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DorkLord54

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,466
Michigan
Is that the argument that suggests Trump isn't a racist even though racists like him?
I think in this case, it's more that a lot of right wing views are just inherently shitty, and don't really need "conserving".

Also, i dpnt get why Lobster Daddy is a Nietzsche fan, when 1) Peterson doesn't like nihilism, even it's existential forms like, well, Nietzscheian nihilism, and 2) Nietzsche very much a vision beyond Christianity, hence his embrace of proto-existentialism.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson


There is a 4 minute video where he tells a class of young men they are born at a 50% disadvantage vs. women, because women have been able to "pick their mates" throughout history. He uses specific words like "failure" when describing this, because insecure young men view their sexuality as a key part of their masculinity.

Obviously, there is an instant "this guy is an idiot" moment, considering he ignores literally all of human society and history with the idea that women have had agency in picking their mates for the last few thousand years.



Really all you need to know when it comes to him, straight from his own mouth.

He is an idiot who's entire concept of biological hierarchy is beyond laughable to anything who actually studies biology or society.

Nothing I wrote was "mocking" you, rofl
 

Deleted member 15326

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,219
honestly not sure why this thread remains open, there's nothing of value to be gained by maintaining a thread dedicated to a bigot. might as well extend an open invite to refugees for r/coontown or gaf

True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson.

He dislikes women and minorities

next
 

Adree

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,072
honestly not sure why this thread remains open, there's nothing of value to be gained by maintaining a thread dedicated to a bigot. might as well extend an open invite to refugees for r/coontown or gaf



He dislikes women and minorities

next

They used to close Peterson threads but every month someone would just make a new one. At least this one has a billion examples of why he's such a terrible person so maybe someone will be slightly moved to consider their love of the guy before they reflexively ask us all to listen to a 3 hour podcast so we can be enlightened by the guy who was the villain on the last season of Flash.
 

Deleted member 15326

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,219
They used to close Peterson threads but every month someone would just make a new one. At least this one has a billion examples of why he's such a terrible person so maybe someone will be slightly moved to consider their love of the guy before they reflexively ask us all to listen to a 3 hour podcast so we can be enlightened by the guy who was the villain on the last season of Flash.

In that case the name of the thread should be changed to "Jordan Peterson |OT| r/loontown
 

Deleted member 18347

User requested account closure
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2,572

oneils

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,102
Ottawa Canada
There is a 4 minute video where he tells a class of young men they are born at a 50% disadvantage vs. women, because women have been able to "pick their mates" throughout history. He uses specific words like "failure" when describing this, because insecure young men view their sexuality as a key part of their masculinity.

Obviously, there is an instant "this guy is an idiot" moment, considering he ignores literally all of human society and history with the idea that women have had agency in picking their mates for the last few thousand years.



Really all you need to know when it comes to him, straight from his own mouth.

He is an idiot who's entire concept of biological hierarchy is beyond laughable to anything who actually studies biology or society.

Nothing I wrote was "mocking" you, rofl


looked to me that he used the word failure here in terms of passing on genes. not anything else. i'm a complete moron, too, when it comes to biology, but i thought that men are generally less successful than women when passing on genes.

now, some of his language seems to imply that women have historically controlled this when it's that it's likely it's the successful men who controlled it. so while main are at a disadvantage when passing on genes, women don't necessarily control it. so maybe that's is what you are taking issue with.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
looked to me that he used the word failure here in terms of passing on genes. not anything else. i'm a complete moron, too, when it comes to biology, but i thought that men are generally less successful than women when passing on genes.

now, some of his language seems to imply that women have historically controlled this when it's that it's likely it's the successful men who controlled it. so while main are at a disadvantage when passing on genes, women don't necessarily control it. so maybe that's is what you are taking issue with.

He is a sociologist, everything he talks about is in the context of society.

Telling young men, "you're twice as likely to be a failure if you're a man" while saying "women play a massive selection in sexual selection" is not talking about "passing on genes". It's literally about mens role in society and how he is attempting to paint a picture that, from birth, men have the short end of the stick, while literally ignoring the entire history of human society.

