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cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,400
Vita really should have gotten a GoW game, made by RaD
Not really, the Uncharted performance is what resulted in Sony and other big pubs pulling the plug.
It was their big, impressive launch title based on a big IP and received positive reviews...

Yet even after a bunch of bundles, sales and whatever it barely managed to made it to 1m shipped units in its lifetime.

Good/Great for niche titles that catered top a small audience and could be successful with sub 1m sales worldwide..but poison bigger sales expectations.
 

Deleted member 36493

User requested account closure
Member
Dec 19, 2017
4,982
Not really, the Uncharted performance is what resulted in Sony and other big pubs pulling the plug.
It was their big, impressive launch title based on a big IP and received positive reviews...

Yet even after a bunch of bundles, sales and whatever it barely managed to made it to 1m shipped units in its lifetime.

Good/Great for niche titles that catered top a small audience and could be successful with sub 1m sales worldwide..but poison bigger sales expectations.
I'm speaking more in terms of what I would have liked to see. The PSP GoW games were some of my favorites.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,925
Was the Vita Dead on Arrival or was there actual hope for at least some success before launch?
People thought it'd do great upfront given the announced support, specs and price. Then the emergency $70 3DS pricecut and MH3G/4 announcements happened and things changed pretty quick.

edit: though to be fair people thought 3DS and Wii U were also slamdunks prelaunch and both ended up also doing way worse than expected. Nintendo did turn 3DS around somewhat but at great cost.
 

Deleted member 10737

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
49,774
Was the Vita Dead on Arrival or was there actual hope for at least some success before launch?
many people thought it was actually gonna be able to compete with, or even beat, 3DS when it came to handhelds in that gen. probably because 3DS's launch price was very high too.

People thought it'd do great upfront given the announced support, specs and price. Then the emergency $70 3DS pricecut and MH3G/4 announcements happened and things changed pretty quick.
yeah. nintendo course corrected really well and saved the 3DS from a similar fate to vita. this is why i don't agree with people kinda celebrating how sony abandoned vita as if they had no other choice. there was a lot they could have done to help it.
 

Hoot

Member
Nov 12, 2017
2,107
Was the Vita Dead on Arrival or was there actual hope for at least some success before launch?

The vita had some chances, but it was basically purposefully buried by Sony (especially Sony America) barely a year after its launch.

it did pretty nicely in japan for a while. Not that great in europe but there was genuine effort from the Sony Europe studios (Killzone Mercneary is legit good, and Tearaway was a really fun little thing, although no console seller, but it played better on vita to me than on ps4). A year after release tho, Sony basically had no word for the console at the major shows (it was ignored at E3 quickly after it came out). Coupled with the fact that they did not invest in having anyone actually making first party content for the console (every major releases like Uncharted Golden Abyss were relegated to a third party dev. Some launch games were given only a fucking 5 month dev time. That's how little they cared about quality).

The lack of care in also pursuing significant major third party titles, like Monster Hunter, also kinda sealed the deal.

It could've had a chance. Not to be as big as the 3Ds. But certainly to have a better fate than what it ended up having. The apologists will usually say "Well it didn't sell so Sony had no reason to bla bla", but the reason it didn't sell well is that Sony made no initial effort in the west in the first place. It was a self fulfilling prophecy
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,925
yeah. nintendo course corrected really well and saved the 3DS from a similar fate to vita. this is why i don't agree with people kinda celebrating how sony abandoned vita as if they had no other choice. there was a lot they could have done to help it.
Yes Nintendo did what needed to be done with 3DS to course correct. I'd argue they didn't with Wii U though, even though they continued ahead with their software plans on the system for it's active lifecycle.

In a very real sense Nintendo and Sony both left Wii U and Vita to their fates, even though they went about it differently.
 

