Sony, where are your sales figures?

They're all about the MAU after the first 3 million sales

Square Enix are transparent with sales ? Not so much :p

Capcom and Nintendo are the only one to have a dedidacted website which update the total shipment of their best selling games.

As for Sony, they have been the only one to give sales-trough data on a regular basis (you forgot Horizon and God of War on your list). More update would be appreciated, but they still gave more useful and real data than 95% of the industry this gen.

It's because Sony sells a lot more than just gaming products. If they went into that much detail for gaming then investors would ask for the same in other divisions. The top line figures are made available on a regular basis and we get hardware shipments every quarter.

Calling maybe the most transparant company regarding figures out on this issue is questionable.

Sony is actually the company who is reporting their sales the most though?

Honest question: why aren't their provided numbers enough for you? What are you looking to gain?

I don't see why any company is obliged to provide sales figures to the consumers.

Mass_Pincup said:

Sony is actually the company who is reporting their sales the most though?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

This. I'm confused, especially if you compare with square enix.

You are calling out Sony? They are the only company that reports continuously.

Jarod McChicken said:

Square Enix are transparent with sales ? Not so much :p

Capcom and Nintendo are the only one to have a dedidacted website which update the total shipment of their best selling games.

As for Sony, they have been the only one to give sales-trough data on a regular basis (you forgot Horizon and God of War on your list). More update would be appreciated, but they still gave more useful and real data than 95% of the industry this gen.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Yep .
We lucky we getting the amount of data we getting from them .

Linus815 said:

I don't see why any company is obliged to provide sales figures to the consumers.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Console war ego.

Anas said:

I know but if Nintendo does it too much, why not Sony too?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

In some ways Sony give more data early on since we get more than ship numbers from them .

Wabba said:

You are calling out Sony? They are the only company that reports continuously.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

really? it never feels like we know the latest number for their big games. they report stuff shortly after release, but do we know where their big exclusives stand years after release?
i guess it would be kinds pointless tho and i get why they don't report sales numbers a while after release, these games are very front-loaded and they're not moving big numbers a year after release, there's no reason to flaunt that.

Anas said:

I know but if Nintendo does it too much, why not Sony too?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

The simple answer is because they're not expected to - so they don't want to.

PlayStation is just one division within Sony Corp, and thus in the grand scheme of things - the only expectations that investor want from SIE is a picture of the business at the high level, so that's all that is shared.

SIE's sharing of first-party sales are very much PR-moves to highlight that their first-party blockbusters do great numbers, but beyond very specific data, they don't like to share anything else that isn't positive data.

Sony is very quick to release news on sales when they have something to be proud of, but they never show poor results, as they tried to cover Vita's failure and others previously.

So my guess is that their games (most of the time confirmed by top ten sales charts around the world) do not tend to sell much after the launch window.

gundamkyoukai said:

In some ways Sony give more data early on since we get more than ship numbers from them .

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Sure, we get more milestone updates from Sony, but in terms of detailed sharing of hardware/software sales across the board, Nintendo is much better since their quarterly and annual reports indicate software sales, and Sony's doesn't.

Anas said:

Fans want to know how much their favorite game sold

Not necessarily console war ego, I love bloodborne and I want to know much it achieved

It's like loving a friend and wanting to know how much s/he achieved in their life

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

But does it really matter?

Out of everything else you buy, is there anything you care how much sales they've done?

I bought Hardwood Backgammon on XBL for I think 400 pts. Whether it sold a lot or I was the only guy in the world who bought, who cares.

Nightengale said:

Sure, we get more milestone updates from Sony, but in terms of detailed sharing of hardware/software sales across the board, Nintendo is much better since their quarterly and annual reports indicate software sales, and Sony's doesn't.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Very true i just happy we get anything from them .
Since the industry has become even worst that before when it comes to data .

Harald23 said:

Sony is very quick to release news on sales when they have something to be proud of, but they never show poor results, as they tried to cover Vita's failure and others previously.

So my guess is that their games (most of the time confirmed by top ten sales charts around the world) do not tend to sell much after the launch window.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Harald23 said:

So my guess is that their games (most of the time confirmed by top ten sales charts around the world) do not tend to sell much after the launch window.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

yeah, it's not like nintendo's evergreen titles that tend to sell a few hundred K each quarter years after release. at this point continually updating people on what bloodborne or uncharted 4 are selling each quarter is pointless because the number is insignificant

When arrogant Sony can't be used anymore, let me introduce you to Opaque Sony™

Even though we get more than enough numbers for games and hardware, it is a catchy name

Why is it important?

MrTired said:

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

?

It's true that Sony immediately stops providing data when those aren't good, and it's also true that usually their exclusives stop to sell after the launch window, because that's their strategy: let's say treating Spider-Man as the most important game ever and then few months after "old news, now this new exclusive is the only thing you should care".