Don't try and explain what Peterson is saying, listen to his words and take them at face value.
 

Enzom21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,989
True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson.
Maybe I am missing a post but how is this:
A two hour podcast?

lol
mocking you?
Also, can you explain why this is a good video?
 

oneils

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,102
Ottawa Canada
He is a sociologist, everything he talks about is in the context of society.

Telling young men, "you're twice as likely to be a failure if you're a man" while saying "women play a massive selection in sexual selection" is not talking about "passing on genes". It's literally about mens role in society and how he is attempting to paint a picture that, from birth, men have the short end of the stick, while literally ignoring the entire history of human society.

Don't try and explain what Peterson is saying, listen to his words and take them at face value.

wasn't trying to explain what he was saying, only trying to understand it and hoping for an explanation. if you get me. i didn't understand his point. thanks!
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
honestly not sure why this thread remains open, there's nothing of value to be gained by maintaining a thread dedicated to a bigot. might as well extend an open invite to refugees for r/coontown or gaf

Era looks at and discusses matters from a different point of view than any other forum. Peterson is highly influential and relevent (even if the reasons might be wrong) so just covering your eyes and going "LALALALALA can't hear you" won't make him go away. Giving him a platform is an interesting point of debate but in Era that platform is one that exposes and mocks him. He's not corrupting anyone here.
 

SixPointEight

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,287
True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson.

Can you summarize why it's worth watching and what's worth understanding? I'm all for forming my own opinions but I'm also all for not wasting my fucking time.
 

Deleted member 15326

User requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
4,219
Era looks at and discusses matters from a different point of view than any other forum. Peterson is highly influential and relevent (even if the reasons might be wrong) so just covering your eyes and going "LALALALALA can't hear you" won't make him go away. Giving him a platform is an interesting point of debate but in Era that platform is one that exposes and mocks him. He's not corrupting anyone here.

We don't have any other threads dedicated to a bigot because they're well spoken. It seems like an odd concession.
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
We don't have any other threads dedicated to a bigot because they're well spoken. It seems like an odd concession.

I think there's a spectrum here. Peterson is both well spoken and extremely popular. Him and his popularity is a modern culturally relevant phenomena that definitely deserves to be discussed.

Just labelling him and his readers as one homogenized group of racists/bigots is easy but not the complete reality. Just as it's intellectually lazy to say that all Trump voters are as bad as the man himself.
 

BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson.
People in this thread already came to their own conclusions. They are already familiar with his content and they already know the sociopathic piece of crap he is.
 

Dust

C H A O S
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,288
Listening to him, I am constantly reminded of how some freshmen students acted after one year at University, thinking they are alpha and omega of subject they majored in.
 

Deleted member 15326

User requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
4,219
I think there's a spectrum here. Peterson is both well spoken and extremely popular. Him and his popularity is a modern culturally relevant phenomena that definitely deserves to be discussed.

Just labelling him and his readers as one homogenized group of racists/bigots is easy but not the complete reality. Just as it's intellectually lazy to say that all Trump voters are as bad as the man himself.

You don't think Peterson's a bigot?

He's popular because he's not vulgar. He's a palatable alternative to Trump and people like him. Thanks to the moderate/centrist obsession with civility white men feel like they can praise someone like him in polite company and not feel bad.

He's not special and people who actually have to deal with "polite" bigots like him our whole lives understand that.

And honestly you can stick trump supporter defenses somewhere warm at this point.
 
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Jan 10, 2018
6,927
I've watched a lot from him lately and I can see why people become inspired by what he says. As a lecturer he shows a lot of energy and passion. He seems to have an answer for everything and he likes to provoke thought.

But this is also part of the problem surrounding him. His knowledge and passion is taken as a sign of relevance. His arguments are rated by how they sound rather than what they actually say. And he's quick to talk about scientific facts and the importance of sources but I doubt most people will even look into those actual sources, and how it's possible to interpret them in more than one way.
 

BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
I mean we are talking about a dude that is against gay marriage because he believes it's part of the secret agenda of secret soviet plants that intend to destroy the west from within , and blames the rise of incels on women

Calling him a bigot is honestly way too kind.
 

illamap

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
466
I would sort of like to watch his videos, but to me he just rambles endlessly without giving any points in timely manner. While a definitely agree on some points he makes, however in many topics he comes across as huge besserwisser.
 

Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,192
UK
honestly not sure why this thread remains open, there's nothing of value to be gained by maintaining a thread dedicated to a bigot. might as well extend an open invite to refugees for r/coontown or gaf



He dislikes women and minorities

next
Keep this thread open so the JP acolytes can't create new threads that just fellate JP and aren't any actual new news.
 

Deleted member 22490

User requested account closure
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Oct 28, 2017
9,237
honestly not sure why this thread remains open, there's nothing of value to be gained by maintaining a thread dedicated to a bigot. might as well extend an open invite to refugees for r/coontown or gaf
This is not a safe refuge for Lobsters. They come in here to defend him and get trounced again and again. There are pages upon pages of this in this thread. It's heavily critical of him.

Maybe I am missing a post but how is this:

mocking you?
Also, can you explain why this is a good video?

Saying how long the video is is mocking ME! AHHHH
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
You don't think Peterson's a bigot?

He's popular because he's not vulgar. He's a palatable alternative to Trump and people like him. Thanks to the moderate/centrist obsession with civility white men feel like they can praise someone like him in polite company and not feel bad.

He's not special and people who actually have to deal with "polite" bigots like him our whole lives understand that.

And honestly you can stick trump supporter defenses somewhere warm at this point.

I don't agree with him on many subjects, his views on women and minorities are really backwards for example. And he is special purely because he is so influential now. Is he the first guy entertaining the ideas he does? Of course not. Is he the first with the combination of charisma, intelligence and expression? For our generation maybe so (as a person advocating the ideas he does, not as a public figure in general).

I am not interested in him as a person (and would most likely not enjoy talking with him), I am interested in the bigger phenomena of who he represents, appeals to and how he shapes our discussion about everything relevant (free speech, human rights, tolerance) at the moment. Us (Era) chiming in is important.

People are reading his stuff for many reasons, some come from libertarian point of view, some for the self-help concepts and most likely some for much darker reasons. His books and ideas can lead to a bad path where the end result is something like the alt-right movement. However implying that everyone who read his book or watched a few videos is a bigot and a nazi is wrong. Saying that means that you are just reinforcing the propaganda that the world is simple, black and white without any spectrums and consists of them and us. Which is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
 

Deleted member 2625

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Oct 25, 2017
4,596
If you want some real insight into Peterson, and how he has "evolved" over the years (thus leading to some people who knew him before being baffled by his current behaviour)... read this. It's extremely illuminating, written by another prof who worked with him at U of T. He even let Peterson's family stay with him for 4 months during renos. He's just as confused and disturbed by the arc of Peterson's rise as everyone else.

and it's not a 2h podcast.

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/201...gest-supporter-now-i-think-hes-dangerous.html
 

astroturfing

Member
Nov 1, 2017
6,456
Suomi Finland
how can anyone think Peterson is charismatic? i think he comes off as a creep who loves listening to his own voice.

the man said he stayed up for almost a month after slightly deviating from his loony meat+salt+water diet by drinking cider or something. he's gone off the deep end.

watch this:

https://youtu.be/mzXXjiwlxmU

next to a real honest intellectual he looks quite weak with his arguments.
 

ry-dog

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,180
I don't agree with him on many subjects, his views on women and minorities are really backwards for example. And he is special purely because he is so influential now. Is he the first guy entertaining the ideas he does? Of course not. Is he the first with the combination of charisma, intelligence and expression? For our generation maybe so (as a person advocating the ideas he does, not as a public figure in general).
.

I fail to see the charisma or intelligence everyone talks about. He's consistently making unfounded statements and fallacious arguments. He's also weirdly angry all the time, I don't think I've ever seen him smile. Joe Rogan or Ben Shapiro seem like a better fit for the "influential moderate/conservatives I disagree with, but admire how they speak" category.
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,229
This doesn't matter. I want Tya to tell me in his/her/their words.

