Luxury cars - why so expensive to maintain?

nightwatcher · Oct 8, 2018

I am someone who would buy quality item knowing it would last me years to come, so it will be a good long term purchase. Specially stuff like winter jackets, watch, matters, underwear, laptop, smartphone etc. things I know I will be using it for a long time.

But this philosophy does not work for cars, and it drives me nuts. Cheaper cars like Camry are not only cheaper to maintain but also more reliable meanwhile expensive cars are horrendous to maintain as time goes on.

So everyone who owns German car, what am I spending my money on? how come more expensive does not equate to better quality parts like every other consumer good so it would break less and reduce your maintenance cost, last you longer.

ColdSun · Oct 8, 2018

Depends on the car and model specifically. I know my Lexus SC430 is still running incredibly well and was very low maintenance for the first 14 or so years.

Parch · Oct 8, 2018

Mass sales allow for more maintenance centers and better parts distribution.

It's not like expensive car companies do not provide better quality and reliability. Plenty of the expensive car companies are right up there in the reliability index. Porsche has always been considered very reliable.

GreenMonkey · Oct 8, 2018

You shouldn't have that much maintenance costs in parts on a good car.

I'm rolling up on 165k on my 2010 Altima and haven't needed anything but normal maintenance (brakes, oil changes, tires, battery, etc). Was warned I have a drive belt going though, gonna need to do that soon.

I'm gonna guess for luxury cars it is a profit thing. I know domestic auto manufacturing makes a lot of money on parts sales. (I work for GM, but I'm an IT/IT security guy, don't know that much about sales though).

Deleted member 2802 · Oct 8, 2018

nightwatcher said:
I am someone who would buy quality item knowing it would last me years to come, so it will be a good long term purchase. Specially stuff like winter jackets, watch, matters, underwear, laptop, smartphone etc. things I know I will be using it for a long time.

You buy luxury underwear and don't replace it for years?

Quality car and a quality mechanic are very good combos.

bionic77 · Oct 8, 2018

ColdSun said:
Depends on the car and model specifically. I know my Lexus SC430 is still running incredibly well and was very low maintenance for the first 14 or so years.

This.

I have had great luck with cars from Lexus and my sister is on her second MDX and both have been tanks.

In response to the OP I believe it's a combination of performance and also the companies not focusing on reliability.

GrapeApes · Oct 8, 2018

shira said:
You buy luxury underwear and don't replace it for years?.

What would be the point of replacing something if it's still useful? I'd rock underwear for decades if they lasted that long.

House_Of_Lightning · Oct 8, 2018

Performance rated parts, lower sales volume = lower aftermarket penetration, better quality parts interior wise, etc. Assembly and parts created in Germany/Italy instead of Mexico. They require higher performing oil, 91+ octane gas (not required for operation but required for performance).

Newer engines are often rolled out with refreshes versus a company like Toyota using the same V6 for 15 years plus. (That said, Maserati are just a Chrysler 300 with a Ferrari engine).

The more upscale you go the more "hands on" cars become. Mercedes-AMG have hand assembled motors. Ferrari's are almost completely built by hand.

NoName999 · Oct 8, 2018

They're called a luxury for a reason.

One Eyed Willy · Oct 8, 2018

Volume of replacement parts
Complexity of mechanical engineering

SeeingeyeDug · Oct 8, 2018

Japanese luxury lasts. European luxury breaks as soon as the warranty is up and is super expensive.

All those Japanese luxury cars are based on something from their other lines. Like Lexus ES and Toyota Camry. Lexus LS and Toyota Avalon. Usually have reasonable costs for a lot of their mechanical parts.

Chromhound · Oct 8, 2018

They put too much new technology in their cars

turbobrick · Oct 8, 2018

Other than what's already been said, more technology means more things to go wrong. The less features a car has also means less things to break over time.

You also have to consider that some companies don't care as much. I mean, think about what percentage of the people that buy new luxury cars actually own them out of warranty.

Lexus, Acura, and Infiniti also have an advantage because they can share engines/drivetrains/ect with their main brands of Toyota, Honda, and Nissan.

