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napoleonic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
176
HDMI to AVR, AVR to display.
Or use multiple HDMI outputs - though that may not work with all AVRs, since HDMI expects there to be a display on the other end of the connection.

TOSLINK may be simpler, but it also means that you don't get things like automatic lip-sync correction, which has to use data from the display to ensure that audio will be in sync.
With TOSLINK you had to correct this manually - if your AVR even had the option.

There is also HDMI ARC - the Audio Return Channel.
That way you would have HDMI to your display, and HDMI from the display to the AVR.
But ARC has limited bandwidth and a limited featureset, which is why it's recommended that you connect directly to the AVR.

ah I forgot about that gpu - receiver connection :-/ that pose another potential problem, wouldn't it cause display lag when playing games? because the video signal has to go the longer route than necessary, yet another hassle on the pc regarding this thing :-/

and what about the question I asked to the other guy, what if the HDMI cable run out of bandwidth when being used to deliver high res high refresh rate video and hd audio?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
ah I forgot about that gpu - receiver connection :-/ that pose another potential problem, wouldn't it cause display lag when playing games? because the video signal has to go the longer route than necessary, yet another hassle on the pc regarding this thing :-/

and what about the question I asked to the other guy, what if the HDMI cable run out of bandwidth when being used to deliver high res high refresh rate video and hd audio?
Electrical signals travel at almost the speed of light. There shouldn't be any latency to be concerned about, so long as the AVR is doing a straight pass-through of the video signal.
If your HDMI cable can't handle the bandwidth, it's most likely that you just won't get a signal at all, or it will cut out. Current cables should be rated to handle 8 channels of audio plus 4K60 video.
 

pulga

Banned for alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
2,391
Can anyone recommend some good bluetooth headphones for about $100? That's the Secret Santa budget.
 

Wiggles

Member
Oct 28, 2017
492
107605_1_.jpg


Still going strong after 8 years. The golf ball sized speakers work very discretely in the small bedroom i've got this set up in. Aside from the lack of Dolby Atmos it's pretty much perfect for me.

On the headphone front i'm using Sennheiser HD 25s at home and SoundMAGIC E10 when i'm out, both pretty awesome quality given the price. I've been really impressed using the former with Dolby Atmos headphone in PUBG.
 

Cambot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
231
Pretty modest...

New systems - HDMI into a Yamaha Aventage AV receiver out to Paradigm Monitor 7 speakers and matching center channel with Paradigm Mini Monitors for the L/R Rears.

Old systems - Most are ran into my RGB Mini Framemeister with analog audio returned from my Sony XBR2 HDTV, or (with the PS2) with digital optical directly into a NAD 3020 Integrated Amp out to a set of Warfedale Diamond 10.1 bookshelf speakers.
 
OP
OP
Jeremiah

Jeremiah

Member
Oct 25, 2017
774
They are Ceres BT 3.5. They have a quarter inch sub out, RCA and quarter inputs.

Are you connected via Bluetooth?

Any good sub recommendations? I'm using one from an all in one box set from 2009 and want to upgrade.

May I ask what your budget is? If it's no budget, the SVS PB16 Ultra will literally shake you. My friend has it and DAMN is all I can say haha.

What AIO did you purchase?

am i allowed to link to there , here?

I feel like that would be something i'm not allowed to do.

RandomDazed I tried to PM you but your profile is private? Send me the link?
 
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Eros

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,656
So I don't really know anything about audio equipment, so forgive my ignorance.

Is there any way to hook up a TV's sound to go to a mixer instead, and then through the speakers connected to the mixer? The equipment I have:

TCL p607
Mackie Mix5
KRK Rokit 6 x2
 

Samaritan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,696
Tacoma, Washington
I need some advice on soundbar systems. I'm split on these two different models:

- theVizio SB-3851-D0 ($250)
- theSony HT-NT5 (which is $450 for open box)

I don't have room to use the rear surround speakers right now, which is why I'm considering the much more expensive Sony system.

I was able to listen to the HT-NT5 in a store and thought it sounded very good; really balanced. But the Vizio SB-3851 gets recommended a lot as the best budget soundbar you can buy right now. I really don't know which way to go with this.
 