Deleted member 18407

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,607
there are no proper retail releases in the west. LRG are a couple thousand at best. the best selling Vita stuff is all in Japan and don't really breach 10K units anymore
I guess I'd count games sold at GameStop and Amazon as proper retail releases though. That's the reason I was asking too, since the retail releases are so niche now, they can't be selling much in the US. Punch Line and Death Mark just came out last month and I can't imagine they sold more than a few thousand copies, right?
 
Was the Vita Dead on Arrival or was there actual hope for at least some success before launch?
I think a lot of folks were riding high on the NGP conference with all the fancy tech demos they were showing off (MGS4! Lost Planet 2! Yakuza Something or Another!) that complimented the titles that did wind up being real games, and the following E3 where the price turned out to be the same as the 3DS at the time was a real jaw-dropper. Once TGS came around and Nintendo initiated Operation Vita Es Muerte, however, I think that a lot of the writing was on the wall at that point.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,960
Osaka, Osaka
I bought zero games physical and at least 50 digital.

It's really hard for me to think this is a good metric of Vita software sales.

I'll see myself out though.

I think a lot of folks were riding high on the NGP conference with all the fancy tech demos they were showing off (MGS4! Lost Planet 2! Yakuza Something or Another!) that complimented the titles that did wind up being real games, and the following E3 where the price turned out to be the same as the 3DS at the time was a real jaw-dropper. Once TGS came around and Nintendo initiated Operation Vita Es Muerte, however, I think that a lot of the writing was on the wall at that point.

This is true. Also Sony initiated the "Vita who?" Operation, and dropped it year 2.
 

ILikeFeet

DF Deet Master
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
61,987
I guess I'd count games sold at GameStop and Amazon as proper retail releases though. That's the reason I was asking too, since the retail releases are so niche now, they can't be selling much in the US. Punch Line and Death Mark just came out last month and I can't imagine they sold more than a few thousand copies, right?
GS and Amazon would be "proper retail". I didn't know those games got retail releases (that aren't company stores), but regardless, a few thou is the best they can hope for, aye
 
This is true. Also Sony initiated the "Vita who?" Operation, and dropped it year 2.
The weird thing about how they handled the Vita in year 2 was how oddly specific the branding was in Japan. SIEJ went in hard with all the hunting action games to make that the focal point of the Vita, so they gave a lot of time to stuff like God Eater 2, Toukiden and others while making a big deal out of Soul Sacrifice as their very own take on the genre. "You guys don't need Monster Hunter, as we have all the hunting action you can stomach!"

...and then MH4 came out and outsold all of those games combined, so yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah.
 

Garlic

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,687
Yes Nintendo did what needed to be done with 3DS to course correct. I'd argue they didn't with Wii U though, even though they continued ahead with their software plans on the system for it's active lifecycle.

In a very real sense Nintendo and Sony both left Wii U and Vita to their fates, even though they went about it differently.

Honestly I feel the need to save 3DS had a huge role in how the Wii U turned out
 
Honestly I feel the need to save 3DS had a huge role in how the Wii U turned out
I don't think there's any question of that. 3DS stumbled out of the gate so hard that the whole company flinched, and even with Japan safely on lockdown, they couldn't ignore just how crappy things looked in the west. I wonder what would have happened with the launch had OoT 3D been there on day 1, as I think the lack of any major "wow" title from Nintendo really hurt that system in a way we hadn't seen before, only to make it all the more grim that they did it again with the Wii U. They forgot that games sell hardware, not the other way around.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,925
Honestly I feel the need to save 3DS had a huge role in how the Wii U turned out
That's true too, Nintendo could probably only save one in terms of the resources needed. They let Wii U ride it out as is and made sure to continue planned 1st party software support in an effort to make some money on the platform and please core users but they didn't make the sort changes that would've been needed to make the system a real success.
 

Deleted member 9100

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,076
It is so sad that the Vita COD is number 2. Never played it, but by all accounts it is an amazingly shitty game (and I love console COD).

