only one I can think of is Misango and he's like D-list at best
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we aint ever getting shit
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Smash Ultimate has 74 Characters, yet lacks Black/Brown characters (READ OP)
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only one I can think of is Misango and he's like D-list at best
we aint ever getting shit
Imagine if they just put Mike Tyson in. His final smash could be exactly the same as fighting him in punch out. You use it and he disappears, and 8 bit versions of him appear on screen for every affected character, and they have to dodge every hit to not get knocked off.
User Banned (2 weeks): History of dismissive posts in serious topics
You can pick a black Mii character, black Inkling and a black villager. I really don't understand the issue here. Most of the roster is non-humanoid anyway...
The graphic novel was planned well in advance of the game's release I am sure. Moreover, Spring Man doesn't tell you everything about the game. The eponymous ARMS in ARMS aren't arms. They're the weapons. And more than just your arms can have the stretchiness thing applied.
Having said that, I agree with your conclusion, as between the two of them they cover everything about the game and universe and, in addition, have the fire and ice thing going.
There's a fuckton. Of the top of my head you have
- Elena from Street Fighter
- Zasalamel from Soul Calibur
- Demoman
- Shadow Man
- Doc Louis
- Sazh from FFXIII
- Shinobu from NMH
- Dudley from Street Fighter
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Who is attacking him? He said he's a white person yet doesn't associate with any character and so doesn't think people should care about this, dismissing the concerns of the thread.
In response, it was pointed out that due to him being white, he hasn't had the opportunity to understand what it's like to not be represented, so he shouldn't be dismissive of how others feel about this topic.
That is the point really it will take many decades before we can catch up, games with PoC leads are not being made that often and as you pointed out developers create games to reach the most people so minority groups are not always going to get representation in the most popular games.
It is something to shine a spotlight on, but it is not something any reasonable person should hold their breath for because it will take a lot of willingness and many years to change.
We're discussing racial representation in video games. The "It's a fictional world" point doesn't apply, because ultimately that would lead to no group getting any representation outside of documentaries because 'it's fictional'. If the world and characters are clearly directly modelled after European characters, then it's fair to say they represent European people.
If there's someone out there who is enough of a dumbfuck to say that "All anime characters are WHITE" while ignoring all the clearly Japanese signposting in them, then Iunno. I don't even know what kind of mindset you have to go through to just pretend a bunch of white european people took over modern Japan and are all eating noodles and generally just being pretty darn Japanese.
I have a lot to read in this thread... but you touched upon one of my two points:
1) Nintendo/Gaming in general needs to do a better job at creating more diverse leading and prominent characters. Before we even talk about who gets into Smash we need to talk about how to expand the pool of black and brown characters to choose from.
2) Smash needs to look at the black/brown characters that exist already while also considering a (hopfully) expanding pool of characters to choose from. As mentioned, Twintelle and Elma are awesome choices - especially Twintelle because she isn't the "main" character but definitely the fan favorite.
fuck it, I am now campaining for MISANGO
He's black/brown, latino AND a native person, he's more diverse than generic American Twintelle.
He's black/brown, latino AND a native person, he's more diverse than generic American Twintelle.
Actually, with SM as an AT and RG as a costume, Twintelle's chances as a DLC character shot up.
Mario
Link
Samus
Dark Samus
Zero Suit Samus
Luigi
Captain Falcon
Peach
Daisy
Popo and Nana
Shiek
Zelda
Dr. Mario
Marth
Lucina
Young Link
Ganondorf
Roy
Chrom
Pit
Dark Pit
Wario
Snake
Ike
Pokemon Trainer
Lucas
Olimar
Toon Link
Villager
Mega Man
Wii Fit Trainer
Rosalina
Little Mac
Palutena
Robin
Shulk
Ryu
Ken
Cloud
Corrin
Bayonetta
Inkling
Simon
Richter
Mii Fighters
So like some of these are the same person, some are humanoid but not human but there are more "humans" in Smash than animals and other creatures.
It's my understanding that the fans (rightfully) brought this up with the devs for Half Genie Hero and she was changed back to her darker skin tone. That I followed. I'm unsure of whether or not a similar controversy occurred before that but I guess I wouldn't be too surprised.
