UK/Physical - Forza Horizon 4 is outselling Assassin's Creed Odyssey

ashtaar · Nov 4, 2018

uptownsoul said:
Because GamePass actually does hurt sales…Just look at NPD for Sea of Thieves.

In March NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/04/24/...5-debuts-as-the-top-selling-game-of-the-year/ ) both Sea of Thieves & MLB launched at the same price ($60)and released within 7 days of each other. Sea of Thieves was #2 while MLB was #3 on NPD…

Fast forward to April's NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/05/22/april-npd-2018-god-of-war-is-the-big-daddy/ ) and MLB stayed at #3 while Sea of Thieves fell to #18

Now I ask you, how did one $60 game (MLB 18) stay at #3, while the other $60 game (Sea of Thieves) drop 16 spots?

.... I don't know where to begin, but I guess I'll start with when has an xbone one exclusive stayed in the top 5 if it wasn't halo 5?
The install base for Xbox one is smaller and by most account the show is a superior game.
You can argue that it doesn't help sells but the fact that xbone had multiple exclusives place highly on the npd even taking the number 1 spot by a game that is only 30 dollars I think, points in the other direction.

Regardless this is great news for playground, they've made a great looking, great playing racing game and I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with fable at xo18

D65 · Nov 4, 2018

Certinfy said:
Did Odyssey bomb hard here then? As great as Horizon 4 is I find it hard to believe numbers are that insane given it's on Gamepass.

This increases sales

Remo Williams · Nov 4, 2018

Ethan Hutn said:
Let's be real. Being bundled with pretty much every One S/X helps a lot at the end of the day.

Happy for the success though nonetheless.

Let's also be real, having such an attractive and well received game increases the appeal of the console, especially when you can find the two bundled together.

OneBadMutha · Nov 4, 2018

Good! Not rooting against Assasins Creed. I'm rooting for Game Pass games to continue selling well outside of Game Pass. This could eventually lead into Sony following suit with putting new stuff in PS Now if they can feel confident about double dipping like this.

TooBusyLookinGud · Nov 4, 2018

I see Microsoft's business move is paying off. Good for them.

GTVision · Nov 5, 2018

I don't know about the UK, but in other places FH4 is currently moving more units via bundles than the standalone game. It makes this specific comparison a bit more tricky.

Not to say FH4 isn't a great success, cause it is (and deservedly so).

TheKeyPit · Nov 5, 2018

Certinfy said:
As great as Horizon 4 is I find it hard to believe numbers are that insane given it's on Gamepass

xICHIGOx said:
I guess so or I don't know why they buy the game since it's on gamepass.

Some of you still don't want to realize that GamePass actually helps the game to sell more. I know that it's hard to grasp, but that's how it is.

Valdega · Nov 5, 2018

Sei said:
Says more about FH4 than Odyssey really.

Ubisoft games have their open world game market, but seems like Forza hit it big with the general market.

Are we pretending that UK sales are somehow representative of global performance? That's why these threads always irritate me. The UK is a tiny part of the overall market. To put it in perspective, Japan is about double the UK's size.

It's bizarre that people pay so much attention to UK sales when the UK is about as relevant as France, Germany, Italy or Spain.

Pryme · Nov 5, 2018

uptownsoul said:
Because GamePass actually does hurt sales…Just look at NPD for Sea of Thieves.

In March NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/04/24/...5-debuts-as-the-top-selling-game-of-the-year/ ) both Sea of Thieves & MLB launched at the same price ($60)and released within 7 days of each other. Sea of Thieves was #2 while MLB was #3 on NPD…

Fast forward to April's NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/05/22/april-npd-2018-god-of-war-is-the-big-daddy/ ) and MLB stayed at #3 while Sea of Thieves fell to #18

Now I ask you, how did one $60 game (MLB 18) stay at #3, while the other $60 game (Sea of Thieves) drop 16 spots?

This ain't sound logic, chief.
I'm not sure how you can use the NPD drop to infer that it is due to Gamepass. Or why you don't know that Sports titles are relatively evergreen and tend to linger in the charts.

Perhaps even why you think it was only the second month after SoT released that consumers discovered Gamepass.

panda-zebra · Nov 5, 2018

Valdega said:
Are we pretending that UK sales are somehow representative of global performance? That's why these threads always irritate me. The UK is a tiny part of the overall market. To put it in perspective, Japan is about double the UK's size.