TheKid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,513
Bay Area
I'm a noob to audio guys, I bought some hd598s recently and I love them so ive started ripping my CDs, I've been using apple lossless and I have a fiiO portable player, before I go too far on ripping my CDs (i've only ripped about 60 or so, got tons more) should I start over and begin ripping them in FLAC format? also I just got the new king gizzard album and its in wav files, any tools I can use to convert it to apple lossless (m4a) or flac?
 

Darkatomz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
367
CA
Desktop setup
  • Music Player: iTunes - I know Foobar and some other players would be better options but are not straightforward at all
  • Sound Card: Asus Xonar Essence STX II with Burson Audio V5i's for the I/V and buffer (Uni Xonar drivers with Xonar Switch)
  • Desktop DAC + Amp - Topping DX7 Pro
  • 2x (Active) Bookshelf Speakers: Genelec 8030C
    • Upgraded from Yamaha HS8
  • Speaker Stands: IsoAcoustics ISO-L8R200
  • Subwoofer: Rythmik E15HP - Sealed to optimize for music, they are the only sub company that has integrated current sensing
  • Sub stand: Isocoustics Modular
  • Power Conditioner - Furman AC215A - For the speakers, woofer, and DAC+Amp
  • Open Cans - Focal Clear (Dynamic)

Retired due to breakage
  • Audio DAC - Chord Mojo (a bit misleading though as it is really an audio FPGA)
    • Can also be used in my desktop setup to drive big speakers if wanted, battery went bad after 18mo
  • Desktop DAC + Amp- Burson Playmate with 2x V6 Classic op-amps for the I/V and 2x V6 Vivid op-amps for the LPF/HP_Vgain
    • Playmate failed twice, first was under warranty


Living Room
  • Receiver: Denon X4000 (Audyssey MultiEQ XT32)
  • 2x Front: Paradigm Reference Prestige 15B
  • Center: Paradigm Reference Studio CC-590 v5
  • Subwoofer: SVS PB-3000 - Ported for gaming/movies/tv, integrated DSP with PEQ which is a real difference-maker
  • Speaker and Sub Feet: IsoAcoustics Gaia II and III
  • Power Conditioner - Furman AC215A (for the sub and the receiver)

I don't really see Denon having a good solution for HDMI 2.1 until at least 2023 at this point. Since the Topping DX7 Pro was a new addition to my setup, I moved the E15HP sub over to my desktop setup and replaced it with a SVS PB-3000 I also decided to simply stick with the 3.1 setup I have given the apartment layout I am in for now.

Links below for details on Audyssey and mic positioning for calibration.
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...l#post21782993
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...tup-guide.html


I also have bass traps installed in corners of my apartment (meaning anything more than 5.1 (aka 7.1, Atmos, etc) doesn't make sense), as it is a cheap and easy acoustic treatment technique for good return. For those looking for a good low frequency test for their woofer, check out the intro to Edge Of Tomorrow.

If it isn't apparent, I am a big fan of speaker isolation stands, as they really work. Far superior to foam-related isolation.


---


Cross posting from the headphone thread as some of this ties into the above.

I have a setup for fixed and portable situations, and use EqualizerAPO and Peace to pre-load parametric EQ settings from the AutoEQ archive (Oratory1990 for headphones, Crinacle for IEMs, both of which are professionally derived and benchmarked against the Harman target curve) to the audio DAC I am using. For the listening unit itself, I prefer a flat, neutral sound without overbearing bass; something that can get you as close to the source material as the sound recording engineer intended, all at a great value.

I carry my personal collection of music in 320kbps or its VBR equivalent (FLAC of my favorite albums, otherwise just 16bit/44.1kHz Fs since it would be pretty damn hard to get 24bit/192kHz tracks of my entire catalog); I am in the minority now that I do not stream my music. I also believe in digital audio since I view this as getting closer to the exact source material, and you can do whatever you want on top of it.

My favorite references for beginners include TheHeadphoneList, Headfonia and Headphone.com that don't get into super levels of crazy that many audio forums are notorious for if you are looking to do research into gear purchases. If you want to get technical, you can check out Audio Science Review.

On-The-Go setup
  • iPhone (Kaisertone player)
  • Lightning to USB Cable --> AudioQuest Jitterbug -->
  • USB DAC + Amp: HIDIZS S8
    • Upgraded from AudioQuest Dragonfly Red
  • Custom IEMs: Jerry Harvey JH13v2 Pro
    • Upgraded from HiFiMan RE-400
    • At some point, I want to get a 64 Audio A12t if I feel like spending a bunch of money...

