I think that almost everyone considers self defense or the defense of your child or another innocent against an attacker to be a valid exception to the rule that it is wrong to hit people.
Also, out of curiosity, which country are you from?
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Is physically reprimanding your kids child abuse? (i.e. spanking, whoopings)
- Thread starter AnansiThePersona
- Start date
I think that almost everyone considers self defense or the defense of your child or another innocent against an attacker to be a valid exception to the rule that it is wrong to hit people.
Also, out of curiosity, which country are you from?
It just plain doesn't work. I caught a whooping every now and then and walked away with 0 resentment or, as far as I can tell, mental scars could really only be effectively punished by taking privileges away. The only time a beating ever did me any good is when my grandmother got my cousin for bullying me and got me for not standing up for myself. That has stuck with me my entire life and done me quite a bit of good in terms of not being a doormat or compromising myself, but that's some pretty narrow application and may have only worked in the context of the rest of my upbringing.
Standing applause for the justification of spanking children. For somebody that does their best to NOT spank your own children please reconsider your priorities other than, ha you sure showed the libs on that one!
Um, I have my priorities pretty well in check, and I don't know what you mean by "you sure showed the libs on that one". I haven't spanked my kids for 12-13 years now. Popped them a few times between 3-5 years old. After 5ish, they were a lot easier to communicate with and understand what they were being told. Personally, if that makes me a shitty parent in someones eyes, that's on them. I'm good where I stand with my very well adjusted, hard working, honest, selfless kids. All three of 'em.
Did you read the post he responded to or is "lib owning" some sort of automatic response now?
So do you prefer a lack of discipline period? Or avoidance of all negative feedback?
In a thread about physically reprimanding your children, I thought it was self evident that we weren't discussing self defense, but apparently I was wrong. Self defense is of course a valid exception to the don't hit people rule. That exception gives that it is morally justifiable for the child to fight back when being spanked.
The world is plenty gray as you say and my opinion and firm belief is that it will be a little brighter if people stop hitting their children.
Please try not to beg the question. If you wouldn't hit an adult, why would you hit a much smaller, slower and less intelligent person?
Let's just say, if my brother, who is a grown adult, kept taking my spoon at the table and I told him to stop, I'd pop his hand too. How about them apples?
I've noticed posters referring to physical punishment as "popping" quite a lot on this thread. It sounds so innocuous. Is it like kissing?
And here I notice that you're actually admitting to "popping" children before they're even able to understand what you say. And you ask if I would consider you a poor parent. Are you fucking kidding? You were literally hurting a child who had no idea why you were doing it. We don't do that to dogs.
So you're basically a violent person. Great defence of your parenting skills.
So you're telling me what my kids knew and didn't know 17+ years ago?
When I tell my grand daughter to put her blocks in the toy box, she puts her blocks in the toy box. When I ask her to clean up her toys, she picks all her toys up and puts them in the toy box. "Nat, clean your hands", she wipes her hands with the paper towel. If she doesn't have a towel, she'll use her shirt. I tell her, "Nat, don't use the shirt, go get a towel". Guess what!!!?? She walks to the kitchen and gets a paper towel. She understands FULL WELL what I'm saying. Not that I've ever had to physically discipline her. She's not my child. My kids weren't much different back when they were toddlers. They understand what you're saying at 2+ years old. They don't understand things they haven't been taught. Well, you don't punish people for doing things they haven't been taught. You teach them about what they might not be understanding at that time. Of course you don't just simply go off on a kid when you haven't even taught them what is going on. You make a lot of assumptions on other peoples methods, and things they did with people that you know nothing about.
Last night, grand daughter in the den with me. It's past 10pm and she was very tired, but refused to go to sleep. So I told her she could watch cartoons. So first, she started sitting on the couch watching cartoons. Fighting going to sleep. After the first episode of Bubble Guppies, I told her she had to lay down to watch any more. She refused. So, I paused the show. Told her again, "Nat, lay down and you can watch it again". She put her little head on the pillow and continued watching. She almost fell asleep, and sat back up, so I paused it. Didn't say anything to her. She said, Pappy, cawtoo pls. I said she had to lay down. She did, and she watched it until she fell asleep. She's two. I guess she couldn't understand what I was saying.
Don't try and sit here and tell me what my kids didn't know. smh
Oh for goodness sake. Yeah, I'm violent.
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Just POPPING in to let you know that you don't have this right.
I mean, he was quoting you where you said that after the age of 5ish is when they understand what they're being told.
"After 5ish, they were a lot easier to communicate with and understand what they were being told."
You may as well have written that long post in response to yourself.
They were more wiling to take what was being said, not that they couldn't understand what was being said.
