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Red Letter Media: Star Wars The Last Plinkett Review
- Thread starter Infinity Times Two
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The things you mentioned about his turn happened in the prequels. My point was, in the OT, Vader's backstory is pretty much zero. He was seduced by the dark side, that's it. I'm not old enough to have been alive during the release of the OT, but I can't imagine people being up in arms about the audience not being shown Vader's turn. For some reason, a lot of today's audience craves backstory backstory backstory, every little detail about every character. Sometimes it's ok not to reveal everything, to focus on the character's action in the present without being so focused on his or her past . I personally just don't think Kylo's turn would have been interesting. We got three movies about the concept, and sure, they could have been done way way better, but I like that we don't know everything about Kylo. It makes the character more interesting to me.
Wouldn't be the first time she shut him up...
I don't want to get into those conspiracy shit but whatever, I don't think Luke character was the worst thing ever in TLJ but It definitely wasn't the Luke we know but that's not the reason why this movie sucks so whatever...
I agree, as I said, I've pretty much realized that I never really liked Star Wars that much. There's good ways and bad ways of doing backstory, SOLO was a textbook example of one that no one asked for.
I don't think it's surprising that people want more complex stories as they get older though.
Find any 65 year old and ask them if they are the same as they were when they were 35. You might be surprised at their answer. Then go back to the OT and really consider all the crap that happened to Luke and think about how that could change a person.
I mean, it's an evolution of character.....it works.
But yes, let's get back to Holdo's hair/outfit. It's so out of place
#SoMuchToDiscuss #SoMuchLegitimateCriticism
True that. I still can't believe Disney had the real Mark Hamill killed and replaced him with Robot Mark Hamill that is the same as regular Mark Hamill except he likes the movie. Real scummy move by Disney
You can't changed your true self but whatever, like I said, Luke portrayal wasn't a problem to me, I can see why he could have gone this way, the only disappointing stuff with Luke to me is how everything ends for him... Obi Wan Kenobi went to even worse shit than Luke and still had hope.
The whole thing about the mixed and confusing feelings the movie gives compared to the traditional adventure SW movies is totally on point. The movie wants to subvert so much, that ends not knowing what it wants to be.
I feel RLM nitpicking makes sense, because they are part of major and valid points. They are examples of the confusingly thematic and tone nature of the film and all the problems with the structure of the film.
When I watched TLJ, I came off from the cinema with the feel that I really didn't enjoyed the movie at all. And this explains perfectly what I felt in that moment.
I feel RLM nitpicking makes sense, because they are part of major and valid points. They are examples of the confusingly thematic and tone nature of the film and all the problems with the structure of the film.
When I watched TLJ, I came off from the cinema with the feel that I really didn't enjoyed the movie at all. And this explains perfectly what I felt in that moment.
Woah, let's not get conspiratorial here, but I heard Kathleen Kennedy was the one who did the actual murdering.
The biggest crime of all though? Her hair and outfit while she did the actual murdering.
Yup. It made the murder real impractical since she couldn't run away because her prom dress was too tight and the wrong shade of brown.
This is the type of nitpicky criticism that I can't just jive with. I suppose if you place characters in movies on a pedestal you expect them to make 100% fool-proof decisions all the time, and whether they do as a result of intentional or unintentional writing is doesn't really matter. When I see Holdo refusing to tell Poe of her plan and when I see Poe charging stubbornly headfirst toward a dreadnaught and killing his team in the process, I don't find that to be an indictment of the writing because I never regard these characters as people who are capable of making the best decisions all the time. I see more unbelievable and inconceivable shit happen in real life than I do in most movies nowadays, yet my standard of expectation should be different for characters in a movie? Why? I'm sure some jerk in the military at some point had knowledge that he should have passed down but didn't. I'm also sure people have unintentionally gotten their squads killed for not thinking clearly.
Nothing that happened in The Last Jedi is inconsistent to me. Could things have been better? Sure, that's an argument one could make. I sure as hell would have preferred a more interesting location than Canto Bight or a chase through space, but my preference for something else does not suggest that the writing is incongruous or inconsistent. All it says is that I'd prefer something else. Everything that needs to be explained in the movie is explained and flows in a logical, linear path. If there were clear-as-day inconsistencies that could not be ignored, that'd be one thing, but I don't see any of that in this movie. If you don't like a character's motivation or where the movie is going, fine, but don't tell me it doesn't make sense.
No matter how sound a character's decisions may be it's always possible for someone to suggest a better solution, which isn't criticism to me. We have the luxury of retrospect as audience members.
Nothing that happened in The Last Jedi is inconsistent to me. Could things have been better? Sure, that's an argument one could make. I sure as hell would have preferred a more interesting location than Canto Bight or a chase through space, but my preference for something else does not suggest that the writing is incongruous or inconsistent. All it says is that I'd prefer something else. Everything that needs to be explained in the movie is explained and flows in a logical, linear path. If there were clear-as-day inconsistencies that could not be ignored, that'd be one thing, but I don't see any of that in this movie. If you don't like a character's motivation or where the movie is going, fine, but don't tell me it doesn't make sense.