*or Closed Cans - Nuraphone or Nuraloop
  • Using these in BT since in this case I value the convenience of no wires
  • (Effectively) the first digital headphone which uses calibration to personalize your EQ, have to say I am very impressed!
  • The dedicated IEM and ear driver design is brilliant, but could be more comfortable. Would love to see more of this type of design to keep the high and low frequencies separated
  • Newest update adds ANC, external hearing, and BT switching
  • While not relevant to iOS users, these cans uses the apt-X HD spec for BT audio which is close to wireless lossless
  • Given that these generally need to be tied to a cell phone, this makes it hard to interface to traditional computers/laptops/etc
  • Cables could be longer, and I wish they were non-proprietary...
 
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stryke

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,347
Hey man, thanks for taking some time to respond. Wireless is important for me cuz I don't like to be tethered if I can help it. Seems like most decent Headphone setups require quite a bit of wires, and an added mic, I just dunno if I could ever commit to that so I settle for the Sony headsets.

And that's fine. I'm not much of an audiophile but I do like the Platinums when the situation calls for it.
The build quality is quite nice and battery life is pretty good too. Comfort is okay but I'm not sure how it is compared to the Golds as I never owned those.
 

dgrdsv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,833
Since we're basically forced to share video and audio bandwidth in a single cable, what happen if we use high res high refresh display that make heavy use of the hdmi bandwidth and still need to 'stream' high bandwidth hd audio???
As far as I remember video bandwidth is separate from audio bandwidth so you can't make audio not "fit" by pushing the video to specs maximums.

We need SPDIF HD lol.
Yeah, and it's actually should not be too hard to make - just make HDMI officially capable to output audio only and the problem is fixed. I don't know why HDMI Alliance is overlooking this use case time and time again.

Oh btw... How about the equivalent to DDL in these modern HD format? Do we have it? The equivalent for DDL for HDMATrueHD whatever? Mainly for games real time audio I mean.
You don't need them since modern interfaces are completely capable of transferring 7.1+ linear PCM with 24 bits / 192 KHz. These lossless formats are pretty much useless for anything but saving storage space - which isn't an issue with real time audio from games.

so on pc you need to do this? Gpu hdmi out - > display - > hdmi out again to av receiver?
This would be ARC and it has some severe limitations in modern HDMI 2.0 protocol (only stereo and encoded in lossy DD/DTS or something). They do plan on introducing ARC 2.0 in HDMI 2.1 which should solve some of these I think. But generally you'd want GPU's HDMI out -> AVR -> TV's/monitor's HDMI in since this will allow you to pass 7.1 linear PCM sound to AVR without any issues.

that pose another potential problem, wouldn't it cause display lag when playing games?
This somewhat depends on if the AVR you're using applying any kind of processing to the video stream it gets from GPU but generally - they don't and there is no additional lag.
 

napoleonic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
176
You don't need them since modern interfaces are completely capable of transferring 7.1+ linear PCM with 24 bits / 192 KHz. These lossless formats are pretty much useless for anything but saving storage space - which isn't an issue with real time audio from games.

um isn't that not the issue? the issue was that dolby/dts audio were a kind to 'pre encoded' audio while games require real time 'encoding' the audio, hence the whole idea of DDL, encoding dolby digital in real time with dedicated hardware?

that's no longer the case now?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
um isn't that not the issue? the issue was that dolby/dts audio were a kind to 'pre encoded' audio while games require real time 'encoding' the audio, hence the whole idea of DDL, encoding dolby digital in real time with dedicated hardware?
that's no longer the case now?
I explained this in my post here.
TOSLINK connections had limited bandwidth, and could only do either 2 channels of uncompressed audio, or 6 channels of AC3 / DTS encoded audio.
So to get 5.1 from them, you had to use Dolby Digital Live / DTS: Connect to encode 6 channels of LPCM to a compressed format that could be transmitted over an optical cable.