It's bizarre that people pay so much attention to UK sales when the UK is about as relevant as France, Germany, Italy or Spain.

Germany is currently bigger in terms of value (being a nation 25% larger by population that's expected), but not France. And Italy and Spain don't nearly compare. UK is the world's 5th largest market behind China, USA, Japan and Germany. Recent forecasts have it growing to larger than Germany within 2 years, despite brexit.

Xx 720 · Nov 5, 2018

Kind of think gamepass sells more of the special/ultimate editions, since the plain version is available. Really curious if Grip, which comes out on retail and gamepass Tuesday sells.

Zappy · Nov 5, 2018

uptownsoul said:
Because GamePass actually does hurt sales…Just look at NPD for Sea of Thieves.

In March NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/04/24/...5-debuts-as-the-top-selling-game-of-the-year/ ) both Sea of Thieves & MLB launched at the same price ($60)and released within 7 days of each other. Sea of Thieves was #2 while MLB was #3 on NPD…

Fast forward to April's NPD ( https://venturebeat.com/2018/05/22/april-npd-2018-god-of-war-is-the-big-daddy/ ) and MLB stayed at #3 while Sea of Thieves fell to #18

Now I ask you, how did one $60 game (MLB 18) stay at #3, while the other $60 game (Sea of Thieves) drop 16 spots?

The fact sea of thieves charted at number 2 and state of decay 2 at number 1 (iirc) in their launch months is rather indicative that gamepass is not hurting sales but actually increasing them. Nobody expected those chart positions at all. The drop for SoT from month 1 to 2 probably reflects the fact that it didn't review wel and word of mouth won't have been that strong. Was never likely to have huge legs.

Vishmarx · Nov 5, 2018

Deserservedly so.

ThisIsBlitz21 · Nov 5, 2018

AC isnt doing that bad, its just that the UK loves their racing games.

Madmackem · Nov 5, 2018

Chettlar said:
Doesn't Odyssey have bundles too though?

Maybe I'm thinking of Origins, but I thought Odyssey did as well.

Not to any great degree, you struggle to grab an Xbox atm without it coming with fh4.

MilesQ · Nov 5, 2018

Madmackem said:
Not to any great degree, you struggle to grab an Xbox atm without it coming with fh4.

I'm looking at bundles on Game sbd Amazon, but imI not seeing any popular bundles with FH4.

Anyone got some links to these bundles?

Deleted member 25108 · Nov 5, 2018

MilesQ said:
I'm looking at bundles on Game sbd Amazon, but imI not seeing any popular bundles with FH4.

Anyone got some links to these bundles?

Just a cursory glance on HUKD....

https://www.argos.co.uk/search/xbox-one-x/?utm_campaign=11553376&cmpid=COJUN&cjsurferid=120563838825435342:KSNOeB7TB4Gi&utm_medium=affiliate&utm_content=Pepper+Deals+LTD&utm_source=CJ&cjevent=a6bc3129e0c611e8813b01da0a18050d&catalogId=10001&storeId=10151&_$ja=tsid:11674|prd:1546795&utm_term=1453124&referredURL=https://www.argos.co.uk/search/xbox-one-x/&referrer=COJUN

https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and-home-entertainment/gaming/gaming-consoles/microsoft-xbox-one-s-with-forza-horizon-4-fifa-19-tekken-7-project-cars-2-bundle-10186128-pdt.html?awc=1599_1541400588_805cc6f114af2daad452aac355fe75be&srcid=369&xtor=AL-1&cmpid=aff~HotUKDeals~Communities & UGC~47868&awid=47868

https://www.shopto.net/video-games/...orza-horizon-4-and-forza-motorsport-7-console

Personally I think its pretty hard to argue that the series hasnt seen some growth, but framing it by putting it against AC odyssey isnt really saying much. The AC games have been on a decline at UK retail since syndicate.

DrDeckard · Nov 5, 2018

So I'm guessing both Xbox bundles and the game are selling very well. What a turnaround ms has had this gen after a colossal eff up.

shark97 · Nov 5, 2018

panda-zebra said:
Germany is currently bigger in terms of value (being a nation 25% larger by population that's expected), but not France. And Italy and Spain don't nearly compare. UK is the world's 5th largest market behind China, USA, Japan and Germany. Recent forecasts have it growing to larger than Germany within 2 years, despite brexit.

In console terms which is mostly what this board concerns most with, it's probably second.

