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P-Switch

Alt Account
Member
Jul 15, 2018
966
lol at people believing the next switch will be as powerful as the PS4... you guys re just setting yourselves for disappointment.

Well, it's definitely technically possible with the new Nvidia Tegra Xavier SoC

But yea, it's silly to expect it. The last thing the Switch or Nintendo in general should try to do is chase timely 3rd Party AAA multiplat games.

Those games don't sell Nintendo hardware nor Nintendo software. They are irrelevant to Nintendo gaming or Nintendo success.

Nintendo should just focus on making Switch hardware being more fun/unique/easier to play Nintendo games and games similar to Nintendo exclusives.

Cloud streaming modern AAA multiplats to the Switch is probably the best future...and good enough for the small minority who really want to play modern AAA multiplats on a handheld console
 

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,326
Well, it's definitely technically possible with the new Nvidia Tegra Xavier SoC

But yea, it's silly to expect it. The last thing the Switch or Nintendo in general should try to do is chase timely 3rd Party AAA multiplat games.

Those games don't sell Nintendo hardware nor Nintendo software. They are irrelevant to Nintendo gaming or Nintendo success.

Nintendo should just focus on making Switch hardware being more fun/unique/easier to play Nintendo games and games similar to Nintendo exclusives.

Cloud streaming modern AAA multiplats to the Switch is probably the best future...and good enough for the small minority who really want to play modern AAA multiplats on a handheld console
Yea I'm fine with cloud streaming, I used GeForce now, just wish Nintendo would do it here too and not just japan
 

Dekuman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,026
Thinking about possibility of 1080p screen. With an X2 it could make sense.

Undocked clocked = current docked mode, roughly same tdp.
All current Switch games can run on docked settings in undocked mode/ devs will also have the option to patch in 'PRO support to make undocked run even better

New docked mode is roughly double the performance of current docked mode, maybe more or less. ~700-800 nvida gflops.
 

Deleted member 5159

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
1,704
Thinking about possibility of 1080p screen. With an X2 it could make sense.

Undocked clocked = current docked mode, roughly same tdp.
All current Switch games can run on docked settings in undocked mode/ devs will also have the option to patch in 'PRO support to make undocked run even better

New docked mode is roughly double the performance of current docked mode, maybe more or less. ~700-800 nvida gflops.

if you account for downclocking it would give you about 500 gflops only. so, only a modest improvement over the current docked mode, it would shine undocked though
 

Tora

The Enlightened Wise Ones
Member
Jun 17, 2018
8,639
You can sort of think of the Switch as an underclocked powerful console, about 1/2 of its potential lost due to heat and form factor. So, if the new revision allows the current Switch to boost their CPU processing power back up to, we'll say "normal" for now, without any changes to the specs, then Switch is truly a powerful console.
Nice, thanks!
It's a shame that it couldn't hit a consistent 2Ghz without sacrificing battery life or excessive heat, feels like it would have made a real difference when it came to ports and even some ports that were just too much for the system, GPU power aside.
 

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,326
Shouldn't it be time for nvidia to release the X2 successor since it's over 2 years old? Did they stop releasing new mobile gpus?
 

Plankton2

Member
Dec 12, 2017
2,670
06ae8c13-ce21-4ff4-92cf-2b1bc9d88fd6.png






There probably won't be a 4k switch, there is no mobile hardware that can handle 4k in gaming, it would be pure waste to include a screen that is over 1080p, or even 720p. I would be happy if the New Switch could handle 720p native in most games and 1080p on TV.

Yea that pixelpar thing goes in line with some of the other "rumors" we've heard about 2019 getting more AAA support from the Japanese side
 

Deleted member 5159

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
1,704
Yea that pixelpar thing goes in line with some of the other "rumors" we've heard about 2019 getting more AAA support from the Japanese side

the games would still have to run on the base console, so, might wanna temper those expectations

lets say that with a revised switch you would get resident evil 7 running at 900p 30 fps docked, 720p 30fps undocked/old switch docked and then undocked you would get nasty resolutions like 500p/480. its a bit tricky. You can still only do it with games with a big overhead
 
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plebc

Member
Jan 7, 2018
1,017
Tegra Xavier CPU benchmarks (Phoronix) from a few days ago.

Noticeably faster than X1 and X2.

Edit: apparently both X2 and Xavier are not even running at the full power, people from the Phoronix forum got much better results by configuring them properly.
 
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Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
Sigh, another thing to upgrade

The Switch should never have shipped with such an outdated display that doesn't even look black when it's off

All the people buying a Smash bundle are going to be pretty unhappy if there's a new better version out months later.
 

Serenitynow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,667
I'm sure this has been said 1000 times in this thread, but I don't see a form factor change because of the joy con. Smaller bezels, however...
 

NateDrake

Member
Oct 24, 2017
7,500
Is there an scenario where they can make:

- an smaller console,

- newer and, probably, better chip,

- better battery life,

- not going over the 300$ price tag.

