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K Samedi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,990
It is incredible how the Switch can continue its good/great results, without being "blessed" with the vast majority of the most important third party games (looking at the charts: Madden NFL 19 ^; Monster Hunter: World; Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Siege; Grand Theft Auto V...)
The console itself, its form factor, its concept and its (primarly first party) games clearly are something with a very strong appeal to the mass market

Out of the 10 or so games I bought this year for Switch, only one was first party. The digital scene is a pretty big factor on Switch. Obviously people buy the big Nintendo games when they get a Switch but I dont think people buy it as a "Nintendo only box".
 

Elandyll

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,825
Is it even worth it to Sony this late in the cycle to try to "win" the holiday at the cost of revenue due to a $199 bundle, or just do a modest bundle for $250 and maximize their profits at the end of the cycle?
Holidays are super price sensitive, as always.
I'd say that as late as it is in this cycle, the only way for them to make still big in-roads in sales (outside of the odd Universal Acclaim exclusive) is via price, specially around BF, and the component cost drop should allow them to do this easily when you consider that the PS4 only dropped $100 in 5 years (granted now with a 1Tb drive).

The name of the game is MAU, subs, and digital purchases...
Gotta increase your install base, even selling at cost (for a bit, during price sensitive seasons).
 

MONSTER

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,522
Perched to see how the final months of 2018 will deliver

HDmUYbb_1.gif
 

Ehoavash

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,238
Should be a nice holiday for nintendo, they'll probably hit their goal too if they launch say a switch revision early 2019, before their financial year ends.
 

NSESN

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,320
I am happy that MHGU was able to reach the top 20 even without digital, now make a gen 5 switch game Capcom
 

Liabe Brave

Professionally Enhanced
Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,672
Switch led Units, PS4 barely edged out dollars.
Wow. Given the small unit gap between the two, that means severely reduced sales for PS4 Pro versus its usual SKU split.

I can see that, the PRO version definitively helped.
That's hardly an insight, since the Pro is the only thing that can help push revenue higher when units are lower. But as I point out above, Pro helped a lot less this month than it usually does.

Wow at XB1X being the lead Xbox SKU in units sold for the month. That's nuts! I wonder what the actual sku split for XB1 HW is. You'd figure that'd be something they'd want to release of the split is that much in favor of their premium SKU
Still interesting, isn't it?
During August there were 2 One X SKUs (solus, Battlegrounds), and at least 5 One S SKUs (starter, two-controller, Battlegrounds, Minecraft, Sea of Thieves). That doesn't count discontinued One S SKUs that may still be available at retail. So making assumptions that One X overall is a third of all platform sales, and the Battlegrounds bundle is 75% of all One X sales, that means about 25% of Xbox One sales were that SKU. With 67% of sales divided between 5+ One S SKUs, would it be surprising if none of them individually rose above 25%?

The only way this becomes interesting is if you think One X is generally less popular than assumed above. If One X usually sells a percentage more like PS4 Pro (or worse), then having the number one SKU in August could be noteworthy. But what hints we've gotten suggest that it usually sells better than Pro.

How did you got at those numbers?
Those numbers come from me, but they are not leaks. They're calculations based on constraints like YoY increases and so forth that we do know. I do my best to make them as solid as possible, so the real numbers won't be wildly different. But they're still estimates, so should not be treated as absolutely accurate.

Is Switch likely to be down in September? Was thinking last year was a 5 week tracking period versus 4 this year. Is that right?
No, not correct. March, June, September, and December are always 5 week periods.

Agreed. As mentioned above withthe prominence of digital markets and ecosystems I would think compatibility and permanence across generations will Demand such a change. Clearly if we can see such a result as we've seen from CoD MW2 as a back catalogue release already this is only going to grow in importance/prominence in the future.
The only two BC titles that have ever hit the charts are both Call of Duty games (i.e. among the very best-selling games of all time). Even if every console next generation has full backwards compatibility, the effect to charts will be very minimal. Only monster successes from the past seem to have a chance to chart, and there just aren't that many of those.

But even more importantly, it's expected that BC for next gen will be there from the start, and 100% (or close to it). That means you can buy whatever old game you fancy any time, and it'll work. This will eliminate the ganging effect of Microsoft's "we added a popular title!" one-at-a-time approach. So instead of being rank 321, leaping to rank 8, and falling again, even the biggest games will hover around, say rank 50. In other words, we'd never see them on the charts.

It'd be more helpful if we just got previous-gen charts from NPD. That'd provide us truly new and interesting data, rather than just altering their methods of presenting the same data we get now.

Edit:
If PS4 has < 1m unit lead YTD going into December, Switch has a good chance of taking the year, I think.
This is an extreme statement. You think Switch could outsell PS4 by 900k in just December? Smash will be huge, but that would almost certainly require a 1.9m+ month, which is PS2/Wii/GBA/DS levels. Switch is not selling anything like those machines right now. And I don't think PS4's December will be as low as last year, which makes the target even higher.