Malovis · Oct 8, 2018

In my opinion actual luxury cars usually maintain or go up in value. The rest seems like a hobby taken too far and companies know people pay for their hobbies.

Linkura · Oct 8, 2018

My dad rage got rid of one of his luxury cars because the tires lasted a ridiculously short amount of time and cost a ridiculous amount of money.

I guess they figure their buyers can afford it.

Culex · Oct 8, 2018

My Saab is a sob story with the money I've dumped into it in nearly 8 years

Soundscream · Oct 8, 2018

People bringing up Lexus shouldnt because its basically a Toyota.

Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari...... tend to have more exotic engines and as a result usually require specialised technitions or parts even to.service. Also because of their price their arent a ton of them on the road like a honda civic or a toyota Camry, so the parts become more expensive because they arent produced in the abundance of other cars.

Soundscream · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
My Saab is a sob story with the money I've dumped into it in nearly 8 years

Saab parts are cheap now, but are you talking reliability? Because they really took a dive when GM bought them.

turbobrick · Oct 8, 2018

Malovis said:
In my opinion actual luxury cars usually maintain or go up in value. The rest seems like a hobby taken too far and companies know people pay for their hobbies.

No car will go up in value though, unless its some super limited production run, or a classic car that's desirable.

Soundscream said:
People bringing up Lexus shouldnt because its basically a Toyota.

Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari...... tend to have more exotic engines and as a result usually require specialised technitions or parts even to.service. Also because of their price their arent a ton of them on the road like a honda civic or a toyota Camry, so the parts become more expensive because they arent produced in the abundance of other cars.

Yeah, the Japanese brands being able to share parts across their brands really helps. Though Audi is part of Volkswagen, though VW has their own reliability issues anyway.

Culex said:
My Saab is a sob story with the money I've dumped into it in nearly 8 years

Yeah, Saabs can be hit or miss. Though that can be blamed on being owned by GM. However they also did weird dumb shit on their own.

meow · Oct 8, 2018

Is this not the case with most luxury items?

Culex · Oct 8, 2018

Soundscream said:
Saab parts are cheap now, but are you talking reliability? Because they really took a dive when GM bought them.

Lots of custom one off parts for my model. The rear self leveling shocks are 500 A PIECE!

Soundscream · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
Lots of custom one off parts for my model. The rear self leveling shocks are 500 A PIECE!

What year/model?

Culex · Oct 8, 2018

Soundscream said:
What year/model?

2008 Turbo X

turbobrick · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
2008 Turbo X

9-3 I assume? Anyway, there are other options to replace self leveling shocks with standard shocks. Though its research you have to figure out on your own (which you can probably find on the internet). My Volvo had the self leveling shocks and I got rid of that shit.

Soundscream · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
2008 Turbo X

Ohhhhhhh that one.

Yeah, I can see that. When GM got control in 2000 there was a big quality dip, pluss you got the most premuim of trims. AWD plus mor HP than the Viggen if im not mistaken. Cool car but I would have been scared to dump that much into it knowing how few are out there.

I bought a 1999 9-3 turbo with 145,000 miles as a beater car for $1,000. Its been treating me awesome, only issue is I need to have the lcd in the display screen replaced.

Culex · Oct 8, 2018

That whole era of GM platform was a disaster as far as repairs. No room in engine bay meant extra hours of labor for no good reason.

My dads classic Mercedes is cheaper to fix, it's truly sad.

ntropy · Oct 8, 2018

perhaps lease?

ParanormalFupa · Oct 8, 2018

They purposefully obfuscate what was once and should be easily accessible. Same anti-repair, anti-diy shit as most modern garbage.

ascii42 · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
That whole era of GM platform was a disaster as far as repairs. No room in engine bay meant extra hours of labor for no good reason.

My dads classic Mercedes is cheaper to fix, it's truly sad.

Epsilon platform, right? My Malibu was on that. I didn't have anything go wrong under the hood to know how that was in terms of cost/difficulty, but I do remember it being far more difficult to replace the headlight bulbs than it had good reason to be.

Soundscream · Oct 8, 2018

Culex said:
That whole era of GM platform was a disaster as far as repairs. No room in engine bay meant extra hours of labor for no good reason.