So don't go off on someone when you weren't being very clear. I misunderstood you in the exact same way. You used the word understand, not the word comply.
I see what you mean. Simplified, at two years old, they knew what they were being told, but refused to do what was asked. Little pop on the hand or butt, non-pain inflicting. Just a distraction, and they would pay attention better. Sometimes just a loud clap would get the attention. I won't ask anyone else to do anything I did or didn't do when raising my kids, as it pertains to how someone else raises theirs. I won't judge another in that respect. My kids barely had to get popped, spanked, whatever, but they were never abused. They are 17, 17, and 21 now. The only thing they do these days, for the past few years even, is not clean their room, wash their clothes. trivial things like that. So they lose privileges until they clean up after themselves. My son is living in our second residence while he's in college, so he has to maintain that house by himself. If he doesn't then he'll be moving back in the primary home.
My girls are straight A students. They are in their senior year in highschool, and taking four college classes through the high school. They also work part-time, a choice of their own. They were taught that material things aren't free. If they want more than I provide, they have to pay for it. They would do extra chores around the house to earn money, but they were able to find a job they like doing. My son, has a daughter, he works 30hrs on the weekend, provides for her, and is a junior in college. 5 semesters left and he'll be a nurse. They work hard, they have goals and they set priorities to achieve those goals. They aren't afraid to ask for help when they aren't sure about something.
Again, if someone wants to say that I'm a bad parent because the only thing they think about is that I popped/spanked my kids over a decade ago, well, go for it. It's ridiculous to say the least, but if that's someones thing, let 'em have at it. I couldn't be prouder for what I've taught them, what they've learned, and how they are applying these things in the real world at such young ages.
There's a disconnect in this thread. What you're describing is more akin to the way I tap my two year old on the shoulder to get his attention. When the anti-spanking people talk about spanking or "popping," they're thinking about hitting them in a way that causes pain and crying.
There's plenty of "shitty parent" comments on here for what we are describing. They are saying what we described is still hitting a child. So, you do it to? You're as shitty a parent as me. /s
Here is a live example of listening, knowing what we are saying... 2yrs old.
She wanted more toys, but we told her she had a LOT of toys on the floor already. She throws a fit. Told her she had to clean her blocks up first, then she can have another toy...
... and just about done.
She wanted more toys, but we told her she had a LOT of toys on the floor already. She throws a fit. Told her she had to clean her blocks up first, then she can have another toy...
... and just about done.
The problem is that the clarification comes like six posts later deep into the back and forth. I guarantee you that everyone speaking out against you thinks that you were hitting your kids, not touching them in order to get their attention.
I know it's prolific now, but take some time to read randomly through the thread. People are telling stories of being hit and beaten pretty badly. So then when someone comes in and says "yeah I hit my kids," that's the context everyone is reading that statement with.
Especially because nobody would consider something akin to a tap on the shoulder to be an actual discipline method. As you said, it's a way to get their attention for the actual discipline or discussion. The guy you gave a standing ovation to was talking about hitting a kid being the only way to stop them from throwing full soda cans on cars from a height. He backtracked later, but do you think that tapping them on the shoulder is what he was talking about as being a way to reach a kid like that? He said he never did it again after that. After his dad just got his attention? It wasn't the explanation after the attention-getting, because he said himself that he knew it was wrong from the beginning.
The thread is talking about reprimanding/disciplining via spanking/whoopings. If you come in to defend that practice and then retreat to saying that what you're actually doing is just gaining attention of course there's going to be some misunderstandings. There's no definition of spankings in my mind that wouldn't involve some pain. It wouldn't be disciplining without pain. It definitely wouldn't be a whooping. I'm not sure I understand the point of tapping someone without pain and then defending that as the only way to solve an issue. It seems pointless if that's truly what you're doing.
In any case it's really muddying up the discussion. The discussion is about physically reprimanding via a method that induces physical pain. i.e. spanking, hitting, whooping, etc. If what you're doing doesn't involve physical pain then we're literally not talking about you and you don't need to be offended over someone else doing something that clearly isn't what you're doing. I will say that only you actually know what you're doing, so if you're deliberately downplaying what's happening you should probably examine why. I'm not calling out anyone specific because maybe they're not, but I do know a lot of pro-spanking people here really were trying to obfuscate things with clever word changes.
In any case it's really muddying up the discussion. The discussion is about physically reprimanding via a method that induces physical pain. i.e. spanking, hitting, whooping, etc. If what you're doing doesn't involve physical pain then we're literally not talking about you and you don't need to be offended over someone else doing something that clearly isn't what you're doing. I will say that only you actually know what you're doing, so if you're deliberately downplaying what's happening you should probably examine why. I'm not calling out anyone specific because maybe they're not, but I do know a lot of pro-spanking people here really were trying to obfuscate things with clever word changes.