You can make a case Japan, Germany and China are all not very console focused markets. Well Japan still is fairly strong, BUT I'd argue since they tend not to buy Western third party games, they become less relevant. Ubisoft, EA, and Activision, dont care all that much about the 7 million PS4's sold so far in Japan, really, because those owners are fairly unlikely to buy their games.

shark97 · Nov 5, 2018

Anyways this is why MS is adding a lot of devs to playground, and given them that 2nd upcoming game not in the racing genre to work on. They're really a star in MS studios, maybe the only one right now. Moreso than say, Turn 10. Regular Forza does ok, but it's been easily eclipsed by Horizon that last few years.

christocolus · Nov 5, 2018

shark97 said:
Anyways this is why MS is adding a lot of devs to playground, and given them that 2nd upcoming game not in the racing genre to work on. They're really a star in MS studios, maybe the only one right now. Moreso than say, Turn 10. Regular Forza does ok, but it's been easily eclipsed by Horizon that last few years.

Yea, They sure are talented. Can't wait to see what they are working on next.

nekkid · Nov 5, 2018

Valdega · Nov 5, 2018

panda-zebra said:
Germany is currently bigger in terms of value (being a nation 25% larger by population that's expected), but not France. And Italy and Spain don't nearly compare. UK is the world's 5th largest market behind China, USA, Japan and Germany. Recent forecasts have it growing to larger than Germany within 2 years, despite brexit.

Yes, 5th largest and nowhere near the U.S. or China. Europe as a whole is a significant market but UK alone? Not so much. To make matters worse, these sales figures only account for physical console sales which make them even less relevant as digital and PC sales grow each year. On top of that, digital revenue includes not just sales of the game itself but also DLC and microtransactions, both of which comprise a huge amount of actual profits.

So yeah, I really don't see the point of these threads. They don't really convey useful information about a game's overall performance.

Martl · Nov 5, 2018

A great game and great bundles lead to great sales. So the question is how the ratio between bundled and normal sales is.

Deleted member 30005 · Nov 5, 2018

Xbox must be over the moon with the progress of Forza Horizon this generation. Development could not have gone better for them. All the more impressive at a time when the racing game genre is sputtering.

HellofaMouse · Nov 5, 2018

Correct me if im wrong, but isnt the uk market proven to not be representetive of global sales?

Xx 720 · Nov 5, 2018

Never would of thought horizon would eclipse mainline Forza but it has. Anxious to see playgrounds work on next gen hardware.

leng jai · Nov 5, 2018

Xx 720 said:
Never would of thought horizon would eclipse mainline Forza but it has. Anxious to see playgrounds work on next gen hardware.

Pretty sure Horizon has been more popular than the mainline games since FH3.

chris 1515 · Nov 5, 2018

It is rise of Forza Horizon sales and fall of AC sales at the same times since AC Unity.

https://www.jeuxvideo-live.com/news...le-les-ventes-lors-sa-premieere-semaine-87448

AC Origins debut sold less than Uncharted 4 or Spiderman or God of War worldwide and probably less than Horizon Zero Dawn too.

Edit: And AC Odyssey sold less than AC Origins at retail in UK

http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2018...les_down_26_percent_from_origins_at_uk_retail

Edit: I would be curious to see Forza Horizon sales If Xbox was a popular console in continental Europe.

zzzyz36 · Nov 5, 2018

In Australia the x1x bundles had FH4, F7 and RDR2 so RDR was probably shifting horizon units more than anything else, horizon just a bonus.

I'm playing the GP version but I bought the ultimate upgrade, wonder if that counts as a sale.

honest_ry · Nov 5, 2018

It came with my Xbox One x. Then I immediately sold it for £40.

Also, its o e of the best games ever so deserves all the sales.

OG_Thrills · Nov 5, 2018

zzzyz36 said:
In Australia the x1x bundles had FH4, F7 and RDR2 so RDR was probably shifting horizon units more than anything else, horizon just a bonus.

I'm playing the GP version but I bought the ultimate upgrade, wonder if that counts as a sale.

99% of the stores who sell consoles here in the UK were selling Forza + RDR2 unofficial bundles. Or bundles like...

Which brings the price of the console down by an insane amount if you were to ebay or trade in the games. We're seeing simmilar deals for the 1X with Fifa, COD, RDR2, and FH4 locally.

Pryme · Nov 5, 2018

HellofaMouse said:
Correct me if im wrong, but isnt the uk market proven to not be representetive of global sales?