Harald23 said:

Sony is very quick to release news on sales when they have something to be proud of, but they never show poor results, as they tried to cover Vita's failure and others previously.

So my guess is that their games (most of the time confirmed by top ten sales charts around the world) do not tend to sell much after the launch window.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Not really that, even.

Even when game has good results, sometimes it's not that valuable a move to reveal it. Because it then sets a milestone from a PR perspective. For example - the fact that TLOU1 sold over 17 million copies will be a benchmark that is pitted against TLOU2.

For example, I don't expect Sony to reveal first-year sales of Horizon 2, even though they did for HZD - because combined franchise sales will allow the data to be more impressive and blended in instead of highlighting that game X sold more than game Y, etc etc.

I can see gamers wanting to know sales for sake of critical mass. There needs to be some kind of minimum level of user base in order to make it worth it for game makers to support various platforms. And in those early years, some gamers want to know if it's trending to be a PS success or an Atari dud.

But at a certain point, it doesn't really matter anymore because every key platform will likely get that third party game (with exception of Nintendo systems who have their own universe of have/have not games due to the unique hardware).

Whether it's PS 80M / XB 50M / PC 100M, or PS / XB / PC all at 70M each, there's likely enough critical mass for game makers to support all platforms.

I think they reported Horizon at 8m.

Obviously a 'total' can only ever be a running one, at least up to a point.

I guess they don't break down that per-game detail in financial reports because investors are only really concerned with aggregate unit totals and revenues, which are reported.

So that means you may only get an update on a given franchise's last entry when they're marketing the next entry... often sales will be cited then as part of a reminder of why this game will be 'a big deal' or whatever.

Harald23 said:

?

It's true that Sony immediately stops providing data when those aren't good, and it's also true that usually their exclusives stop to sell after the launch window, because that's their strategy: let's say treating Spider-Man as the most important game ever and then few months after "old news, now this new exclusive is the only thing you should care".

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

As Nightengale said even when the games do good they don't always give figures .
Sure it easy for them to say for eg UC4 sold over 10 million but i guess they don't see the point .

Anas said:

I know but if Nintendo does it too much, why not Sony too?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Because Nintendo is a gaming company and its first party games are a huge part of its revenues. This is not the case for Sony. Also, I would not be surprised if they are forced by the Japanese regulator to disclose theses numbers. Is there any public Japanese publisher who does not disclose its sales numbers?

This is also why Sony and Nintendo have to disclose their hardware sales, but Microsoft don't. For Microsoft, Xbox is so small that the investors don't care

gundamkyoukai said:

As Nightengale said even when the games do good they don't always give figures .
Sure it easy for them to say for eg UC4 sold over 10 million but i guess they don't see the point .

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

But then console warriors will use the radio silence to affirm whatever their narrative is at that point. In anycase Sony doesn't need to release the numbers if they don't want to, the warriors be damned.

Nightengale said:

Not really that, even.

Even when game has good results, sometimes it's not that valuable a move to reveal it. Because it then sets a milestone from a PR perspective. For example - the fact that TLOU1 sold over 17 million copies will be a benchmark that is pitted against TLOU2.

For example, I don't expect Sony to reveal first-year sales of Horizon 2, even though they did for HZD - because combined franchise sales will allow the data to be more impressive and blended in instead of highlighting that game X sold more than game Y, etc etc.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Nightengale said:

The simple answer is because they're not expected to - so they don't want to.

PlayStation is just one division within Sony Corp, and thus in the grand scheme of things - the only expectations that investor want from SIE is a picture of the business at the high level, so that's all that is shared.

SIE's sharing of first-party sales are very much PR-moves to highlight that their first-party blockbusters do great numbers, but beyond very specific data, they don't like to share anything else that isn't positive data.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

this makes sense, since they haven't set a precedent on sharing software numbers in a specific format, they have a lot of freedom to share any data they want in a specific way that makes them look the best.
for example not sharing the vita numbers but later announcing the 500 million thing.

Sales figures are for investors & board members. They tell them.

Aokiji said:

Sales figures are for investors & board members. They tell them.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Board members know, but regular investors don't necessarily.

If you're a Sony investor, you're an investor in Sony Electronics, Movies, Insurance, Games and all other Sony stuff. Just as they don't reveal everything for all divisions, they don't reveal low impact sales data for the games division.

I'm not sure why so many posters defend them not giving any numbers or details, especially since it got worse over the years.
There's no good reason to not show them.

It's not a Sony only problem mind you, but "others too!" is not an argument.

Nightengale said:

Not really that, even.

