also to place this view on the Tales series.

The whole Tales fandom didn't begin until the release of Tales of Symphonia (or maybe even Tales of the Abyss), so technically before that, it pretty much didn't have a historical fanbase (do people outside Japan talk about Tales of Destiny?). I'd say the Tales came out a bit past the JRPG prime but was able to create a dedicated niche fanbase (like fans who cosplay the characters, character polling, merchandise, etc.), which DQ wasn't able to cultivate. Both series are almost in the same position (was heavily introduced in the West during the mid 2000s, their big introduction game sold millions) except sales and Tales had a Western presence in the golden era of JRPGs. What did Tales do to create this dedicated niche that DQ wasn't able to do?

Mediking · Nov 8, 2018

I'm actually a fan of DQ but this silent bland protag has got to go.

Nightengale · Nov 8, 2018

Western JRPG community is not a united symbiosis of a community.

There are big communities in big franchise JRPGs like FF and KH but stuff like DQ, Suikoden, Yakuza, Trails and Tales are micro-communities that are very passionate about the IP, but is smaller than what the internet chatter may imply for them.

Fans of Yakuza/Trails/Tales will not necessarily support DQ and vice-versa. Even more so for the bigger franchise JRPGs.

Valkerion · Nov 8, 2018

DQ11 came out at a terrible damn time and did not go hard enough on its hype campaign to convince everyone to grab it, over all the other amazing games dropping at the same time.

As for as a game, DQ is fine but its never stepped its stories and characters up compared to others. While Japan was raised on jolly Dragon Quest, most western fans were raised on Final Fantasy 7. Least thats my general theory without muddying it too much.

Why is Dragon Quest largely ignored by the Western JRPG Community?

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