I get the argument you're making, but she's never been officially depicted as anything other than a person of color in her games. Imo that's what counts.
It's a lot harder to understand this kind of thing when you're well represented in practically every game you have and will ever play.
As well as all other forms of entertainment.
I think there has been a misunderstanding, in the case of Fire Emblem and other fictional world settings, Japanese players/readers/viewers do not assume the characters to be Japanese nor European based on the language, clothing, mannerisms, etc. It's like watching Star Wars, even though I am hearing Han Solo speaking American English, it does not mean that I should assume the character is American, thanks to the text at the beginning, I know it is taking place in a galaxy far far away.
The problem is that he isn't anywhere near as popular as Twintelle.fuck it, I am now campaining for MISANGO
He's black/brown, latino AND a native person, he's more diverse than generic American Twintelle.
here were a couple posts that stood out for me.
I was disappointed in this too. I think there's some concept art floating around whereI would've greatly preferred that. It even looks better.she has all the weird crystal hair stuff going on but retains the brown skin.
I'm at least glad that her true form is only a thing in the very last cutscene and they immediately give you the option to keep her default look.
That last one especially is pretty damn mean. I mean yeah sure, we're all adults, what's a joke here and there, right? Definitely not a joke in good faith though.
His post was arrogant and ignorant all in one, but at the same time I can somewhat understand him. I've "connected" with Link as a character for years, same with plenty of other non-brown characters. You don't need to be the same race to connect/relate to a character. I agree it helps plenty, and I'd love to see more leading roles by people of color (Just Cause is a great example), but that doesn't limit me in any way in connecting or relating to characters.
How about not constantly bringing up alternate costumes and skins as get out of jail free cards when games chooses to represent characters with light skinned defaults. This is like letting them have their cake and eat it too.
at this point I think we're done with arbitrary rules for who gets in, Sakurai clearly don't give a fuck
but I know he's NEVER getting in, just saying he'd be a more diverse pick than Twintelle
Twintelle is a French woman.fuck it, I am now campaining for MISANGO
He's black/brown, latino AND a native person, he's more diverse than generic American Twintelle.
But what color is gannon? I have always seen ganon and gerudo race (and gorons too) in general as the black characters in zelda.
I've sorta always associated Fire Emblem characters as Japanese tbh. Yeah plenty of the games take place in a more European setting, but I dunno, them being Japanese-like was just stuck in my head.
If Japanese players were having this conversation, right now, trying to decide how much ethnic representation that Japanese and/or Asian players get in games, would Marth go under "Japanese race" or "White European race"? Would he be viewed as being closer to Mario and Link? Or closer to Ryu?
Hhhhooooooowwwwww!!!!???
I think Twintelle is definitely going to be the ARMS character that gets in. She is a girl, black, and very popular for...reasons.
I'm dumbing down his entire reasoning for the way he feels because of race. YES
lol
He can but at the moment, it is what it is.
I don't see these as Smash worthy characters. I think Nintendo is the key here at least if we are on the topic of Smash Twintelle and Elma are the most iconic fit, Doc Louis should not be fighting, Punch-Out has a really bad history when it comes to race a lot of the humor was pretty racist to all peoples. Smash use to mean you had to at least had a history with Nintendo platforms. Any of those on your list is kinda Assist Trophy levels because putting them in for the sake of skin color would bring Smash to the level of PS All-Stars. If you have to google the names we already lost the deal.
The point is you won't downgrade the cast with Twintelle and Elma they carried their games enough and still on the minds of many fans of the Switch.
I'm black and I don't understand it either, so it's not just him.
In all the time I was playing games growing up I literally never gave any thought to the fact that the fictional characters in the games I was playing were a different race as me. If a black character was available I'd be likely to pick them, like in Streets of Rage for example. But I've never actually cared beyond that.