Good thing we have evidence from the US that Forza Horizon 4 is selling very well there, too.

OG_Thrills · Nov 5, 2018

HellofaMouse said:
Correct me if im wrong, but isnt the uk market proven to not be representetive of global sales?

It's said to be XBOX's best performing market outside of the US and therefore garners more attention when it comes to XB EU sales. Unfortunately, outside of that market it's hard to get a read on retail sales because XB exclusives rarely chart in places like Germany, France, Spain etc etc

MCN · Nov 5, 2018

We do love our racing games over here. It's why most racing game studios are based here.

christocolus · Nov 5, 2018

well done PG games it's good to see such a stellar product doing so well.

DrDeckard · Nov 5, 2018

OG_Thrills said:
99% of the stores who sell consoles here in the UK were selling Forza + RDR2 unofficial bundles. Or bundles like...

Which brings the price of the console down by an insane amount if you were to ebay or trade in the games. We're seeing simmilar deals for the 1X with Fifa, COD, RDR2, and FH4 locally.

Microsoft are going hard with the bundles in the uk

Pryme · Nov 5, 2018

DrDeckard said:
Microsoft are going hard with the bundles in the uk

'Unofficial'.

Spacecowboy · Nov 5, 2018

Great news, glad to see PG doing so well

artfulkurosawa · Nov 5, 2018

I'm playing both games (well, Horizon is on hold while I plow through Odyssey) now and both are great. Good to see both doing well in the marketplace. Not sure why people feel the need to tear one game down to praise the other. If 10-year old me would have caught a glimpse of either game on a big 4K TV, I'd have lost my shit. Also, Xbox dissing...why?

pswii60 · Nov 5, 2018

TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

sns97 · Nov 5, 2018

OG_Thrills said:
It's said to be XBOX's best performing market outside of the US and therefore garners more attention when it comes to XB EU sales. Unfortunately, outside of that market it's hard to get a read on retail sales because XB exclusives rarely chart in places like Germany, France, Spain etc etc

In France, sell.fr provides the Xbox One Top 3 (using GSD data). We can see that AC:O charted better than Forza Horizon 4 on Xbox One between week 40 and 42.
But with the release of RDR2 in week 43 they're both out of this top 3 unfortunately.

Code:

France Xbox One Top 3 (sell.fr)

Week 40:
  1. AC:O
  2. FIFA19
  3. FH4

Week 41:
 1. COD:BO4
 2. AC:O
 3. FIFA19

Week 42:
 1. COD:BO4
 2. FIFA19
 3. AC:O

Week 43:
 1. RDR2
 2. COD:BO4
 3. RDR2 Special Edition

christocolus · Nov 5, 2018

pswii60 said:
TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

xD...so true xD

DR2K · Nov 5, 2018

How is this in anyway impressive? We're talking about one of the weakest major markets physical sales data.

nekkid · Nov 5, 2018

pswii60 said:
TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

It sold well? There must be some sort of explanation!

MCN · Nov 5, 2018

pswii60 said:
TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

Microsoft aren't allowed to do well! This place seems to have the weirdest Xbox hate-boner at times.

Trup1aya · Nov 5, 2018

Rodjer said:
This is an impressive result for an Xbox One game also available on Gamepass.

Certinfy said:
Did Odyssey bomb hard here then? As great as Horizon 4 is I find it hard to believe numbers are that insane given it's on Gamepass.

Gamepass has proven time and time again to have no negative impact on sales. If anything it helps boost sales..

Golvellius · Nov 5, 2018

pswii60 said:
TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

Put a smile on my face, good summary :)

Shark · Nov 5, 2018

Awesome. Playground Games is a fantastic dev and has perfected this formula. I'm glad there is big a market for this type of game.

Ebtesam · Nov 5, 2018

pswii60 said:
TLDR summary of the thread so far:

1) It's only for one week!
2) Oh it's LTD? Then obviously it hasn't outsold PS4 + XBO versions of ACO combined, this is XBO only
3) Oh right.. it's outselling both combined, really? Well Assassin's Creed Odyssey has bombed big time
4) It hasn't? Hmm.. well FH4 is cheaper than ACO, I've seen it cheap in places. That's the reason.
5) Game Pass helps increase sales
6) No it doesn't
7) Yes it does
8) No it doesn't
9) Sea of Thieves!
10) Bundles!!
11) RDR2

So So true xD

UK/Physical - Forza Horizon 4 is outselling Assassin's Creed Odyssey

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