HDMI has the bandwidth to do 8 channels of uncompressed audio, so there is no need to encode it to Dolby TrueHD or DTS:HD Master Audio.
Those formats only exist to save space on a Blu-ray disc. LPCM, Dolby TrueHD, and DTS:HD Master Audio all have the same audio quality. Real-time encoding of LPCM to one of those formats would only add latency.
Hey Pargon great to see you here as well :)
May i ask you to give a few recommendations how other users can get good virtual surround? I'd love to add it to the OP and try it myself!
  • Windows Sonic is built into the Windows 10 Creators Update or newer - though it doesn't work with all games, since it does not report channels the same way as a 7.1 sound card.
  • Dolby Atmos for Headphones is a $15 purchase, and behaves the same as Windows Sonic.
  • Creative's X-Fi MB3 is $30 and gives you access to SBX Surround if your motherboard's codec is supported. Note: You have to use on-board audio for virtual surround to work. It will let you select other sound devices, but you won't get 5.1 / 7.1 virtual surround.
Personally I prefer Creative's hardware solutions like CMSS-3D or THX/SBX Surround, but they require that you have one of their sound cards.
Dolby Headphone is another hardware option that some sound cards or on-board audio offers.
ASUS have their own virtual surround tech now, many AVRs have virtual surround options too.

The important thing is that the sound device is configured as a 5.1 or 7.1 device in Windows.
With the exception of Windows Sonic / Dolby Atmos for Headphones, if it's not configured as a multichannel device, you're not getting virtual surround, as the game is not providing 6 or 8 channels of audio.
 

napoleonic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
176
I explained this in my post here.
TOSLINK connections had limited bandwidth, and could only do either 2 channels of uncompressed audio, or 6 channels of AC3 / DTS encoded audio.
So to get 5.1 from them, you had to use Dolby Digital Live / DTS: Connect to encode 6 channels of LPCM to a compressed format that could be transmitted over an optical cable.

HDMI has the bandwidth to do 8 channels of uncompressed audio, so there is no need to encode it to Dolby TrueHD or DTS:HD Master Audio.
Those formats only exist to save space on a Blu-ray disc. LPCM, Dolby TrueHD, and DTS:HD Master Audio all have the same audio quality. Real-time encoding of LPCM to one of those formats would only add latency.

But what you're saying is, that we can't have DTSHDMA in real time gaming, right? Unless it's cutscenes with pre-encoded DTSHDMA audio files, am I correct?

But because multichannel PCM is equal to them so just use the PCM? Am I correct here?

But how about the software aspect, do games and OSes recognize the situation so they could send out the correct multichannel LPCM according to the selected audio output setup? And the receiver would picked it up too? No complicated tinkering needed?

So connect the gpu with hdmi cable to the receiver, install the gpu hd audio driver, setup the windows to output multichannel audio via gpu, setup the game to do the same and enjoy gaming with proper multichannel LPCM audio? Done?
 

Astronut325

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,948
Los Angeles, CA
I use to game on a dedicated 5.1 setup. That's when I was a bachelor. Now, married with kids, I game on headphones. :(

Maybe in a few years, will be able to game on a 5.1 set up again. Need a compact system suggestion.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,379
Any recommendations on a good theater in a box? Currently just have some nice headphones, but I kind of get annoyed wearing them for long periods of time and my TV speakers are horrible. Just looking for something nice for a smallish bedroom without spending a ton.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
But what you're saying is, that we can't have DTSHDMA in real time gaming, right? Unless it's cutscenes with pre-encoded DTSHDMA audio files, am I correct?
But because multichannel PCM is equal to them so just use the PCM? Am I correct here?
That's correct - though I doubt any games will use pre-encoded TrueHD/DTS:HD tracks due to licensing costs.
But how about the software aspect, do games and OSes recognize the situation so they could send out the correct multichannel LPCM according to the selected audio output setup? And the receiver would picked it up too? No complicated tinkering needed?
Basically all digital audio is LPCM by default. You don't have to do anything.
Just make sure you configure the audio device to the correct number of channels in the Sound Control Panel.
I'd also recommend setting it to 24-bit 48kHz, as a few games have issues with other sample rates.
So connect the gpu with hdmi cable to the receiver, install the gpu hd audio driver, setup the windows to output multichannel audio via gpu, setup the game to do the same and enjoy gaming with proper multichannel LPCM audio? Done?
Yep - though most games should automatically use the correct channel output, rather than requiring you to select 5.1 / 7.1
Old games (<2007 or so) may require you to set up IndirectSound to get multichannel audio working.
 