I identify far more with Michael than Franklin in GTAV, because Franklin is a street gangster and is nothing like me as a person. His skin colour is one small part of his character, just like it is for me. I have no affinity with a character just because they're a similar colour to me; they don't represent me and they have nothing to do with me. And someone doesn't not represent the kind of person I am just because they're white. This idea of race-based "representation" in fictional media is just so bizarre to me.
Yeah I dunno. Maybe because Marth has always spoken Japanese in any game I've played him in, or that Lyn was the first Fire Emblem character I interacted with.
Did you really take me posting a picture of Wario as an attack? He said he didn't feel represented as a fat white male who dreams of more. I showed him a fat white male who dreams of more who is in the game to point out that, he actually is represented. Even though there was some humor intended, it's far from being mean or being an attack. You seem to be more upset about our tone in responding to the guy than his total disregard for how minorities feel about representation and why it might be important to them.
I can connect with Link too. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be more diversity. There is an inherent difference when you have grown up seeing people that look like you put only in minor roles, stereotyped roles or none at all versus when people that look like you almost 100% of the time are represented. As a black male, I connected differently to the movie Black Panther than I did Captain America. Doesn't mean I couldn't connect to Captain America but it's very different and there is a problem when someone who isn't black tries to tell me that it doesn't mean anything.
It really sorta baffles me too. Like do people think they can identify with Link more because they're white? Or with the Master Chief because they're white?
A well-written and created character will be able to connect with pretty much anyone, regardless of race.
Talking more established characters than avatars (Miis, inklings, villagers)
He's from a race of desert-dwelling brown people, but he himself is a corrupted evil wizard so he looks all greenish and nasty
Forgot about Doc. Sandman seems like a better fit for Smash as a Little Mac opponent.
By my count, there are 44 human/humanoid characters in the Smash Ultimate roster. This is more than half the playable characters. So if you want to say there are 44 playable humanoid characters, only 3 of them (Inklings, Villager, and Miis) offer you black or brown skin tones. None of these skin tones are the default and are options beneath more prominently featured white characters. By the metric the OP is going for, there remains zero black or brown characters in the fighter roster by default.
The status quo is unchanged whether you count from 44 or 72. The answer is still that there are zero black or brown fighters outside of three skin-tone options for other characters. Those three options are good. I am grateful for them. I am glad there are brown Inklings and Villagers. But the problem as a whole persists.
There have been a few people who've asked this, so I don't mean to single you out. You were just the most recent person to reply to.
It's kind of late right now, so I am not going to LINE any of my friends to ask, but that is an interesting question. I would assume, that most never would have thought about it until the question is posed to them. Ethnic representation isn't a big deal here, it is thought of in a very different way than in the West.
I can agree, since I've also connected with plenty of white characters.
But then the next question is: why aren't there more coloured protagonists? If we can connect to characters of any race, why are they all white by default 99% of the time?
You're right that it's lacking, but it does have Ganondorf, Little Mac, and skin color options for Villager and others.
That's the pity with Japanese character game designs though since the 80s. Characters have been known to have many colorful hairstyles, but they're usually pale-skinned.
That's the pity with Japanese character game designs though since the 80s. Characters have been known to have many colorful hairstyles, but they're usually pale-skinned.
Lyn (specifically for her character), I can understand (as she is Sacaean, which is like Elibe's Asians). Marth, if having not yet played Fire Emblem, I can understand (Though I, and most others, took this as 'hes the guy only in JP games so he only gets JP voice', but that's not something that would apply to the JP audience). But as soon as you open a Fire Emblem game and see any of the other characters, I can't see looking at any of those and thinking the majority are Asian.
This is a fair point that they may not consider it (and this fact that they probably DON'T give it much thought in general is why I give early Nintendo characters a full pass on race), but I would be shocked that if after thinking about it they would place Marth and Roy as being more Japanese than European.
I mean
A. It makes yoyr statement factually wrong, which is why I'm correcting it (same as I've corrected misconceptions surrounding Ken's heritage)
B. It points out that, hey, Twintelle is also a woman who gets to be both athletic AND feminine, which is rare.
And
C. It just generally pisses me off when people see black folks advocating for something and, instead of saying 'hey, let's get in on this too' they decide to say 'fuck what the darkies want, what about us'.