Seems a bit hypocritical for them to say someone should come to their own opinion from words, only to use a 3 hour video to prove theirs; i see this WAY too often from people who don't bother to articulate their stances on things but rather go "HERES A VIDEO I WATCHED". If you can't articulate your opinion from that very video you linked than perhaps you don't clearly understand what is being said.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
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Oct 26, 2017
11,284
Listening to him, I am constantly reminded of how some freshmen students acted after one year at University, thinking they are alpha and omega of subject they majored in.

maxresdefault.jpg


"You know, I'm something of a philosopher myself"
 

BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
I don't agree with him on many subjects, his views on women and minorities are really backwards for example. And he is special purely because he is so influential now. Is he the first guy entertaining the ideas he does? Of course not. Is he the first with the combination of charisma, intelligence and expression? For our generation maybe so (as a person advocating the ideas he does, not as a public figure in general).

I am not interested in him as a person (and would most likely not enjoy talking with him), I am interested in the bigger phenomena of who he represents, appeals to and how he shapes our discussion about everything relevant (free speech, human rights, tolerance) at the moment. Us (Era) chiming in is important.

People are reading his stuff for many reasons, some come from libertarian point of view, some for the self-help concepts and most likely some for much darker reasons. His books and ideas can lead to a bad path where the end result is something like the alt-right movement. However implying that everyone who read his book or watched a few videos is a bigot and a nazi is wrong. Saying that means that you are just reinforcing the propaganda that the world is simple, black and white without any spectrums and consists of them and us. Which is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
You can't disassociate those factors though. His "self help" books are filled to the brim with the "darker reasons". I've actually read that shit. The dude constantly goes on incoherent rambles and is constantly blaming women and minorities. It has no actual self help anywhere in it. It teaches you nothing but blaming others for your misfortune.
And the dude's just a terrible writer in general. Try reading 12 rules for life. Dude constantly goes on irrelevant tangents over and over and over and forgets to make conclusions time and time again. He writes like a teenager who remembers something in middle of a essay and proceeds to dedicate the rest of the entire thing to the irrelevant thing he just remembered
 

I Don't Like

Member
Dec 11, 2017
14,918
True. It is best to condemn based on the words of others. Coming to your own conclusion is too much work.

You mocked me, but I'll again reiterate that the video I posted is well worth watching if you want to understand someone like Jordan Peterson.

There are 45 pages to this thread - we know where he's coming from. That's why we think he's a ridiculous asshole whose pseudo-intellectual, psycho-babbling bullshit is viewed as some kind of incredible gift of expression (see post below).

You can post a 10 hour video of this guy on if you want, it doesn't change the fact that:

1. Peterson denies systemic racism
2. Denies systemic discrimination against women
3. Claims some fantasy militant feminism is not only widespread in the world but is responsible for disenfranchising young men (causing them to do bad things)
4. Dabbles in climate change denial and looks down on environmentalists

No amount of fancy words can hide who this guy is at a fundamental level, and that's a over-privileged white guy; classic liberal douchebag who is popular because he finds verbose, sophisticated-sounding ways to say "feminism sucks" and "black people do it to themselves."

Is he the first with the combination of charisma, intelligence and expression?.

Jordan Peterson has no exceptional ability in any of these things. If he wasn't spewing his anti-feminist, racism-denying bullshit on YouTube nobody would know who the fuck he is. And, seriously, it's beyond comprehension that you find him charismatic. I bet most of his hardcore fans wouldn't even give him that.
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
I fail to see the charisma or intelligence everyone talks about. He's consistently making unfounded statements and fallacious arguments. He's also weirdly angry all the time, I don't think I've ever seen him smile. Joe Rogan or Ben Shapiro seem like a better fit for the "influential moderate/conservatives I disagree with, but admire how they speak" category.

I am basing that assumption mostly on his popularity as a popular guest to various shows and as an author.

Jordan Peterson has no exceptional ability in any of these things. If he wasn't spewing his anti-feminist, racism-denying bullshit on YouTube nobody would know who the fuck he is. And, seriously, it's beyond comprehension that you find him charismatic. I bet most of his hardcore fans wouldn't even give him that.