dgrdsv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,833
the issue was that dolby/dts audio were a kind to 'pre encoded' audio while games require real time 'encoding' the audio, hence the whole idea of DDL, encoding dolby digital in real time with dedicated hardware?
that's no longer the case now?
You only need to encode gaming audio into DD/DTS if you want to push >2 channels through S/PDIF since its bandwidth isn't enough for anything more than 2 channels when using linear PCM (16/44 I think). With HDMI you can push 7.1 channels in linear PCM at 24 bits / 192 KHz and thus there's no need to encode it into anything. Encoding into DD TrueHD or DTS Neo (or whatever its called, keep forgetting) won't give you any benefits since it's the same lossless audio as PCM and it won't fit into S/PDIF bandwidth either. The only benefit to these formats is that pre-encoded lossless audio takes less storage and this is only important for video / audio distribution (Blurays, streaming, etc.), not gaming audio.

But what you're saying is, that we can't have DTSHDMA in real time gaming, right? Unless it's cutscenes with pre-encoded DTSHDMA audio files, am I correct?
Correct, there are no DDTHD/DDHDMA real time encoders - since there's no point in their existence.

But because multichannel PCM is equal to them so just use the PCM? Am I correct here?
Yes. Lossless formats provide the same audio quality as linear PCM. The only difference (theoretical, tbh, as I can't think of any reason there may actually be a difference) may be due to using a different decoder - if say your PC s/w decoder does a better or worse job than AVR decoder. But this, again, is relevant only to pre-encoded video/audio and not games.

But how about the software aspect, do games and OSes recognize the situation so they could send out the correct multichannel LPCM according to the selected audio output setup?
PC games don't choose a format which OS/driver outputs to external device, user chooses this format and games just use user/OS/driver specified mixing format and then output the result in the user/OS/driver specified stream format.
This sometimes result in bugs, btw, when a game suddenly can't use the specified format and you have to dial it down (usually) to "CD Audio" (16 bit / 44 KHz). But such cases are very rare and happen on older games, usually there are no issues.

And the receiver would picked it up too? No complicated tinkering needed?
HDMI compatible receiver will pick up LPCM with no issues. It's the easiest audio format to pick up actually since it's just a raw bitstream of audio data with no encoding applied to it so it's the least work for AVR to convert to analogue audio actually.

So connect the gpu with hdmi cable to the receiver, install the gpu hd audio driver, setup the windows to output multichannel audio via gpu, setup the game to do the same and enjoy gaming with proper multichannel LPCM audio? Done?
Basically. You don't really have to setup much in modern games though since most of them will simply pickup Windows speaker configuration and provide just some basic dynamic range adjustments like headphones / TV / surround.

Any recommendations on a good theater in a box?
You have to give us at least your expected price range since there's basically limitless number of possibilities otherwise.
 
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Cloud-Hidden

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,982
Just thought I'd make sure everyone knows:

Bose headphones are on sale at Amazon right now. Just picked up a pair of QuietComfort 25s for $179 (usually $279). Might be good for those of you who travel and play games on the plane / bus / train frequently.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
Just thought I'd make sure everyone knows:
Bose headphones are on sale at Amazon right now. Just picked up a pair of QuietComfort 25s for $179 (usually $279). Might be good for those of you who travel and play games on the plane / bus / train frequently.
I'm a big fan of the QC20. They may not be the highest fidelity headphones, but I find them very comfortable to wear for long stretches of time since the fit is very different from IEMs, and the active noise cancellation is very effective.
I don't like the passive isolation you get with IEMs that reduce the ambient noise by a similar amount. Feels like I'm underwater, and the cable transmits a lot of noise if anything rubs against it.
Being able to press a button and hear your surroundings or have a conversation, while still retaining a bit of low frequency noise reduction, is really convenient too.
The only inconvenient thing is the battery pack. It's not huge, but it can get in the way if you're using portable devices, and you do have to remember to charge it. Worth the trade-off though, in my opinion.