In other words, a bit of a Super Switch and bit of a Switch Lite model. Could someone enlighten me? The X2 should allow for this, but reading this thread, it seems like it's unlikely? I guess they could price it at 350$ and bundle a game like SMO, MK8DX or Splatoon 2 to make it more attractive.
An X2 would deliver on those, though the price could be a point of contention. X2 is more energy efficient, thus better battery life. A smaller system would be tough. Switch would need to retain the height of the Joycon, though if they remove the screen bezel they could bring length down a bit.
 

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,326
An X2 would deliver on those, though the price could be a point of contention. X2 is more energy efficient, thus better battery life. A smaller system would be tough. Switch would need to retain the height of the Joycon, though if they remove the screen bezel they could bring length down a bit.
I would rather them take away the bezel to make the screen larger instead of to make the system smaller, then they wouldn't have to make a new dock either
 

z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
ReviewTechUSA has heard from his sources that it is a Pro console trying to reach the base PS4 level performance. Apparently they started working on a custom chip even before the Switch we have today, but it was too expensive at the time and they weren't sure if the customers will like the concept, so they went first with downclocked Tegra X1 to test the waters.

Could get announced in January.

Foxconn leak would suggest this is true. Matt did say that Nintendo couldn't go with a more powerful Switch because it was too expensive, this always seemed like a weird comment to me because the Switch wastes a ton of money on different things it didn't need to do, those half dozen circuit boards for one, and the dock's separate hardware for display is another, not to mention it was sold at a profit. Nintendo having a second more powerful Switch prototype that was too expensive for a $300 price launch makes sense here. He would be referring to that and not the difference that shrinking the X1 to 16nm would make (which is at best going to add $30 to the Switch's price).

Nvidia said that Nintendo and they were looking at a long relationship, possibly going decades and if they were sitting on the next model at the time, that makes perfect sense.

Developers have said weird stuff about Switch ports, even Reggie said that 2019 is when we will start seeing 3rd party games arrive day and date, a parity console would facilitate that, but also Rainbowsix Siege developer's weird comment about the Switch not yet being the one to get the game.

We all know that Nintendo is making a more powerful Switch, it coming this soon is the shock, but if you buy into the narrative that Nintendo pushed out Switch to test the waters, it makes sense that they would sureup it's failures, and performance is a big deal, even for Nintendo where their own games struggle. Switch also has one big unNintendo spec, slow memory bandwidth. This is something Nintendo's engineers are always pushing for... There is a quote a few years old from a Nintendo developer that high speed memory bandwidth is part of Nintendo's DNA and what they want to pass on to future generations at Nintendo. This was during the Switch's development, so the X1 chip has always been a bit weird for a Nintendo product, it's performance is really par for the course, but the memory bottleneck is extremely odd.

I think people are caught up in the timing of this device from the platform's perspective and not looking at the timing of this device from the industries' perspective, building a refresh 3 months sooner than the PS4 Pro might be a bad thing? Having a 10-20 Million user base for next gen games to be ported to on a Switch that can handle it, would be a big incentive to keep 3rd party interest high. We saw what happened during the Wii era, and while the Wii literally was half the market, the industry at large ignored it.
 

DeSolos

Member
Nov 14, 2017
540
I'm sure it's been said, but more than a "Switch Pro" I just want a 1080p switch that doesn't have a difference between portable/docked mode.

Wouldn't even cause any overhead for devs.
 

Dark Cloud

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
61,087
Get ready for a Switch Pro. With games like Kingdom Hearts 3, Metroid Prime 4 and other big third party games to show it off.
 

Deleted member 5159

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
1,704
Tegra Xavier CPU benchmarks (Phoronix) from a few days ago.

Noticeably faster than X1 and X2.

Edit: apparently both X2 and Xavier are not even running at the full power, people from the Phoronix forum got much better results by configuring them properly.

i mean, how many times one has to repeat that nintendo never ever ever uses new tech on their designs, the xavier is like one month old, maybe it can be used as a base for a pro version in 2020/2021 not before.
 

Dark Cloud

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
61,087

ReviewTechUSA has heard from his sources that it is a Pro console trying to reach the base PS4 level performance. Apparently they started working on a custom chip even before the Switch we have today, but it was too expensive at the time and they weren't sure if the customers will like the concept, so they went first with downlocked Tegra X1 to test the waters.

Could get announced in January.


Woah so ReviewTechUSA heard it will be a Switch Pro too!
 

z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
An X2 would deliver on those, though the price could be a point of contention. X2 is more energy efficient, thus better battery life. A smaller system would be tough. Switch would need to retain the height of the Joycon, though if they remove the screen bezel they could bring length down a bit.
When you were told that Nintendo Switch was Pascal, were you just told it was 16nm or Pascal specifically? This new switch is obviously the custom SoC found in firmware.
 

NateDrake

Member
Oct 24, 2017
7,500
When you were told that Nintendo Switch was Pascal, were you just told it was 16nm or Pascal specifically? This new switch is obviously the custom SoC found in firmware.
Pascal specifically. I assume you are suggesting the device I heard about in 2016 may have been referring to this unit, had development been ongoing in conjunction with the Switch X1 we have now.
 