I think Switch definitely has a chance to outsell PS4 this year, but not by so much in a single month. I'd project PS4 to do 2.7m in the holidays (marginally less than the last two years). So if Switch has a ceiling at, say, 3.5m total (only Wii has ever been notably higher), then they need to be less than 800k behind by November. Right now they're 300k behind. I believe they'll drop back by another 100k in September, but reasonably flat in October. So beating PS4 will not require a legendary holiday, just a very good one. But if they somehow exit November 500k back, it'll be a challenge.

A $200 PS4 would need to be in significantly higher volunes than last year to beat Switch for Nov-Dec total. Last year all 3 systems sold basically the same in the holiday season.
No they didn't. Switch sold 400k units less than PS4 or XB1 in the holidays. My personal prediction is that Switch will outsell PS4 this holiday, by a lot. But a $199 PS4 with ample supply would alter that.

$200 PS4 demand outstripped supply big time. Sony will have to push much more stock. Switch Nov will be way highee than last year and Dec should be too. Pushing like 200-300k more than last Nov wont be enough imo.
If Sony do 3m this holiday--which is what +250k versus last year would be--then Switch will have a hard time catching them for the year. Not impossible, but it'd require a historically-huge performance. And after launch month, Switch has just never been putting up those kinds of numbers.
 

Instro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,018
If Sony do 3m this holiday--which is what +250k versus last year would be--then Switch will have a hard time catching them for the year. Not impossible, but it'd require a historically-huge performance. And after launch month, Switch has just never been putting up those kinds of numbers.

I'm confused. The Switch sold far more last December than it did during its launch month.
 

Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,500
No they didn't. Switch sold 400k units less than PS4 or XB1 in the holidays. My personal prediction is that Switch will outsell PS4 this holiday, by a lot. But a $199 PS4 with ample supply would alter that.

Wait what was the Nov-Dec totals last year then?

Edit: I was looking at the wrong numbers for Nov lol. This makes sense.
 

Deleted member 2785

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,119
Good question on the POS cards. NPD tracks everything sold at the register, so they are aware of the POS card sales. Not sure how they're counted, though. MatPiscatella , are POS cards tracked as physical software, accessories, or digital software?

POS cards are defined as "Game Cards" and are aggregated within "Accessories and Game Cards" in the reporting. POS/Game Cards can include everything from digital credit on eShop, PSN, Xbox through WoW subscription cards and Gold subscription cards and everything else digital that is sold via a Game Card.

These sales are up over 40% year to date.

So the POS cards are counted as digital sales, and NPD reports those sales only for the companies they have permission to report digital sales, then?

Like I said above, sales of POS cards are counted within "Accessories and Game Cards." And we report Game Card sales for 100% of US retail. eShop codes are counted, as well as everything else, in this bucket. These are actually considered physical sales in the monthly reporting.

In our Games Market Dynamics report (which we just recently released) we allocate all of Game Card spending to the appropriate digital buckets, as well as project for all of the missing data pieces through a combination of point-of-sale, survey, statistical modeling, etc, to get to a complete market picture.
 
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M-PG71C

Member
Oct 29, 2017
139
The Switch and PS4 are going to post some scary ass numbers this holiday season. Which is awesome.

Now, what I wonder is how the 3DS may fare this Christmas...
 

Horror

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
1,997
And while Smash is going to do big numbers, I hardly think national news is going to cover the sales of one game unless Switches starting flying off the shelves like Wiis. Will Nintendo sell well this holiday season? Yes. Will it do so well that it will totally eclipse PS4 and Xbox like you aren't implying? No.

I never implied that the Switch would "totally eclipse" the Sony/XB1. That's you putting words into my mouth and moving the goalpost. What I said from the very beginning was the Switch will be the winner this holiday season. The PS4 will do great, the XB1 will be solid.

These are just toys. No need to catch feelings over them. :)
 

Plankton2

Member
Dec 12, 2017
2,670
Do we have any updated numbers on NES classic and SNES classic. The last I remember was 2 and 5 million respectively.

What are peoples thoughts on where the PS1 classic will end up?
 

Deleted member 2785

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,119

KillerMan91

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,355
I just don't think Sony will do wide $199 sale this year because of their forecast. Even if in November they suddenly thought that ''we can afford this lets do this'' you can't magically manufacture more units in few weeks. Those decisions have to be made now. I guess if they up their forecast by few millions when they release Q2 financials it could happen. Otherwise not.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,297
I never implied that the Switch would "totally eclipse" the Sony/XB1. That's you putting words into my mouth and moving the goalpost. What I said from the very beginning was the Switch will be the winner this holiday season. The PS4 will do great, the XB1 will be solid.