Even when game has good results, sometimes it's not that valuable a move to reveal it. Because it then sets a milestone from a PR perspective. For example - the fact that TLOU1 sold over 17 million copies will be a benchmark that is pitted against TLOU2.

For example, I don't expect Sony to reveal first-year sales of Horizon 2, even though they did for HZD - because combined franchise sales will allow the data to be more impressive and blended in instead of highlighting that game X sold more than game Y, etc etc.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Your argument only compliments mine in the sense that they use sales figures mostly just for marketing, as something they want to show only when it's good news.

I'd agree with them that a sequel that does worse than the previous title is disappointing even when the numbers itself are good.

jeromeSF said:

Because Nintendo is a gaming company and its first party games are a huge part of its revenues. This is not the case for Sony. Also, I would not be surprised if they are forced by the Japanese regulator to disclose theses numbers. Is there any public Japanese publisher who does not disclose its sales numbers?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

I don't think Nintendo does it only because it's forced (i also don't believe all japanese gaming companies do this, where are Konami sales numbers for example?), you can tell by how accurate this is, they want to track all their products, again that's part of the nature of the company: Nintendo cares about their IPs or even their hardware in the long term, they updated sales figures even for the Wii U every fiscal year, which definitely wasn't something to be proud of but at least they keep their transparency.

AlexxKidd said:

Calling maybe the most transparant company regarding figures out on this issue is questionable.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Yep, he thinks they are inflating the figures.

A certain group of hardcore "fans" of a certain company believe this shit.

Zatoichi said:

Yep, he thinks they are inflating the figures.

A certain group of hardcore "fans" of a certain company believe this shit.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

who brought up inflating numbers? they don't do that, maybe their fans occasionally do.
and they objectively aren't the most transparent company when it comes to sales, that just doesn't make sense with how little they share sometimes.

Harald23 said:

Your argument only compliments mine in the sense that they use sales figures mostly just for marketing, as something they want to show only when it's good news.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Not really.
For eg the new R&C is the best selling one but you don't see Sony saying anything about it
If they really wanted to use figures for marketing you would hear about them more often .

Harald23 said:

i also don't believe all japanese gaming companies do this, where are Konami sales numbers for example?

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

I just check: games represent only half of Konami's revenue so it's a different situation. I don't know for sure what are the disclosure's rules, but I won't be surprised if video games companies have to publish their software numbers.

gundamkyoukai said:

Not really.
For eg the new R&C is the best selling one but you don't see Sony saying anything about it
If they really wanted to use figures for marketing you would hear about them more often .

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Wrong, they said it is the fastest selling one, not the best which means maybe its cumulative sales are not very impressive.

I remember a developer here said it was the most successful Insomniac game but never proven by Sony, so it may or may not be true.

Why does it matter? I'll never understand the obsession some people have with sales numbers. All I care about is if a game was successful enough to get a sequel and/or keep the developer alive and well. Beyond that, knowing sales data does nothing for you.

Why it's bothering you If you're not an investor?

jeromeSF said:

I just check: games represent only half of Konami's revenue so it's a different situation. I don't know for sure what are the disclosure's rules, but I won't surprise if video games companies have to publish their software numbers.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

I don't think they have to share anything, which is why the industry has rely on analyst and research firms if we want to get an understanding of sales figures for specific titles (outside of when a company makes a good news statement )

Harald23 said:

Wrong, they said it is the fastest selling one, not the best which means maybe its cumulative sales are not very impressive.

Some developer said it was the most successful Insomniac but never proven by Sony which may or may not be true.

Click to expand...

Click to shrink...

Nope you wrong. I know this cause I made the thread
https://www.resetera.com/threads/rachet-clank-2016-is-insomniacs-most-successful-game.53348/
So PR said it's there most successful but they wouldn't know because?

The thing is Sony usually needs a solid justification to put a PR about sales, especially after the early years of the gen.

The first official game sales PR we got on PS4 was for the launch title Killzone Shadow Fall.
Then it was the first million achieved by Bloodborne after a few days only. That one was probably too precious for Shuhei to not have a PR.
Then Uncharted 4 was the best launch for a PlayStation IP on PS4. It wasn't actually written in the PR but it's obvious it was.
Then Horizon Zero Dawn came and took the most successful new first-party franchise launch on PS4.
Then God of War became the fastest-selling first party title on PS4, beating Uncharted with 3,1 million in 3 days.
Then Spider-Man beat God of War to take that crown with 3,3 million in 3 days. Funnily enough no official PR for Spider-Man was published on the Sony website in fact. Is it because Insomniac is not a first-party dev ?

Anyway, plenty of other games can do well, such as Detroit, but there is no particular justification to bring a PR compared to those above. I wish we knew some LTD figures but they have no real motivation/reason to do that, as the PR must bring a particular milestone.