No matter how sound a character's decisions may be it's always possible for someone to suggest a better solution, which isn't criticism to me. We have the luxury of retrospect as audience members.
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Not to mention her hair was down when an up-do wouldn't have gotten in the way. Plus she just drew attention to herself with the blond highlights, should have made it another shade of brown.
Yea, that was pretty spot on. Especially the granular dismantling of the plot. I think he's wrong on Luke though. An old dejected Skywalker coming back around after a chat with his old master Yoda during a moment of personal crisis, yea that works, it felt very Luke and Yoda. And while not the conclusion I wanted to see for the character I'm satisfied. The rest of the film, eh.
User banned (1 week): hostility, ignoring a mod post, and a history of similar infractions.
No, i won't drop it. As there's no reason to at all.
This poster started quoting me first. Which ended up in them accusing me of two actionable offences. Which i've been rebutting.
And lets not even get into the comment they made about my post history.
RLM's politics are a legitimate aspect of discussion in this thread. As it's part of TLJ Plinkett review. So again, i won't drop it
All you've done is now given them the excuse not to respond to me. Good job, that's some quality moderation.
Firstly, my TLJ claim was not utter nonsense.
The way you're defending them from my "baseless" accusations. i thought you were a big RLM fan. Are you telling you don't remember at all. Any of the examples i provided ?
And i thought i was the only one with the terrible memory. Guess not.
And had her SJW army cover it up.
Kind of a meandering review, but at least it was fairly short and mildly entertaining. As talking about Last Jedi has been a nonstop exercise for eight months now, there wasn't much fresh in his points; hardly a surprise with what most of the review covered, that's to say, not that much time spent on Luke/Rey/Kylo. I would've liked to hear him talk more on what he enjoyed about the movie. These reviews are always seen as tearing down something "bad" when the Star Trek 09 review, among others, stayed entertaining when praising the movies. And not that RLM is a stranger to acting pedantic in their criticism, but stuff like criticizing the red guards' choreography or how Finn & Rose managed to get their ship into the door were pretty lazy remarks.
The point that kept coming up about what is and isn't "Star Wars" is something that never resonates with me. Not with Star Wars or other properties. Ends up feeling stifling to pigeonhole what a franchise can do or be.
The point that kept coming up about what is and isn't "Star Wars" is something that never resonates with me. Not with Star Wars or other properties. Ends up feeling stifling to pigeonhole what a franchise can do or be.
What makes the "what is and isn't Star Wars" more baffling was the constant comparisons to Star Trek, something that is not even close to Star Wars other than being set in space. I know Mike loves his Star Trek and references to it, but comparing the leadership of Holdo to Pickard was weird.
It's not that weird when you see it in the Star Trek VS Star Wars fanyboy wars. Which he and Rich are warriors in.
Star Wars is Sonic is Shenmue confirmed.
It's the circle of life.
Maybe my memory is faulty, but were previous Star Wars Plinkett reviews ever this heavy with the Star Trek comparisons though?
Every piece of media Mike reviews is heavy with Star Trek comparisons, honestly.
It's a pretty long-running joke in the RLM fanbase, how obsessed he is with Star Trek.
I think how it ends for Luke is incredibly hopeful. I'm not sure how it can be seen any other way. His actions at the end of the film, what he says, how he "dies" is all incredibly hopeful.
As far as Obi-Wan going through worse, this is just not true. Obi-Wan saw Qui-Gon get killed and Anakin get roasted. Two very bad events, sure. Luke saw his aunt and uncle who raised him get burnt to charred skeletons. He saw his mentor who he met just after seeing his aunt and uncle die get cut down by the guy he thinks killed his father. He then gets his hand cut off by that same guy and is told that the worst person to ever live is his father. Then he watches his other mentor die and disappear, who tells him suddenly, hey, you have a sister! Then he watches his father die seconds after he finally connects with him. Lastly, his nephew, betrays him and slaughters his students. And on top of that, he's aged 35 years. This stuff is gonna change a person.
Also, Obi-Wan was the one who wanted Luke to kill Vader in ROTJ. He had lost all hope for Anakin.
Not at all. I just feel it was an uncalled for warning. Especially as all i'm doing is defending myself.
Other than that asking questions guy from First Contact, I think. Nope.
This is very true (and very funny) Butthey get into the Star Wars talk it takes a wholly new angle. Which is a shame, as a long time ago i thought they were above that fanboy bullshit.
Of all my complaints of TLJ, the one that hurts me the most is that I found Luke's lessons and arguments uncompelling. I was never sold by the writing/his dialogue on much of anything, like why the jedi must end. Anything compelling came from him just being a fantastic actor.
As did Yoda.
I felt that's why they didn't want to tell him that Vader was his father. As it would make Luke hesitate killing him.
I know that, but I mean specifically within the context of the Prequel reviews, I don't remember constant comparisons to something in Star Trek other than as Shy mentions the random engineer asking pedantic questions. Using Star Trek as a serious comparison to Star Wars, and using constant references to Star Trek to critique stuff in Star Wars, seems new, in my mind, and not really appropriate considering how different Star Trek is to Star Wars, especially regarding character motivations (also, isn't Star Trek kind of morally grey or semi-complex? You would then think it is a good thing TLJ isn't as black and white, but then that's a complain in this review).