These are just toys. No need to catch feelings over them. :)

Lol Wait hold on champ. First you said:

It's a foregone conclusion because unlike 2017 all of the Switch's heavy hitters this year are released in the holiday season and the initial consumer rush to buy them will be concentrated in two of the biggest sales months of the year.

When I had said it wasn't a foregone conclusion that Nintendo would dominate the holiday sales. So either you have a hard time with reading comprehension or English might not be your first language. Either way, no one is catching feelings over a console, but it would help if you didn't move your own goalposts. :)
 

Deleted member 2785

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,119
Is that $99 price tag still in that impulse range for potential buyers?

I... think so?

My hunch is that the NES Classic Edition / SNES Classic Edition is a perfect gifting item for the holidays when someone is buying a present for someone else. Family friendly, very cool to open, every older person in the family very likely at least has familiarity with the games.

The PS Classic seems more to me like something that someone will buy for themselves as a gift, particularly core gamers. And these folks prove over and over that price sensitivity is very, very low and they'll pay whatever.

So, yeah, I think it is, but I think it'll be bought a bit differently than the NIntendo systems?

Who knows. My assumption is that these should be incredibly difficult to find throughout the holidays and into 2019.
 

Horror

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
1,997
When I had said it wasn't a foregone conclusion that Nintendo would dominate the holiday sales. So either you have a hard time with reading comprehension or English might not be your first language. Either way, no one is catching feelings over a console, but it would help if you didn't move your own goalposts. :)

How do you take any of that as me implying that the Switch will "totally eclipse" the PS4 and XB1 this holiday season? It'll definitely beat them this holiday. Maybe your definition of what constitutes a total eclipse is different from the textbook definition of it.
 

chezzymann

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,042
The Switch has been on the market over one year.
So after it's first year was the PS4 outselling the X360, PS3 and Wii U? I'll let you work that one out
The ps4 sold 14 million in its first year. Then it sold 17 million. Then 20. Consoles accelerate. The switch will too. Im saying its not fair to compare a console in its peak to a console that just released, beause theyre at different stages in their life span. If anything older consoles SHOULD sell more than newer ones. Since the switch is already neck and neck with the ps4 its peak a couple years from now could potentially be higher. And yes, the ps4 was outselling the xbox 360 and ps3 but thats irrelevant because those consoles were well past their prime and over 8 years old at that point.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,297
How do you take any of that as me implying that the Switch will "totally eclipse" the PS4 and XB1 this holiday season? It'll definitely beat them this holiday. Maybe your definition of what constitutes a total eclipse is different from the textbook definition of it.

And I'm saying you have no way of knowing this without knowing what Sony's plans are especially knowing what games will be releasing on PS4 and Xbone for the holiday season. I'm done with this conversation though.
 
Oct 31, 2017
12,085
MatPiscatella Here's a question regarding BC compatibility, and please correct any facts I got wrong:

Modern Warfare 2, AFAIK, just received BC. It charted number 8. That seems like a very positive development for additional revenue for game companies for BC games that can still be bought/downloaded on current-gen systems. Could companies then pressure Sony into adopting that next gen, unless that's already the goal for them?
 

Deleted member 2785

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,119
MatPiscatella Here's a question regarding BC compatibility, and please correct any facts I got wrong:

Modern Warfare 2, AFAIK, just received BC. It charted number 8. That seems like a very positive development for additional revenue for game companies for BC games that can still be bought/downloaded on current-gen systems. Could companies then pressure Sony into adopting that next gen, unless that's already the goal for them?

The console manufacturers and third party publishers are partners and communicate all the time. I don't think pressure is the right word.

There are many factors both technical and strategic that can impact these kinds of decisions, and as with any decision which is influenced by so many people opinions and judgments will differ.

So publishers will express their needs/wants, sure. But usually it's not a pressure thing.

Back compat is a good deal for publishers, and it takes fewer development resources than a full remaster, but remasters will deliver more new revenue, on average. So then it becomes a math problem on expected demand vs costs.
 

WillySJ3

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
2,197
MatPiscatella Here's a question regarding BC compatibility, and please correct any facts I got wrong:

Modern Warfare 2, AFAIK, just received BC. It charted number 8. That seems like a very positive development for additional revenue for game companies for BC games that can still be bought/downloaded on current-gen systems. Could companies then pressure Sony into adopting that next gen, unless that's already the goal for them?
How exactly could companies pressure the console makers and why?
 
Oct 31, 2017
12,085
The console manufacturers and third party publishers are partners and communicate all the time. I don't think pressure is the right word.

There are many factors both technical and strategic that can impact these kinds of decisions, and as with any decision which is influenced by so many people opinions and judgments will differ.

So publishers will express their needs/wants, sure. But usually it's not a pressure thing.

Back compat is a good deal for publishers, and it takes fewer development resources than a full remaster, but remasters will deliver more new revenue, on average. So then it becomes a math problem on expected demand vs costs.

Thank you!