I don't find the QC25 to be quite as comfortable as they're much larger and heavier than the in-ear design of the QC20 (but still very light relative to other circumaural headphones) and the noise reduction is not quite as effective either since the passive isolation of that design is lower.
Because they go over your ears, there's a slight pressure when you switch noise cancelling on, but it's not as bad as NC used to be. Less of a problem for me than the physical pressure of larger/heavier headphones.
Running off a single AAA battery is great, as it goes for something like 30 hours and the case has a space to keep a spare. I use rechargeable batteries with it (get Fujitsu pre-charged) so that I'm not buying a pack of batteries a month, but it's great having the option of walking into any convenience store and picking up more if you do need them for some reason.
It's one of the reasons I've been hesitant to upgrade to the wireless QC35. The wire is inconvenient - especially with most new phones requiring adapters - but I don't like devices which have fixed rechargeable batteries, rather than batteries you can swap out for a fully charged spare when they die.

I have higher-end headphones too, however I find the complete absence of other noise to be far more immersive when gaming and end up using Bose more than anything else now.
I could never go back to open-back headphones like the higher-end Sennheisers. Once you've been using NC headphones for a while, things like fan noise, AC, road noise etc really begins to stand out.
This video review did a great job demonstrating the effectiveness of the noise cancelling. (wear headphones)
 

Chris Kay

Member
Oct 30, 2017
26
At the moment (and having owned another receiver for nine years before upgrading) the 1080 will suit me for several years and then some. Dolby Vision pass through was added in September via online update; networking features on these new models are amazing by the way. IMO 2.1 won't be necessary for me until maybe 10 years from now, but that's definitely different from other people's upgrade cycles. 2.1 definitely comes across as very forward thinking.
Yeah, I think so as well. HDMI 2.1 will only really be relevant when the switch to 8k and beyond comes. I just want to prevent having to upgrade again in a few years.

But good to know that Dolby Vision was added as well. Thanks for the info.
 

Chekhonte

User banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 31, 2017
1,886
Getting a multi functional dac and an planar magnetic headphones has been last stop on the audio front. I had no idea how much a difference a dac could make. Between usb, optical and coax everything I have hooks up to it minus the switch which is a bummer.
 

dgrdsv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,833
Just looking for something around $200-$300, maybe a bit more if the quality is there. This is more of a stop gap to last a couple years before I splurge on something real nice.
Well, entry levels are all usually sound kinda similar so the only advice I'm able to give you is to try and find a way to listen to the one which you'll select before buying. On the other hand, at such price, it's not a big loss if you won't like how it sound.

My current PC speakers system is some ass old Chinese 5.1 which I bought about 15 years ago for something around $150 I think. Considering the price, this was one hell of an investment but I'm planning on gradually upgrading it to a system built from Dali Zensor speakers probably over the next couple of years. It simply doesn't sound good enough for PC gaming anymore.

Yeah, I think so as well. HDMI 2.1 will only really be relevant when the switch to 8k and beyond comes
Not really, it is relevant for a proper HDR output at 4K@60+ right now. Which is one of the reasons why I currently withholding from upgrading my TV to 4K/HDR - I want to be able to push RGB 12 bits to it in 4K/60Hz at the very least and modern HDMI 2.0b doesn't allow this. So I'm waiting it out, looking at how TV prices are falling in the meantime.
 

Log!

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,410
Using a set of ATH-AD900X headphones with my Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium HD.

Also, the first two Thief games and System Shock 2 are absolutely amazing audio experiences.
 

Cloud-Hidden

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,982

Great write-up, dude! I was looking at the QC20s but I absolutely can't stand putting things into my ear. I've heard that they are far more comfortable than the in-ear earphones I'm used to, but I can't really stomach it. I also share my music a lot, and there's no way in Hell I'm going to let someone else shove something into their ear and then hand it back to me without knowing their hygiene habits.
 

DieH@rd

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,558
What should I aim to get headphones-wize [with mic, preferrably detechabe/hideable] that is plugged into audio ports of my Asus ROG Strix B350-F Gaming motherboard. It supposedly has one of the best audio solution that are found in Asus boards [SupremeFX S1220]. It would be good if I don't need to use external DAC/AMP if I don't need to.
 
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PeskyToaster

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,312
I definitely need to look at upgrading my tv and computer sound. I also need headphones for the PS4. I'm using the Sony Golds but I wanna see if there's better stuff out there, higher quality but still voice chat. Is there a resource/guide for what I need to buy? Like a PC part picker equivalent for sound setups? Like I know for a sound system you get like two speakers on the side and then throw some around the room. Or do you just buy a complete setup and it comes with everything you could want?
 

hollams

Member
Nov 7, 2017
168
Denon X4300H Receiver with 5.2.4 Atmos setup, 2 SVS PC12-Plus Subs that rock the house. Recliner has buttkicker speaker installed as well so when the bass hits it really hits.