I don't think that's what the OP intended, but the "tapping" has been described as physical abuse by multiple people in this thread, that's where the arguments have been occurring.
Well, anybody who thinks it is abuse to tap a kid with the force of a shoulder tap in order to gain their attention is off the mark. I apply more g-force to my son when I pick him up.
Well, I can't speak for how your brother might or might not behave, but you gave a hypothetical situation in which you would react to a minor provocation by hitting.You'd fight at the dinner table rather than moving your spoon out of reach or simply leaving the table until the nuisance gives up. Most people live their entire adult lives without having to smack, slap, hit or "pop" others. This in turn sheds a poor light on your parenting skills.
Yeah, doubt that. If you'd let someone bully and provoke you, and you'll walk away, that's all your choice. At some point, I'll stand up for what is mine. I taught my kids the same thing. If that's bad parenting by your standards, oh well.
Exactly this. If it's not physical punishment then it's not the topic of the discussion.
You are correct, I can talk to many different kids with different personalities and mostly be successful with that approach.
EDIT: Just wanted to apologize for this post. I was shitposting and did not at all mean anything that I said. I don't condone physically reprimanding children in the slightest.
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Super dumb racist remark. It's nonsense. First of all: Many white people hit their kids. And lots of white kids who never got spanked are great kids. Also, not all non-white people hit their kids.
The absolute dumbest post i've seen in a long time.
When I misbehaved, I got a smack on the bottom. When I said something bad, I got my mouth washed out with soap. I learned eventually to behave and watch my mouth.
These lessons have stuck with me into my adult life. As far as I'm concerned, discipline for abhorent behaviour works.
These lessons have stuck with me into my adult life. As far as I'm concerned, discipline for abhorent behaviour works.
I learned to behave well without being abused by my parents.
Sure, that kind of aggressive conditioning works fine. Works on animals too. We wouldn't be able to enjoy circus animals without it. You still have the choice of other ways that work just as well or better though.
It's all up to you to do it in a different way or not. But if a false sense of authority is more important than i can understand you rather hit your kids. The fear that that induces almost feels like they respect you, right?
Did you just call me a child beating circus animal? Because get fucked if you did.
I have not had to discipline my child. If they misbehave I will teach them through reason and understanding.
But if my child is literally Eric Fucking Cartman when they get older and laugh at your pathetic attempts to be Super Nanny, then they will get a smack on the bottom or wrist.
Hmm, I've heard the phrase "wash your mouth with soap, but always took it to be a figure of speech.
Please, folks, don't stick nasty stuff into your children's mouths. Especially for something as minor as being impolite, this is sending the wrong message about how to be a responsible adult.
If the risk of being considered a disgusting lout by your fellow adults isn't enough, consider that in the United States forcing a child to take soap into the mouth has occasionally resulted in loss of custody of the child, and that a young man was fined for washing a child's mouth with soap in the UK.
I was spanked as a kid and I'm fi- no, wait, it fucked me up. Hitting your kids is wrong, end of.
I don't think cracking out a belt and whipping a child is great or striking them across the face but a quick/sharp slap on the butt is okay.
Friend, you seem to have been taught to use physical aggression, even to the point where you voluntarily give an example of fighting with your own family at the dinner table as a model for your favoured method of childrearing.
I'll do you the courtesy of assuming you've got pumped up with bravado and got carried away, that you're not disposed to come to blows with your own closest family over dinner table silliness, and that your children were never the uncomprehending recipients of inexplicable and unexpected smacks.
The alternative hypothesis is too hideous to countenance.
Wow. You're a pro. You've successfully analyzed who I am because of four post on the Internet, while tactfully using over exaggerations with some assumption sauce. Well done.
I'm merely pointing out that you are willingly presenting yourself as a person with a very short fuse. I assume you're presenting a caricature of your true self. If you really do physically attack your own family over the dinner table, I don't know what more to say.
My mom was pretty abusive at one point. She would spank me, slap me, throw things at me, hit me with a shoe, etc.
And I honestly cannot imagine ever having a kid and hitting them. Or an animal.
I have a dog and even if she poops in my shoes and pees on the floor the most I'll do is lift my hand up and pretend that I'm about to hit her
And I honestly cannot imagine ever having a kid and hitting them. Or an animal.
I have a dog and even if she poops in my shoes and pees on the floor the most I'll do is lift my hand up and pretend that I'm about to hit her
Jesus, I read the post and all they said was they'd pop their brother on the hand for taking his spoon. How in the world do you come up with everything you did over something so silly and small.