I haven't watched this particular video yet, except bit from the start. Haven't got the time to watch rest of it yet. But I'll still comment a bit on this discussion I've seen going on from the first page. About RLM being against diversity. I don't believe this to be true, I earlier commented on this same issue in GAF back in the day so I remember some details about their Force Awakens review. Where therey literally say: "diversity is a fine thing", "remember those idiots who wanted to boycott the movie for having female and black leads", "It's great that we have three new heroes that are different than the previous generations". I do think those statements are quite clear. Now are they cynical and also out of touch what representation in mainstream media actually means to people, especially kids getting to see heroes who look like them? Yes absolutely. Some go as far as calling them alt-right, that seems really silly. There's a tendency for some to interpret everything RLM might say (or not say) in the most unflattering light as possible. Or twisting something they don't like to hear as some kind of offensive remark. Calling people idiots who got outraged about the diversity of the cast, is hardly pandering to that crowd.
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Sorry, I probably misunderstood. If your point is that simply telling the audience that Snoke did it is completely inadequate, I agree.
My original point was that a lot of people defending TLJ try to pass off the Snoke fizzle as RJ just not wanting to follow up on JJ's setup, when RJ literally flat out told the audience that JJ's setup was exactly the case.
Obligatory. (and almost a year out-of-date now)
A half hour of Mike interrupting videos to make Star Trek comparisons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reApQlk5JiA&app=desktop
"Leadership" is a pretty transferable quality across different franchises.
Picard is a good leader. Steve Rogers is a good leader. Lieutenant Gorman is not. Holdo is not.
Contrasting great leadership with extremely ineffective leadership is perfectly valid.
Did you see Berry post after the mod post? Anyway, this thread is wild. Will be interesting to see what happens in IX and how they advertise it. Rumors say RJ trilogy has been halted and JJ knows he has an uphill battle.
Berry was the one continually being antagonistic.
Also would you people seriously stop parroting the fake rumor spread by alt-righters and their wet dream.
I mean they would be stupid to not reconsider all side projects after seeing how solo was recived in the box office.
Yes, the nuance of Holdo's hair and dress. Such discussion. Such criticism.
Seriously the amount of stealth sexism and parroting of alt-right fever dreams just coasting by is appalling. There's barely any actual discussion of merit.
It's really impressive. I've had a number of agressive posts towards me and it has nothing to do with content from RLM. Kind of gross.
I feel bad for Rian. He didn't make a perfect movie, and this Plinkett review does a good job at roasting him a bit, but he is delivering a superior product than spin-off trash.
I enjoyed this Plinkett review more than the last few. Fairly evenhanded and funny, though nitpicky as is expected from an hour-long review. I still think Half in the Bag is the real crown jewel of RedLetterMedia; having multiple people discuss a thing will always beat one guy grumpily ranting into a microphone imo.
It's interesting how much Mike focuses on writing over directing. A lot of the plot-contrivances he points out aren't really things I would even think about while I'm watching a movie. I just generally assume by default that a movie is going to have contrivances. But I will admit in retrospect that some of the contrivances do go a little beyond your standard movie fare. The actions of Holdo and Rose in particular are head-scratching. Some of the writing in this movie does kind of come off as a liberal guy trying too hard to be woke.
Still, it's rare that we get a mass-market movie as weird and subversive as TLJ, and I enjoyed it for that if nothing else. Carrie Fisher force-floating in space had me laughing. As did Luke going to burn the Jedi books, then ghost-Yoda coming and saying "LOL I'LL DO IT FOR YOU THIS IS WAT YOU WANTED RITE LOL", and then Luke whining about the thing he was going to do anyway. I don't care how seriously you take Star Wars, that shit is funny. I never expected to see such weirdness in a mainline SW.
It's interesting how much Mike focuses on writing over directing. A lot of the plot-contrivances he points out aren't really things I would even think about while I'm watching a movie. I just generally assume by default that a movie is going to have contrivances. But I will admit in retrospect that some of the contrivances do go a little beyond your standard movie fare. The actions of Holdo and Rose in particular are head-scratching. Some of the writing in this movie does kind of come off as a liberal guy trying too hard to be woke.
Still, it's rare that we get a mass-market movie as weird and subversive as TLJ, and I enjoyed it for that if nothing else. Carrie Fisher force-floating in space had me laughing. As did Luke going to burn the Jedi books, then ghost-Yoda coming and saying "LOL I'LL DO IT FOR YOU THIS IS WAT YOU WANTED RITE LOL", and then Luke whining about the thing he was going to do anyway. I don't care how seriously you take Star Wars, that shit is funny. I never expected to see such weirdness in a mainline SW.
Unless there's some new source I'm unaware of, literally every source for this rumour is youtube or alt right websites.
Oh please. You were one of the most openly antagonistic posters here. Why try to victimize yourself?
You're kind of making my point. Why are you talking down to me? I wasn't antagonizing anyone.
You and I both know they're just spreading the alt-right bs.
Pointing out facts about your behavior doesn't prove your point. Keep playing victim if you want.
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