My dads classic Mercedes is cheaper to fix, it's truly sad.

Old Mercedes are actually not bad when it comes to reliability. But they really shit the bed entering the 2000s

Darth Vapor · Oct 8, 2018

Over engineering is a real thing for some luxury cars. I don't want a bunch of replies so I'm not gonna name names but it's not hard to find out.

Deleted member 8118 · Oct 8, 2018

Luxury cars (at least speaking of German and British engineered ones) take higher amounts of maintenance because of proprietary technologies. Also, these cars usually don't share the same powerplants from model to model, so when going in for repairs, you have to have someone that is more knowledgeable to repair it (specialized mechanics).

Moreso an issue, these cars also run more electronics in them. There's hundreds of sensors in a brand new Mercedes S-Class vs a Honda Civic. If any of these sensors go wrong, you're going to have to deal with diagnostics. Over time these sensors can start to go bad and give faulty readings which can do anything from throw out faulty fuel ratios, etc. That leads to a game of whack-a-mole when these cars get older.

Also, these cars have less of an aftermarket, meaning that less and less can be replicated, especially when you're looking for something of the likes of a "generic part" for many GM vehicles. Due to there usually being a small amount of parts, these companies have to pay high import/export payments to places with high amounts of sales.

Also worth mentioning, these cars take a lot more to build, with engines that are often inspected more than your average Civic or Corolla before it comes out of the factory. They are also built completely by hand or partially by hand. That level of labor has to be put into the costs of the end product.

Luxury and exotic cars also have high end design firms making the designs for them and to compensate, they hike up the prices. Think of Pininfarina (an Italian design firm responsible for the designs for many iconic car designs (Ferrari), appliance designs and so forth.)

So, these cars aren't expensive for no reason. You're getting the top of the line technology that is available to the public. Almost all luxury manufacturers have a racing division that is kind of like an aerospace for road cars, a way to test the newest technology. After that technology is tested, it can find its way into road going cars.

That's all I can really contribute, but I hope it explains enough.

turbobrick · Oct 8, 2018

Soundscream said:
Old Mercedes are actually not bad when it comes to reliability. But they really shit the bed entering the 2000s

Yeah, some of the old cars are actually pretty basic. However the parts are still expensive. The 1983 300D I had was cheap until I needed parts. Got rid of it because my Volvo 240 was not only was cheaper to fix, but was better to drive.

Roxsus · Oct 8, 2018

Lexus's are not that expensive to maintain and are very reliable. I had a 2009 GS450h for 5 years never had a single problem with it. I traded it in for a 2019 RX 350h. I'm a family man now, I needed more room.

Deleted member 17092 · Oct 8, 2018

German parts aren't actually any more expensive than their counterparts, so if you can find a mechanic who will let you buy your own parts, and are decent at diagnosing the problem ahead of time (error code reader and research), it's not bad. Also Audi and Mercedes have dramatically improved their reliability in recent years.

Deleted member 37011 · Oct 8, 2018

Japanese and American luxury cars have the advantage of "badge engineering." Toyota/Lexus, Honda/Acura, Nissan/Infiniti, Ford/Lincoln, Chevrolet/GMC/Caddilac, Dodge/Jeep/Chrysler. They share platforms and engines. Other than Audi and Porsche which shares some platforms and engines with Volkswagen, the German manufactures don't have that. Also factor in that most Japanese manufactures have plants in the US, Canada, and Mexico which cuts down on import costs. Yes BMW does build some SUV's in the US.

Porsche's tend to have higher reliability due to the brand being performance orientated. They know owners, especially 911 and Cayman/Boxster owners, are going to drive them hard. So they make the engines and transmissions robust to take the abuse. Or at least that's what I've been told by Porsche owners.

Legend of Aims · Oct 8, 2018

Own a Infiniti and BMW over 150k miles. Will never touch another BMW.

Deleted member 31199 · Oct 8, 2018

shira said:
You buy luxury underwear and don't replace it for years?

Quality car and a quality mechanic are very good combos.

Agreed on the second note but it depends what you mean by luxury underwear. I buy from a company called bgreen and their boxers survive dozens of washings and dryings.

Luxury cars - why so expensive to maintain?

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