Such a shame too because the vita had so many amazing games that should be higher than that. Just from a FPS perspective the Killzone vita game was fantastic.
 

srtrestre

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,971
Any interesting Vita TV info? Only #s I've ever seen were from that hilarious "Sony just killed AppleTV/Sony read the market perfectly"JPEG from the old site, and that number was in the single digit thousands or something like that.
 

Arthands

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,039
Vita is like that guy who had a premature ejaculation. He never have a second shot

There was some hope before launch because it was the same price as 3ds and they thought they still had monater huntwr but even gaming journalists were openly questioning its ceiling with how mobile had exploded.

No not really. The Vita was announced with the same price, but it was done for as soon as they revealed the memory card price. There has to be a catch somewhere, and people were too impatience to see what the catch is.

Not to mention the games announced were weak af. Those stuffs they shown such as Yakuza, Monster Hunter P3 or MGS4 were just prototype showcases and never confirmed as actually coming to Vita in the future, and Bioshock/Assassin's Creed/Call of Duty were announced with nothing to show (and they end up as smartphone tier shits). If anyone actually think Vita stood a chance they are being delusional and let the hype get to their head without being rational.
 
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Agent X

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,141
New Jersey
Abbreviating Mortal Kombat 2011 as MK11 when there's an actual Mortal Kombat XI isn't confusing at all.

There's a Mortal Kombat XI?

I have a pretty good Vita collection but no Uncharted, is that worth picking up? Not huge on 3rd person shooter type games, though, and never played the console games.

If you're not big on the genre, but can get the game at a good price, then I'd recommend it. I know several people in this thread don't care much for it, but personally I think it's a very good game in its own right, aside from some of the touch screen and camera gimmickry.

You don't need previous experience with the other Uncharted games to enjoy this game. In fact, it might be good for you to start with this one, for two reasons:

1. Chronologically, the events of this game precedes all of the other Uncharted games.

2, The other Uncharted games are generally superior overall, so if you start craving the story and the gameplay, then you can expect even better things when you move on to the PS3/PS4 games.

I still want a Uncharted: Golden Abyss Remaster on PS4 ;(

I'd like to see that, too.

No Lumines? I have lost faith in humanity.

Yeah, sad to see it didn't crack the top 10. I wonder where it ended up in the grand scheme of things? It's still a great game, and (like Uncharted: Golden Abyss) still exclusive to the system after all these years.

Lumines and Wipeout Pure were two of the first games I bought for PSP at the US launch. Seven years later, Lumines: Electronic Symphony and Wipeout 2048 were among the first Vita games I bought at or very close to that system's launch.
 

Seeya

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,984
Vita had absolutely no chance whatsoever and it was clear from the beginning.

I honestly think that they might have had a chance had they dropped one of the touch screens, the OLED, and had some of that internal memory for users, while giving it proper L2/R2 controls, and securing monster hunter. Basically kept manufacturing costs down while keeping the msrp neutral and ensuring seamless remote play compatibility. They also needed to aggressively go after getting support from the android gaming segment.

Alternatively they should have sold a very cheap (but marked up) L2/R2 add on for remote play.

As is it was basically just a bit too expensive still and couldn't quite deliver on a lot of fronts. In a lot of ways they designed the vita with the same mindset as they had with the PSP, when they should have learned with the PSP and PS3 that a prestige product "build it and they will come" only pans out if all the fundamentals are in place, including the price.
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,721
I honestly think that they might have had a chance had they dropped one of the touch screens, the OLED, and had some of that internal memory for users, while giving it proper L2/R2 controls, and securing monster hunter. Basically kept manufacturing costs down while keeping the msrp neutral and ensuring seamless remote play compatibility. They also needed to aggressively go after getting support from the android gaming segment.

Alternatively they should have sold a very cheap (but marked up) L2/R2 add on for remote play.

As is it was basically just a bit too expensive still and couldn't quite deliver on a lot of fronts. In a lot of ways they designed the vita with the same mindset as they had with the PSP, when they should have learned with the PSP and PS3 that a prestige product "build it and they will come" only pans out if all the fundamentals are in place, including the price.