For multiplayer games with friends.
AKG-K712 Pro Headphones with a ModMic and Astro Mix Amp for Xbox and PC.
 

BigE

Member
Oct 25, 2017
46
Rtings reports that aptX Latency for WH-1000XM2 is 187 ms, and that Sennheiser PCX 550 is in the similar range [171 ms].

IMO, that's too much for gaming and movie/TV watching.
I agree. That's why I think you shouldn't feed your game audio into a capture card then into a blue tooth transmitter to headphones, then to a microphone, then back to the capture card and then listen to it.
 

Jersa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
973
Boston, MA (USA)
It feels like lately with constantly shifting connectivity standards there hasn't been a good time to update A/V receiver. With HDMI 2.1 just over the horizon, now must be an exceptionally poor time to update, right? Would like to add HDR passthrough functionality to my Pioneer SC-81, which would put me going to something like an SC-LX701 or SC-LX502. Looks like the 502 is a refresh of the 501 that includes updated port standards, but still not HDMI 2.1, so I'd imagine the rest of the Elite Line will get HDMI 2.1 next fall for the 2018 updates.
 

Velinos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
54
I built a home theater room in my basement over the past year. I have a 65" LG OLED B6 with my Xbox One X hooked up to this setup. Only 5.1, but given the size and shape of the room (ceiling is at about 6.5') anything more seemed like overkill.

Receiver: Anthem MRX 1120
Fronts: GoldenEar Triton Two+ Tower
Center: GoldenEar SuperCenter XXL
Rears: GoldenEar SuperSat 50
Sub: GoldenEar SuperSub X

The system sounds great though.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
Great write-up, dude! I was looking at the QC20s but I absolutely can't stand putting things into my ear. I've heard that they are far more comfortable than the in-ear earphones I'm used to, but I can't really stomach it. I also share my music a lot, and there's no way in Hell I'm going to let someone else shove something into their ear and then hand it back to me without knowing their hygiene habits.
The fit is more like an earbud, but with a better seal as the tips have interchangeable silicone covers rather than being hard plastic. They don't get inserted into the ear canal like IEMs. That's one of the main reasons why I find them so much more comfortable.
But I completely understand that many people prefer over-ear headphones, especially if you share them.

Anyone tried Atmos on headphones in AC Origins? Doesn't seem to do much to be honest.
I don't know what platform you're on, but it's starting to look like Assassin's Creed Origins and Rise of the Tomb Raider only support Atmos on Xbox, and not PC.
Overwatch has its own Atmos support built in (PC-only), and I think Battlefield 1 also supports Atmos on PC. I thought that Battlefront 1 did too, but I don't see it listed on the Dolby site.
No idea about the other games listed as having Atmos support on the Dolby site.

It's very disappointing that features like these are spread out across all platforms, seemingly at random.
There are a number of games which support HDR on console, but not PC.
At the same time, I think PC is the only platform with any games that support Dolby Vision HDR.
Rise of the Tomb Raider was demoed running in HDR on PC more than a year ago, but the only platform with HDR support right now is the Xbox One X. It's a mess.
 

NEE HEE HEE

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
844
Any AVR users here?

I'm running 5.1 with Direct on the AVR and PCM on my PS4/X.

The only thing is Im not sure if it's my TV or the AVR (Denon). It'll periodically do a black flash, and lose its signal entirely. Only way to restore the signal is to turn the TV on and off.

Man I need to stop being lazy and test another TV to see if my AVR is the issue. If anyone has this issue as well though and can recommend a better brand that would be great. Maybe denon products are just shit?
 

Velinos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
54
Any AVR users here?

I'm running 5.1 with Direct on the AVR and PCM on my PS4/X.

The only thing is Im not sure if it's my TV or the AVR (Denon). It'll periodically do a black flash, and lose its signal entirely. Only way to restore the signal is to turn the TV on and off.

Man I need to stop being lazy and test another TV to see if my AVR is the issue. If anyone has this issue as well though and can recommend a better brand that would be great. Maybe denon products are just shit?

I use AVR with my system and haven't had issues like that. Could be the receiver, but it also might be your HDMI cable. Swapping out things will help narrow down the culprit. Good luck.
 