Mr.Gamerson

Member
Oct 27, 2017
906
Speaking of the bezel, how much thinner can Nintendo realistically make it without using an OLED panel? A portion of the bezel seems necessary because of the joy-con on each side so I expect that portion at least not get smaller.
 

z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
Pascal specifically. I assume you are suggesting the device I heard about in 2016 may have been referring to this unit, had development been ongoing in conjunction with the Switch X1 we have now.
Yeah, that is what I heard, that there was a more powerful Switch being developed on a different node, I heard about it in January 2017 though. I also look at that Foxconn leak and everything fits with that. I've also been told about a million times from a million different people that the Switch was to "test the waters". You don't test the waters, without the plan to then "jump in".
 

milkyway

One Winged Slayer
Member
May 17, 2018
3,004
I'm all in for a Switch Pro. Seems sensible to release a more powerful Switch when PS5/XB4 are around the corner and the Switch doesn't even match base PS4/XBO. Not that I'm complaining a lot, but it's probably best not to lag more than a generation behind graphically speaking.
 

NateDrake

Member
Oct 24, 2017
7,500
Yeah, that is what I heard, that there was a more powerful Switch being developed on a different node, I heard about it in January 2017 though. I also look at that Foxconn leak and everything fits with that. I've also been told about a million times from a million different people that the Switch was to "test the waters". You don't test the waters, without the plan to then "jump in".
Even if we entertain the Foxconn leak as accurate & that a secondary Pascal-based SoC was being tested while the Switch X1 was out on market, it would still suggest the Pro is using a proven and reliable SoC from Nvidia -- in this case the X2. The information in the ReviewTechUSA video seems too high-end to match what we'd be getting in a 2019 product that retains the Switch form factor. At best, we are looking at hardware that may be 2x the current Switch in terms of raw performance.

Interesting. I remember these talks from you on GAF.

I certainly will not say that is what happened. That would be a cop out. My contact gave me inaccurate information. If it happens to be what this revision uses then it is a happen accident.
 
Mar 17, 2018
2,927
I see now people are accepting that the Switch successor is going to be more powerful. I wonder what chipset they are going to use. Let's hope it's something good.

But this is life people. I have a really nice Tarptent. The new version came out this year after years. It's fine. Better things happen. It doesn't mean what you have is bad. It means things are progressing fast.

Nvidia was working with old chips. They will probably have something great coming here.
 

Mory Dunz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
36,370
I don't feel like the Switch can run some of the higher end games to a satisfactory degree. And I don't see them splintering the base with huge games like KH3 exclusive to a "pro". Which is why even if there's somewhat of an upgrade, I don't think there would suddenly be more games announced for Switch.
 

Dark Cloud

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
61,087
I don't feel like the Switch can run some of the higher end games to a satisfactory degree. And I don't see them splintering the base with huge games like KH3 exclusive to a "pro". Which is why even if there's somewhat of an upgrade, I don't think there would suddenly be more games announced for Switch.
I agree I can't see Nintendo splitting the base. If they did boy would that piss people off. I wouldn't be pissed, but I know a good amount will be.
 

Tathanen

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,035
I don't see any changes to screen size happening, even via bezel reduction, because it'd damage Labo compatibility. And Labo's a long-tail product line.
 

Advc

Member
Nov 3, 2017
2,632
So it begins... Now everybody who reads that and was thinking on getting a Switch, might just wait till the new model drops and purchase that instead.
 

z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
Even if we entertain the Foxconn leak as accurate & that a secondary Pascal-based SoC was being tested while the Switch X1 was out on market, it would still suggest the Pro is using a proven and reliable SoC from Nvidia -- in this case the X2. The information in the ReviewTechUSA video seems too high-end to match what we'd be getting in a 2019 product that retains the Switch form factor. At best, we are looking at hardware that may be 2x the current Switch in terms of raw performance.
The Foxconn leak is 100% real, it's undeniable. We just don't know exactly what those clocks mean. Pascal is just a shrunken X1, so any "16nm+" Tegra chip at the time would be referred to as Pascal, I was just wondering if your source knew the difference. (and they might have, but it's unrealistic to me that Denver cores would ever be used, so X2 as is, has always been a shortcut to saying a 16nm Tegra)

Foxconn leak gives 921mhz for the GPU, which is actually very telling about the truth of it, Tegra X1 uses 76.8mhz base clock, so Switch uses a 5 and 10 multiplier for it's clock, this points to a 12x multiplier, so this Switch Pro, if all of this lines up means that the Switch they were testing back in 2016 and did not release, has a CPU about twice as powerful, twice as much RAM, and a GPU that is either 20% faster (472GFLOPs docked), OR a GPU that has double the cuda cores and is 2.4x more powerful (944GFLOPs).

This article is about a premium device, they are adding new hardware and software features, balanced by price and looking at adding a better screen.

Also yeah, it wasn't Pascal, it was Mariko, which we all have code for in our Switch units.
 
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