Nah. I think Vita just simply came out too late.

Smartphones had already eaten its entire market and the 3DS has swallowed up what was left (even 3DS just barely survived the onslaught!)

Vita really needed to launch a year earlier, ideally more than that. They really should've aimed for a 2009-2010 release, before the absolute explosion of smartphone tech.
 

Celine

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,030
Nah. I think Vita just simply came out too late.

Smartphones had already eaten its entire market and the 3DS has swallowed up what was left (even 3DS just barely survived the onslaught!)

Vita really needed to launch a year earlier, ideally more than that. They really should've aimed for a 2009-2010 release, before the absolute explosion of smartphone tech.
Yeah, both 3DS and PSV were handheld consoles conceptualized before the smartphone explosion and based on old assumptions.
3DS survived and ultimately sold relatively well but that was on the back of Nintendo first-party software which sold 190 million units worldwide (just for reference the whole PSP total software sales as March 2012 was 330 million units).
PSV didn't have the luxury of having Nintendo games so when third-party support was weak it sealed its fate from the get go.

I think a lot of folks were riding high on the NGP conference with all the fancy tech demos they were showing off (MGS4! Lost Planet 2! Yakuza Something or Another!) that complimented the titles that did wind up being real games, and the following E3 where the price turned out to be the same as the 3DS at the time was a real jaw-dropper. Once TGS came around and Nintendo initiated Operation Vita Es Muerte, however, I think that a lot of the writing was on the wall at that point.
Since Nintendo unveiled 3DS at E3 2010 it was clear Nintendo was aiming to steal third-party support from Sony handhelds, they showed off games identifiable with the PS brand and with graphics fidelity or game concepts that simply couldn't be done on the humble DS.
Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil, Street Fighter, Ridge Racer, Dead or Alive, Kingdom Hearts and later Monster Hunter all screamed "hey the PSP games you liked now could run on our shining new handheld why bother with Sony next portable?".
 
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Since Nintendo unveiled 3DS at E3 2010 it was clear Nintendo was aiming to steal third-party support from Sony handhelds, they showed off games identifiable with the PS brand and with graphics fidelity or game concepts that simply couldn't be done on the humble DS.
Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil, Street Fighter, Ridge Racer, Dead or Alive, Kingdom Hearts and later Monster Hunter all screamed "hey the PSP games you liked now could run on our shining new handheld why bother with Sony next portable?".
I don't disagree, but I don't think they really hit that home for a lot of folks until the Monster Hunter double whammy. That not only showed off Nintendo's savvy, but also exposed Sony's lack of planning on the Vita that they couldn't secure even a G-rank version of the game that just got done selling 5 million units in Japan, let alone the next generation of the series.
 

ILikeFeet

DF Deet Master
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
61,987
I don't disagree, but I don't think they really hit that home for a lot of folks until the Monster Hunter double whammy. That not only showed off Nintendo's savvy, but also exposed Sony's lack of planning on the Vita that they couldn't secure even a G-rank version of the game that just got done selling 5 million units in Japan, let alone the next generation of the series.
If there was an early sign of Sony foregoing japan, that was it
 

Principate

Member
Oct 31, 2017
11,186
I don't think there's any question of that. 3DS stumbled out of the gate so hard that the whole company flinched, and even with Japan safely on lockdown, they couldn't ignore just how crappy things looked in the west. I wonder what would have happened with the launch had OoT 3D been there on day 1, as I think the lack of any major "wow" title from Nintendo really hurt that system in a way we hadn't seen before, only to make it all the more grim that they did it again with the Wii U. They forgot that games sell hardware, not the other way around.
I mean the Wii U launched with what they considered to be a "wow" title. New series sold between 10-30 million and that game even sold sell as far as wii u games are concerned. It's just not a series that really expands a products consumer base but more a title that scales with it.