Easy_D

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,275
That's what happens when the game uses a basic stereo headphone mix that is only panning sounds across two channels - and that is probably the majority of games.
As you have found out, 5.1 or 7.1 virtual surround fixes that problem, and makes audio sound far more natural.
That's the reason why I recommend everyone use a sound card with (good) virtual surround instead of a 2 channel DAC for PC audio, or equivalent hardware for consoles.
Virtual surround is not a bad thing. For some reason lots of people seem to confuse those awful "surround sound" headsets that used multiple drivers in the headphones with virtual surround.
And audiophiles seem to think that their high-end headphones don't need it, as if their HD800s magically add 6 channels of audio to the game.
That was a very educational post, thanks man.
 

Karish

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,521
Been using my SHP9500s with Dolby Atmos for headphones on my Xbox One X and am thrilled.
 

pksu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,238
Finland
Virtual surround is not a bad thing. For some reason lots of people seem to confuse those awful "surround sound" headsets that used multiple drivers in the headphones with virtual surround.
And audiophiles seem to think that their high-end headphones don't need it, as if their HD800s magically add 6 channels of audio to the game.
It isn't necessarily a bad thing but virtual surround processing still happens after the game engine has finished processing sounds and a lot of environmental information is discarded (for example regarding occlusion). I hope "real" solutions like Steam Audio will become more common in the future.

One example of different post-process sound effects, there are clear differences:
 

napoleonic

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
176
That's correct - though I doubt any games will use pre-encoded TrueHD/DTS:HD tracks due to licensing costs.
Basically all digital audio is LPCM by default. You don't have to do anything.
Just make sure you configure the audio device to the correct number of channels in the Sound Control Panel.
I'd also recommend setting it to 24-bit 48kHz, as a few games have issues with other sample rates.
Yep - though most games should automatically use the correct channel output, rather than requiring you to select 5.1 / 7.1
Old games (<2007 or so) may require you to set up IndirectSound to get multichannel audio working.
I see, thanks for all the answers, also hopefully those people on earlier pages that complained how their new console games didn't give them dtshdma audio also saw our conversation and gained understanding about this matter, lol.

Oh still leave one question for me, if lpcm is superior and multichannel capable today then why do blu ray movies still need dtshdma and their friends? Isn't that a complete waste of resources? Or am I still misunderstanding something?

And can you explain to me what's dolby atmos again? What's the difference?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
It isn't necessarily a bad thing but virtual surround processing still happens after the game engine has finished processing sounds and a lot of environmental information is discarded (for example regarding occlusion). I hope "real" solutions like Steam Audio will become more common in the future.

One example of different post-process sound effects, there are clear differences.
Well that's not caused by virtual surround. Issues like a lack of occlusion are just how the game handles audio processing.
You would hear the same thing with a stereo headphone output, or a real 7.1 speaker setup too.
I do wish that it was better, but complex audio processing is still expensive to compute without dedicated hardware, and it just doesn't get the same focus as things like graphics.

I will say that I'm not a fan of Dolby Headphone because it adds a ton of reverb and makes spaces feel like a big empty room. It is good for audio positioning though, and Dolby Headphone is not the same thing as Dolby Atmos for Headphones. It's probably at least a decade old at this point.

Oh still leave one question for me, if lpcm is superior and multichannel capable today then why do blu ray movies still need dtshdma and their friends? Isn't that a complete waste of resources? Or am I still misunderstanding something?
It saves space on the disc, which can be used to support more audio tracks (different languages), higher sample rates, higher bitrate video, or could allow a single-layer disc to be used rather than dual-layer.

And can you explain to me what's dolby atmos again? What's the difference?
Dolby Atmos is different. Instead of a fixed 5.1 or 7.1 channel layout, it uses object-based sound.
That means the sound in a movie or game is described as co-ordinates in 3D space, and your receiver then calculates how best to present that based on the number and position of the speakers in your room.
 

pksu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,238
Finland
I do wish that it was better, but complex audio processing is still expensive to compute without dedicated hardware, and it just doesn't get the same focus as things like graphics.
Yeah and the hardware required is more like modern GPUs with more tight engine integration than just a simple effect library as EAX/EFX was. Steam Audio actually supports GPUs for accelerating ray tracing for sound along with baking propagation data which is sweet. I've never written or played anything A3D related but I heard it did something similar back in the days.