I don't. Check the above.

You can't disassociate those factors though. His "self help" books are filled to the brim with the "darker reasons". I've actually read that shit. The dude constantly goes on incoherent rambles and is constantly blaming women and minorities. It has no actual self help anywhere in it. It teaches you nothing but blaming others for your misfortune.
And the dude's just a terrible writer in general. Try reading 12 rules for life. Dude constantly goes on irrelevant tangents over and over and over and forgets to make conclusions time and time again. He writes like a teenager who remembers something in middle of a essay and proceeds to dedicate the rest of the entire thing to the irrelevant thing he just remembered

Of course you can. How many books have we read during our lifetimes where the views of the author weren't in line with ours, but there's still something to be learned from them. It's up to you to be a critical reader. I might read his book one day just to see what the fuss is about and to be able to discuss it better (just like you have done I assume). The person himself is of course the sum of his opinions I am not denying that.
 
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BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
I am basing that assumption mostly on his popularity as a popular guest to various shows and as an author.



I don't. Check the above.



Of course you can. How many books have we read during our lifetimes where the views of the author weren't in line with ours, but there's still something to be learned from them. It's up to you to be a critical reader. I might read his book one day just to see what the fuss is about and to be able to discuss it better (just like you have done I assume).
You seem to be very confused. Not a single person here has said merely reading his books turns you into a bigot. That's not my argument at all. My argument is that it's impossible to disassociate his self help books from his bigotry. Because they are bathed in it. Anyone that genuinely likes these books and uses it as a guide is indeed a bigot. And yes, I've read the book, that's the whole point of my post. I read it and know thanks to that that his "self help" shtick is the exact same as his bigotry.
 

Foffy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,391
I mean we are talking about a dude that is against gay marriage because he believes it's part of the secret agenda of secret soviet plants that intend to destroy the west from within , and blames the rise of incels on women

Calling him a bigot is honestly way too kind.

I still can't get over that.

For me, that's literally only topped by the fact he acts upon his wife's doomsday dreams as if they're prophecy.
 

Foffy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,391

One of the reasons he goes around talking and lecturing is because his wife had a dream that if he didn't, western civilization would be at great risk or something to that level of sheer absurdity.

She also had a dream of World War III, and that apparently links into what he does. Peterson is big on Jung, so it makes sense he gobbles up the unconscious via dreams.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,326
I still can't get over that.

For me, that's literally only topped by the fact he acts upon his wife's doomsday dreams as if they're prophecy.

Which in turn is only the second time dreams have been the cause of his chosen path... he started his journey into Red Scare because he had nightmares as a late teen of nuclear annihilation and for some reason that led him to research communism which eventually led him to be terrified of Post Modern Neomarxists.

He's a comic book villain.
 

Old Luke

Member
Jul 20, 2018
495
One of the reasons he goes around talking and lecturing is because his wife had a dream that if he didn't, western civilization would be at great risk or something to that level of sheer absurdity.

She also had a dream of World War III, and that apparently links into what he does. Peterson is big on Jung, so it makes sense he gobbles up the unconscious via dreams.
WTF man? Do you have any links for this?
 

deadman322

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,396
what do you expect from a man that believes the use of magic mushrooms can be used to scientifically study the supernatural. guys a fucking quack.
 

Branu

Banned
Feb 7, 2018
1,029
Era looks at and discusses matters from a different point of view than any other forum. Peterson is highly influential and relevent (even if the reasons might be wrong) so just covering your eyes and going "LALALALALA can't hear you" won't make him go away. Giving him a platform is an interesting point of debate but in Era that platform is one that exposes and mocks him. He's not corrupting anyone here.

What makes him so exceptional that he deserves his own OT?
 

mael

Avenger
Nov 3, 2017
16,812
He is a sociologist,
He's not a sociologist, he's a clinical psychologist.
Any sociologist worth their salt would dismiss pretty much anything the lobster daddy would say.
What makes him so exceptional that he deserves his own OT?
The amount of thread he can generate.
This is literally the only thing that him so exceptional....that and his graphs, by god I've never seens graphs so bad.
 
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